Why It Is Equality For Men To Pay For Dates

[Anonymous]

I would agree that in an ideal equal world, men and women would pay half for dates.

However, we live in a world where men and women are in very different situations, and thus, treating men and women the exact same in all situations does not necessarily lead to equality, but rather can increase inequality in some instances. Equality does not necessarily mean same. For instance, 2+3 and 4+1 are equal, but not the same.

In this current society, women paying half for dates would only exacerbate inequality. On average, women make less money than men, and also are required to pay many more expenses than men, from menstrual products to bras to clothing (it is considered unacceptable for women, but not men, to rewear clothes) to gyno appointments to makeup. There is also evidence that women’s products cost more than equivalent men’s products (aka the pink tax).

In our current society, men paying for dates serves to decrease this inequality in expenses required to be paid. This is why I am not concerned with the societal expectation in which men are expected to pay for (hetero) dates, and in fact am opposed to this expectation being alleviated (at least in cases where the man is financially capable of paying), until we acquire the ideal world in which men and women make an equal amount of money and men and women are required to pay an equal amount of expenses outside of dating.

In this current society, expecting women to pay the same amount for dates will only serve to increase inequality.

[RJGraveyTrain]

I don't agree with this whatsoever. Having a penis doesn't mean you need to foot the bill, to expect that because someone's gender IS sexist. It's no different than a man expecting a woman to do all of the cooking.

If men were meant to pay for days then penises would shoot money. Women who want equality need to take it in its raw form, not the way that benefits them the most. Seriously.

[Negrodamuss]

thank you..

This is what a real feminist looks like

[RJGraveyTrain]

@Negrodamuss You're welcome. Though I identify as an egalitarian, I see men's rights as just as important as women's. I am completely on legit feminists side and hold the same views, I just don't identify as that personally.

[Negrodamuss]

yeah i get ya. Neither do i but, this is really the kind of nuanced perspective that i like to see in people... especially women

[RJGraveyTrain]

@Negrodamuss Well I appreciate that very much.

[myTake Owner]

Men ARE meant to pay for dates, though. Women are wired to seek mates who can provide for them.

[RJGraveyTrain]

Then you aren't for equality. You're a traditionalist which is the OPPOSITE of somebody for equality. Saying that men are meant to pay for dates means that women are MEANT to be subservient stay at home wives.

Seriously, get over yourself. You're not going to convince me or anybody else who is for equality otherwise.

[myTake Owner]

How does that mean that women are meant to be subservient stay at home wives?
I agree with one traditional gender role, that doesn't mean that I agree with all.
I don't agree with women being ruled by men. If anything, women should rule men. Women are the ones who give birth to civilization; thus, women are the ones who would get the right to lead & have power over civilization.
& Yes, that involves demanding that men pay them money if they (men) want to go out on dates with them (women).

[RJGraveyTrain]

So you only agree with the traditional roles that benefit women, but not men.

Typical. You basically lost all value to your argument that you could have had to sway me so this conversation is pointless.

by the way, what I am suggesting is that if YOU think it is equal to have gender expectations that means men are allowed to have gender expectations of you two and you have ZERO right to complain. Want a man that'll take care of you financially? Fine, but that means he can expect you to be subservient or a stay at home wife, otherwise it isn't "equal."

#failedlogicfails

[RJGraveyTrain]

too* rather

[IceEverest]

^^^She is one of the wisest G@Gers...
Thank you...

[myTake Owner]

If we completely get rid of all gender roles it won't be equal; it'll end up with women getting the shitty end of the stick bc we already have more expenses to pay

[FatherJack]

Why doesn't MY penis shoot money? I feel cheated !! Nicely put !!

[Chief16]

m.quickmeme.com/.../...4e7c8a36d2eeb1c63645221.jpg
Sigh... I was really, really REALLY hoping this was a troll, but some people are beyond saving. I'm sorry. But...
https://i.imgur.com/kdQVd1q.gif

[myTake Owner]

We're not expecting men to pay for everything. Women pay for bras, menstrual products, gyno appts, papsmears, birth control, etc.

[CoolSky01]

men pay for shaving foam, razors, trimmers, cars, lotions, hair products, toiletpapers... etc its 2016 you must be sooo dumb to think that men dont actually put an effort to look good...

[myTake Owner]

@CoolSky01 Women also pay for shaving foam, razors, trimmers, lotions, hair products, toilet paper, etc?
Women pay ALL the stuff men do... but also MORE.

[CoolSky01]

More? well no one is telling you to buy 10 shampoo bottles when 2 are enough , i pay more than lots of girls i know, you can't buy whatever you want then blame it on me, these things are not all necesary, you buy 10 of everything when you need one then you whine about the money not being enough, well maybe start being a bit smarter when buying things, if i pay for a date its cause i want to not because its a must if you want to force me iam going home and you can take the bus home.

[myTake Owner]

@CoolSky01 menstrual products to bras to gyno appointments... are those options?

[ClumsyAngel]

Thumbs up, @Chief16

[Chief16]

@ClumsyAngel haha credits to @ThisDudeHere

[ThisDudeHere]

Thumbs up mate 8)

[CoolSky01]

How much does a box of tampons cost? allso do you think men dont buy underwear? you are asking for men to pay for you because you buy 3 products that cost like... I don't know 20 or 30 dollars a month? its not my problem if you chose to buy taht $1000 dress or to buy tons of makeup or 5 different kinds of lotion, i have sisters, i have classmates, i have girls around me i know what kind of shit they buy and most of the time they buy overpriced stuff just cause...

