Do men have an obligation to protect and provide for women?

[Nightinggale]

Yes.

No.

Depends. (Please explain)

[Kiwedin]

No, but I guess it would depend on the situation. In this day and age, men and women should be financially self-sufficient and shouldn't rely on the other. There's no obligation to do anything for a member of the opposite sex, but I do think that in a loving relationship, the two people will naturally feel protective of the other. I think when we care about someone, we inadvertently become a protector of sorts as a way to express our love or even to keep them safe as a means of not losing them to anything. I think both men and women should be protective of their partners, but due to our obvious physical differences, that method of protection will vary. If I was stronger and bigger than my boyfriend was, I'd totally fight off a mugger for him, but I'm just little, so the way I protect my boyfriend is more emotional, social, or practical for someone of my stature lol.
I want to say that men are meant to be protectors though, but this is just coming from my upbringing as a Native American. We were an egalitarian society, men and women were equals and had respect for each other, but we didn't deny our obvious differences. We believed that our "gifts" served a purpose, and while I can go on and on about that, what that meant for men in specific regards to how they dealt with women had a lot to do with their physical advantages. Men are larger, stronger, and faster. This is their gift, but the thing is, the Creator gives these gifts with the intention that it would be used to benefit the tribe as a whole (think "with power comes responsibility"). For example, human beings are the most advanced species on Earth, therefore, that would give us the responsibility of taking care of the Earth and all who live on it. Men are the more physically gifted gender, therefore, they have the responsibility of physically protecting their families and their communities. A man will protect the woman he loves and a woman will nurture the man she loves. It might be a little outdated, but it's an another interesting perspective you might consider.

[Nightinggale]

Very beautifully said. I do already agree with you actually.

[realperson02]

@nightinggale I recommend this for an mho. I thought we're gonna see women joking about this question. but this is absolutely fantastic.

[Nightinggale]

I agree. I'll probably give this one mho honestly

[alphadoggystyle]

well said, except that the mentioned sexual dimorphism, the physical differences in the genders, actually make men superior biologically, so if you want things to be equal in a society, you cannot give men more responsibility without giving us more authority than women have. This is why feminist society is not working out, because they dont want to allow men to have authority over women.

[MlleCake]

@Nightinggale, don't listen to this fool @alphadoggystyle You are so much better than that.

[MlleCake]

@alphadoggystyle Oh, nooo, sweet boy thinks he hurt my widdle girl feelings with his moronic sexist rant. You are so damned cute.

Tink tink tink, like a bug in a jar.

[alphadoggystyle]

@MlleCake you're clearly gotten to, keep crying behind that computer screen while pretending to be be unfazed. Your more predictable than an insect.

[tugg-A]

@Kiwedin
What does it mean to be a protector? I'm not larger than many women. I'm 5'4" 137 lbs and I can't even beat my 12 year old niece in arm wrestling. Granted it takes her a while to beat me but I am not extremely weak either.

[Nightinggale]

I agree with alphadoggystyle. Men are usually physical and mentally stronger and make better leaders. If they are going to protect and provide for their women, those women need to listen to him and what he says.

[MlleCake]

Tink tink tink.

[Kiwedin]

@alphadoggystyle That's the problem though, our society is constantly trying to figure out which sex is better as a means to achieve power, and that in itself is wrong. In my culture, there is no better or worse sex, we're equal, because we complement each other. Before colonization, we needed each other to survive. Both worked hard to ensure survival as equal partners, but their gifts were different. Peace between the genders will not happen unless we acknowledge this. Yes, men are physically stronger than women, but this doesn't make them the superior, because there is no superior sex. Just look at this:
www.raysofhealinglight.com/.../...male-aspects.jpg
Men and women are vastly different, but our gifts are all equally necessary. A world run by men is too harsh, analytical, and cold. A world run by women is too emotional, spontaneous, and gentle. We need both, because together we bring balance. Maybe that's too hippy dippy of a concept for you guys, but I believe it.

[Nightinggale]

I agree with you. But at the same time I think relationships work better 95% of the time when the man "leads" the relationship. Im not saying men are better, we aren't, but I do think it makes the most sense for men to be leaders and women assistants.

[Kiwedin]

@tugg-A I was talking in a more historical/cultural sense, but I honestly don't know haha. I come from a long line of men who were big, strong, gifted hunters, so I wouldn't really have any knowledge of that sort to give you. Physical stature isn't what makes a man a man though, there are plenty of other qualities than men have that offer more, especially in this modern time.

[Kiwedin]

What do you mean when you say "lead"?

[Nightinggale]

Good question. I mean to be the one who has the final say on most things. Like what to do with the children in terms of discipline, what to do with the finances, basically the one who makes important decisions. Also, to be an emotional and physical support system for your wife and children. I do think men should obviously talk with their wives/girlfriends and listen to their concerns and input but I think it makes the most sense for the man to be the one who has a final say in most issues.

[Nightinggale]

Also I need to say that this should all be concensual, obviously. Im not one of those dumbasses who believes in making your wife/children listen to you through force. If you're a good enough dude then your lady will probably want to let you be the leader.

