Why do the vast majority of men believe in paying for the first date in America?

Women have constantly fought for equality in the workforce and now earn the same as men do WHEN STARTING OUT. The pay gap doesn't begin until they take off for children. If I split the bill so many women wouldn't even think to give me a second date. Why are men expected to pay for the first date? And how many many dates do we have to pay for?


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Most Helpful Girl

  • Because its called being a gentlemen

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    • It's called sexism.

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    • @AroundTheWorld

      It is sexist because men are the ones expected to be chivalrous, not women.

    • @AroundTheWorld

Most Helpful Guy

  • Men pay for the first date to establish neutrality. I pay for everything on a first date. If I realize there is not, and won't be, any chemistry, I can walk away feeling like I provided a social opportunity that just didn't play out. First dates are not a competition. When I ask a woman to join me for dinner, that's what "I" am asking: "Join" me for dinner. I am having dinner, I am paying for that dinner, I would like your company during that dinner. Going "halves" on anything usually involves implied obligation, which is a really bad way to start any relationship. And that's another thing: Since when did a first date signify the beginning of a relationship? Two people getting together to decide if they want if they want to spend more time together shouldn't obligate the person invited to pay for their part of the social event. Pay for the first date. It shows a woman you are interested in her, without expecting her to pay for the privilege of being in your presence. A woman who agrees to have dinner with you has already provided her side of the social obligation. Asking her to pay half is kind of an insult. Man up. Pay for the first date. Good time. Second date. Bad time. You've paid her to be a grown up and walk away.

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What Girls Said 15

  • if men themselves aren't having a problem with it, i dont c why this is an issue.

    i know plenty of women who'd b more than happy to split a bill. a woman who expects a man to pay for every single date is a high maintenance princess in my opinion. like that's not even having standards. that's just being a brat.

    we could sit here complaining about why some traditions aren't yet abolished, or we could move on and compromise. the choice is yours.

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  • I always pay for at least myself, and preferably for the guy too.

    I make quite a bit of money, it's only logical for me to pay. Expecting the guy to always pay is sexist. "Chivalry" is code for sexism.

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    • No it's not, what about chivalrous behavior taught to sons by their own mothers?
      Is that sexist, women teaching boys to be courteous, to pay for first dates, to be expected to do so?
      Men didn't invent Chivalry, Women will be the death of it.
      I have a friend who thinks as such and will ask me why she can't "Find a good man"
      and my question is "What do you look for in a good man", When she replies I always go "You mean you want someone to do things you just said you hate, for you?"

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    • I respect your opinion. I find that most women want equality until it actually comes to the responsibilities that said equality entails. A woman who puts her money where her mouth is and takes responsibility for herself is sexy, and it says a lot about your character.

    • @AroundTheWorld ""Is that sexist, women teaching boys to be courteous, to pay for first dates, to be expected to do so?""

      Yes, they're teaching him sexist behavior. Just because a female teaches you sexist behavior, doesn't mean it's not sexist.

      @Kirah I've always said whoever earns more money should be the one to offer to pay, I admire how you're on the same page. More people should think like you do.

  • Tradition, probably. Doesn't mean it's right, but these things take time to change and catch up with the reality.

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  • If someone (man or woman) INVITES me for dinner than they should pay the bill as I would pay the bill if I invited someone for something - however if they just asked me out and didn't make it clear that they invited me I'd actually be prepared to pay for my part because why would they need to pay for me in that case?
    Guess it's still a little more.. conservative (?) in America though..

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    • how often do you invite men out?

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    • @Asker
      She knows goddamn well that women never ask men out. Ever. And she knows she's a hypocrite. She's mad because she grew up during peak feminism and was left with the idea that women just innately deserve to have a man do all the work, pay all the money, and shuffle off and dispose of himself when convenient.

    • lol nice one 😂😂😂I WISH IT WAS ALL THAT SIMPLE @Transigence

  • usually the men do the asking, so they do the paying. i think whoever asks should pay.

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    • But that is hypocritical because women typically dont ask

    • i dont think you understand the meaning of hipocritical...
      women usually ask after the first date, usually not the first, ur right. but it just depends on the people really.
      i dont think the man should ask the woman and then expect her to pay. sometimes they go half and half. but it really depends.