[myTake Owner]

@CoolSky01 women buy underwear too...

[Panay]

Most of the things you've given as example as things women have to buy, men AND women buy. I think you underestimate the cost of grooming and toiletries for men in the modern world.
And what about things like gym memberships? You're talking about the average woman, so I'll talk about the average man. A gym membership can cost anywhere from £25-£40 a month!
A nice car to impress women? I don't see many women attracting guys with their vehicles, but I've known women to reject men purely based on which car they have.
Sporting equipment? Of course women play sports too, but if you're going to talk about the needs of the average woman, then on average, men play more sports than women do, which equates to more money spent on sports.

[myTake Owner]

@Panay women have almost as many gym memberships as men
and the difference between sports equipment and menstrual products is that almost ALL women buy menstrual products, and ALL men dont. In contrast, there's a much smaller gap b. w men n women when it comes to when it comes to sports equipment
also sports equipment is a choice. Having periods is not

[CoolSky01]

you still haven't answered my question, how much does your period costs you every month? you got me curious since you keep throwing the word around, how much do you pay that justifies using a strangers money because you're worth it?

[CoolSky01]

by the way it is a choice you can get a piece of cloth no needs for pads or tampons, everything in life is a choice.

[StreetLevel]

So stop wearing bras. Most of us would certainly have no problem... Seriously though. If you really wanted to you can sit here and compare and contrast what the sexes buy. IT DOESN'T MATTER, your logic is terrible in the first place.

[CoolSky01]

@StreetLevel everything is a choice, dont wear a bra not my problem

[hellionthesage]

Well this is all completely inaccurate. Women do not make less then men, period. This is something that has been debunked so many times I am astonished its still parroted so freqeuntly. The only three occupations where their is a pay gap is in modeling where women make an insane amount more then male models (the highest paid female makes 47 million, the highest paid male makes 1.5 million) pornography where women make more then men (100 to 250 thousand for women to a mans 40 thousand), and STEM fields where women make more for starting pay because of the female only highering quotas (yet another unfair advantage women have over men). The only reason why that number was gotten was because they compared male salaries to female salaries not comparing men and womens salareis in the same field. Thats like being upset that a social worker (80% female) doesn't make as much as a surgeon (80% male). It also refuses to acknowledg that women gravitate towards certain jobs (of their own free will, which women do have) and men do so as well and that men and women are not identical and thus gener parity is not something that will happen unless its forced onto both parties against their will. This is all established fact: www.washingtonexaminer.com/.../2580405
Also the fact that women make up 80% of all domestic spending in the US, that is 80% of all money being spent is by women despite the fact that men tend to make more because they choose higher paying jobs shows that women are spending their money and mens money too (which is what you are advocating), its 70% of global domestic spending as well so again you have no excuse. Women are the most pampered group in society. Stop playing this game if you want to be treated like nobility like women where historicly (that was chivalry, the treatment of women as if they where nobles, since chivalry is an oath of feality to nobility that was then applied to women) fine. If you want men and women to be equals also fine. But you can't have both. Either you stick to your gender role and he his or you are both not bound to it. This bullshit where you get to do what ever the hell you want and he has to act in the very restricting typical male role is not only not equal, its objectifcation (you want a walking paycheck) and sexist (not that you will care) not to mention blatently hypocritical. Just admit you want to use men as a paycheck and move on stop trying to justify your bigotry.

[myTake Owner]

Well why do surgeons make more than social workers? In Russia doctors are given the same respect as kindergarten teachers are here. Why do you think that is? Here's a hint: they're all women. Women-s work is devalued and that is why female dominated jobs pay less.

And female porn stars are obviously paid more because men are more comfortable having sex with random strangers and thus will do it for a much smaller sum of money.

And just wondering, what are the roles that I would have to abide by if I wanted the man to pay for my dates?

[hellionthesage]

What? They make more because they have to have an insane amount of training that not only is more intensive and difficult but also takes longer. To be a social worker you just need four years of college, to be a surgeon you need to have four years of undergraduate school, four years of medical school and then any where from 3 to 8 years of residency (intense work usually having twenty hour days and being on call with low pay) surgeon experience before becoming a full fledge surgeon. Its not about respect its about work put in. If you do less work you get less pay thats how it should work. Why would you be treated better then some one who is doing far more then you? Thats idioticly stupid. No female work is not devalued. "womens" work is safe easy work. Four years of work to become a social worker that has no risk attached to it, fifteen years of work for a surgeon that has many risks with it. The notion that their the same is idioticly stupid. Thats grasping at straws, and doing a poor

[hellionthesage]

job of it at that. No, women get paid more because its the demand, it has nothing to do with the men being willing to perform. Its not pleasent work and not every one is capable of doing it so it has nothing to do with men being "more comfortable" with it. Your having sex sure, but its in front of dozens of people you have to stop constantly your tired because its a twelve hour day and its not with some one you want its with the who the studio says and its quite miserable by all accounts. Its demand, its watched for the women their fore they control the market value for their work. So why did you neglect to mention modelling? Or STEM fields? Or the female highering quota for male dominated fields (but only the good ones, seems women are just fine with men doing all the shit jobs like mining waste managment and construction) but none in the female dominated fields (like social work, pediatrics, psycology, HR managment, secretarial work, teaching, etc)?