[Nightinggale]

consensual*

[Kiwedin]

Then I have to disagree, because that seems to imply that you think you have better judgement than your future partner. I was raised in a home with a parent who studied law and another who studied child psychology, so my parents always emphasized what was scientifically proven to be the best course of action, and there was always room for negotiations (that's the law aspect). My parents were a team, they discussed everything together and decided together, and personally, I think that's optimal. Sometimes my mom won, sometimes my dad won, because they acknowledged that sometimes, the other was better suited to decide on a given situation. Your partner is going to be more knowledgeable than you are in certain things, so why should you have all the decision-making power?

[Nightinggale]

I shouldn't have all of it. And yes I admit that there are plenty of women who I guarantee are smarter than me on tons of subjects. I just think men generally make more logical decisions. And I do think men should have discussions and listen to their partners.

[Kiwedin]

That's the point I'm trying to make though, logic is a valued trait, but logic alone doesn't make for the best decisions. I still think partners should have an equal say and equal decision-making authority.

[Nightinggale]

But what if they can't reach an agreement? Thats my point. I think logic outweighs intuition/emotion usually. Maybe Im completely wrong I don't know. Thats just how I see it.

[Kiwedin]

Compromise. Negotiations. That's what real partners do. You argue your case until you both come to a new conclusion, one that pleases both.

[Nightinggale]

But is that truly possible 100% of the time? Maybe im just uncompromising. I do admit that im extremely stubborn.

[Kiwedin]

That's how my parents were growing up and it's how I am today. It's very much possible, as long as you leave your ego out of it and remain objective. It's not about being right, it's about coming up with the best solution and persuading the other to see your point of view, or in some cases, opening your mind and using empathy to see their point of view.

[Nightinggale]

Hmm. You've given me a lot to think about and consider.

[MlleCake]

+Nightinggale I am proud of you for giving what she said some consideration. I answered the question light-heartedly, but she really unburied the core concept in such eloquent detail. Better than I ever could.

And remember, I believe that individual couples should pick the relationship styles they like with intention, while still maintaining a basic respect and sense of equality with people who choose differently.

Like, in YOUR relationship, it's cool if you abide by the idea that he's superior and she's inferior, as long as you don't abuse her or the kids, it's none of my biz. But because I haven't agreed to that dynamic in the world, you treat me neutrally, not superior OR inferior to you and neither of us does the asshole thing of trying to dominate each other. Does that make sense?

[Nightinggale]

Yeah that makes sense. Even if I did try to have a relationship where I hsd the say in shit, I would want it to be consensual, and for her to want it to.

[alphadoggystyle]

sorry but no, our society has already figured out long ago that men are superior to women and better at achieving power. The only issue is that for the leaders (mainly men) to make sure their society keeps making children and at the same time keeping their workforce productive, and many of the most important jobs/fields for a society (construction, infrastructure, STEM etc) are done by men, and if they want women to have children even more pressure is put on men to be productive. However because women are not the majority voters and the gatekeepers to reproduction, politicians have to cater to them at the expense of men, but we are slowly seeing that this type of society is not sustainable, as men become less productive and women are having less children the more freedom they have. So it is going to collapse and be rebuilt with more patriarchal rules.

[alphadoggystyle]

Furthermore, that picture is very inaccurate overall. Men are far more creative than women on average, and we are also more tranquil (most monks are male for example). Women have less patience than men, everything in their lives revolve around planning for their future (marriage, children, career) before her biological clock runs out, as a result most women live very stressful and impatient lives during their prime years.

Men are definitely the superior gender, it has been proven so many times in so many ways that its laughable to even try to argue against it. Men being more suited to be leaders is just one of many advantages we have. Womens primary purpose acccording to nature is to have children which is why you are limited in many other ways compared to men.

[alphadoggystyle]

* because women are the majority of voters

[alphadoggystyle]

we dont need peace between the genders necessarily, because for "equality between the genders " the way most feminists describes it, will never be possible to achieve without discriminating against men, so no, the only way to achieve peace is for women to admit their inferiority and let men be the dominant ones. The funny thing is men could easily dominate women by force again and women would not be able to stop it, but it would be best for both genders if women would just submit. Men dont need women for anything other than sex and reproduction, while women need men for that in addition to utility, resources and protection. Reproduction will be possible with the help of artificial wombs in the future which will make sex and company the only remaining thing men would want/need from women, and even that could be satisfied with virtual reality porn, prostitution or sex robots in the future. Women need to bring more to the table if they want peace.

[btbc92]

First of all, men are called to be leaders and head of his household. He should want to desire to protect and provide for his wife and family. He is not obligated to do that to women who aren't his family and isn't married to. Women should want to equally feel the same. But men have a different role that only he can do, and women have roles that only we can do. Though no woman would ever feel safe with a man who won't do that for other women in general. How one man treats other women will determine how he will treat her.

