Respect the Brutalities of Dating

Often, I see people on this site that simply do not seem to respect the dangers and brutality of dating. This can range from playing games and attempting to emotionally manipulate, people not giving recently dumped people the sympathy they need, and folks who are just down regarding their dating situation being subject to even more harsh criticism and/or floccinaucinihilipilification (I honestly cannot think of a better word here). I have received it myself and I know how it feels, and I also see it with other folks and when I do, that really makes me feel for the person on the receiving end. Let's take a look.

Respect the Brutalities of Dating

Some people will literally ask how to play games and how they can emotionally manipulate their dating partner or their ex. This is an example because clearly, this person in question does not realize how awful their date or their ex must be feeling or will feel. Dating is a huge emotional risk and I can only imagine how he/she whoever they are must already feel. If they're dating, I can only imagine how he/she may finally hope that they will once and for all evade the brutal and nasty dating world. If they've broken up, I can only imagine how awful the pain of heartache must be on them already the basic level. Already, without any manipulation even. So please, do not play head games. Do not pull on your partner or ex-partner heartstrings, because you may not realize how much you're torturing them. And if you ever experience it yourself, I am sure you will understand the ramifications of this. If anything, you should be at least understanding and perhaps even supporting of your dating partner or ex. But at the minimum, don't hurt them any more. I don't care how awful they were. I honestly believe that no one deserves to feel the pain of heartbreak, yet it's inevitable for almost all of us sadly.

And this is coming from someone who has no dating or relationship experience. I am going to get to this later. Now I know that after hearing this, you all probably don't want to read this anymore, but see, I to my own demise, have spent an extreme amount of time over the past few years investigating these topics and spending time in dating forums. I have had no opportunities to gain experience in this department, and I've tried to be as resourceful as I could so far. I am going to get to this later, but realize that even though I have no practical experience, not by choice, I am very afraid of the ramifications and complications dating is going to bring and how brutal this stuff can be, after all I've heard in the media, on the internet, in real life. And as you read this, you'll understand why.

The other category I want to address is the outsiders who look at people that have been dumped recently and belittle their pain. This I think, is quite heartless and it really pains me when I see someone do this. It's not unheard of for people on the outside to not have enough sympathy for those that are going through a breakup and I really don't understand why. I have never even been in a breakup, and yet I can really picture and imagine the struggles the recently heartbroken must be going through. I mean these poor folks are probably crying their eyes out. I've heard of people throwing up and having all sorts of physiological side-effects just from the severity of heartbreak. That just sounds awful. For many, even other things that they have always loved are not even possible to appreciate anymore. Moreover, especially some of these folks, who if they were already at a loss of dating options and really struggled to finally just attract one person, now have to unfortunately think about the horrible possibility that they I'll never find love again. They're going to have to go back to, again, the brutal and harsh dating scene. And if there's any emotional manipulation going on, that I can imagine is only amplifying the pain. I wouldn't want to be there...so...just as a perspective. And really, it should be of no surprise why many go suicidal. It may seem trivial...uuntil you're the one who gets dumped later on...and again, I am saying this without any relationship experience...and I already respect the danger and threats of breakups and the real problems they can cause. And yet I have seen people, even people who have no experience just like me, ridicule them and say something like, "Get over it already," or, "Stop obsessing over a guy," and while the second one may be sound advicw, they'll say in a criticizing way, and I just feel bad for the person in question. Clearly he or she is already feeling so horrible and then they have to deal with the harshness of others who belittle their pain and such complications. So please, even if you do not yet understand how awful breakups must be, and really even I don't, at least don't prematurely disrespect the potency of this and belittle those who are already in so much pain. You end up almost as bad as their ex who for all we know may even be making matters worse by toying with them. Even if you have been through all the pain and think it's trivial, still. As an example, you may think dropping an ice-cream sucks but not the end of the world and yet a small child may fiercely cry. You're not going to tell that child to shut up and stop crying (maybe cruel parents might), but rather comfort him/her, even though to you as an adult it of course is nothing. Just as a side-note, I really feel for any of you that had parents who abused you for crying. That is just awful and I don't even know what to say about it. Crying? Crying is just emotional expression of a resigned or devastated state, and I hear parents abused their children further after that? That's horrible. But anyway, back to what I was talking about...