[hellionthesage]

As for what a woman could do to get free shit its very simple. If he has to follow the traditional gender roles then so does she. You don't get both. You either follow through with your duties and obligations as a woman ie cooking cleaning, nurturing, having sex with him when he wants it not when you want it, and allowing him to have final say in decisions. Then in turn he can provide for you ie pay for everything, shelter you, put food on the table, protect you, and ensure you have a good life. Those where the traditional roles and obligations. So if he is investing all of that into you you damn well better be giving the same amount of dedication and effort back. Or you can be equals in all things and pay for your own shit and take care of your own needs and wants and he can take care of his. Those are the options. Anything else is not only unequal but selfish and hypocritical.

[loveisbeautiful]

I don't usually laugh at what people write on here, but I did this time. And, it's not a laugh out of meanness or making fun of what you wrote, because I'm not that kind of person. It's more out of the ridiculousness of the reasons you gave. Honestly, I don't see how any these are actually reasons as to why woman can't pay for a date.

So, let me break it down this way.

1) Gynecological appointments, which include paps smears are all (or should be) covered under ones medical insurance. So, though you'll pay some the cost of the appointment, you'll only have to pay the amount the insurance company doesn't pay. So, there's that.

Then there's the part where birth control can also be covered in your medical insurance, if you have prescriptions insurance included in it. Even if you don't, I don't think it would be that much. Also, not all women take the pill, so that's not a legit reason either.

There's also the part where depending on a variety of things, a women can go years without getting a paps smear. As long as the last one she got came back good and nothing was wrong, from what I've been told she can go three years before she has to get another one. So, that test isn't an every week or every month thing. So, that's not a reason either.

2) Now, when you say menstrual products are you talking about like tampons and stuff? Because, I don't really think four dollars and ninety-nine cents for Tampax tampons is going to put a woman so far in the financial hole, that she can't pay for a date every now and then. So, that's not a valid reason.

3) Now, let's talk about bra's and makeup. If a woman chooses to buy more bra's when she already has a bunch, that's on her. Which means, it can't be used as a reason she shouldn't pay for a date or even chip in half. Same goes for makeup, that's a luxury purchase which means she didn't need it but bought it anyway. So, anything someone chooses to spend on stuff they don't actually need, is their choice and shouldn't be used as a reason why you can't pay for a date.

[loveisbeautiful]

4) Women have this weird idea, that because they say men make more then women, they mean all men. Truth is, not all guys work in corporate office on the 12th floor with a view of the city and money shooting out of their butt, every time they get off the chair. Most guys are just regular people with regular jobs and regular pay and have to use their cash for paying bills and buying things just like women do. So, I believe this unequal pay thing depends on what career industry you are in because not all men are wealthy enough to pay for everything. Something to think about.

Truth is, some men make more than women. Some women make more than men. And, some men in women make the same amount. Again, something to consider.

[loveisbeautiful]

Personally, I don't get why men and women are debating on who should pay for the date when they haven't even been on the date yet. Who cares, who pays. Honestly, dates are suppose to about fun and getting to know each other. They are not suppose to be about worrying about who's going to pay the bill when the check comes. No matter what though, at the end of the day this take is suppose to be about why men should pay and to me and my logical brain these aren't reasons but instead lame excuses as to why men should have to pay and women shouldn't.

[ted22]

Its like you read my mind. I thought the same thing when I read this.

[loveisbeautiful]

@ted22 great minds think alike, I guess.

[ted22]

I'm a bit of an asshole so I wouldn't bring you down lol. #youaretheMVP

[loveisbeautiful]

@ted22 Haha, thanks. Also, since I don't know you personally. I'll say, that's how you see yourself but not what I necessarily know to be true. People tend to be harder on themselves then need be.

[ted22]

Thanks for the kind words. I do have some good qualities (I think) but I can be an asshole. I like to be thought provoking at times but it can come off really bad lol. You seem level headed and I respect that.

[loveisbeautiful]

@ted22 You're welcome and thanks, I appreciate that. I know someone who also refers to himself as an "asshole" but he's actually one of the best people to come into my life. So, sometimes who we are around will determine how we act. Way I see it, as long as you're not pushing little old ladies down or taking lollipops for children, you'll be fine lol.

Just out of curiousity, what do you mean by thought provoking? Like, you speak your mind a lot or something?

[ted22]

I like to have a different view because there is always two side to every story but people these days seem to have tunnel vision.

[loveisbeautiful]

@ted22 I agree, there is always two sides to everything. That's actually how I am with things, I see things from both sides. So, I understand.

[ted22]

We need more people like you.

[loveisbeautiful]

@ted22 Thanks, that's nice of you to say. I'm more of an observer of behavior and base my opinions on that. I'm also more of a common sense / logical person, so I kind of just see things like that.

[ted22]

Yep thats me too lol

[loveisbeautiful]

@ted22 Like I said early, great minds think alike lol. I don't often have things in common with people, so it's nice when I do.

[ted22]

Really? This is one of the best answer on this topic ever. Im copying and paste it to use in the future lol You should get the MHO which I know the asker wouldn't give you.

[loveisbeautiful]

@ted22 Yeah, I don't have a lot in common with most people. I see things differently, think differently and just am different. So, it makes connecting with others and finding common ground an issue. Thanks though, I'm glad you liked what I wrote so much you're are going to reference it in the future lol. And, you're probably right about that.