Money wise, he is responsible for being accountable for where his finances are being spent on. He should not have to spend on trivial things without being wise with his finances. Especially when he desires serious things like marriage and having a family. That is a quality most women who wants that will judge. If he can't provide in that manner, he is not a suitable partner.

[Nightinggale]

What about women, what should they want to bring to the relationship/marriage?

[btbc92]

Well, it depends on the mindset of those who want to date that person. I'm a traditional person with the sense and morals of how God designed marriage and sex to be. But since we are living in a world and time where both parties has to work nowadays. Especially when everything is getting expensive, I say it's however and whatever gifts that particular woman is able to provide. What may not be good enough for one man may be good enough for another. Marriage is about sex, and that is very important to have in marriage to hold together unless they are ill. To not deprive one another and to remember that once married you belong to each other. Not by yourself anymore as you become one flesh. In dating, you should only provide what your willing to offer. Dating is an about process and elimination. If that person doesn't fit the qualities you need in marriage and long term in general, the relationship must cease.

However, there needs to be respect and willingness to self-sacrifice.

[Nightinggale]

Being religious do you think women should submit to their husbands?

[btbc92]

And the same applies to men as well. I believe in gender roles for the sake that again, there are things that only women can do, and things only men can do physically as well as emotionally and psychologically. Everything else needs to be discussed by the couple to the best of their comfortability and affordability with logical reasons and the consideration of one other. As long as it's not unrealistic, both parties terms should be respected.

[btbc92]

I don't believe in religion. I believe in having a relationship with God. Because when a woman can follow God, she can follow her husband and the man she chooses. Likewise the man who follows God can lead his wife and family. God made it clear to Paul for men to love their wives as Christ loved the church. Submission means being subservient to one another. It means out of love the same way you help your friends and parents out of love. Because only men can lead a woman if he's leading his life righteously and with wisdom. His wife should be his crown. Somebody to love and honor. Religion teaches men to treat women as slaves in the bedroom and outside of the bedroom like she's beneath her. That is where the confusion comes in. Religion is what started the feminist movement and the equality mantra. That wasn't supposed to be like that. We're all equal as human beings, but not equal as different genders. Each one has a strength that is a weakness for the other. It was done on purpose for

[btbc92]

the sake of us needing each other and loving each other both conditionally and unconditionally. That is what I believe in.

[Nightinggale]

Beautifully said. Thanks for the discussion

[cth96190]

@btbc92
I am amazed.
You are a woman who understands the natural order, in terms of gender roles, the importance of sex and that dating is (or should be) a series of auditions that one must go through to select a mate.
If more women exhibited your level of intelligence, logic and understanding there might be a way to repair the damage done to gender relations by the Cultural Marxist hate movement known as Feminism.

[Nightinggale]

I agree, cth96190.

[tugg-A]

@btbc92
Men and women can do the same roles. They just refuse to do so due to thinking it is only what the opposite sex should do.

[btbc92]

They do the same roles now because its what's ideal for today's society. Not in the past.

[tugg-A]

@btbc92
They still chose to do different roles in the past. They didn't have to.

[conor981]

So in other words men should provide and protect and conform to the usual traditional man role while women get to pick and choose the roles they want. Honestly what even is the role of a woman if she doesn't want to be submissive, cook, clean and be feminine? Its like having to bear all the 1950s responsibilities without the authority men had over women? You can't expect equal treatment when you dont treat himself as your equal which means not expecting him to provide and protect and stop whining.

Seriously putting men down for finances? while women get to spend their money on jewellery and purses. Any man who has the intelligence will see right through your delusion

[Nyx_85]

Of course he's not obligated to. It depends on if he wants to or not. I mean in some situations (like a woman is being beaten on the street and he doesn't even call the cops) he may be a real callous asshole who should just avoid humans altogether and go live in a hole... but it's still his choice. I think if you have children and she's agreed to stay home full time and raise them until they are at least school age then of course you have an obligation to provide for her. She's caring for your offspring and not working. That's kind of the trade off. You can discuss her going back to work once the kids are old enough.

[Nyx_85]

But the majority of mothers outside the home. So to most people that won't be a huuuge concern.

[tugg-A]

@Nyx_85
What about a man being beaten on the streets and a woman doesn't even call the cops? Is she real callous?

[Nyx_85]

@tugg-A I'm not playing that game with you.

[tugg-A]

@Nyx_85
So you don't care if men get hurt, just women?

[Nyx_85]

@tugg-A Are you mentally ill?

[tugg-A]

@Nyx_85
If you aren't going to answer my question, then I'm not going to answer your question.

[Nyx_85]

@tugg-A I don't respond to needless and entirely irrational bouts of whataboutery.

[Nyx_85]

Nor do I have to play a game with those who derail and jump to conclusions because all did I was answer a question that was asked. The question was "Do men have an obligation to protect and provide for women?" I answered that question. My opinions on if the roles were reversed is entirely irrelevant regarding this discussion. Because that's a different topic.

[Nyx_85]

*all I did was

[Nyx_85]

Gawd you're probably one of those types who scream "WHAT ABOUT THE MEN? DO YOU HATE THE MEN?" when women share their abuse stories... then bombard them with a bunch of statistics. GTFO.

