Atheists "lack a belief in God" the same way rocks, chickens or any inanimate object does?

I find this point interesting because often this is the claim many new atheists make. if atheism is just the "absence of belief" that proves too much.

I'm wondering if most new atheists would equate this lack of belief with the same equivalence as a rock equally possessing the same lack of belief?

Its an interesting point because i tried this question out with atheists at university and they said in a come back "but rocks don't have beliefs" i was like EXACTLY. So now what we're both agreeing is that atheism is the lack of belief in objects that have the capacity to have beliefs.

Then we have to talk about what a belief is and whether or not we can know they're true or not. The argument for mind. I. e if we are just a collection of sense experiences. .. then what does it mean for that to have beliefs

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And you are? I'm a GirlI'm a Guy

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Most Helpful Girl

  • I lack the belief that you're actually a student at university.

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Most Helpful Guy

  • What does the statment "I do not believe in god" have in common with "I believe in god"? Believe. Both are beliefs and that is your first mistake in your argument. Atheist believe there is no god, that is they posit that the statement "God does not exist" as true without empirical evidence. This is no different then positing that "God existst" without empirical evidence. As for you equating non belief to rocks etc, I do not understand the relevence to that unless you are suggesting that belief would involve higher brain functions or it's integral to humanity and sapience which would also be illogical as you have no evidence to support it. As for mind, we are not a series of sense experiences because we respond to experiences, otherwise we would feel sensory input but not respond to it or intereact with it. Its a over simplification or an outright incorrect notion of what mind is. Mind: the element of a person that enables them to be aware of the world and their experiences, to think, and to feel; the faculty of consciousness and thought. Basicly you fell into the trap of supposition of a supposition.

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    • Saying "I lack a[ny] belief" is not more a belief than not collecting stamps is collecting non-stamps.

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    • @jacquesvol At no point was I attempting to equate atheism with agnosticism, they are very different as I pointed out. It is also true that I presupposed your position as an atheist instead of apathiest since most would either argue the irrelevance of the existence of god or not be bothered enough to argue to begin with, neither of which you seem to have done (unless I am misunderstanding) hence me pointing out that it was an educated guess based upon your responses. Atheist: a person who disbelieves or lacks belief in the existence of God or gods. Apatheist: is acting with apathy, disregard, or lack of interest towards belief or disbelief in a deity. There is a distinction, one claims there is no god the other claims it doesn't matter if there is or is not. Its no different to claiming to be an agnostic atheist, you are making contradictory claims, one of having no knowledge, the other to having knowledge. They are mutually exclusive points.

    • @jacquesvol Religion is not the source of terrorist attacks. Politics are this is fact, your evidence you give proves it. There was always a political gain. No different then when Nazi's used pseudo science to prove there superiority. It wasn't science that was the root cause of WWII or the Nazi's it wasn't the Jewish people. It was politics. By creating a scapegoat it gave people a feeling of control, a feeling they had not had in a long time this was then used to manipulate the people until such a time that the Nazi party could gain control. Commonality is what allowed for this. By creating a us vs them mentality it created solidarity of purpose and helped reduce the individual voice of objection. This is why religion is so frequently used. Its also why Bush constantly used the terms freedom and democracy (despite the fact that we are not a democracy but a democratically elected republic) in order to create a solidarity with in the US in order to convince people to do as he wished.

What Girls Said 12

  • No. Those things aren't even aware of the concept of God. They lack belief because there is no alternative. Atheists, however, are aware of the concept of God, and thus are actually capable of not believing in God in an actually meaningful way, because they do have an alternative. Very different cases.

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  • I don't know what you're trying to say?
    I'm an atheist therefore I do not believe in any god.
    If you want to compare me to inanimate objects who have no belief then... Well I guess you're not wrong? It's just a very pointless observation and an idiotic comparison.

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  • "So now what we're both agreeing is that atheism is the lack of belief in objects that have the capacity to have beliefs."