[Tombstone1000100]

Wow wow wow, Now you're someone I wouldn't mind paying for the first 10 dates. 😂

[myTake Owner]

@Tombstone1000100 congrats now i know who "anonymous" was

[loveisbeautiful]

@Tombstone1000100 The sad thing about this site is, there's so many wisenheimers I can't tell when someone is being honest with me or sarcastic, which one would you be?

[Tombstone1000100]

I really like your answer. Very well thought out and logical. It was a compliment. You'd know for sure if m actually being an asshole, right now m not. 😂😂

[Tombstone1000100]

@OP m not sure what you're talking about. Neither am I interested in finding out.

[loveisbeautiful]

@Tombstone1000100 Okay, just checking. In that case, thank you. I appreciate the compliment.

[lightlysaltedchips]

I love you you are my hero

[loveisbeautiful]

@lightlysaltedchips Haha. Thanks.

[Bandit74]

-The pay gap statistic that say women make 76 cents for every dollar a man makes did NOT compare similar job types, experience, or hours worked. It only compared the average pay of all men to the average pay of all women.

-Pink tax... If you genuinely believe the male version of products works just as well as the female products then by all means, purchase the male version if its cheaper. No one is forcing you to buy the women's version.

-Rewearing clothes... Men don give a fuck if you re-wear clothes, hell we probably won't even notice it. Women are the ones that put that pressure on each other. Some guys wouldn't even care if you showed up to his place naked, so if you really want to save money that's always an option.

Also what happened to that line feminists always shove down everyone's throats, "THAT WOMEN DRESS FOR THEMSELVES AND NOT FOR MEN" Oh so suddenly that doesn't apply here =.=

To be honest I wouldn't care about being expected to pay if it was you were actually consistent.

I don't want to be the guys who pays money to take a girl on dates for over a month knowing the same girl who is expecting me to pay for all the dates and wait over a month for sex has likely sent nude pictures to numerous guys on tinder and had sex by the second or third date with guys she met while dry humping with at a club or party, guys who didn't have to spend a dime on her.

It would be worth it paying for dates if when I actually got to see her naked and sleep with her it was something special, but no its something a bunch of other guys got with a fraction of the effort. Which is fine, but Id rather be one of those guys, the guys that get it free with no effort. I have no interest in being the guy you're hard to get for when you were easy for all drunk guys at parties. No thanks, I'll pass on that opportunity.

Oh an another reason why guys should avoid women who make them pay for all the dates..

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=qAhO5SLF9Ck

[godfatherfan]

Wow, that is just disgusting. What a pathetic piece of trash

[blondfrog]

Those men are stupid too though for paying for he meals she is not even really attractive maybe above average at best.

[pnl86]

In the spirit of equality, equity, "fairness," or any other romantic fluffy word we would like to use...

Consider an island with 10 men and 10 women. Further, assume that both men and women have limited resources. Assume that "dating" costs resources. Assume that men have only 5 gold coins, and dates cost 1 gold coin. Assume further that each girl wants to go on at least five (5) days before she feels comfortable enough to be in a long-term and sexual relationship with a man.

How many different women can a man date? (answer: 5)

How many different women can a man secure a long-term and sexual relationship with? (answer: 1)

How many different men can a woman date? (answer: 10)

How many different men can a woman secure a long-term and sexual relationship with? (answer: 10)

By imposing and burdening men with a cost of dating, what women are doing is essentially limiting the options men have (limiting their alternatives, weakening their bargaining power, and essentially forcing men to subsidize women's bargaining power to increase their own alternatives). Men are deprived of choices, while women are armed with choices, all under this self-serving pre-textual rationale of "equality/equity/fairness."

Let's look at that argument even deeper.

When a man spends $X on a specific woman, the "benefits" of spending those resources are non-transferable. In other words, only that specific woman can receive the benefits from that investment. The man cannot transfer the benefits of that spending onto other potential mating/partnering opportunities.

When a woman spends $X on a dress, make-up, her hair, waxing, etc., the "benefits" of that spending are transferable. In other words, those investments can be used to grab the attention and attract multiple men.

So, as Justice Louise Brandies used to say, "Sunlight is the best disinfectant." If you expose the economics of what women are essentially suggesting, they are essentially arguing for men to limit their dating choices, while allowing for women to maximize their dating choices. Uhhh... no thank you.

You want equality... reach into your wallet and invest in the guy you're dating, specifically to that guy, as a non-transferable investment. Otherwise, go run that game on some other dude who will buy what you're selling.

[pnl86]

Also, under that logic, "WOMEN" should pay for dates, because do you have any idea how much multi-million dollar homes and fancy sports cars cost? I mean, in order to look attractive and attract the attention of multiple women, I have to make those mortgage and financing payments each month. Not to mention organic food and gym equipment to maintain this body. And don't get me started on the clothes. So, with all that money that poor little old me spends on looking good and being attractive to other women at large, it's only "FAIR/EQUAL/EQUITABLE" that women pay for dates.

[smølf]

In my view, equality is archived when we are all equal before the law. I couldn't care less about absolute equality in other aspect of life than the law, who cares if women spend more time at home taking care of the children or if men pays on dates, both men and women have a choice not to, that is the entire point.

No two people are alike; hence, no two groups of people are alike, men and women least of all.

Equality before the law is mainly men’s issue in the western world; men have less rights than women by the law, so the struggle for equality is mainly a problem for men. The issues where women are not equal, is in the private sphere and those issues are therefore not a concern the legislative body’s of our countries.

