Would you vote for a national ban on burqas and niqabs in places of public access?

I'm asking this question because two political parties in my country Switzerland are currently preparing a national initiative to ban full-body disguises for religious purposes (burqas and niqabs). Because we have direct democracy on a national level, Swiss people will be able to vote whether they want this or not.
Currently, burqas and niqabs are already banned completely in France, Belgium and Chad. They are banned partially in the Netherlands, Egypt and the Congo and they are banned regionally in Switzerland (region of Ticino) and Italy (region of Lombardy).
If there was direct democracy in the US and you could vote on such an initiative, would you vote yes or no? And why?


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Most Helpful Girl

  • The burqas and niqabs creeps me the fuck out and they come off as looking like people part of a cult. Doesn't matter what reason for anyone to wear them, if I saw someone wearing that and not knowing the reason. I would be paranoid out of my mind and wanting to start freaking out. That's due to the fact that those outfits don't seem friendly at all. Though I know I'll just get a bunch of hate for thinking this and a lot of people would just tell me to get over it and they deserve more to dress the way they want than to be sensitive to anyone else being freaked out by it. I would seriously hate to run into anyone wearing those things. If I saw surrounded by people dressed like that I would probably have an anxiety attack and just fall apart right there.

    I would vote ban just due to how much it that outfit looks scary. Though It wouldn't matter and I would be forced to having to try and avoid people dressing like that. Though i'm happy that isn't a site you see.

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Most Helpful Guy

  • The niqab is a sexist symbol both against men and women which is opposed by most Muslims and isn't even Islamic to begin with.
    It is used to deter rape because according to its proponents lust is the cause of rape and it's the woman's job to cover up. By wearing it, it proclaims that all non-relative males are potential rapists who are unworthy of looking at the woman.
    It also restricts the woman and robs her of her identity.
    There is also the question of security and being able to identify individuals that dress as dementors.

    Sadly in Canada it is legal to vote and become a citizen in this monstrosity.
    I want to see an INTERNATIONAL BAN so that everyone sees that niqabs are worn predominantly in Saudi Arabia and Daesh controlled territory.

    @Mydnite you might like this
    This is a video from the liberated town of Manbij.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vxid75HiUfc

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    • 3mo

      "dress as dementors" hahaha that made me laugh xD. And yeah, I read about Manbji in the news. I'm so happy for these people. Turns out the Daesh dickheads were chased out of town by a bunch of tough female kurdish peshmerga fighters... fucking awesome :-).

    • 3mo

      Switzerland is on the right path. You guys already banned it in some places, it's time to ban it everywhere.

What Girls Said 17

  • yes. it symbolizes oppression of women and as a society we must get rid of that barbaric, ignorant, backwards culture. Bravo to those countries that ban them, hopefully many more will follow.

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    • 3mo

      What about women who decide to wear niqab?
      If a French girl wants to wear niqab she can't , it's oppression too
      By saying women who wear niqab are opressed is like saying women who wear skirt are whores
      Leave women dress what they wanna , respect her decision , and don't force women to wear in a certain way then keep talking about liberating women
      Forcing women not to wear niqab is the same as forcing them to wear it

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    • 3mo

      @reixun It's got nothing to do with GOD or religion as we have told you countless times. It has to do with a backwards culture that views women's as lesser human beings and therefore should be shamed and stripped of their identity in public and removed of basic human rights.

    • 3mo

      @reixun those 8 pink dislikes are obviously from brainwashed people from that region just like yourself. there's a ton of them on this site.

  • No, that's messed up. Seems like an obvious tactic to dissuade Muslims from inhabiting certain countries. I'm not for disrespecting the customs of one's religion just because I disagree with it.

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    • 3mo

      But can't it also be considered respectful to wear these things? Just to clarify: we're not talking about head-scarves, we're talking about full-body disguise. I mean... I personally feel treated in a rude manner if I need to talk to a person who won't show me her face. Moreover, I feel very much disrespected as a man. In my opinion, these things are not only disrespectful towards women but also towards men. The idea behind them is basically "all men are pervert pigs who can't control themselves and get real ugly the moment they see a woman's bare face". Isn't that reaction understandable?