    This sentence basically says "atheists think that objects cannot have beliefs". So what you're saying is that objects DO have beliefs? That actually makes YOU look crazy, did you miss that bit? Think things over before posting them so you don't make yourself look stupid.

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  • With your logic, I could do the same thing proving the rock is also religious.

    If I held a rock up and said to it, "Hey, rock, say nothing and do not react whatsoever if you believe in god."
    **wait for it**
    **wait for it**
    **wait for it**
    **wait for it**
    **wait for it**
    **wait for it**
    Then I could conclude, "Ok, it's confirmed. My experiment worked. This rock is definitely a religious rock."

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  • I'm sorry but I can't believe that you have any idea what you're talking about. Chickens are not inanimate objects. That's simply biological fact. If you can't understand facts then you are not a good source for conversational topics. Unless you're trying to make atheists look stupid, you're doing great at it.

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  • I'll admit, I laughed

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  • It is a lack of belief, yes.

    But, it isn't a lack, like that of a rock or a chicken.

    Unlike the rock or the chicken, the atheist is aware of other beliefs.

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  • i understand the possibility of god (s) i don't believe they exist, or if they do, they do so in a way that is unrelated to humans. the things you are describing don't really have a conscience or level of intelligence to comprehend or contemplate god (s)' existence.

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  • Im not really getting what you're asking me about.

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  • This doesn't make sense. I'm trying so hard to take this seriously, but I'm failing.

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  • Attention, everyone: There's a troll on the loose, whatever you do, do NOT feed him!
    Thank you.

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    • Honestly, the only person I've ever seen refer to people as "new atheists" is @G-daz so I wonder what he would think about this "argument".

What Guys Said 32

  • No.

    Rocks are incapable of belief in a religion. Atheists just choose to reject that type of belief, because it makes zero sense to them.

    dl.dropboxusercontent.com/.../...scientology-2.PNG

    "BELIEF" is just information/data that you accept as a FACT that is TRUE, even WITHOUT evidence of its validity. Essentially, dogma.

    There's nothing valuable about beliefs. It's just something you think is true, whether it's actually true or not. Nothing to be respected about that either. It's just... stuff that you think is true. Nothing more. Nothing less.

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    • The Asker disagreed then never bothered to answer :(

    • "Rocks are incapable of belief in a religion" my mind is just blown by this

      😂😂

  • Yeah. so?
    We ain't so different a rock.
    Just a bag of chemicals on legs where electrical and chemical energy goes up and down and one form to the other ain't it?

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  • I don't quite see what you're trying to achieve with this question.
    A belief is the acceptance of a claim without any good, rational and experimentally testable evidence.
    That is why I personally don't believe in anything. If I drop an apple from my window, I KNOW gravity exists. I can then ask a mathematician to explain me in more detail what gravity is and prove it to me mathematically. There's not even a shred of evidence, let alone good evidence, for the existence of any god/s. Hence, I reject to accept the claim that god/s exists - meaning, I lack the belief in god/s.

    Yes, a rock doesn't belief in god just like an atheist doesn't belief in god but for different reasons obviously. There are also people who drink alcohol and rocks don't drink alcohol either. Men don't have menstruation and rocks don't have menstruation either. So what's your point?

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  • You are a very unique person with a very ridiculous view
    1.media.dorkly.cvcdn.com/.../...747ba1b35cbf9a.gif

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  • Atheists lack a belief in god in the same way that non-stamp collectors lack passion for collecting stamps

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    • That's too complicated for asker.

    • Non-stamp collectors collect non-stamps, that's clear. :)

      Rocks and chickens and atheists don't even collect non-stamps!

  • No, the crucial difference is that rocks don't have brains and are therefore unable to think through anything. Chickens have brains, but they're very tiny ones.