Here are some issues where woman have rights men don’t have in most western countries:

*Women have the right to genital integrity
*Women have the right to vote, while having conscriptional immunity (Israel is the exception)
*Women have the right to choose parenthood, men have no say regarding abortion
*Women have the right to be assumed (competent) caregivers for children, as shown by the parental rights giver to women over men across the board
*Women have the right to call unwanted, coerced sex rape, men can in some countries not even by legally raped by a woman
*Women have the right to lower jail sentences for the same crime in the US, Australia, UK
*Women have the right to not be assumed sexual predators - British Airways, Qantas, Air New Zealand, Virgin Australia
*Women have the right to government departments that solely serve their interests Office on Violence Against Women - US, Ministry for Women - New Zealand, Office for Women - Australia
*Women have the right to government-enforced gender quotas Leadership positions in publicly traded companies - Norway, Legislated quotas in national parliaments - Belgium, France, Greece, Ireland, Spain, Portugal
*Women have the right to exclusive tax benefits for being a business owner US, Australia
*Women have the right to domestic violence shelters US, Canada, and the EU
*Women have the right to not be assumed the primary aggressor in a domestic dispute US, UK

[bluenose1872]

Yeah if women want equality and men to take more of a hand in the upbringing of kids then the courts should drop feminine bias. I've seen useless mums getting custody from very competent dad's just coz she's female. That's gotta stop. A lot of women are just good at camouflage. Deep down they're horrible bastards. Men always get suckered by them just coz they're attractive though

[oddwaffle]

While I agree with you, I gonna have to borrow a quote "some animals are more equal than others". In front of the law, the one with more money tend to be more equal. If you show up with a freebie lawyer who wants to cut a deal and be done with you then you are pretty screwed. If you show up with 7 lawyers from the top end of the chart then your chance of getting screwed is pretty low.

I think a lot of women inequality can be explained by the fact that women tend to choose those options. Men work much harder when he get married and has a kid. Women work less and spend more time with her family. If you were a boss and you have an important position, would pick an eager to work guy or a gal who might not be there because of her family?

[bluenose1872]

@oddwaffle I'm old fashioned. I think men are far more competent than women. That bias was built up through experience not just inherited sexism. I've never seen a woman hold her nerve under pressure. I've never seen a women in a powerful position able to separate personal from work. It's always personal to them. Men are less distracted and generally work better together if there's no women in the mix. I've been in the army and all male building sites and if you don't pull your weight they'll let you know fast. Women get away with all sorts with men which is detrimental to work load. I just dont know why people can't let it sink in we aren't equal. Women are good at some things, men at others. What's the problem with that? There must be a reason men are bigger and stronger and women are more sensitive and maternal. It's as obvious as the nose on my face personally but still numbnuts say deep down were exactly the same and deserve to play in the same playing fields.

[myTake Owner]

@bluenose1872 there is no feminine bias. That's a myth. Men rarely get custody because they rarely ask for custody.

As for oddwaffle, women DO work when they have a child. HouseWORK. Men have the privilege of defining work as something they get paid for.

[ThisDudeHere]

If you don't mind, sr, I will copy this list for future reference. I may need it to smack some sense in to a feminist.

[bluenose1872]

You honestly think everybody does things the same way? There's no worldwide standard. My ex wanted to work but she didn't want to be the main breadwinner. She didn't like telling me what to do and she enjoyed being with the kids. Very traditional. There is a bias in courts and in society in general towards a mother where I'm from. It's well known. Women get special treatment. I remember my pal getting smashed on the head with a stiletto heel from his girlfriend coz he wanted to go to a party instead of going back with her. She split him wide open. Police were already parked near the club and arrested him. He never lifted a finger. He got community service for assault. Like I said the establishment is sexist against me

[lumos]

Are you kidding me? Nobody is forcing anyone to buy a ton of makeup, clothes etc. If you buy quality bras/clothes then you won't have to buy more all the time. Rewearing clothes is one of the most normal things a person can do. I've literally never heard anyone calling someone out for wearing the same shirt twice. And if they did, they would get so many weird looks and would be considered a douche for saying something like that. Plus, if you want to stop this (nonexistent) stigma regarding wearing clothes more than once or twice, THEN STOP SUPPORTING IT. I. e. do whatever the fuck you want and stop caring about what other people think about your clothes. That's on you and you alone.
And if you don't want to waste money on pads and tampons, get yourself a menstrual cup. Appointments to the gynecologist falls under any other medical treatment. Should we pay for the guy's dinner because he goes to the dentist? No. Everyone who's responsible enough pays for birth control. Guys usually pay for the condoms and girls for the pills. I've even heard of people within relationships who split the bill when it comes to birth control pills, especially if they don't use condoms.
Also, nothing says that dates should be expensive, or even cost anything at all. You could literally go out on a walk and get a 2 dollar ice cream if you want. If you can't even pay for a 2 dollar ice cream because you've already spent it all on bras, makeup and tampons, then maybe you should rethink your priorities when it comes to spending money.

[myTake Owner]

"Should we pay for the guy's dinner because he goes to the dentist? No." No because girls also go to dentists

[lumos]

And guys also go to get their junk/prostate checked.

[myTake Owner]

The latter is when they're like 70

[lumos]

Not at all.

