Why do we shame positive things in American society?

1st example is patriotism. I will never apologize for being proud to be an American. My ancestors worked hard to get here and even harder after they did, all for the opportunities this country has to offer. And now it seems like my generation would rather put their own country down and I don't get it. Every country has bad things in its past... but we're one of the freest societies on earth.

I think America is the greatesr country in the world. Why are so many people ashamed to say that?

2nd example is privilege. If I have to hear about my straight, White, middle class privilege like it's a BAD thing again, I swear... it's GOOD. Being privileged is a GOOD thing. It's what we all want... to live a happy, stable life. It's called the American dream!

It's wrong that minorities suffer. But shaming people for NOT suffering doesn't help them.. it just hurts everybody. Privilege doesn't make someone a bad person it just makes them lucky so instead of trying to take it from those who have it you should be trying to help EVERYone get it. Prosperity isn't a bad thing.

Am I the only one who feels this way? Haven't we gotten a bit ridiculous as a society that we're telling each other and the world that the exact things that make us great are bad or wrong?


0|3
3|18

Most Helpful Guy

  • I think the crux of your message is in the paragraph :- "It's wrong that minorities suffer. But shaming people for NOT suffering doesn't help them.. it just hurts everybody. Privilege doesn't make someone a bad person it just makes them lucky so instead of trying to take it from those who have it you should be trying to help EVERYone get it. Prosperity isn't a bad thing".
    What you are saying is absolutely correct but I would move away from the idea of being proud or not being proud of who we are. It is an individual's choice how they feel about themselves, the important thing is not to impose their views on other people. Lets look at your statement of bringing everyone up to a certain standard of living or having rights. Yes I totally agree but one person should not stay up at the expense of another but on the flip side a person should not move up by bringing another person down.
    I feel general terms such as "Prejudice" or "Privilege" are defeatist in that they polarise people if we think of ourselves has people first of rather than men/women, racially different, class different etc.
    In life all people should have equal rights to advance themselves. How you do it is up to you, if you acquire wealth ( again goes back to the "You haven't hurt or abused anybody" to get it) then you should feel proud or entitled to have it and spend how you wish ( a whole other topic of discussion for another day).
    I can see how sometimes discussions like this become emotive but in a strictly logical sense your premise holds a lot of water.

    0|0
    0|0
    • I never said others HAVE to feel proud to be American. I said it's a positive trait to appreciate your country and we treat it like a shameful one. Whether you do or don't, it doesn't make me a bad person to appreciate my nationality.

      And as for the 2nd part, I think the major flaw in your thinking.. and other people's.. is that you seem to think one group being up is whats bringing the other down. And it's not really that way. Being privileged is never a bad thing. Suffering is a bad thing.

      I grew up in a really poor household for the 1st 12 years of my life. Gun shots, cockcroaches, shit plumbing. I know what it's like to be poor. Then my dad got a great job. And I knew what it was like to be upper middle class.

      It taught me there's no shame in fortune and no nobility in misfortune. One is good, the other beeds fixed. And that doesn't come down to displacing the people who made it to the top. That's a childish, reactionary way of thinking

    • Show All
    • That's fine - Understand now

    • Thanks for MHO

Most Helpful Girl

  • i agree, i'm very patriotic about my country and i do feel privilege for being angolan rather than an ethnic or religious minority. i would feel awkward if people made me feel bad for belonging. i guess in places like america, intense patriotism is commonplace in racists and those with the "go back to your country" narratives. also everyone expects everyone to be an apologist for something they can't help, just look at that one poll for whether muslims should apologize for terrorism haha

    0|0
    0|0

What Guys Said 17

  • Patriotism is ridiculous because being proud of your country is ridiculous. You can be HAPPY or CONTENT or perhaps even EXCITED about living in America but you can't be proud of being a US citizen. Pride is something that is necessarily connected with personal achievement. You can be proud to have passed an exam or to have been a good mother. Being a US citizen is not a accomplishment, it's a pure coincidence that you were born in America.

    Saying that America is the greatest country on earth is nationalistic and extremely offensive. I know you don't realize this (most Americans don't) but to the rest of the world it's extremely insulting. You're basically that snobby, arrogant kid walking through your high school saying "I'm so smart and attractive and perfect, I'm just the greatest person in the world, all you other guys are dumbasses and losers." You just come across as a complete asshole when you say this kinda stuff. Americans are the only people on earth who keep claiming that there country is the greatest. Ever wondered why? Because the rest of the world understands that just because you love your country doesn't make it the greatest. In fact, there's TONS of evidence that America is NOT the greatest country on earth. America is an embarrassment to the developed world in a number of issues, including education, over all health of the population, crime rate, life quality, life expectancy, child death rate, teenage pregnancy rate, protection of animals and the natural environment, social equality, democracy etc. etc. These are FACTS. You can look them up.