    Atheists have brains. They have presumably been presented with arguments for and against the existence of God or gods (why do monotheists never mention the "gods" when they say atheists don't believe? there are hundreds of millions of polytheists in the world even today) and have reasoned to the best of their ability that their is no God of any kind.

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  • I've seen this brought up before.
    I guess it's accurate. I mean, rocks don't believe in god, sure.
    But I've never understood what the point of this conversation was supposed to be.

    What am I supposed to extrapolate from this?
    Would theists prefer to debate rocks rather than real people? Actually, that's a great idea. It would be an amazing change to see theists actually win a debate against an 'atheist' for the first time.

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  • https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YKcabMXAjUU

    In all seriousness though, rocks and chickens don't have the mental faculties to educate themselves about the subject to determine if something is worth believing in or not. I'm sure there are gods that people believe in that YOU don't believe in. Wouldn't you say you lack any type of belief in them?

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    • Well considering other Gods are existential existing only as Beings within the universe of matter and not the alpha and omega. Relating the two are very different questions.

      I wasn't saying rocks and chickens have belief. I suggested it as an equivocal analogy. Atheists often proclaim a lack of belief. Implying that they hold no belief because they can't rational. Rocks don't have beliefs precisely because they lack the ability as intelligent beings to have beliefs. Whereas atheists do and thus have beliefs

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    • So you're saying that the Abrahamic God is the only one ever believed in to not be a physical being grounded in what we consider existence?

    • Asker,
      Comparing atheists to brainless rocks or near brainless chickens is just insulting atheists.
      Religion is like a penis. It's fine to have one and it's fine to be proud of it, but please don't whip it out in public and start waving it around... and PLEASE don't try to shove it down my or my child's throat.
      Do not start writing laws with it.
      Do not think with it.
      Sincerely, tired of hearing your religious guff
      Were not impressed by anything you imagined and call a deity.

      s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/.../...0d8953ea94.jpg

  • Well.. the whole concept of why people are at war
    based on different beliefs, is a mystery to me.

    I've come to my own conclusion.

    "Time" is the real "god".. so to speak
    that both atheists and theists worship
    christians and other religions alike, just decided
    to rename "time" to "god".

    But again, this is just my conclusion. ^.^

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  • A chicken isn't inanimate.
    Also, as far as we know, anything that isn't human lacks a belief in god because they don't even understand the concept of it.

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    • And i never said a chicken was inanimate. I listed then i said "or". So rain check then focus on answering the question

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    • Reread.

      There's a spacing limit would you have believe. And only so many things i felt like listing. Then if you're aware of grammar you'd know i placed a conjunction as any alternative that's inanimate

    • Re-read.
      "... the same way rocks, chickens or any inanimate object does?" - This implies that chickens are inanimate.

  • No, absolutely not, atheists are more passionate and emotional than what u think, they don't believe in a god, because of some emotional events or emotional ideas about what the meaning of life is to them, "now atheists" never been harmful when their belief is based on science, now atheists! .. i don't know what their future is holding,
    U know what, me as a believer, i think "now believers" are those who supposed to be called rocks, they implement their faith without knowing the reasons, they don't know how to translate their religions to the real world, they depend on blind faith, they are afraid of science, they are denying the contradictions in their own interpretations,
    They are denying the serious questions, they are depending on other people rather than seeking it by themselves, they think god is with them because they're believers. .. well.. It's not believing only... it's UNDERSTANDING, it's thinking deeply, its asking questions, its how to control your life and how to make it easier ans simpler, it's studying, searching, ... That's the real implementation. ... and seriously why would you believe if you're afraid of reality, even though you know that believing is reality,
    Now to atheists, their problem isn't with the religion it self, their problem is in the way people interpreting the religion, i said atheists are emotional because they are that kind if people looking for deep questions, at the same time looking for deep answers when they ask a question and can't find an answer to it or getting ignored when they ask about it, well, it's natural. ... when you give them a simple answer, rather than giving them something deeper and meaningful, finally they would ask... what a religion that gives such a nonsense, meaningless, crazy, irrational, stupid answers, while my mind have the capacity of something more real!.. now u see? that's what happens when people give wrong interpretations in the name of their religions, but the problem here is with the atheists too... they ask people but they don't go to see the sources by themselves, now they think it's a fashion that they don't know it's something serious, they forgot that we all are going to die and life won't mean anything then, they are accepting the concept that there is no god because they can't find a proof to him, they are a little bit arrogant deep inside. ..
    I used to be atheist by the way.. that's my story..