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    • 3mo

      BlueCoyote Some countries even prohibit building towers. ;)

  • It is not a burqa or a niqab that does bad things, it is bad people and clearly not everyone who wears them are bad people. Far from it. I see women every other day in them, and they are with their kids, at the store, at the park, just living their lives. If the idea is to somehow stop crime or stop people from doing terrorist things, which is really what this is saying, we all know, it won't do that at all. The people that do these things will continue as they have done. America is built on freedom and if we start banning clothing, it becomes a slippery slope as to what else might need banning.

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    • 3mo

      No, it's not about crime (especially not for me). I am far on the left politically, so I'm definitely not your typical law-and-order enthusiast. I also don't have anything about the women who wear burqas, I'm sure many of them are very nice (though a little brainwashed) people. It's about the burqa/niqab themselves and what they symbolize. In my opinion, they are very degrading to women and also very offensive to men. Contrary to other pieces of clothing, the burqa was designed for a specific purpose: to hide women in public. The implicit message is: "If you are a woman, you are not worth being seen in public". I find that humiliating. The burqa's message to men is: "You are all a bunch of sick, barbaric, pervert pigs who can't control yourselves and your urges. So women need to be protected from you." I also find that quite insulting. And many women get forced by their crazy medieval husbands to wear these things...

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    • 3mo

      ... having someone try regulate that or tell us we have to live this one way. I see the merit in both ways of living. I think ironically Trump is trying to make the US xenophobic (I say ironically because his wife is foreign... you'd think he'd have a better understanding). He's talking about banning immigration from certain places or implementing tests to see if foreigners traveling here are bad, but he has no grasp of history (or frankly many other things). Walls, fences, regulations, airport scans, bans... they do not stop people who want to truly do harm. They only give the illusion of safety. Add to that we are a huge country so closing off our borders is basically impossible. People will do like the Mexican's have done for decades, and just create thousands of miles of underground tunnels to get over our "walls." As far as the burqa, I was really thinking about it the other day, and it's almost like the wall problem...

    • 3mo

      ... If the goal is to free these women from the tyranny of being controlled by a religion and a culture dominated by men, removing the burqa won't accomplish that. It's almost like telling an abusive man, you can't slap your wife in public. Okay, he says, but then what happens when he goes home? The culture is still there and they will still find ways to control women or abuse them if the cultural norms or the religious norms aren't fundamentally changed and as we've seen throughout history this usually isn't done quietly or nicely because you're asking a group of people to willingly give up power and control for none of the above in exchange. Removing the burqa may indeed actually make it worse for these women. If they can't be covered up, then they may be forced to stay home for example, ending what little freedoms they do have. I think the problem is so much more complicated than just the clothing there.

  • I think it's a step back to start dictating what others can wear, don't the west pride themselves on not being an oppressive force on women when comparing themselves to the Muslim faith?

    I do not think they should be banned HOWEVER I do not think you can reserve the right to keep your face hidden because of religious beliefs. If a shopping mall (for example) has a no hats and no hoods policy, then take your peep scarf off. Your belief that there is a supreme being has nothing to do with the rules of the shopping centre/mall. The mall is not a place of worship, your religion has no authority. If a bus driver asks you to remove your peep scarf so he can check the ID against your face you either take it off or you walk home. That's my opinion on the matter.

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    • 3mo

      Yes, I think that's a sensible opinion. Now the problem that I see in public is this: Imagine I was a dad and went to the park with my teenage daughter (park = public area). I see a couple of women in their burqas. Personally, I find this dress very insulting towards me as a man and towards the cultural values of my country. I also find it insulting for my daughter. Teenagers are a little shy and insecure about themselves... imagine my daughter seeing these women being so dehumanized (voluntary or not doesn't matter here). I want my daughter to grow up as a strong, secure woman and don't want her to see other women being treated like shit (or treating themselves like shit).
      Now you could say "that's just your opinion". And I guess you're right. But what if other people felt the same way? What if it was 1,000 people feeling the same way? What about 10,000 people? What about 4 million other people (that's about half of the population of Switzerland)? At what point can it be (cont)

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    • 3mo

      @BlueCoyote When I was a 10yr old boy (that's LONG ago!) , I went to a closed swimming pool once or twice a week. They had a pool where every adult and adolescent could come and a second pool "women and children only". I went to two different public "boy's schools" from 6 to 14 years. There wasn't one woman in any of these school. No girls either, of course. My girl cousins went to girls only public schools.
      When my wife started teaching at 22, her schools were coed but several religious schools nearby were not coed.
      I remember also that some trains had "women only" divisions.
      That's just a long generation ago thus.
      When years ago I came in Mexico DF, the subway there had "women and children only" wagons.
      When we see these things done by immigrants we raise eyebrows. Our society changed a lot in a few decades, theirs didn't yet. (But in Morocco and Tunisia I have seen children in coed schools.) Their society too is changing. Give them the time. Forcing them will only create resistance.