    America is the freest country on earth? Hahahah! Are you kidding? Have you ever set one foot outside your country? I'm sorry but as an outsider, I can't help but find this statement simply stupid. It's so not true. America has one of the most oppressive governments in the western world. There is practically no diversity among media outlets, police brutality and racism among police officers is raging, poor people are being systematically excluded from the democratic process, the constitutionally implemented separation between church and state is being violated all the time, and the NSA is spying on America's own citizens. I don't know what universe you live in but "freedom" is a little more than just firing your stupid guns.

    0|0
    0|0
  • yeah people shouldn't complain about privilege, it happens and it's always going to be around, complaining won't solve anything thats for sure.

    as for America being the greatest country in the world, I like how you expressed your opinion :) and i honestly think a lot of people give flak the United States ever since this video lol

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VMqcLUqYqrs

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZPHSXUS0_1c

    i know one of these links don't work so I posted 2 lol

    0|1
    0|0
  • Those things are all good things, unless you're white then if you have those opinions, you're racist. If you're white, go to school, work hard, work your way to being comfortable in life, you're evil cuz the only reason you're there is cuz you oppressed others by your working hard. The only other reason you're there is cuz white people that you never met and lived hundreds of years ago enslaved people. That made you rich. You're supposed to hate yourself, apologize to all the people you oppressed, give them everything you don't have and live on the streets begging. That's how other people get rich, by you being poor. You can't open a business, hire smart, hard working people, promote and pay well those that work hard, be race blind and hire the best person for the job. That makes people poor and destitute. Geez, what are you thinking?

    1|1
    0|0
  • I think its normal to think your home country is the best. If you ask people in France what country is the best, chances are that most of them will say France, ask Canadians which country is the best and they will say Canada. The same goes for most other countries, its common for people to be biased in favor of their own country. However people only seem to get mad when Americans express these biases. We are discouraged from this and pushed towards trashing our country.

    I kinda wish all the Americans who constantly trash America complain about how every other country is better would just save up and move to another country.

    0|0
    0|0
    • Exactly. I don't think you can really quantify "the best". But I think if anyone should think a country is the best it's its own citizens. I don't expect them to feel the same way outside the states.

  • Because people are crabs with inflated egos

    Fuck others success. Let's pull them down to our unappealing level, instead of trying to reach that level. You're thin and guys acknowledge you? Fuck you. I'm too lazy to hit the gym and stop eating a whole Little Caesar's pizza a day, so I'll shame you to gain weight and ban porn and other look-based jobs and put a lot of women out of jobs so I don't feel so shitty about myself
    everydayfeminism.com/.../

    Oh, you're an extrovert and have a lot of friends? Fuck you. Stop talking to people so we can be miserable and lonely together
    www.nationalreview.com/.../people-now-whining-about-extroverts-having-social-privilege-katherine-timpf

    Oh, you read and teach your kids the basics before sending them to school, and you live in a good family? Fuck you. It's unfair to the less fortunate. Stop reading and raising your child right with your resources and giving them an edge so our kids can be equally disadvantaged
    www.nationalreview.com/.../professor-if-you-read-your-kids-youre-unfairly-disadvantaging-others-katherine-timpf

    On the case of privilege, it's an equality thing. If someone is 3 steps ahead from the beginning, everyone wants to be 3 steps ahead. AKA even

    blog.greglturnquist.com/.../...-no-one-will-be.jpg

    Oh, and notice how all these are FEMINIST articles

    0|1
    0|0
  • Patriotism is a silly thing. It is a false state of allegiance held by people who prosper off of those who actually work; soldiers are patriots, revolutionaries are patriots, but the average person is nothing but a dimwit with a dictionary who fails to understand that they are just Nationalist lackeys who could not care less about patriotic behavior or the real progression of their country. These are the folks who talk about their ancestors but they themselves are nobodies who have done nothing to further the culture and worse they dare speak, whether in appreciation or to spit upon, as though they are meaningful citizens.

    Patriotism is for Citizens who are not grandfathered in through natural birth and simple miracle of life because that type of patriotic attitude is just a numbers game; you'd be as proud to be an Armenian as you are an American if you had just been born there instead of here.

    This of course leads into your understanding of the American Dream, which has nothing to do with privilege, because privilege isn't the American Dream. As a matter of fact it isn't only wrong but it is the direct opposite; the American Dream is that privilege doesn't exist, that people can and do have agency, make a difference, be a voice, and that there is some founding equality. It is not about comfort but instead about pure work; it is the sweat of the brow and the blood of the blistered fingers that makes the American Dream rather than the cushion you typed this on and the Mac you yourself didn't buy. This is why it is funny; people speak of their ancestors as though they take credit, as if they are made citizens by the brow, and their sweat and blood and tears are trophy legacies rather than something aspired to.