[Nyx_85]

There was supposed to be an exclamation after the question mark in the "WHAT ABOUT THE MEN". For effect. But this site is silly. So just imagine there was.

[tugg-A]

@Nyx_85
You gave an if a woman was beaten on streets and man doesn't help but not a if man was beaten on streets and woman doesn't help example. You automatically thought it was important to make it known how bad men are that don't help beaten women but not how bad it is for women to help beaten men.

I don't know why you did it but you did it. What am I supposed to think when you give it for women but not men? How am I not suppose to see that as sexist? If you'd gave it both ways, I could have ruled you out as a sexist, most likely.

[Nyx_85]

@tugg-A In no particular way did my comment assert that. The question about about if men should provide for and protect women. I used a woman being beaten as an example. The question had nothing to do with what women should do if faced with a similar situation. You are jumping to conclusions because I didn't include something in a conversation that it wasn't even about? Come on now man.

[Nyx_85]

Seriously do I need to make a disclaimer "And do the same for men!" or "Men too!" any time I talk about anything having to do with women these days so guys like you don't get all pissy? If chicks did it you would tell us to mind our own business... Like really.

[Nyx_85]

"I prefer tampons over pads"

"Don't forget about the men!"

I'm joking but seriously that is close to the level of ridiculousness of your comments.

[Nyx_85]

No seriously any time I hear men talk about stuff like child support or alimony or prison rape now i'm going to be all "WHAT ABOUT THE WOMEN? IT HAPPENS TO US TOO". See how you like derailment.

[tugg-A]

@Nyx_85
Okay. Even so, had you given other example, I could have ruled out you being sexist.

Either way, I wouldn't be able to protect many women at 5'4" 137 lbs.

[Nyx_85]

Oh I joking. I won't do that. Because I have enough sense to not assume shit.

[Nyx_85]

"No I'm

[tugg-A]

@Nyx_85
I actually have called out a man complaining about prison rape by telling him it happens to women too. So I don't just confront women with it.

[Nyx_85]

@tugg-A I don't NEED to give another example because the question was asking if MEN should protect WOMEN. NOT what women should do. I answered the question as is. You are the one who is choosing to jump to asinine conclusions. I am not required to add in some little disclaimer because YOU take things the wrong way.

[tugg-A]

@Nyx_85
That is true but had you gave that, I would be more confident you were not sexist and it would make it better chance you weren't sexist.

How am I suppose to protect women at 5'4" 137 lbs? I can't even beat my 12 year old niece in arm wrestling.

[Nyx_85]

@tugg-A Not everything is about you...

[Nyx_85]

Just because you lack the ability to determine what is a part of a conversation and what isn't that is not fault. Any assumptions you make are your own. Not to be rude but do you have FSA or something? I know somebody with it and he has trouble understanding certain things.

[Nyx_85]

*FAS sorry

[tugg-A]

@Nyx_85
It's about me when my username is put in the reply box.

[Nyx_85]

@tugg-A... Did you forget to take your meds today?

[tugg-A]

@Nyx_85
Healthy people don't take medicine.

[Nyx_85]

@tugg-A Riiight. Says the one trying to beat up kids...

[tugg-A]

@Nyx_85
I don't try to beat up kids nor do I beat up kids.

[Nyx_85]

@tugg-A Whatever.

Child beater.

[tugg-A]

@Nyx_85
What makes you think I beat children?

[Nyx_85]

@tugg-A Who tries to arm wrestle young girls! Obviously you are a child abuser!

[Nyx_85]

Why don't you pick on someone your own size!

Oh wait.. she probably is.

[tugg-A]

@Nyx_85
It was her idea and arm wrestling is not fighting. We pencil fight too. I have an excellent pencil fighting record.

[Nyx_85]

@tugg-A Doesn't matter if it was her idea. You are the adult.

You child abuser!

[Nightinggale]

Please private message eachother if you want to argue. Im on my phone and can't turn notifications off

[tugg-A]

@Nightinggale
We are not arguing.

[tugg-A]

@Nyx_85
How is arm wrestling considered abuse?

[Nightinggale]

Regardless of what you all are doing please pm eachother rather than keep commenting

[tugg-A]

@Nightinggale
I'll be for that but she'd have to initiate it since I'm not level 2 yet.

[Nyx_85]

@Nightinggale

Sorry dude!

[Nightinggale]

No worries. :)

[Nyx_85]

@tugg-A I can't message you either lol.

[Nyx_85]

@tugg-A I set my profile to public. Try again.

[tugg-A]

@nyx_85
Yes you can. It's just level 1 can't initiate the messages. Once you start, we can message. Others have with me.