    • 3mo

      Women aren't allowed in Starbucks at the minute because they are doing some work inside and don't have a partitioning wall to divide the men and women. Women have to send their drivers in to fetch them coffee... because of course they can't drive themselves.

      The Arab culture in Saudi and similar places is... I'm not going to say what I think if it but I think it's an utter disgrace we do business with them. Utter disgrace.

  • I would vote no. Each woman should have the choice to dress how she wants. There's nothing inappropriate about burqas or niqabs and if the lady wants to dress that way, I do not want to vote for something that will stop her from doing so.

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  • No. People should be able to wear whatever the fuck they want.

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    • 3mo

      Can you believe it
      That mydnite felt so silly about herself that she escaped and blocked me :D

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    • 3mo

      And just to let you know: I also have something against christianity, judaism and all other religions you can think of.

    • 3mo

      When you say that European woman can get naked and this is freedom , but another european woman can't wear NIQAB just because she's Muslim
      Something is wrong here

      And evolution is just a theory

  • No. Even though I don't agree to the tradition of women covering them up because it's a sin for men to actually look and see their beauty and how beautifully the nature has created women?
    But yeah it's their culture, I think they should be given the right to wear whatever they want.

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  • Any country who bans it is infringing on freedom of religion. If it's a security issue then they can have female security confirm identities.

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    • 3mo

      guess what
      i answered to these claims, but he couldn't give a reasonable response , so he avoided talking about the subject

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    • 3mo

      sexual fetish based on degrading, sauna is not about degrading
      people are celebrating it in public, then you come say we should force women to wear off niqab cause its oppressing-while these women don't think so-
      in the same time these people admitting that this fetish is about degrading

      you claim i dont know about european culture and she claimed that we are brainwashed
      its much easier when you dont have a real reason to start say that

      you are the one who don't know about our culture nor our women problems
      and you keep avoiding my question, you didn't answer it till now

      and here my question again i wish to be answered
      "why can't an European normal woman wear niqab? while the very same woman can get naked?"
      what kind of freedom does she has when she only has the option to get her cloths off but not to cover?

      i wish to be answered i wish

      and i know its stressing you, cause you have no real reason and conversation is in public

    • 3mo

      man forget about me totaly
      you asked a question
      3 women want it to be banned
      14 women don't want it to be banned
      :D
      it seems all the world is brainwashed and backwards but you are the super doper sophisticated progressive open-minded smart man

  • I'm Swiss and I'm going to vote NO because everyone should be able to wear what they want. (I know your question was addressed to people from the us but I still wanted to answer)

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  • No, it should be a religious right if they want to wear it. It really disrespects them to ban it

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    • 3mo

      Does religion justify anything though? Personally, I feel like religion is often used by radicals (both muslims and christians) as a fig leaf to get a free pass for anything.

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    • 3mo

      I was saying muslims in general are not terrorist. And the whole point of someone immigrating to a western country is so they can experience freedoms they didn't have before. It is not right to ask them to give up something that is important to them.

    • 11d

      but why is it acceptable to expect the host country to compromise their identity to accommodate foreigners?

  • It's bullshit. Why should a woman be made to wear sunshine she doesn't want to. No way those ladies want to wear that stuff! Get rid of them now

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  • No, while I don't agree with the idea, I'm not going to disrespect people that do.

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  • Nope. Freedom of Religion.

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  • I would vote no for the niqabs and burkas. They try to make a special day for it in my country (only talk about it) but when they saw how much people didn't want it they just shut up and abandon the idea

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  • yes, I don't want western values overtaken by Muslim customs. they should assimilate

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  • No, but they should remove it going into banks or places where it's tight security. In other places a female member or staff should be allowed to ask to see their face.

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    • 3mo

      I see. That's basically how the Netherlands handles it.

    • 3mo

      They have to meet in the middle and be respectful of each other. It shouldn't be only one side that has what they want.

