Virgin Guys and Angry Girls: A Message to Both

I am 19 years old and I never even had a kiss.

Now, I wanna clear up some things:

1) I'm not some weirdo

I look and dress normal, shower on a regular basis (of course), I have friends, I go out often, I have a job, I have hobbies etc.

2) "It will come"

By far the most annoying thing people here say. No, it won't. In my country the first kiss happens between the age of 10 and 14 (official statistics) and as for sex, I don't know the official numbers but from what I saw, I'd say 15-16. And those who are late do it at 17. So it might not be a big deal in your environment, but being 19 years old here and never having a kiss, is way too late and too big of a deal.

3) Lifestyle

I used to train two kinds of martial arts, basketball, and volleyball. I have been swimming for 13 years and I went on swimming competitions and won shit. I used to do some amateur bodybuilding too. On top of all that, I play guitar and write songs, I draw, I cook, I do spray paint art. No girl ever gave a fuck about any of those stuff. I also went through many social circles and hung out with many different groups, from popular kids, over metalheads to even criminals.

4) Giving it a rest

There have been periods when I would stop looking for a girlfriend and just focus on other activities. Still no girl magically walked into my life, like people here often say it happens.

5) Saving myself

I wasn't saving myself for somebody special, I simply never even had a chance to kiss any girl. No girl ever wanted me.

6) Looks

I'm no Brad Pitt, but slightly above average I'd say. 6'2 tall, about 190 pounds, buzz cut, short beard, wide shoulders etc. I don't think I can improve here much, since some stuff are up to genetics, but I did what I could. Also in the past, I used to have long hair, slick back hair, short hair, I was completely bald, I also had a full beard, stubble, goatee, and no beard. Girls weren't interested in me in any of those periods.

I hope I didn't forget any of those common things people think when they hear about my problem.

I know a billion guys who are like ugly, fat, losers, stoners, obsessive gamers and so on, guys who never did anything with their lives, and yet they can find girls with ease. And besides everything I've been through, I feel like a loser, because of the fact I could never even get a kiss from a girl.

And I saw many guys here write similar posts, only blaming women for everything, and also many women writing posts where they insult guys like me.

I'm not blaming women, since I really love women (even though they don't like me at all). Also I don't think it's okay to say for guys like me that we suck because we can't find a girl. So here is my message:

For girls:

Don't want to sound cocky, but how many girls here can say their boyfriends went through half of the things I did? Probably not many. I am far from perfect but I have been working on myself most of my life and it still didn't help in this aspect. I still have to watch kids who were riding bikes and playing hide and seek while I was looking for a girlfriend, now have girlfriends. Don't insult guys like me, because it's hard enough for them already. Just because relationships and dating are easy to get for you, it doesn't mean they are for everybody. Try to help, if you can't, at least don't be mean.

For guys:

I am a one in a billion fucked up case, and I will most likely die one day without knowing what it feels like to kiss a girl. But you are not me. If you are a loser, you can't expect for girls to be all over you. Work on yourself. Work on your looks, on your hobbies and activities, on your intelligence, on your social life etc. Work on everything. Not just for girls but for yourselves. If you are gonna be degenerate losers living in basements and playing video games, chances are you are not gonna get anywhere and probably no girl will like you either. First become a cool person.

I hope that through my fucked up case, I can at least point out some things to both genders and hopefully help with this "war" that has been going on here recently.

Thanks for reading!


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What Girls Said 9

  • 1mo

    I don't think you sound weird. 'normal' people can be so weird it's srsly stunning sometimes.

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    • 1mo

      Doesn't matter, normal people still can find somebody while for me, its impossible

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    • 1mo

      I have no idea. I know loser guys who have smoking hot girlfriends. And I couldn't get ANY girl in the universe. Thats why I said Im a lost cause. I dont know what the problem is. Nobody knows

    • 1mo

      Well start somewhere! I'm serious, try going after more average girls.

  • 16h

    interesting

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  • 1mo

    Some girls can have this struggle too. I am a 30 year old virgin and I've never been asked out. The only time I've kissed someone was when I was drunk. The last time was when I was 22 and my first kiss was at 20. I have a very ugly face and most guys ignore me. When I am interested in someone, and I show interest in them, I get rejected or worse, they act disgusted or offended that someone like me would dare be interested in them.