The other form of this is when we complain about our dating situation or lack thereof, and/or attempt to find solace by investing ourselves in a hobby, and we get hostile answers and other folks who harshly tell us to get over ourselves. I have been on the receiving end of this for many years so I can really get behind this. They'll tell us that it's our attitude holding us back, but in reality, they often fail to realize that our attitude becomes this way after a series of fail attempts. As an example, I have over the past few years tried to be resourceful as I could, initiating conversations, asking girls out, activating myself, etc. But of course, I also had to deal with familial restraints which also made things a lot harder and still continue to to some degree. I hve watched like a hawk for potentially interested girls, never failing to ask out a romantic interest. And still at 17, I am completely inexperienced. I've been on one date that came from online and that lasted 5-10 minutes of her refusing to come in and sit inside because she was too shy, even with her friends coercing her...never kissed, still a virgin, no romantic/sexual experience at all, aside from a cold 2-minute slow dance on prom. I see other people my age reflecting on their high school peers and they're already analyzing how to better attract the people they want because their past flings and relationships have not been good and I haven't even been able to start playing the game, being unwanted by girls my whole life. And I am sure there are other people lime me, but what hurt even more is when last year after repeatedly being told to stop stressing over it, I attempted to find some solace in a video game, and then I really got criticized again on this other forum for that. I am kind of doing that now with chess, and at least that's somewhat more accepted (it's also in my opinion, better than any video game). But even when we try to do that, we're still criticized, and it's like there's no way to win with this. You stress over the problem (which I still think is stress-worthy) you get sneered at by people telling you that you're worrying over nothing. You keep trying and still get nothing and then you get even more down on yourself. You attempt to find solace in a hobby, you are still looked down upon and as brutal and horrible this dating thing is, the problem is, there's nothing better. Resigning is even worse, because then you have to basically accept being alone forever and that's very difficult to do (almost impossible) naturally with all this romantic/sexual desire. As much as I try to find solace in playing chess, I still go to bed everyday aching for someone to love and love me back. So eventually, we're going to have to address our problems.

And some of us can't even get dates, but even if we do, then we have to deal with the horrible possibility of getting dumped because we were naturally and inevitably too needy/clingy and desperate after all these years of being unwanted which resultd in perprtual desperation no matter what you do and as a result, them seeing "red flag" (which I think is a petty and unjust method that people use to rule out dating prospects) I mean it's not really avoidable, unless one wants to ruin the experience by worrying about how much they emotionally invest (which people shouldn't have to do but unfortunately because of the following, end up doing), or friends/family/others criticizing us for naturally "settling"...and encouraging us to break up and date around, or the other person doing so. American society is so materialistic that we treat relationships the same way.

The other problem is how unnecessarily picky and particular people have become in the dating scene. From what I see here and on other forums, it seems that people will break up over the most trivial of things and there's all these expectations to follow arbitrary and useless dating rules. I just think, for example clinginess/neediness is a subjective trait. And many treat it as an objective thing to measure arbitrarily and will ask questions like if whether they're texting too much or if their boyfriend is too clingy. Like those questions, you shouldn't have to ask. There shouldn't be a right or wrong here. Just what the couple subjectively wants and if there's disagreement, then unfortunately there's not much option other than to break up or compromise, but the point is, people shouldn't have to change who they are at the basic level. Unfortunately, society is encouraging exactly the opposite with such arbitrary dating rules and customs and "red flags" where the slightest deviation, positive or negative, can lead to serious problems and even getting dumped and you being left wondering, "Why?" We're told to not open up or get attached, and things like this, and really it seems silly. Like it's natural to do so when dating someone you like and there have been couples that succeeded who declared exclusivity after just one date. Yet dating rules arbitrarily tell us that this is way too early. All these expectations really turn dating from what should be a naturally enjoyable experience into this horrible and brutal emotional game. To me, it just surprises me how even the average person is able to succeed in dating with all these complications and ramifications.