  • They are quite unsightly.

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What Guys Said 22

  • NO way. If someone wants to wear a burqa, it's OK for me.
    If someone wants to wear a nun's dress, it's OK too for me.
    If someone wants to wear a kimono, it's OK too for me.
    If someone wants to wear jeans, it's OK too for me.
    If someone wants to wear nothing at all, it's OK too for me.

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    • 3mo

      One of very rare times I disagree with you ;-). I think the difference between a kimono or jeans vs. a burqa is that kimonos or jeans aren't insulting or degrading. Neither is being nude, which is why I'm also fine with nudity (sure, some people might feel offended but objectively speaking, nudity is not offensive in any way).
      The burqa or niqab (full-body disguise) has a very degrading symbolism, both towards women and men. Because whatever certain individuals say about it, the purpose stated by islamist ideology is clear: to hide the woman and protect her from men's stares. In other words, the message towards muslim women is: "You are not worth being shown in public" and the message towards men is: "You are all a bunch of sick, pervert pigs who can't control yourselves and the minute you see a woman's face, you will lust after her:" Isn't that a little different from say, a kimono?

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    • 3mo

      I doubt they walk around like that since there are no holes for their eyes... but even if they do: I don't discriminate against one specific social group or religion. Like I said in other comments here, I don't have anything against the muslims as people. I have something about the burqa as a piece of clothing. I find these nuns' dresses to be just as offensive and ridiculous as burqas. I don't care whether you're christian, muslim, jewish, hindu, atheist... just please give me the normal human respect of showing me your face.

  • Yes I would support that. I want to be able to look at the face and expressions of the ones around me to perceive my safety, and their reactions.

    Thinking about it, you can't know when they are smiling or crying, or cringing.. or whatever. Also important, everyone is assuming that it is for women and women oppression blablabla, it's also a good disguise for men to pass as women.

    It is not oppression, if they came to my country willingly they'd have to follow our rules, and not the opposite. We already accept many things, and that's ok, but if it changes my own safety, then fuck off.

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  • Covering of the face and the head is a violation to security, but only they can get away with that. Also, if we go into Islamic countries we would have to abide to their dress codes otherwise face consequences, so they should wear what we wear if they decide to come to the west.

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  • I would not vote for a ban because things like freedom of religion, freedom of choice make us a free country. Stomping on someone's right to do what they with thier own bodies is against the values of freedom. Against the values of a free country. By banning these burkas/niqabs we will only be attacking our own values.

    I respect everyone's right to choose, so I will 100% be against banning the niqab in public places. For things like driving license or in court or to be a nurse or to be a teacher they should remove their niqabs.

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    • 3mo

      Okay, I see. I respect freedom very much and I'm glad I live in a very free country myself. However, I think a lot of people on here seem to confuse basic rights with "absolute rights". All fundamental rights such as freedom of speech or freedom of assembly are and have been restricted in some cases. To give you just one example: I can't just walk up to you in public and call you an idiot, even if that was my opinion or my way of practicing free speech. In some cases it is necessary to restrict a basic right in order to protect other people's rights and freedom. So it's a balancing of different interests if you will. The question then is what side ways heavier in the specific case of religious full-body disguises.

    • 3mo

      Freedoms are restricted when someone else hinders or infringes on someone else's freedom, or their is a threat or harassment involved. I don't see in what way someone's right to choose what they want to wear effects anyone else's freedom.

      Personally I am against niqabs myself I find them dehumanizing, I am sure most women don't want to wear niqab. But we don't know who is doing it out of free will or cultural/religious pressure. We must respect their right to choose. Dictating to other people what they can or can't do, what they can't or can't wear is oppressive, if we go down that road and start dictating to people and limiting their freedoms soon we will find ourselves in the recieving end. The day might come somebody finds what we do offensive and hence must be banned. You can't just pick and choose when is freedom applicable when it should be banned.

      By undermining our own values we are no better.

  • The face needs to be identifiable so...

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  • My country wants to label itself as the greatest and freest in the world. As such, there's no way in hell I'd support such a ban.

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  • No. I completely disagree with them covering their face. Which is actually not in the Quran either. That should be banned.

    But completely telling them to open up would be evil from our part. If we want people to respect us then we should respect them.