[cth96190]

There is no obligation to provide for, or protect, Feminists and their fellow travellers.
Because our masculinity is toxic; because we should all be killed (Valerie Solanas); because all sex is rape (Andrea Dworkin); and because women need a man in the way that a fish needs a bicycle (Gloria Steinem), women have made it clear in the most forceful way possible that we men are neither wanted, nor needed.
Then there is mansplaining, man spreading, making little Swedish boys sit down to pee and so much more.
Okay, women, go away and do it for yourselves and by yourselves.
Let the men know how that works out for you when the Islamic rape gangs come and kick down your door, or grab on the street, which is happening all over Europe right now.
You know the ones, those 'poor refugees' who were welcomed in by the liberal women. The same liberal women who said that we men were wicked evil racists because we pointed out the bleeding obvious, in terms of the consequences of allowing these people to enter Western Civilisation.
Girls can do anything. :-)

[Nightinggale]

God damn. Well fucking said. I agree 100%. Are you MGTOW bro?

[cth96190]

MGTOW monk.

[Nightinggale]

Oh hell yeah. Thats awesome. I've really considered going monk. I'm doing quite well so far. Any tips you could give a young mgtow?

[cth96190]

At this stage, watch as much of the MGTOW content as you can on YouTube and pick from the buffet what suits/works for you.
If you are not familiar with Tom Lykis, you should find plenty of ideas that will give you cause to think.
Do not become a hater. Instead, have a realistic perspective on the relationship between men and women and an understanding of how the gender relationship has been trashed by the Cultural Marxist hate movement known as Feminism.
Here is the most important thing, at your time of life: do no put your cock into anything that you are not prepared to marry.
Also, be mindful that every time you do put your cock into a female you are risking a false rape allegation and/or a lifetime of child-support payments.
If you date, jerk out a load (or two) BEFORE you go on the date. That will allow you to think with greater clarity and see the girl for who and what she is.
There are unicorns out there, but you have to be extremely careful.

[Nightinggale]

Okay. I will take all of that into account. Thanks man!

[Anonymous]

We shouldn't but society is gynocentric and males are raised to always put females first. Females are raised to expect males to put them first, even these females who say "I don't need a man" abide by the code that they are living the happy little-protected life they live with the subconscious understanding that men will save them. In a bank robbery when someone says "at least let the women go free"... you won't find a single one of these so-called "strong and independent women" stepping up to say "HEY let the men go free, and we will stay here".
IN tragedy... women will always allow the men to take the hit, or stay behind so they can save their own asses.

The one's who say women can take care of themselves... live in a bubble of ignorance because the privileged little world they live in was created and is maintained by men.
In a crisis, these women who can "take care of themselves" are the first to look for a man to help them.

As can be seen in ANY video of ANY tragedy.

[Nightinggale]

I agree 100% bro 👍

[kilowatt04]

In certain environments where men are physically more able to do it, for sure. For most of history. I heard a first story too on the radio about a homestead commune, where both the men and the women were super liberal, and believed that women and men were basically the same at first, but as their subsistence lifestyle went on, they were pretty much forced to get into traditional gender roles because of what they were each able to do better.

But today in general? Or in the society I would like to see? No, we get so much benefit from having coed projects in so many fields of work, and hard labor is inevitably being taken over by machines anyway. As for protection, we have guns, pepper spray, tasers, and other weapons now that are advanced enough that they don't depend on the higher physical strength of a club or sword. Everyone should be looking out for everyone else, and protection is no longer something that only men can do.

I don't think we are in danger of losing anything by not using traditional gender roles as we progress to doing bigger and better things as a society. If we are all taught a good overall skill set, they come back pretty easily if they are ever needed, like after the collapse of modern society or something. We should be teaching men and women alike to more stuff than they have traditionally been taught to do, so that we can get things done that could not be done in past times.

[AleDeEurope]

Not anymore. Women decide to take male roles, so men no longer have an obligation to protect and provide for women, unless these women are part of his family (including wife).
Men can't be expected to stick to their roles, while women move out of it. You can't expect men to protect women when women don't give back to men.
The reason men HAD an obligation to protect and provide was because women gave birth, took care of the kids and the house, but that doesn't happen anymore, so there's no reason for men to protect women.

[Okfchi]

So who is giving birth, taking care of kids and the house? And also, is this only specific to the US?

[AleDeEurope]

@Okfchi The only thing women are still expected to do, is give birth, because they're the only ones that can do it. But taking care of the kids and the house, that's not a female role anymore.
This is specific to the West.

[Nightinggale]

Yeah man fuck the West. We haven't progressed we've regressed. We have all this money and technology but everyone is fat and depressed.

[Okfchi]

Where I live. Women give birth, take care of the kids and the house, and have to jobs to support the house all the while her husband might not be helping financially. But anyway, if we are to assume that helping with the house and the kids is now a shared obligation and that the woman helps financially with the family life, isn't the man still required to provide and protect.

[Okfchi]

@AleDeEurope, so I I go and take some boxing and self-defense classes, shouldn't my boyfriend protect me in a street situation still?

[Nightinggale]

If you still need his help then what was the point of the self defence classes?

[Nightinggale]

Key word being SELF defense.

[Okfchi]

Men are by virtue stronger. I might need a guy to help me. Nad I would help him just the same if I can.