    I know that plenty of women do have it easier than guys, but not all of them. Women like me who aren't attractive have it as hard as men. Plenty of guys on here say I can just go out and have sex, but I don't want that. Yes, I could probably go to a bar and find some drunken guy who will take anyone, but I don't want to lose my virginity on a drunken one night stand. I want to be in a relationship.

    I understand your struggles completely. The problem is, most guys don't understand mine because they don't believe women struggle. I've heard most of the advice that you've listed as well. I hate it when people tell me that it will happen eventually. I'm 30 years old. I have plenty of guy friends, but once they find out I might be interested, they don't want much to do with me.

    I've also had guys on this site say that I probably never give men a chance. Guys have never asked me out. I've never rejected a guy. If a guy does ask me out, I will give him a chance.

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    • 1mo

      Wish I could help you, but as you can see, I can't even help myself. Maybe try working on your energy, natural feminine energy can compensate for looks. And as for looks, do what you can. Some things are up to genetics, but with hair and make up nowadays, every girl can improve her looks

  • 1mo

    I didn't have sex until I was 20, I didn't have a real boyfriend until that age as well. I was not as pessimistic about It as you. I honestly didn't want any male attention until around that age and low and behold I had a few people wanting my attention. It happens when it happens. You are young. Don't rush it.

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    • 1mo

      As you said, you didn't want anything before that. So its a completely different story. Im not rushing it, I am already way too late. And you are basically saying "it will come" which I said I hate, since its complete bs and the worst possible advice somebody can give to a person in my position

  • 1mo

    I think it's hard to meet someone these days. I have lots of single friends, and like you, we're all normal, attractive people who just struggle to meet someone. Or have been through break ups.

    I'd like to quote you here "Don't insult guys like me, because it's hard enough for them already. Just because relationships and dating are easy to get for you, it doesn't mean they are for everybody. Try to help, if you can't, at least don't be mean". I couldn't agree more, but I think that applies to both genders, not just girls. A lot of the men on here seem to enjoy trolling and making fun of the women and girls who are on here asking for advice just as much.

    I think it's something that everyone on here should take notice of, and try to help instead of just being unpleasant to people.

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    • 1mo

      Agreed. And it is hard nowadays, but considering so many people do it with ease, clearly we are doing something wrong...

    • 1mo

      I've had a few conversations about this with my friends (male and female), and the main conclusion we keep reaching is that we are pickier than some of our coupled up friends, and won't settle for someone we wouldn't be happy with. Not just talking about looks obviously. Some people would rather have 'anyone' rather than 'someone special' I think.

      Good luck though, I hope you do meet someone lovely, you never know when it might happen :)

    • 1mo

      Well Im not looking for "the one" either. I have no problem with casual stuff. But I can't have either. Good luck to you too :)

  • 1mo

    Okay, I'm 18 and I didn't get my first kiss until 2 months ago because no one liked me. I wasn't the cutest girl until this year but never ugly. I've improved. I had a shy personality until a couple years ago. Now I'm outgoing. People seemed to like me more when I was working on myself. The better my personality was, the more people who liked me. It's not just about being attractive. It's about how you carry yourself. It's about how you come off to people. It's about whether you seem interesting or not.

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    • 1mo

      I have a lot of friends (of both genders) so apparently people in general see something interesting about me.

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    • 1mo

      Well yes, but I mentioned that as an example since nobody was ever attracted to me

    • 1mo

      You just need to find someone whose interested in what you put out into the world

  • 1mo

    You mentioned your looks and your lifestyle, but nothing about your personality and attitude. I think improving that area is the key to getting what you want.

    I would never shame you for being inexperienced at your age. And I appreciate you not turning into a woman hater. Good luck to you.

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    • 1mo

      Well I think the fact I did so many activites and all says a bit about my attitude. But overall, what is your suggestion for improving?