[MSamu3l]

I'm starting to wonder if that age range on the myTake owner is right, and I'm not trying to be an ass. The take is so naive and one dimensional that it's hysterical. I'm fine with people saying guys should pay for dates (tho I believe who ever initiated the date should pay, of course society dictates this be guys too), as a society, we need standards/norms. But the reasons given are so ridiculous I'm just done. And as expected, she went ahead to attack the dentist comment.
As a side note, I'm actually glad the girls are the ones calling her out more.

[tupperware]

Sweet Jesus. Ok, I'll bite... from the top.

www.collegeatlas.org/top-degrees-by-gender.html
Yes, on average, women *earn* less money than men. Five of the top 10 college majors men choose deal directly with money (Business Administration, Finance, Accounting, Economics, Marketing). Two are STEM majors. Seven of the top 10 college majors women choose lead to careers working with people, only one of which (nursing) pays fairly well. Two are related directly to money, and one is a STEM major. Four of the top 10 masters degrees men take are STEM and 3 are money. Nine of the 10 most common women's masters degrees are "people" subjects (seven of which are teaching) and one is money. None are STEM.

More expenses? Men pay well over half of the income tax, and women are more than half of welfare recipients. In other words, we're already giving you money hand-over-fist. On top of that, have a look here and then get back to me on whose money you must already be spending: she-conomy.com/.../marketing-to-women-quick-facts

"Pink tax"? Use the men's products if they're so comparable. Or, you know... actually look at the products yourself and see why the cost is different.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8HEr8zmVEZQ

On account of the above, men paying for dates serves only to benefit you, not decrease any inequality. You're already spending our money as it is. Could it be that you want to have OUR cake and eat it too? Perish the thought!

Still not good enough? Buy your own dinner. No? Well the fact that you posted this as anonymous is not surprising.

[bluenose1872]

Our cake and eat it too lol. That's practically the whole point of it from what I can see

[myTake Owner]

Men paying "more than half" of income tax & women getting "more than half" of welfare doesn't say mjcb. Even if it was 60%, that's only 10% more than half.

[tupperware]

https://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-soi/10in05w2.xls

In 2010, men earned about $3.5 trillion total. Women, about $2.1 trillion. The average tax rate in 2010 was 11.81% (https://taxfoundation. org/article/summary-latest-federal-income-tax-data-2012#table8).

So women paid a total of about $252B in income taxes (which is 38%) and men paid about $408.5B (which is the other 62%). That's a difference of 24%, or $156.5 billion.

Anything else? I have the numbers showing that men give women $3.2 billion a year in welfare alone, if you want to see them.

[genericname85]

your argument is invalid. women don´t earn less then men.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1oqyrflOQFc

also if i date you, why is it my obligation to compensate for me earning more than you? it´s not my fault that i earn more than you is it?

if i were earning less, there´d be a good chance, you wouldn´t date me anyway, thus i think you shouldn´t be payed on top of choosing the better earning date. (please don´t take this argument too serious i know this is not how it goes down in most cases... just playing the stereotypes).

i think it´s a sign of good will to invite a person to eating out. but i also think, i´m no 1940´s patriarchist sexist who´ll pay the women for eating with me. we are equal. food won´t set you back a lot so don´t complain if i think that both paying for their food on a date is fair. i mean gender paygap is bogus so why are we even discussing this? xD

[genericname85]

i think it got the wrong link https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1oqyrflOQFc

[Azara]

men should not pay for dates. that just makes women indebted. all the reasons you mentioned, are things that should be rejected on their own, men paying is not a compensation but a trap.

gynecological vids are paid for in most countries. its backwards that medical care is not a right as a citizen in civl society, as you need health to have good workers and flourishing economy.

as far as wearing the same thing, there's no law against it. if a guy would rather pay for you than have you re wear clothing he's choosing to control you with money and judgement. thats not a good candidate.

women products cit more as long as women accept this,. women make less as long as women accept this.

if men paying for dates creates the illusion things are 'equal' than it is detrimental, and in my opinion people should just go on very cheap dates so no one is sacrificing money and the content of the date is getting acquainted, not being purchased... if you really like a person money isn't necessary. people use money to compensate for lack of chemistry.

[myTake Owner]

menstrual products tho

[teawrecks]

I don't know. Like, I work hard to earn the money that I do and I have no problem spending it on things I need. I have no problem paying for myself for things, either.

I'm self-sufficient and I can't imagine being any other way in life. It makes me uncomfortable to ask or expect someone to pay my way for things, especially just because that person may have a dick in their pants.

I earned the money, if I want to have fun and enjoy myself then I will spend the money I earned knowing full well the repercussions it'll have on my bank account.

That is the adult decision I make when I decide if I want to go out.

[confused314636]

This is beyond stupid. How about the fact that men "on average" (rolling my eyes) pay more for car insurance & health insurance. We also have to pay for pretty much the same hygiene products only difference is tampons really.

No one is telling you to buy tons of clothes, underwear, make up, etc... That is your choice to buy those things. If you want a guy that likes those things, then sure go ahead, but you also have the option not too. Just like it is my choice whether or not I'm going to pay for a date. If I don't, probably won't get a second, but no one is making me.

I think the problem is that "some" women are so angry about the stuff that they have to go through, that they forget there is stuff men have to go through as well. It is not a "who has it worst" contest. I can tell you that if you had this attitude with me, I would not spend a penny on you. I don't date men hating women. And that is how you come across. Would you date a man that had this attitude towards women? Then why is it acceptable for you?

[myTake Owner]

Can you tell me more about what men have to go through?

