Old fashioned things such as - opening the doors for women , paying for her meal when not official boyfriend or girlfriend etc
- Yes, they know how to treat a woman.Vote A
- No, they're outdated. Women should be more independent.Vote B
Most Helpful Guy
Any woman who thinks we could just go back to the 50's mentality without giving up a LOT would be sorely mistaken.
I mean, YEAH guys paid for your meals and home and brought home the bacon and such. Of course we were expected to. What was a woman going to do... get a job? Get a job that pays nearly as much as I, a man, would get?
Men were expected to pay for everything because expecting a woman to have a job was like expecting a child to have a job. They just "weren't fit for that type of environment". Pretty insulting, no?
OK, fast forward to today. Now what is your excuse? What is your excuse for expecting to be paid for? "Because it is gentlemanly?" Being ladylike entailed not speaking up, not bringing up politics. Sit down. Shut up. Look pretty. That was the female equivalent of what we seem to erroneously call "chivalry".
The remains of "men being men" is just trying to get the respect of being equals while still trying to keep special treatment. Like a child who wants to have the respect of being an adult... until they have to pay bills.
"But buying her dinner can go a long way in impressing a girl"
And buying me a Tesla Model S would go a long way in impressing me for sure. Do I "expect" that kind of treatment? no. Do I think a girl is "less of a woman" because she didn't buy me something? Hell no. It's not my money, why in gods name should I expect it from her?
I'll put it another way: If a man is "cheap" for not paying for your meal, what does that make YOU, if you were apparently bothered you even had to buy your own?
No. This "golden age of chivalry" is a myth created by looking back not at the world as it was then, but as the movies portray it. It is confirmation bias. Seeing the ways in which women got preferential treatment and acting like we can just recreate that without bringing along the sexist baggage it is so inexorably linked to.
OK, so how does dating go for me? I must have a terrible time, right?
In almost every date I've been on, going Dutch has been the assumption. Like any other get-together with literally anyone else. Someone can offer, and that is a nice gesture. I LIKE paying for girls who don't expect it. (I also like NOT paying for girls who DO.) I've paid many times. In many cases, girls paid for ME. Every unspoken rule or piece of arbitrary etiquette is a barrier to it just being us two in the room.
And that's the point. It isn't the money, it is starting a relationship like we owe you something.3
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Most Helpful Girl
A lot of old-fashioned guys also have sexist views, such as
- women aren't allowed to work and should only stay at home and cook
- the man is the head of the household and the woman has no say
- women should always ask the man for permission to do things, however the man can do whatever he wants even if it has a great impact on the relationship
- women should keep the house clean and the men fed at all times, otherwise she's a bad woman and disrespectful
- hitting a woman is ok
etc. Really depends on just how old-fashioned the guy is. Plenty of old-fashioned guys DO NOT know how to treat a woman with respect.4
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