  • 1mo

    media4.giphy.com/media/lhVtLMpuC9uAU/giphy.gif
    Try being in your mid 20's and being a virgin, and you think 19 is too late to start? Ffs your still a pup!
    I am saving myself for someone special though, I want to do it with someone I actually really like and have feelings for. I've been kissed. . . and not a very pleasant first kiss when I was 17. The guy was like a washing machine on spin, I had a sore throat and a bad cough for a week afterwards. I've had 3 one off dates, none of them were suitable for me. All other possible dates screwed up before they met me, so I cancelled them.

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    • 1mo

      You are a completely different story. The opposite sex is interested in you. You just chose to be like this. I had no choice about my situation.

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    • 1mo

      @Shorty1991 Thanks and I understand your position. I guess that this is what the Topic Creator is more or less afraid of, and I honestly don't blame him. I've felt this way too for a while but, I was able to overcome many of the odds by trying. Everyone has a different solution to a common problem but my method/story, wasn't helpful to him.

    • 1mo

      @Amorphous Thanks, you too!

  • 1mo

    I say this without the intent of coming off as just another "mean girl," but here's my perspective. You sound like a great guy. Had I met you, I probably would have wanted to get to know you. You've done lots of really interesting things, and we share a lot of the same interests. However, it's your attitude that made me immediately want to back off. "By far the most annoying thing people on here say. No, it won't" (referencing the "just wait, it will happen" argument). That attitude would make me drop you like a hot potato. You're WAY too pessimistic, and I'm not going to hang around with a debbie downer who, at only 19 (REGARDLESS of statistics), has just decided nope, I'm doomed forever. People can sense when you're giving off that attitude, and it's contagious. No one feels like being depressed, and so they don't want to be around you when you're like that. Know what I mean?

    I was 23 when I had my first kiss, despite, as you say, the statistics being QUITE against me for my country. That relationship, which I'm still in, was completely unexpected -- it just happened, I didn't even know I was of interest to anyone until I was approached. I'm not saying "Just wait, it'll happen," because you're right, that's really freaking annoying to hear. What I'm saying is that you need to stop being so damn pessimistic. "No, it won't happen." YOU DON'T KNOW THAT. Stop. It surely won't if you keep up that attitude, because everyone around is going to feel it and not want to even be a part of that.

    I genuinely didn't mean to come across as mean or angry. It's just difficult to put this opinion into words without sounding so.

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    • 1mo

      I wasn't always this pessimistic. This is a result of the above mentioned experience. Also, for everybody else, it just happened but at the age of 14 or 15. And I have been more socially active than anybody I know. If it was going to happen to me, it would have, a billion times by now. Don't worry, you don't sound mean and thank you for the kind words at the beginning

    • 1mo

      "Stop being so damn pessimistic."
      Wow, I didn't know it was that easy - I'm cured.

      You're right about the rest though, and I wouldn't want to burden anyone else with my depression.

    • 1mo

      AND YOU DON'T KNOW IF IT ACTUALLY WILL HAPPEN, WHICH IT MIGHT NEVER.
      So assuming it never will is the best chance to not get disappointed when it actually doesn't.
      You have no way to predict the future and odds aren't always in everyone's favor regardless of their decisions and actions to prevent or change things.

What Guys Said 22

  • 1mo

    You can be all of these all you want but no girl is just gonna go on your front door step looking like a lost puppy and looking to fuck.

    You have to go out and talk to many girls, get to know many women, befriending many women. That's how you get sex. Even tinder is a decently easy way to get sex.

    I'm 19, haven't had my first kiss or have had sex. I'm not going to mope about it and cry myself to sleep at night. You know why? I didn't try hard enough, it was never in my interest.

    So stop feeling sorry for yourself and go out there and get some pussy dude.

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  • 1mo

    I'm sure some girls are interested. Your just not reading the signals thier given you.

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  • 1mo

    Same in America bud. First kiss usually happens between 10-15. I didn't get mine until I was at prom at 17 as a joke and the first real one was 22 with my first fiancée.

    It's happens in its own time. Work on yourself and making yourself proud internally but humble externally.

    In time bud, don't stress. The women in your generation are almost all irredeemable trash.