    • women expect the man to ask when they won't ask themsevles

  • I don't actually think it's true that women earn the same as men at the start of their careers, but I agree with you that the rule is silly. That said, I always leave it to the guy to pay for the first date, 'cause on the occasions where I have not, I have, without exception, gotten the response "Don't you want this to be a date?"
    How many do you have to pay for? None. You can reject the rule and hold out for women who share your view.

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  • Because traditional roles, it shows the possibility that the guy isn't cheap, it is gentlemanly, and its a nice gesture.

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    • that sounds so incredibly sexist

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    • Pathetic*

    • so many women detest cooking for their man, that is the thing

  • If you don't want to pay for her then don't. It's that simple. If it's such a huge issue for her she is not worth your time.

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  • I won't look at the other opinions for my own well being. I think everyone should pay for what they eat.

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  • I didn't know they did.

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  • I generally try to split, so the guy doesn't feel like I owe him anything. If a girl ditches a guy because of him not paying, she's just looking for an excuse to not date him.

    That being said, guys DO generally start with a higher interest level, as they approach females they find sexually alluring and females are pressured to "give him a chance" and date guys they don't have an automatic interest in. Also, the guy generally chooses the place, she may get stuck going somewhere she also has little to no interest in. So there could already be two strikes against her incentive to show up. That's why the first few dates should be super low key - like coffee or a beer. That cuts down on everyone's investment all around until you decide if you like each other or not.

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  • i dont get it either, the times have changed!

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  • Hi anonymous

    Many women and many men still have traditional values... I generally earn more than the men I date but I still appreciate them paying for the first date, if not the consecutive ones. It shows a willingness to look after the woman and offer some small financial support. You say the pay gap doesn't begin until they take off for children but on some level that is what girls are looking ahead to. Men subconsciously look for the most fertile woman and women subconsciously look for a mix of traits that lead to a good father (read The Social Animal if you are interested in this), part of which is the ability to provide support on a number of levels, including financial. I can understand your frustration but unfortunately just like a small waist and larger hips and chest probably looks good to you, women like power and money. That's life. It also gives us girls some protection as you're less likely to cover the first date unless you're planning on having more dates... (so it weeds out the players). That said, if she says she's a feminist and makes you foot the bill I'd dump her for being a hypocrite.

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    • Oh and sorry - why do men foot the 1st bill date? Mostly so they'll get better chicks. I know a millionaire who starts every party by buying his group champagne. It's annoying, especially for the other men, but irritatingly effective. America's not so bad- in Geneva you can't get a date without showing a girl your payslip first!!

    • Who is the author of the social animal? I see different books with that title

  • I think because it's polite, and we've been doing it for centuries and it hasn't changed yet. If I was going on a date with my boyfriend I would offer to split the bill evenly between us, unless he insisted that he wanted to pay.

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    • but would you actually split the bill and gladly do so

    • Yes.

  • is there ANYTHING at all that men WANT to do?

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    • So men are always expected to pay, they say they're sick of it, and now you're calling them lazy and entitled?

      What have YOU done?

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    • and by not paying for anything you accomplish that? alrighty then...

    • Do you understand logic, or are you just intentionally trolling? How is "bags of male attention" an argument? Is it because the things that draw male attention are somehow worthless? You need to grow up.

What Guys Said 31

  • It depends on who you ask, for me personally I was raised to be a gentleman, to treat a women right, I'm old fashioned don't ever see myself changing. Now if a women wants to pay for her half that's fine but I have to at least offer to pay for the full thing.

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    • so then your wife won't have a career then? She will be at home taking care of the kids?

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    • It does. 15 years ago that is how it was. 20 years ago that is how it was. The only thing that changed was women not having to cook but men still have to pay for almost everything

    • -shakes head-

  • OMG! Can broke ass men please stop complaining about paying for the first date like it's a thing? It's like hearing a friggin' ugly or 14 year old girl complaining about why girls should have sex with a guy if they want a relationship and why guys should just all wait or be with a girl without sex.

    It's not about the "money." The same way that it's not about the "sex."

    At the very least, it's a sign and an indication that a man can put his own ego aside for a moment, and simply cater to and give a girl what he reasonably perceives she wants and what he reasonably perceives is "IMPORTANT TO HER... AS A WOMAN."

    It shows he cares.

    Now, some girls have an issue with it. Some girls are all like, "No! I can pay for myself, I DON'T NEED A MAN TO PAY FOR ME!"

    Some girls are all like, "No! I'm going to pay for myself, because I don't want to feel and I don't want you to feel like I owe you something (sexual) later on just because you paid for me."