[Nightinggale]

Well then there's no problem. All is well if you would give back to him. 👍

[AleDeEurope]

@Okfchi I clearly said men should protect the women in their family, that includes wife, and I thought it was self explanatory that wife also included girlfriend.

You're from Egypt, of course things over there are different. Here in the West, it doesn't work like that, hence why most Western countries have such a low birth rate.

[RJGraveyTrain]

I think that as a partner, regardless of gender, you are obligated to protect and provide for your SO. I know people have it in their heads that it's "so unfair" but the truth of the matter is, is that you have to contribute to a relationship - at least the adult ones that involve bills. It's up to the people in the relationship how they contribute and how much.

Also as for protecting them, I don't date anybody who would let me die in the apocalypse because that's just not practical. Plus, I can't respect anybody who'd stand by and let their SO get harassed or the like, male or female.

[tugg-A]

@RJGraveyTrain
Would you date a man that would die for you in the apoxalypse?

[RJGraveyTrain]

@tugg-A Provided I liked him, yes.

[tugg-A]

@RJGraveyTrain
But you wouldn't die for him in the apocalypse?

[RJGraveyTrain]

@tugg-A I never said that lol. I'd die for anybody I loved if it meant they could live.

[tugg-A]

@RJGraveyTrain
Okay.

[pineappleorange]

@tugg-A Believe me, if you TRULY loved someone, then sacrificing your life to allow them to live is NOT being unselfish. It's actually being very selfish.

If you have ever gone through losing a partner or spouse, then you would know that it is extremely difficult to go through such a loss as losing your best friend in life.

[cth96190]

If some creature harassed or in some other way threatened a lover/partner or child of mine, he/it would die on the spot, as well as anyone who was with him.
If I saw a Feminist, or some other lefty loon who was carrying a 'will trade racists for refugees' sign being pack raped by 'immigrants', I would kick back and enjoy watching her receive her necessary reality check.

[Sara413]

I think we all have an obligation to protect one another and look out for each other, and that includes stepping in when you see someone being hurt by someone else if and when you are able to do something about it... but that's something I expect of everyone, not just men.

And no I don't think men are obligated to provide for anyone except themselves and their children if they have them... but again, I expect through same of women. Sometimes that will mean providing for their spouse so they can stay home or cut their work hours, etc.

[Okfchi]

Yes if she is your mother let's say, your sister who lives alone and might need financial help, and of corse a wife. It is a naturally-felt obligation towards certain people you feel responsible about as a person and as a man. With regard to protection, do you really like watching a woman you know in troublesome physical situation and not help if you can?
But of corse a man is not supposed to be dragged into fights for a woman who doesn't care about the consequences of her act or a partner who spends lavishly unnecessarily.

[tugg-A]

@Okfchi
And a woman can help her dad, brother and any man that needs financial and physical help too.

[Okfchi]

@tugg-A that goes without saying. In my society, women are giving in superb way. I saw a 40 year old woman getting into trouble trying to stop a fight and save young guys from getting brutally beaten.

[itsagirlthing900]

I dont know that most Do but i think they Should.

now before anyone starts attacking me, I am driven and hardworking and can financially support myself if need be and I don't need a man to do everything for me because I am not helpless.

However, if you look back at history, yes the roles of women and men have both changed but the one thing that has remained consistent is that the men are the protectors and bread winners of the family. A quote from a movie, "The man is the head, but the woman is the neck that turns the head."

[hellionthesagereborn]

So the gender roles have changed but not for men and that's acceptable that men continue to be burdened by there obligations to women while women are freed of their obligations to men? So basically he works she eats? That's slavery, or a parasitic relationship (take your pick). Either she is equally obligated to him or neither are obligated to each other that is the only way you can have this without being both a hypocrite and sexist.

[pineappleorange]

You can financially support yourself at 17? Do your parents know about this? Because I'm sure they can collect some good rent from that room that you're staying in at their house.

[itsagirlthing900]

@pineappleorange Too say that I can financially support myself NOW was wrong of me, however I do work hard and I pick up as many hours as I can when I am not in school. I have been been working since I was 10 (snack bar, babysitting, dog walking, caregiving, all under-the-counter and slow money but still working) I own my car and I pay for my own insurance.
What I meant to say was that I WILL be able to financially support myself. It is practically impossible to pay rent with a part time job.

[itsagirlthing900]

@hellionthesagereborn I see your point but my opinion remains that men should have an obligation to protect and provide. It does not make me sexist because I never said anything about women not feeling the same obligation if circumstances reversed. If I were in a relationship and my boyfriend lost his job and couldn't provide for me then I would be fine with paying for meals and paying his rent or have him move in with me. Im fine if I am on dates and I pay for meals here and there. I don't see any problem in this and if you do, then it looks like if we ever met we wouldn't start dating and I don't think either of us has a problem with that

[itsagirlthing900]

both parties should be mutually benefited

[hellionthesagereborn]

Well that's my point their must be mutal benefit or its wrong. What you originally presented is not mutually beneficial, neither is the second suggestion because that is simply riding out a short period of time, that's not really benefiting him in the times that he is not in bad shape. So in the times where he doesn't lose his job what are you doing for him? It doesn't have to be providing the same thing, in fact that would be a bit absurd as he wouldn't need anything from you if he is already providing that particular resource (in this case money and protection, if he has money he doesn't need yours and he doesn't need your protection) so what is he getting from it? What your arguing is for a traditional relationship and that's fine BUT you need to also be traditional, if you expect him to do his traditional role of being a protector and provider then you need to follow through with your traditional obligations as well, its the only fair way of doing things.