And yet, people just don't seem to respect the ramifications of all this. They're more than willing to break up with their partner over the most trivial reason imaginable, belittle other people's pain, emotionally manipulate, etc. I personally just wish that society would better respect these complications that can arise and have more sympathy for those suffering from these brutalities and be thankful if they ever do get into a successful relationship because they're very very hard to find, and you do not want to have to go back to the dating game if you can avoid it, because it makes one's life as we saw extremely difficult and imposes a lot of emotional pressure for a very long time.


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What Girls Said 3

  • I am a serial dater.
    To ME, all dates are just mutual job interviews for sex and fun times.

    There are good and bad dates.
    There is good and bad sex.

    Naturally no-one wants to repeat bad experiences.

    The "not knowing" is the most exciting component to me.
    After that, all the frenetic anticipation is gone.

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  • I'm an advocate of tough love. I'll be sympathetic the first few times someone posts a particular question, but if that's all they talk about and they've changed nothing (as in, ignored all sound advice) why should I continue to be sympathetic?

    And speaking as someone who has struggled with depression, I'd really love it if people would stop throwing the word "suicidal" around. Being really really really sad and down is not what being depressed or suicidal feels like. You're trivializing mental health issues every time you do so.

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    • But breakups have led to and can cause depression. And though not as serious or common, lack of success in dating in general can as well. I didn't say it will. I just said that it CAN cause some people to go suicidal, and I guess I should have worded that better because I over-exaggerated with "many" because of course the vast vast majority DON'T, at least not seriously like you said.

      And I am one of those folks you mentioned in the first parragraph, mainly because even after we do try that, we still get nowwhere. Although I understand why an outsider like you after a few attempts would be irritated. I mean what else can you do? This is why I personally think therapy and one-on-one counseling is great for anyone struggling with either of these issues, and is what I am taking. And have actually taken on and off for a year now. But tough love, in my opinion, is still mostly not the best way to approach it because even if the person is being unreasonable...

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    • You have a lot more self-awareness than most people who use this site. There's a particular user who posts nothing but "why won't anyone go out with me? Why am I so bitter? Do you think I'm attractive?" questions. I keep telling him that he ought to explore his feelings of poor self-worth in therapy but he refuses. It's like... You refuse to do anything to help yourself and you expect me to pat your head and say it's all going to be okay? No! You're limiting yourself by thinking you're not good enough for anyone and asking for validation doesn't fundamentally change that thought process.

    • I have seen that term "tough love' used by people as an excuse to throw around terms such as whiny, pathetic, self entitled brats who need to just "get over it" or "get over themselves" or "just deal with it." I'm not saying you do this, 9mfeo, but I've seen plenty of others do this.

      My advice is if a person will not listen to reason, the best course of action is to shut up and move on. Using the aforementioned terms isn't tough love, it's stupid (again, not saying you do this, 9mfeo, but plenty of other people do it under what they consider "tough love"). You are MUCH more likely to just make this person defensive. Sometimes just shutting up and moving on is the wisest and, dare I say, most sympathetic course of action.

  • Today, people don't fox what is broken. Too many people just want to try new things and not appreciate what they have in life right now. Faithfulness is a problem now as well. People need to accept this when they jump out into the dating world. The world has changed...

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    • Exactly, people just do not have enough respect for how difficult attaining a relationship can be. Relationships just aren't valued enough these days.

    • I doubt faithfulness has changed much in the past few decades.

    • Why do you doubt that?