    At that point, all you can do is "listen" and listen very carefully, because there's a fine line between a girl simply trying to show you that she "doesn't EXPECT a man to PAY FOR HER," versus her basically showing you that she has really deep issues with men in general (and the kind of woman you don't want to be in a relationship with).

    But please, PLEASE... for the love of God... stop complaining about paying for first dates.

    Not for nothing, but does everyone notice how it's always 15 to 24 year old guys that complain about paying for first dates?

    I mean, at that age, nobody can fault these guys with being "cheap," because we get it, money is tight or just not there - yet there are no shortages of sexual urges. It's a difficult period in a guy's life. We get it. The more important question is, do YOU get it?

    Instead of trying to "intellectualize" and come up with an "excuse" for your temporary financial inadequacy and sense of financial worthlessness and lack of real social status and standing in the world as a man... and instead of trying to have girls "compensate" for this temporary period in your life... can you just admit that you're just broke - and although you'd love to feel the pleasure of taking care of, spoiling, and showering a girl with affection and a sense of comfort in being with you... you can't yet... and that's OKAY

    Nobody reasonably expects you to at 18-24 ... so stop trying to grow up too fast... live in the NOW... not in the 5-10 years from now

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    • Hahha yes 🏆

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    • But, if you adopt this inflexible, rigid, hard-and-fast "protest" or "strike" rule of... "Fuck women... let them act first... I'm not going to expose myself to the risk of being used, taken advantage of or manipulated," then the only person you're hurting is yourself.

    • "It shows he cares."

      Explain why women shouldn't show that they care. Expecting the guy to always pay is incredibly sexist, and it's all feeding back into the "putting women on a pedestal" effect.

  • Cause I was raised to be a old fashioned gentleman and to not let chivalry die

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    • The idea of being a gentleman is sexist. People say being a gentleman is just being nice but people definitely put an expectation on men to be nice to woman

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    • I know, just the gender roles that apply to guys.

    • @the_champ HAHAHAHA that killed him. Such a true point

  • I would automatically pay for the first and all dates even if I was a pauper and she was a millionaire. Why? Because that's just the way I am. I couldn't be any other way. I suppose it's my way of giving her something. Just because I want to. That is reason enough.

    If she wants to split, I'm fine with that. But I would prefer it to be because she wanted to, instead of feeling obligated to offer. But I would never ask her to, no matter how little money I had or how much she has.

    If she wanted to pay for the whole thing, because she wanted to. I would accept it and thank her. It would probably also make me feel really good. Because it's sending the same message that I would be sending her if I paid.

    The whole thing is voluntary. If one feels it's necessary, or some kind of obligation, then it loses it's meaning. It only has meaning because it's voluntary. It only has meaning if the person *wants* to do it, freely given.

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    • The principle to your reason is, I do it because I want to.

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    • Your logical is still, that is just what men do.

    • That's correct. It's pretty simple.

  • I'd never ask a girl on a dinner date or anything expensive for the first meeting. Like why would I want to blow a lot of money on someone I barely know.

    Also it only puts you at risk for being taken advantage of by girls like this

    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=qAhO5SLF9Ck

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  • Because splitting the bill is way less romantic. I don't even do dinner/food dates for a first date or two anyways because I think there's way better date ideas but if I do end up having that as a date I'm paying for the time that they took out of their day to spend with me. You don't HAVE to pay for them if you don't want to. Nothing is making you and you shouldn't feel pressured or required to do it. I still do it because I like being nice to the people that are in my life.

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  • I treated my first girlfriend to the movies, but funny thing is that i was broke and in college and she was too. I used my last 20 bucks on movie tickets and after she treated me to dinner and money was never an issue.

    It never should be... well to a certain limit tho

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  • The person to make the invitation should offer to pay for the other person's half. Whether it be male or female. But everyone should assume that they ought to pay their own half.

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    • countless studies have shown that women disingenuously offer

    • Asker, you're right. Lots of women offer as a shit test to see if you'll accept. I've met a few women that ACTUALLY

    • believe they should pay for themselves.

  • Because the mating rituals of most animals consist of the male impressing the female with the size of his antlers, physical strength or colors of his feathers or other abilities.

    Humans are no different.