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  • 1mo

    Go to some kind of social event that girls will be at and get really drunk and smoke a ton of weed, something will probably happen :D

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    • 1mo

      It sounds funny but I'm serious

    • 1mo

      Doesn't sound funny, Im on such events very often, I go out quite often. But no, it didn't help. I thought it would too

    • 1mo

      But do you get really high? That is the deciding factor when it's me, I have to get high enough to not care what other people think of me at all.

  • 1mo

    I embrace my weirdness. My hair is crazy and my interests are exclusively movies.
    I think I'm in the state of not looking for a girl, just keeping an eye out for one.

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  • 1mo

    You say you're 19 and you're from Serbia? It's hard for an American guy to advise you on how to score with Serbian women, but there are a few universal truths to consider:

    Even if you didn't miss out on the dating scene during your junior and senior year in high school, being a 19 or 20 year old guy is absolutely the worst age you can possibly be. That's because, legally, you're to old to date high school girls and you're to young, immature and poor to be taken seriously by girls your own age.

    Also, here in America the vast majority of 15 and 16 year old guys have never come close to getting laid. I have to assume that the same holds true for Serbian guys. So just ignore the bullshit that your guy friends have been feeding you, feel good about yourself, and get on with your life.

    When you turn 28, have a decent job, and are still having these problems with women then you'll have something to feel depressed over. Just remember that being a 19 year old guy is the absolute lowest time in most guys love lives.

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    • 1mo

      Yes, you are right, it is a very tough position to be in. But I couldn't find a girl even while I was in school and had like 200-300 girls around me every day. Now I have almost none. And here actually most 15 and 16 year olds are sexually active. And not just because they say so, but you can actually see these kids change girlfriends often and such stuff :/

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    • 1mo

      Yup! I get where you're coming from. When I was your age I was where you are now. That's why I'm saying you're way to young to give up and get down on yourself. If everything you've said about yourself here is true then you have a great future with women. Just know that you're not a freak. I've known so many smart and great looking guys who've gone through exactly what you've been going through and then went on to find girlfriends and eventually get married. Just stay positive and your luck will change real soon and in a big way. Hope this helps?

    • 1mo

      It actually does. Im just afraid that I will never know what casual hook ups and casual sex feel like, since thats the stuff people do more at a younger age. As I get older, girls my age are gonna want more serious stuff and even marriage

  • 1mo

    Man people here need to get their heads out of the their ass's...
    Everyone who thinks that if you work hard on yourself and keep trying and failing - you will eventually win... YEAH RIGHT... BULL-FUCKING HORSE SHIT.
    *You just have to wait, someone will eventually come* - The typical A grade excuse anyone can come up with to avoid giving the real answer, that YOU are most likely SCREWED from start to finish.

    You can keep trying for over 30 years and the result will most likely be the same.
    Not everyone lives in this fairy land where if you keep trying hard you eventually win. NO, there is no such land... You can keep going to the gym, be social all you want, you can change you behaviour, lower your expectations and standards to a bare minimum and the result will still be the same. Women will still find you repulsive or unattractive...

    They say *Looks aren't everything* but they ARE.
    Then they give you some bullshit story about *My Boyfriend / Girlfriend* another typical story of my life 101 answer. Do we really NEED to know YOUR story? No, but you shove it in our faces anyway.

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    • 1mo

      I get your point but if it was only up to looks, how do you explain a billion guys I know who are not only uglier than me, but really ugly fucking rats in general, and they can find girls with ease?

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    • 1mo

      that is your decision and im not going to argue about this, i stand by my point of view - you stand by yours.

    • 1mo

      Exactly. Thanks for sharing your opinion anyway. Cheers!

  • 1mo

    Thanks for sharing this amazing rant of self-aggrandazing shit.

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    • 1mo

      That was not the point of the post, I just mentioned most common bs people write to me here so I needed to explain why its all bullshit

  • 1mo

    I'm 31, incel. Think anyone magically walked into my life? No. This is bullshit.