What Guys Said 9

  • In terms of your hobbies, the reason why chess and video game are "criticized" by struggling daters is for two reasons:

    1) those hobbies tend to be solitary in terms of meeting other people in the flesh [especially PC games; they're too lonerish for me and that's why I prefer console]

    2 ) these are not "mainstream" hobbies , these are niche activities

    ***3 )*** you don't meet many, if any, women, doing these activities

    -----

    Diversify your hobbies. Cook. Hike or camp. Work out or play a recreational league sport. Take up art or music. Be a Renaissance man and diversify your knowledge and abilities.

    Also make sure you converse with people EVERY time you are out, men and women alike. Especially post college, this is how people make new friends and get into new social circles... and that means meeting more women. :)

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  • A very good take and I have much more to say about it.

    Firstly, I would suggest that you are perhaps prematurely pessimistic, and please don't take this to mean I am disqualifying your feelings. Have you seen how many very attractive young women your age and even older have never gone out on a date, much less been kissed? I do think that being dateless and still being a virgin at your age are probably more common than you think.

    Secondly, I would like to suggest that you expand your hobbies into activities which are more group oriented rather than adversarial oriented like chess and video games. What do you think?

    I have more to say but it's nearly 2:30 am right now in California and I should be sleeping!

    P. S. What video games do you like?

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  • Lol I was thinking of Mortal Combat through all of this. But GREAT take:)
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EAwWPadFsOA

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  • I would try your best to forget about women & dating & focus on yourself first. The deck is stacked against you if you are male.

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  • ... too much text... I lost interest after 2 min... sorry no offence intended.

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    • I understand and perhaps it should have been written more clearly. It was done on my phone. Sorry for the inaccuracies and lack of clarity.

    • The text is fine, only it could benefit from being more to the point :)

  • handle it/deal with it.

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  • The key to dating is being attractive, thats it. Women will not go for ugly men and vice versa. I know this problem I have it!! I go to the pinnacle of preppy and attractive colleges in the south. Im feeling these pains now, women will not acknowledge ugly or average guys, you gotta be buff, tan, and chisled. Also true a lottle personality comes in, you gotta be selfish/ down right mean, women like teasers they hate the "quiet nice guy in the corner" I should know I am that guy. You gotta be loud, vivacious, and upright selfish to date.

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    • Generalizations

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    • screwed, but I dont take that as defeat, I work out everyday (to become more attractive) I try to network as much as I can (to get the status and partys I want to get into) We always need to change and improve our selves, thats what makes us better

    • You don't have to be the nice guy I think the corner, you have to be the cool guy in the corner.

  • Screw dating.

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    • True that. I mean just look at all the difficulties it poses... it's terrible.

      Probably, currently in my life in my limited experience, this is probably what has overall caused me the most net unhappiness.

  • Man, you have my respect for expressing what you think, this is the way forward and I think it will bring you a long way.

    I think you raise some good points, and there are ways to address them.

    First I think the 'cold approach' is overrated, in my culture it doesn't work, I haven't seen it working for others either. For it to work there needs to be strong physical attraction between the two and the moment has to be just right, no friends or family around, it is simply unlikely.

    Better build a circle of friends with which you do the hobbies you love, chances of finding someone available increases the more people you know and the girls will accept you easier being 'checked' by their friends, bottom line spend more time with people you have something in common, this will make you happier and more likely to find someone.

    Second, people in big cities act more distant, they might have a good reason, you can't be warm with too many people in a day. Example: I hit the pavement at high speed while cycling in the city, nobody stopped to check if I am still alive and able to walk, I could have had a broken bone or something, if this would have happen in country side I am sure that people would have to jump to help.

    I also noticed girls being much warmer to me when traveling to country side, people in general are easier to talk with, they don't look to you suspicious when you try to strike up a conversion, I don't have much experience try to cold approach when travelling to smaller cities/villages but I don't do it often, but it easy much easier to have conversion with people there. My point is that you might want to change where you live, since you are only 17 you could choose a small town when going to University, assuming you are going to do.

    Don't forget, for you the best is yet to come, you are going to meet a lot of new people from now and chances of finding your match will only increase.

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