[confused314636]

Haha, how about dealing with women, that alone should allow us higher wages... (obviously I'm kidding) but seriously, you sound like a child. And you are one, 18-24. Come back to me when you have experienced life a bit more.

No, it is not my job to educate you. Your responses to everyone else pretty much prove that you are not open to understanding the problems of men. You would probably just say it's our own faults cause Patriarchy right? But you are convinced it would be better if its a "matriarchy", which is sexist. How about a world where there isn't either?

The fact that you think men have no problems at all, only proves my point. You don't understand what it is like to be a man, anymore then men understand what it is like to be a woman. So stop blaming other people for your problems and grow up.

[confused314636]

What the hell, I'll throw a few in.

Higher suicide rates, domestic violence against men is accepted and laughed at, pressure to succeed (men are expected to, it's only a plus for women), pay more for car/life insurance, etc... There are a lot of things. Don't sit on your side and pretend it's all sunshine and blowjobs for us on this side of the fence. Cause we see a lot of benefits to being a women too, only difference is we get yelled at when we point them out.

[00Lelouchxx]

Long explanation

Men and woman are not equal though? Your body can't do what my body can. and mines can't either.

It weird me out when people say we are equal no were not Lol.

Now what woman want is the same human being rights as a man. Thats totally different.

And the reason why guys pay for the first date is because 9_times out of ten we asked u to hang out.

So we are taking u somewhere to hang. I have a male friend I hang out with. When ever I say let's hit the movie theater see batmanv superman I pay for the tickets. He wasn't planning on going there on his own I asked. its common courtesy's.

But we confused courting a woman with that. Like that part of the rules.

Once you get to know a girl start splitting thing with her I'll but the tickets u buy the drinks and pop corn. Stuff like that. speak up for your self.

Not all woman are gold diggers

We act as if our value as men is money. And woman value is how much can they use of it.

Yeah there are girl who are gold digger and expect a certain life style well those girl are treated like a value type item.

You don't want them for there personality right yo want them for the looks and body that they keep up.

[106473]

I believe it is gentlemanly to pay for dates, yet still split the bill sometimes.

As for your "pay" section women on average make about the same and the pay gap is a myth. Pay is determined by skill, experience and field of choice. If the female goes into the veterinary field and the male goes into the welding field the welder will make more. If they both choose the same profession they will make the same amount.

Alternative three is that they both have the same job yet the male or the female has more experience in the field they will get paid more.
'
Now if they both had the same job and same pay and the female has a child the female would more then likely have maternity leave. mean while everyone that was working in that field or office are down one employee and have to work harder to make up for the lack of help. Most men don't get maternity leave. So thats not equal.

Everything comes down to the decision of what job you pick to do, and what you decide to spend your money on.

[ManOnFire]

I believe that guys SHOULD pay for dates, yeah. And you don't even need all the reasons to explain away or justify why guys should. They just should. It's as simple as that. It is male courtesy for his female partner. Why is there even debate about this?

I feel like the guys who are angry about this and think women need to pay must be guys who are insecure about being men and don't want to have to do their male roles. It's just stupid. Pay for the damn date!

[godfatherfan]

Many people cannot afford to pay for everything. Also, once you have a lengthy relationship you will see you want a partner, not something that is one sided. If I am able to pay, I do. But if I start to date someone, and she does not at least offer to pay for something in the first 3 dates, I drop her. I have done that a few times. Some women don't want a relationship, they want free meals..

[Byakuyarko]

As long as the food is good and the conversation interesting... I don't think it matters who pays. Let the girl/guy pay whenever he/she feels generous. Women desire to be taken seriously as active competitors of males in and out of the work place... Which is only fair. So there's no point in treating them like adult children, who need to be 'taken care of'. If a woman can guide a space probe on interplanetary missions, she can and should bloody well treat her beau to dinner if she wants to.

[ManOnFire]

@godfatherfan I agree with you on the last part, that some women want free meals.

@Byakuyarko You do have a good point about if chicks can guide probes than they can treat a guy once in a while, yeah. I mean, women nowadays do want their own money and are so desperate to be wealthy with careers, so I guess sometimes it wouldn't be bad for her to pay. But overall it's just a male courtesy for a guy to treat his girl.

[Byakuyarko]

Hogwash. Hollywood and Wallstreet has brainwashed women into thinking that it's a man's privilege to date them. Men shouldn't be cheap on dates. But at the same time, women ought to stop expecting to be wined and dined for the privilege of their company. I see those relationships flourish in which men don't feel entitled to sex and women don't feel entitled to be pampered.

[skykidx1]

I agree

[Octavius]

"insecure about being men and don't want to have to do their male roles"

that's an oxymoron. It would be insecure doing roles only because you feel pressured to do them by society and those around you.

[93stepsawayfromhome]

— "you don't even need all the reasons to explain away or justify why guys should. They just should"

That is some serious North Korean level bullshit right there. No.

[bluenose1872]

Women don't want equality. They want everything laid at their feet. It's megalomania. Imagine real equality. Women calls you a creep and you break her jaw. No more chivalry. Women pulling their weight for a partner. No more maternity leave. No more special exceptions in work. Ridiculed like a man gets amongst his mates. Women don't get the brunt of real life coz men have shielded them from it. Its brutal unless you've got the right attitude. A man with a bad attitude anywhere gets it harsh. Women get treated with kids gloves. No more of that. It was fine the way it was. Always the loud few ruining it for everybody

[myTake Owner]

"Real equality; women calls you a creep and you break her jaw" Orrrrr how about you just stop hitting people in general?
How about you stop making fun of male friends?
You shouldn't achieve equality by extending injustice upon an unaffected group but by removing injustices from the affected group.