[vonasaurus]

both halves of a couple have an obligation to take care of each other. perhaps in different ways, but the principle is the same.

ie: i broke my leg and am completely dependent on my husband for everything. he cooks for me, cleans, gives me sponge baths and washes my hair in the kitchen sink (since i can't shower or bathe with my cast on)... all without expecting anything in return, because he knows i would do the same for him if our positions were reversed.

[realperson02]

yes dude men are slaves of women and have to do everything in order to get sex 😂😂😂 jk jk

ok on a serious note, I simply don't understand why I am obligated.
back in school , whenever a bully tried to beat up or harass a guy friend or a female friend I used to stand up for them and if wanted to fight, I would beat the life out of them.

so protecting the innocent and right is natural for me but I won't be doing it as a obligation towards any random person just because she is hot.

as far as providing is concerned, this day and age is quite expensive and it's wrong to put the pressure on a guy unless he is a millionaire.
I am quite amused to see women saying that a guy should pay for the first date (in the case where both are strangers )
simply because you cannot have sex with a stranger then how can they expect a stranger to pay for them in the first meeting. these kinds of things works both ways

[Turkish_Delight]

Men weren't made to protect us. However, whenever the woman is inadequate to protect herself the guy should activate himself.
Men will not be next to us all the time. We, women should practice to protect ourselves as well.

[Mysterioustruth]

Do you believe in equality?

[Okfchi]

@Mysterioustruth @Turkish_Delight opinion holds irrespective of views on equality. A woman can be self-sufficiently and still the mans is required to act in certain ways.

[Nightinggale]

If she needs a man's help then she isn't "self sufficient".

[Okfchi]

That's not about the woman. Let's say she can defend her self physically quite well and can actually fight, does this mean if you are a man you will not protect it her in a situation (of corse if you are related)? It is really about what you feel normal to you, it is the instinct for men.

[Okfchi]

@Nightinggale, if you don't feel it in your guts, don't bother asking bro. Just don't spend money on women or try to protect them.

[Nightinggale]

It is about the woman though. You claimed she could be for equality while simultaneously "needing a man". That's impossible. If she depends on a man but no men depend on her then it is not an equal exchange.

[Nightinggale]

Yes, I would defend her. But that doesn't violate my beliefs because I don't support equality in the first place. I support equality of opportunities and under the law, thats as far as it goes.

[Okfchi]

The "men don't depend on women" part tho... your Nike shoes and addidas shirt were made by women working in maquiladoras overseas for 12 hours a shift and getting less than 5 dollars a day for her family, and that helped her husband and older son to migrate to another country leaving the family behind and become working force for other countries that need it. It is very complex if we talk about gender in the very abstract.
The way I see it, it is an exchange. Women as a human being provide to men certain things they can't get otherwise, and men provide in return similar things. The two genders cannot live without the other. The fact that you are asexual might be causing you to not see this.

[Okfchi]

@Nightinggale aromantic* sry :DD

[Nightinggale]

I'm not asexual? Where did you get that?

[Nightinggale]

Oh okay. How did you know I was aromantic?

[Okfchi]

We talked about this in some other question

[Nightinggale]

We did? Oh, I don't remember. And Im not saying men dont depend on women, Im saying in this specific hypothetical situation where Turkish Delight depends on a man but then he doesn't get anything in return for it, that isn't equality

[Okfchi]

Naturally and in a healthy society, a man is getting back in return, maybe even more.

[Okfchi]

And hey, I think the "equality" that you mean is the definition advocated by mainstream feminists. Fuckers who just ruin the lives of women from unprivileged economic and social backgrounds.

[Nightinggale]

Now that I agree with 👌 Fuck feminism.

[cth96190]

"Men were not make to protect us."
Apparently, you failed both biology and history.

[Turkish_Delight]

I'm not a feminist but I believe in equality. And If you're a fan of showing your power protect your woman against bigger men.

[conor981]

@Okfchi nice hypothetical situtation. I hope you met the ladies making the nike and addidas shoes since you are so confident?

[conor981]

IF you are for equality , you wouldn't expect men to save you. I like how women tend to be so opportunistic , you can't be equal and push a man to edge to fight just for him to come back and still get to hear that yeah "we are equal"

[Anonymous]

Of course. I assume you don't mean women generally, which seems to be what many of your respondants think. But the women you love? What kind of person would you be if you didn't feel such an obligation?

Providing and protecting can take many forms. And you wife or girlfriend ought to be doing the same things.

[Nightinggale]

I did mean in a general sense sort of. I really left it open to interpretation to see how people would respond to it.

