Should Churches Pay Taxes: Your thoughts

Ah, should they render unto Caesar the things which are Caesar’s, and unto God the things that are God’s?

In my opinion they should not. I buy the 1st Amendment argument that giving the state the power to levy taxes creates the potential for the government to influence the course of religion within the culture. Naturally the presence of a tax exemption that a religious group must qualify for has the same potential (a difficulty faced by the Branch Dravidians but not the Catholics). And that potential has led to clashes in the past.

For example, Native Americans who use peyote have been challenged by legal authorities. To date their rights have been upheld, but just as Holmes established a clear and present danger standard that affected free speech in Schenck v. US, so too would the right to tax religious organizations lead to unethical application of it by opponent groups. I get nervous anytime previously fundamental rights are chipped away at, be it for security or money.

#1 isn't topical. You may have a point in regard to the church's handling of finances (particularly the wealthier and less helpful to the masses churches - and I think we concur on the top one there), but the issue is more metaphysics than economics.

#2 paying taxes on business activity is becoming standard for every move. There's definitely the risk of differential taxation here and it feels a little like worshiping money to tax sacred ceremonies.

#3 mythos over logos. The notion that you will get any laws that aren't, as you say, tainted with religious influence is a stretch. The basic structure of the culture and its laws is strongly influenced by the founding belief system (mythos) which creates the logical order (laws) of the state. Even the basis of your question - Is this a right or wrong thing to do? - is deeply intertwined with the basic notion that there is such a thing as right and wrong - good and evil. That's distinctly tied in with the common belief that people should strive to achieve the good and shun the bad. Which goes back to morality. Where are its roots? The old mythos - in the US, mostly Judeo-Christian values.

As you wrote, "I have a problem with you when you and your god make the laws that tell me how I should live." Ah, then, what should be the basis of morality? If it isn't to be the inherited values for the Judeo-Christian background, what should guide our conduct?

No doubt the lobbyists are an issue, as are the rural Americans who buy in without thought to whatever crap they're served. But I think it would be even uglier if taxes were levied. Just as with so many other American entities, the bigger and richer ones use economic power to manipulate things to their advantage. The US has already bizarrely followed Israel's lead in starting an unwinnable Mideast War. Must we have battles between Catholics and Protestants at home too?

My answer is a question to the question asker. What is the point of asking this question while all you do is to argue with everyones answer?

I have to say that I don't completely agree with you.

I agree with your last point 100%, but your first point just isn't realistic. God created everything, so he doesn't need money? If that's the case, money shouldn't exist in the first place. (Although I think I question your point here simply because I question the existence of God)

And religious leaders don't actually perform legal changes. If you just have a church wedding without signing a marriage license, the government doesn't recognize your marriage. So they're really not providing a service to the state.

My main argument against taxing churches involved a lot less thought than yours did--many churches can't afford it. Churches rely upon collections during services, and I know my church (or my mom's church, really) only gets a couple thousand dollars a week. That money doesn't go very far as it is, and losing some of it to taxes would be devastating. Those "super churches" like the one Joel Osteen runs pull in millions, and they should definitely be taxed, but you can't tax the ones that can afford it and leave the others be.

I definitely think you're right lol.
I don't think any organization that makes money should be exempted from taxes. They want to be here in this country, and paying taxes is what it takes to keep the country running. All the citizens have to do it, so it's only fair.

They definitely should be taxed. They've got too much money to start with. Why should those nonsense organizations get off easy?

i definitely agree with you all the way!

Yes, they should.
And your reasons are excellent - couldn't agree more.

I think I'm in love. Ha ha ha ha. I can see where the devoutly religious are going to especially find fault with your first reason. God doesn't need the money but something about how God has given you everything you have (job, family, money, blah blah blah) and it's therefore your duty to give a little back in appreciation so that His word can be spread to the infidels. Once His word has been spread to the evil Godless masses, those people will then in turn accept His love and God will bestow upon them all His gifts and they will then be self-sufficient enough to pay their tithes as well. Or something. Ha ha. (I think I've been around these people too much.)

But I love love love your reason #3. Even before I got that far in reading your question, I was thinking much of the same. I agree that I have no problem with what people want to believe but it really bothers me when religion either attempts or succeeds at affecting our laws. We're supposed to have freedom of religion and yet we allow that?!

I would love to hear the "reasoning" behind why NOT. You said you were burned at the stake (no surprise really as I am already anticipating the tidal wave of down arrows I am sure to receive for this!) but did anyone give even the semblence of a sound argument to support their position?

That said, as much as I HATE it, I don't think they should have to pay taxes for 2 very good reasons but I would prefer not to list them here because it will just give all the religious zealots fuel for free. Because I guarantee that most of them probably don't have a good reason for their position and I'm not going to help them in their quest to keep our country under the religious based puppet regime, lol. I'd be more than happy to message you privately with my reasons if you care to hear them, lol.

not all churches get paid well, true religion doesn't cost anything to attend. my church makes nothing a year. its all based on ties and donations and what ever is left over goes right back to the kids of the families that attend church.