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  • 1mo

    First off... I did not have sex till I was 27 and I am 32 now. I also was not a virgin you would pick out of a crowd. Literally one the "hotties" at my high school and to this day women look at me and say "REALLY? You? 27?".
    Yes society is brutal about making you feel like a total loser until you have sex (especially in college type atmosphere). Society also does NO FAVORS to lots of men by telling them "it will come eventually blah blah blah".
    THAT SAID I have to give you what I got at one point... tough love: If you want to learn how to swim you just have to jump in the water.
    BOTTOM LINE: Even if you are a combination of smart, good-looking and kind... that is not enough by itself. You have to be willing to put yourself out there and take risks WITHOUT EXPECTATIONS. You can't just go out to bars... you have to strike up conversations. No matter how much of a douche-bag a guy is, or how ugly, or how weird... if he is the only one present who is taking the initiative then as far as many women are concerned he is the only guy who is expressing interest (CORRECT me on that if you want ladies... I am quoting what platonic female friends have told me).
    If you have not worked on how to flirt with women or ask them on dates then yes it will be brutal to start (I am not going to sugar coat that part because it was brutal for me too). Yes you are probably going to make a fool of yourself. Don't despair over it... just join the club with the rest of us and understand that finding a relationship goes hand in hand with feeling like an idiot. Just remember to try and not be a douche-bag at your most difficult moments. Remember to not ever take rejection personally, because when all is said and done attraction is not a choice.
    Couple of ideas:
    1) Get comfortable with yourself as is - This needs to happen anyways for your own peace of mind. More to the point, if you feel like you are not enough without a girlfriend they are going to "smell" it on you and observe it in your behaviors. It is not a healthy state to live in no matter your relationship status.
    2) Female friends - platonic friendships with women are often key to helping you get comfortable around women, sort out your own motives, figure out the do's and do-not's and potentially have a wing-woman to guide you.
    3) Be more social outside of your inner circle - Yeah... I know... this one is annoying because I normally prefer to work on really close friendships but that is not how you meet new people.

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    • 1mo

      Great points! Its just sometimes hard to believe that a bunch of losers never put in any effort and girls came into their lives, while I couldn't find one even if I was the only guy in the world. But you are right 100% about everything you wrote. Any tips on how to be more comfortable with myself?

    • 1mo

      Who THE FUCK needs platonic relationships? I WANT TO GET LAID, NOT LISTEN TO SOME BULLSHIT STORY ABOUT A GIRL BEING MISTREATED BY SOME OTHER GUY...

      Good grief did you spit a pile of crap.

    • 1mo

      I could give two shits about what society dictates as being a "Loser" or a "Winner". That BS is subjective and I personally don't think that anyone should be allowing themselves to get dictated by this freaked up paradigm in the first place.

  • 1mo

    I'm 21 years old (turning 22 in a month), virgin, never had a girlfriend, never had a kiss.
    But I do not make it a too big of a deal, yet at times it gets me.

    I don't care about the fact of what I just said and let life do it's course, not, that I believe, that I am gods plan but more like it's my fate.
    I am just destined to be it.

    They say my time will come but I don't think so. My time is running out and there's nothing I can do about it.

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    • 1mo

      Well if you are ok with it, thats your thing. But I am not, I hate it and I want to change it. I have been trying for years, but no success

  • 1mo

    Mate you can't say you are putting yourself up to the game because you are not. I workout, draw, do cycling, running, dancing, photography, gaming, partying, cooking... Like in the past people used to say I was that one guy in a million, and whoever gets to date me is the luckiest in the world, bla bla bla... They also wondered why I'm single. You know why? Because I spent a lot of time "perfecting" myself. Until I said to myself..."Why don't I go out and meet some girls.. FLIRT with them, try to DO SOMETHING with them". So at the age of 19 I started partying. Half year later I turned 20 and had my first kiss at one of those parties. How? I made my intentions clear... I went up to the girl, started dancing, flirting and we eventually made out. The day after, I was shocked how I finally had my first kiss... Man, the following months my friends started to say..."Wow, you kiss every girl now... Teach me your trick...".
    You HAVE TO APPROACH THEM! Same goes for the dating world.

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  • 1mo

    I kinda believe this is trolling to me but I'll still reply seriously:

    With your age + features, some hours research of Tinder (like sign up as a girl on a fake account and look how other males look in their photos), make some effort into putting together a good profile and swiping right on everyone you like, plus spending your super-likes... There is simply no way you'd not be fairly successful.