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  • I'm atheist and this is stupid. Yes rocks don't have beliefs but you gain pretty much nothing by comparing humans who have the ability to have beliefs, to inanimate objects that are... inanimate.

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  • Just because an atheist doesn't believe in God or any other religion, does not mean they don't have any beliefs at all. Most will belive in science and they belive that science disproves all religions. An athiest has heard the arguments for and against religion and has decided they don't belive in religion.

    A rock has no beliefs. Not because it's athiest but because it's a rock. It can't understand the arguments for or against anything so can not have an opinion on it, because it's a rock. This is not the same as being an athiest. Athiests have an educated opinion on religion then decide not to believe in it. A rock can not do this. Because it is a rock.

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  • I was raised to be a Christian... However, when I was young, I asked the Pastor that if an individual was pure of heart but worshipped god in a different way or in a different religion. His response was that the person will go to hell.

    From his response... I was disgusted from his answer...

    Anyways i do believe in a higher power. But i dont believe in religion written by a person.

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  • your argument is invalid. rocks have no sentient thoughts, neither do chickens. hell, a rock in an inanimate object and is therefore incapable of any cognitive functions. even chickens, which are smarter than people give them credit for dont have the capacity to process religion.

    You cannot compare things which are so radically different. its like judging a human and a spider in a silk producing contest.

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  • I've read this over and over again and i still can't figure out what you're even saying.
    So let me try:
    "atheism is the lack of belief in objects that have the capacity to have beliefs."
    Sooo you're saying an atheist does not believe in rocks? IM SO CONFUSED
    blacksportsonline.com/.../...ung-confused-face.jpg

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    • He's just telling the world that atheists are dumber than rocks or chickens.

  • Have you considered the fact that rocks don't posses a brain?

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  • I wouldn't presume to know *what* a chicken does or does not believe...

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  • I think the people you asked this to at your university probably walked away asking, "how am i at the same school with this moron".

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  • More like... A rock can't think.

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  • God is a rock, does the rock do anything? You have faith in a rock that doesn't do anything and is an inanimate.

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  • I am your new god now !!! worship me in both dreade and awe !!!

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  • Great, another Gid-Botherer telling atheists how to think.

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  • yes, atheists are evil... because you have a closed-mind and hate anything new? see a shrink..,

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  • I "believe" that I'm detecting a bit of bovine scatology here...

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  • There are different definitions for atheist. It can be, as you say, simply lacking belief in any god/s, but it can also be taken to mean actually rejecting belief in god/s.

    Just because someone lacks a certain belief that doesn't make them anymore like a rock than you. There are an infinite number of possible beliefs we all lack.

    You presumably lack the belief that there's a pink elephant camping in your left ear - you're such a rock...

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  • You're over thinking the shit out of it and delving too much into petty semantics.

    Do you believe in Osiris, Molech, Baal, Odin, or Huitzilopochtli? Or do you lack a belief in them? And doesn't that make you an atheist too?

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  • It's pretty simple. Atheists believe there is no god. Agnostic is more like "don't know don't care" kind of attitude, they basically are atheists but it's more out of apathy then anger towards religious people.

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  • Inanimate objects and animals without high-function thinking ability don't have the ability to choose a belief, so it's not the same.

    Also, atheism is not a lack of belief, it's a belief that differs from those of theists. This in itself is not really an important distinction except that some atheists insist (incorrectly, IMHO) that it is.

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