    Privilege is not about shaming the Majority or recognizing the suffering of the Minority in the American Dream, it is about the abolition of it at all costs, the very basis of moving out of England was to escape the tyranny of The State and yet here we sit ready to defend the tyranny of the State as "Patriots" who piggyback on the ancestors while living whimsical lives of decadent ignorance flipping coins in popularity contests we call "elections".

    Yet, alas, it doesn't matter. You roll around in your Nationalism and cling like the Leech you are to past victories in lifetimes you never experienced while milking this so-called "Privilege" which is counter all America stood for.

    0|0
    0|0
  • Europe shames patriotism even more, they fear it'll become fascism again, like WW2.

    Same thing with the minorities. Look at what's going on with the refugees. They're allowed to do anything just because they're not the majority, and therefore need special treatment.

    This kind of shaming occurs in the Western world, were liberals run rampant, shaming anyone that doesn't agree with them.

    0|0
    0|0
  • being patriotic is okay, but when you wave your flag in everyone's face. as well as the bible and your views, thats where the problem is.

    I dont care who you are, where you come from, or whatever. We ALL want the American DREAM. That is why you have the influx of immigrants here. They did it during the time of Ellis Island (some came here illegally as well).

    We have also become the worlds babysitter. We expect others to be like us, but other countries think we are too extreme on things and the western world is bad.

    0|0
    0|0
  • I agree with the 2nd one but not the first. Patrionsim is more like being a nationalist to be honest. When you love your country so much you start treating other people from other countries like subhumans and can lose sight of the truth and when your gov lies to you "turn a blind eye".

    0|0
    0|0
    • All things in moderation. You can love a thing and recognize its flaws.

    • Well then that's okay.

  • Wow... the illusion that you live in. Are you saying that other countries are not as free as America? The healthcare in the US is known to suck. No one is putting the country down, we are critical of our flaws, and that's where improvements should start. You can't just go on and act so proud because of something that you didn't do. If you actually want to be proud of the country that you live in, wouldn't it make since to make those changes yourself? It's true that our ancestors worked hard to get us here, but seriously... who's ancestor didn't work their asses off? No matter where I live or where my parents came from, I won't ever think a day in my life where I should have more pride to develop a classification for myself. I am an American; but someday I may decide to live somewhere else. America sounds great. @rescuemyheart, ... America isn't the only great place.

    0|0
    0|0
    • Don't recall saying that. Like ever. I never even said America was the freest. I said one of the freest. Also I never said not to be critical of your country's flaws, I think thats good as long as it's productive. I'm talking about people who say it makes you small minded to be proud of your country's positive attributes.

      And yeah never said it was the only great place. You just love putting words in my mouth

    • Ahah. Sorry for that, miss. I was in the zone to express my feelings and opinions on the matter, y'know? I generalized you with all the people who I've heard had a similar stance towards yours, and for that I'm sorry. I'm not necessarily saying that you said those things, but I hope I got my point across. Except I don't think I got it across to You in particular. My elaboration was the reasoning behind why one shouldn't be (or have reasons not to be) proud of patriotism.

    • It's okay, but I do think the kneejerk assumption is kinda exactly the point I was making. Appreciating your country seems to automatically put you in this blind nationalist category for a lot of people. You can be patriotic without being wilfully naive

  • i think u are making a big deal out of that. USA is so powerful. it is something u should be proud of , yea. even if u are in a failed country , still patriotism is not shameful. actually it is something to respect. about privilege , i think no one can deny ur right to live a happy life and to enjoy what u have , even if u are lucky , u should enjoy ur luck. but still u need to know that u have a responsibility and a duty to do towards those who happen to have nothing...

    0|0
    0|0
  • Multiple reasons most of it stems from the media though.

    0|0
    0|0
  • America is the greatesr country in the world. Why are so many people ashamed to say that?
    their not ashamed they just realise that its not

    0|0
    0|0
  • American is the best , there is alwasy full of hopeness in America, United we stand that's all the matters, no need to be shame positive things in American society
    God bless America

    0|0
    0|0
  • It seemed to change in the last 4 or 5 years. Liberals on the far left are driving the change.

    0|0
    0|0
  • Insecurities mostly

    0|0
    0|0
  • The 1% gets shamed by some Americans too, despite the fact that they pay roughly half of the income tax. That means that all public schools are 50% dependent on the 1%. They do way more for education that most people.

    www.cnbc.com/.../...f-of-federal-income-taxes.html

    1|0
    0|0

What Girls Said 2

  • People tend to overanalyze every single sentence, other people say... I guess you should just be brief like sayin you love your country enough to avoid other people writing a long essay to u

    0|0
    0|0
  • I feel like you are bashing minorities

    0|0
    0|0
Loading...