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  • Charge of Irascibility (Code Red)

    Discussion: The target is accused of having anger management issues. Whatever negative emotions he has are assumed to be unjustifiable. Examples:

    “You’re bitter!”
    “You need to get over your anger at women.”
    “You are so negative!”
    Response: Anger is a legitimate emotion in the face of injustice. It is important to remember that passive acceptance of evil is not a virtue.

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  • She got me fucked up if she think I'm going to be some free meal giving door mat lol and this is how you get through them gold diggers this is their kryptonite I don't have time for high maintenance bitches.

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  • Know what's more interesting, I find a lot of women tout "Feminism" and "I'm just as good as any man" and "Equality!" get very very offended if you hold open a door or pull out a chair. But don't reach for that bill first and see what happens.'

    Note: This is not ALL women, but a good majority of the ones I've dated.
    One of them proceeded to give me a lecture on how ALL men behaved and thought, I spent around 10 minutes showing her exactly what she wanted, her psychology friend standing right near her chuckling (her friend has known me for over twelve years) and then promptly shut the whole act down and read her the riot act.

    I don't mind paying for dinner or movies, even as friends.

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  • Apparently, women want equality... until the bill comes, and then we are back in the 1950s again

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  • Women are now more willing to go dutch on dates these days!

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  • Its cuz we gott impress them and win their hearts or else they will runaway. Im shure thTs what every guy who pays for his cutie worry about that.

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  • Cause women are the most sexist gender. They are shamelessly sexist.

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  • Who cares?

    Simple solution, don't take a girl on a pricey date until after you've had sex with her.

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    • Good advice. Just invite her to do shit you were already going to do anyway. "Hey, I'm going to the laundry mat on Thursday evening, want to come hang out?" Maybe spot her a soda. If she actually likes you, then she'll just like being around you. If she doesn't, she can pretty much go away.

  • I would never pay for the first date. I just don't see why I should so I won't.

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  • Because its a tradition, a none spoken rule to dating. It's expected of the man in the relationship. If it's not broke, don't fix it.
    Women may want equality, but somethings don't change.

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    • Women are also "traditionally" stay at home moms, cooks, and caretakers. We've been brainwashed in this society to believe that women should be free from their traditional roles, while men should not be. Equal should = equal. Take the bad with the good.

  • hey i dont mind paying but on my terms not hers, if the woman wants something more pricey or go to a more expensice place then I dont mind going dutch with her.

    I always tell them that : )

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  • Because theoretically women are not given equal pay to pay for their own lunch !

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    • "Theoretically" is the key word. On average men work more hours and are expected to do the more dangerous and disgusting jobs. In my humble opinion, someone working on an offshore oil well deserves higher pay than a nurse. More risk, more reward. Male dominated professions tend to pay a higher salary than female dominated professions for a reason, and that reason is risk.

      For the same job and same hours, there is virtually no pay gap. Statistics can be interpreted any way you want.

      You will find that many statistics and "facts" are conveniently interpreted to serve a purpose.

    • some people just can't get sarcasm.

  • this is an acceptable double standard. i don't think equal rights extends to dating.

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  • Whoever asks pays. If the woman asks you out on a date and expects you to pay, ditch her.

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    • women don't tend to ask

  • Because they are insane

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  • Because we pay for the dates. The woman's family pays for the wedding. Its just how its been done for years. You date people with the intention places go somewhere only if things work out. Yes not every relationship will work out but you need to date people in order to know what you want in a relationship.

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  • I've learned fro experience that if you don't pay for a first date, you won't get a 2nd because women will think you are cheap. I have also come to learn that if you pay for the first date, you still might not get a 2nd date. Dating sucks for guys and it can burn a hole in your wallet.

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  • We may be equal today, but women are more equal than men.

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  • Well personally, I just don't like seeming to be cheap. I don't like cheap people myself and I wouldn't expect a girl to find cheapness or over-concern with money an attractive trait.

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    • She's cheap if she doesn't intend to pay for herself. How is that any different?

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    • she typically won't invite you out to pay and countless studies show that women who offer don't really mean it

    • Well that doesn't really bother me. I have had women ask me out and pay but not as often as I ask them out and pay but I just don't care. It's a minor expense and I'd rather pay than be petty about it. I'm the same way when I'm out with guys. I probably buy more than my share of rounds and throw more in than most when the check comes. I just don't care, or rather the extra money is worth less to me than the feeling of caring about it is distasteful.

  • I guess because some women want to have their cake and eat it to. But if your fool enough to pay for her meal more fool you.

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  • Vestigial chivalry and double standards that favor women.

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