    I mean... I'm 25, I've most likely liked around 2000-2500 persons if I were to guess based on my usage... I've had about 20 matches, when I show my matches to my friend he says my standard is too low so they're not models... Out of these, I've been on 5 first dates and 3 second dates. I've given a single kiss to two of them and made out 1 of them.

    Prior to Tinder, I haven't had a convo longer than 10 minutes with a "random" girl. My above statistics speak for themselves just how much of a catch I am, so if even I can score a kiss from Tinder, I believe it's pure trolling when you say that you cannot.

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  • 1mo

    Oh right, lako je to reći, ali malo teže napraviti :P

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    • 1mo

      Na sta tacno mislis?

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    • 1mo

      Onda me ti ovde najbolje kontas, jer tesko je ovim strancima objasniti koliko se kod nas te stvari rano desavaju, i koliko sam ja vec propustio sa 19 a da ne spominjem tebe :/

    • 1mo

      Pa, živa istina nažalost, naročito kod nas na Balkanu :(

  • 1mo

    I had my first kiss late but have got a lot further as of late. What I've found is that there are a LOT of people in your position on here, anonymity probably. These statistics are just social norms and are self reported. Self reported studies are usually erroneous. Most people like you are ashamed and so you never really find out how many people are actually in the same boat. Things seem to happen easier once you gain a bit of experience. Stay positive bro

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    • 1mo

      Oh and by the way your only 19! I don't understand how you got this whole idea of dying without getting a kiss.

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    • 1mo

      it's hard to say without meeting you man, maybe there's something about yourself your not picking up on or your judgement of how you are perceived is skewed. Your tall, girls usually like that. The one complaint I have is your attitude, as I said listen to edibor.

    • 1mo

      Yeah, well, I might never find out :/ But thanks the good will to help and for actually trying to say something constructive instead of the usual pep talk I get. Cheers!

  • 1mo

    Go to China, show them your passport, and let the girls come. Seriously, go to other countries, being "white" and "American (if you are)" actually means something there.

    America and the West are too stuck up on individualism to see through this and if you point it out, they call you racist. Well, I'd rather be racist than single forever.

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    • 1mo

      Im not American, Im Serbian, the whole world hates my country and my people so I doubt it would help

    • 1mo

      Is that true? lol I've heard other people say that too. Americans really do seem pretty stuck up though, especially if they're white and middle class

  • 1mo

    you are still 19, that is very young, statistics or not, still very young

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    • 1mo

      As I said, maybe its young for your environment. For mine its way too late. I know A LOT of people yet I dont know literally anybody in my situation. From both younger and older people than me.

  • 1mo

    It really sucks when you try your best and have nothing to show for it.

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  • 1mo

    Dude I didn't get my first kiss or laid until I was 21. It's not the end of the world, but regardless of your struggles, never be pessimistic or negative, especially around women. Trust me, your lack of confidence will be more of a turn off than anything.

    I mean don't put it out there that you're a virgin or never been kissed, but once you do, you'll realize nothing changes. Dry spells happen for men even after losing their virginity.

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    • 1mo

      Nobody around me knows this. Thats why I share it here. It is the end of the world here, where 15 year olds have an active sex life.

    • 1mo

      Where do you live? But in all honesty, there'll always be guys who have it better and worse than you do. Such is life. You can't get too fixated ok the fact younger people are getting laid.

    • 1mo

      Of course, its natural to have people better and worse than you. But when in one aspect of life everybody is better than you, well that's a problem

  • 1mo

    well who says statistics can control your life? you are plain stupid. you can easily kiss a drunk girl in a club TONIGHT. you can be so absolut and a downer... .

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    • 1mo

      I can't, maybe you can. If I could, I would have, a billion times by now

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    • 1mo

      most are gems, but you can begin with things like the video abuot "sluts" where he totally debunks your ideas of women and helps giving you a healthier paradigm of looking them as the sexual creatures they normally are with no prejudice or passion... .

    • 1mo

      Ok, thanks for the advice!

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