And by the way in the US there *is* no guaranteed paid maternity leave.
And men SHOULD get maternity leave, if they give birth. (Trans men do.) That's equality.

[bluenose1872]

You obviously don't live in the real world. Everybody around you are good little worker bees. They go to church every Sunday and make love to their partners the same time every week. They're shit scared to step outside the little line society painted for them. Inside they're screaming though. Dying to cut loose and do something reckless and impulsive. In my world men do hit men that mess with them. Women do get maternity leave and they do get the courts on their sides. They can be horrible bitches and a lot of them do need a belt in the mouth to get the wind out of their sails. Glad you live in paradise.

[Jager66]

The pay gap is a Myth, it has been debunked for decades.

-Women account for 85% of all consumer purchases including everything from autos to health care:
91% of New Homes
66% PCs
92% Vacations
80% Healthcare
65% New Cars
89% Bank Accounts
93% Food
93 % OTC Pharmaceuticals American women spend about $5 trillion annually…
Over half the U. S. GDP

- Senior women age 50 and older control net worth of $19 trillion and own more than three-fourths of the nation’s financial wealth.

-The number of wealthy women investors in the U. S. is growing at a faster rate than that of men. In a two-year period, the number of wealthy women in the U. S. grew 68%, while the number of men grew only 36%.

I think women can manage paying their half on a date.

[vonasaurus]

it's 2016~ if i have a job and disposable income, i can take care of myself.

when my man and i went on our first date, i came fully prepared to pay for myself. i let him buy me a cup of tea, when he offered, but i paid for my own meal.

now that we've been together for almost 2 years, we take turns paying for dates. or, if i pay for supper, he'll pay for the movie. other times, we'll split the check.

men should not be stuck with the tab just because of their gender. if someone is generous enough to pay my way, it's a kind gesture and i appreciate it... as long as it doesn't come with any strings (if you think i owe you sex because you bought me dinner, you've picked the wrong girl).

[Hopefuldreamer8]

I just prefer to pay for my own or to split. I've never liked for someone to pay for me. I make decent money now but even when I didn't, I still preferred to pay for myself.

Also, I've never heard of it being unacceptable for women to wear the same clothes again. This is definitely a new one. I love shopping for new clothes that I can wear many times and that will go with other outfits. Most women and girls I know do this.

I don't find any of the products that I need to buy sets be back that much. I can buy a box of pads and still be able to afford to buy a meal for myself or anyone else.

[myTake Owner]

Look at the big picture. Think of how much money you spend on pads in a LIFETIME

[Hopefuldreamer8]

Sure but that doesn't mean a guy is obligated to pay for everything for me. But then again, I like standing on my own two feet, and I've never expected anyone to pay for anything for me. Everything I have in my life, I've paid for myself. I was taught from a very early age not to rely on people.

[Stacyzee]

I agree with you.
The only people that make excuses not to pay dates are those who are cheap or looking for an excuse out.
I find the ones that don't want to pay for dates, are the ones that have had a 100 first dates.
There's a reason why you never make it past the first step, they instead take their anger out on the women and make it seem as if we are ripping them off.

However, I will state this.
When a relationship is established with this guy, I will have days where I pay for everything or treat him. Some days I will go half and half. In the beginning stages however, usually it is the male role to woo the woman.
As much as people hate to stand inside boxes of roles, it exists very much so in our society.

[myTake Owner]

Thank you for your affirmative opinion! I got a LOT of hate on this one!

[Stacyzee]

I know you! Lol! I'm pretty sure the haters will flock into my comment as well.

[Stacyzee]

**I know you did!

[Abe90]

I agree with the bottom half of your statement but you top half, not so much lol let's say for example: what if you found a guy you really like and he was practically broke and could barely afford to get by on his own. Would you give him a chance knowing that you may have to pay a little more than usual? He would eventually have to save up to pay for both of you though. Or would you move on because he can't afford to pay for you both?

And I think it depends on how we were raised that allows us to make our decisions

[Stacyzee]

Thanks for respectfully replying to me. I can't tell you how many users are hostile and want to rip me a part because they disagree with me. You're maturity is appreciated.
To answer your question , with that very personal dilemma taken into account if I really liked the guy I wouldn't mind paying more than usual until he stabilizes himself. The fact that he's a guy with goals is enough to make him appeal to me.
On the other hand , if he were broke and didn't care much about his future I wouldn't even consider him.

[ThisDudeHere]

It is unfair to assume that ALL men don't spend as much as women do.
If we are to assume that is true, then what of the men who actually do spend as much or even more? Because of your sexist ideals, they will still be expected to pay for dates, even though they don't abide by this "men in general spend less".

Lady, if you want things to be convenient for women only, it won't work that way. You have to make it convenient for us as well. And you do that by either just disregarding the whole notion of men having to pay, OR you compensate for men somehow. Like, if men HAVE to pay, you then, for instance, just HAVE to go on another date. OR sleep with the man on the first date. Or somethinh like that.

Absurd? Well you don't say?

Otherwise, what do men stand to gain by paying and potentially receiving nothing in return?

And no..."the privilege" of being in your company does not count. You're not a princess.