[Xleah17x]

yes they do! now since i dont feel like paying my bills wanna do that? also dont forget to bring the pizza ;) and i dont feel like walking on the ground so can you carry me so i could protect my shoes lmaoooo XD jk but all jokes aside theyre not obligated to but it would be a nice thing to do for both men and women if theyre in need of it but thats usally someone you know/care about weather its friends, family... etc

[Nightinggale]

Sassy are we?

[Xleah17x]

ohhh soweyyy i was trying to be nice :0 D:

[Nightinggale]

Hahaha no worries.

[cheesecakes]

I assume everyone will say no. But the truth is a lot of men feel they have to provide and protect. It's what the society usually waits from a man. And i don't think it's wrong since we're stronger which means we can protect and work more in order to provide 💪🏻

[Aizou]

Obligation doesn't exist. The only two major rules of importance, is choice and consequence/action and reaction. If you don't want to do something, simply don't do it, but expect consequences derived of said action. If we only talk whether or not you're obligated to provide for anyone, then the answer is no.

[rjroy3]

Protect, yes within reason. You can't protect a woman from herself and oftentimes "She don't wanna be saved, don't save her. She don't wanna be saved, don't save her. She don't wanna be saved, don't save her". But random girl you don't know in the bar. You see someone slips something in her drink when she's not looking. Probably cool to let her know what you saw and warn her to get another drink instead. See that she's getting harassed by someone? Giving her a chance to acknowledge you and giving her the opportunity to request for help. a lot of people don't want your help and butting in only makes you look bad and pisses them off, but if you show that you're willing to help and they choose to ask for it then you're golden.

Provide for her? No obligation whatsoever. But if you agree to do so (ie, she is involved with making this decision), then you have a responsibility to her to keep your word. That's pretty much it.

[xxmamichulaxx]

No, the only women a man is obligated to care for and protect is his mother and his wife.

[Mysterioustruth]

Do you believe in equality?

[xxmamichulaxx]

@Mysterioustruth Of course

[qwertyKitchen]

I would include daughters and, in some cases, even sisters.

[xxmamichulaxx]

@qwertyKitchen For "women" I didn't include daughters , since I imagined the asker meant adult females, but I do agree. As for sisters, sure in some cases, though I dont think a man is obligated to provide for his sister

[Nightinggale]

I mean it in a general sense. Are adult men morally/socially obligated to protect/provide for adult females

[xxmamichulaxx]

@Nightinggale I couldn't answer with a direct no or yes, so I picked depends , that's really how my answer formed

[Nightinggale]

Yeah I understand. No worries

[qwertyKitchen]

Ah @Nightinggale. I took it differently, having just added my own opinion. I didn't necessarily mean financially support his sister, either. I meant be there for her… be a good brother… and she ought to do the same for him.

[qwertyKitchen]

But daughters even in adulthood? Sure. You don't really ever stop being a parent until your kids are putting diapers on you.

[Nightinggale]

@qwertKitchen No worries, I gotchu now.

[xxmamichulaxx]

@qwertyKitchen I took your opinion as financially, but now that you cleared it up, I definitely agree with you. Its not a dads place to financially support his 30 year old daughter but its always his place to be her dad and give fatherly advice no matter how old she is , same. thing for a brother to do for his sister. its not because she's a female that he should do this, its because she's family

[qwertyKitchen]

Cool! :-)

[tugg-A]

@xxmamichulaxx
And a woman is obligated to care for and protect her father and her husband too.

[xxmamichulaxx]

@tugg-A of course , that's what you do for your family , its not just an obligation for males to follow

[Mysterioustruth]

@tugg-A No their not because they suck at it but they're obligated to make me a sandwich when I ask for one.

[Revinz]

That depends. If a woman want equality then no. If a woman want to stay as a child, and wants the man as her father, yes. But the father decides what is done with the money, and decides what is best for her.

If she gets both, it will not be sustainable in the long run. Which a woman quite often do in this modern era of feminism.

[ThatLeaf]

No. I believe a healthy relationship should be give and take. Being there to support the person but also to be able to let that person support you as well. The more you look out for each other the more healthier the relationship is. Something that is one sided is never the answer

[snowangle]

Not really. Let me rephrase. I'm a bit of an idealist, but I believe every person has an obligation to be respectful and compassionate towards their fellow humans, regardless of gender. Women shouldn't get special treatment, but just be a decent person and treat others well.

[Alessus]

Provide? I don't think so. But protect is a bit trickier, as I believe that if you can protect someone from physical harm, whether you are a man or a woman and whether the person who is in danger is a relative, a friend, a lover or a stranger, you should always attempt to protect them. But that's just how I think, I cannot force that sort of obligation onto anyone else, so technically the answer is still no.

[BlueCoyote]

People should provide for and protect each other, regardless of their biological sex, their gender, their race or their age. In a decent society, we should provide for the ones in need and protect each other not because we are men/women but because we are human beings with compassion and empathy. Solidarity is the key word here.
In relationships, both partners should help each other in whatever way they can. Again, not because they are men/women but because they love each other.