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    • 3mo

      But they could still wear hijabs (head-scarves) and cover their hair, their head and their neck (just not the face). Hijabs will never be illegal in any country. So would that still be too much to ask for in your opinion?
      What about in cases such as making an ID or showing your ID? In Switzerland, it's mandatory to own either an ID or a passport. However, at the moment women in burqas can just wear their full-body disguise on the ID-photo which kind of defeats the whole purpose of identification...

    • 3mo

      Yeah that's why I said they shouldn't be covering their face for security reasons. They aren't even supposed to. It's the male minority pricks who make them do it.

      as long as they show they're then they can cover anything else.

  • Does the dress represent an oppressive lifestyle and law structure? Yes.
    But so does trying to ban what people are and aren't allowed to wear. So no, I wouldn't vote for that.

    If you want to free Muslim women from the shackles of Sharia Law, give them an education.

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    • 3mo

      Well, they already receive that education in European countries or in North America. I certainly agree with you that education is the best tool against islamism (or really, any extremist religious ideology). The question is whether we should also protect the women who are forced by their husbands to wear these things and whether we should protect society from feeling threatened or insulted by these dresses...

  • Freedom of religion was granted in the constitution, that's what this country was founded on

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    • 3mo

      Yet, all the basic rights of the American constitution have been restricted in numerous cases - not just in the distant past but also in recent times. I think many people here seem to confuse "fundamental rights" with "absolute rights". It's not quite the same. Just because the American constitution (btw. all European constitutions say these things too!) says that you have the freedom of speech or the freedom of assembly or the freedom of religion doesn't mean that you can make use of these rights at all times and regardless of your environment or specific circumstances. For instance the constitution says that you have the right of free speech but it doesn't say "Anyone can say absolutely anything they want under any and all circumstances".
      So if you think America was founded on the principle of absolute freedoms, you are actually mistaken. America was founded on the principle of secular humanism, which says that my freedom to swing my arm ends at your nose.

    • 3mo

      The niqab is not mandatory in Islam. It's actually a minority that believe it is while the majority oppose it and think it is wrong.

    • 3mo

      @QuestionMan that's wrong. It's optional, majority think it's a woman's choice whether to wear one. Not that it's wrong.

  • Great hypocrisy by the supposed freedom lovers. Everyone's free to strip but if they want to cover themselves it's out of the question.

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  • You are wrong. Here in belgiun it is illigal to disguise yourself so that your identity cannot be seen. This also includes religious clothes if they do that. Its not only for religious clothes. The reason they do this is because men in burkas have robbed places and protestors ususually disguise themselves to avoid police persecution.

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    • 3mo

      Yes, sorry, my bad. I just mentioned burqas because I mainly wanted to talk about them. In Switzerland, it's currently illegal to disguise yourself for political reasons (such as during a protest) but it's legal to disguise yourself for religious reasons. Personally, I think that's a bit of a double standard. I mean, if I have to show my face as a member of the Antifa/black bloc, shouldn't I also have to show it if I'm a member of a religion?

    • 3mo

      Yes i think that it is a double standard too

  • And then some say that Muslims want to force their ideas
    While it's the other way around
    Ironically these people consider themselves civilized

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    • 3mo

      Well I could argue that it's part of our culture to show our face. So just like my girlfriend would have to wear a burqa if we traveled to Saudi Arabia, an Arab girl would have to lay off her burqa in a European country.

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    • 3mo

      Instead of being too angry cause you don't know how beautiful that woman is

      Why don't you focus on real things that educated westerns worry about
      Like parents who train their child's to be whores -THESE ARE NOT MY WORDS THATS HOW THEY DESCRIBED IT-
      and tell me what is the fuck is this, cause it seems to me they are teaching their daughters to be sex objects
      AGAIN THATS NOT WHAT I THINK , THATS WHAT EDUCATED WESTERNS THINK
      I CAN SHOW YOU THE WHOLE VID, BUT I THINK YOU DONT LIKE KNOWLEDGE
      http://www.imgpaste.net/image/VnJN7

      http://www.imgpaste.net/image/VnTPw

    • 3mo

      https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_nudity
      In Rome section:
      "Slaves for sale were often displayed naked to allow buyers to inspect them for defects, and to symbolize that they lacked the right to control their own body."

      So according to your culture
      NIQAB symbolize Royal people
      Nudity symbolize slavery
      Some Muslim women treat herself like a queen and that pisses you off
      No wonder who loves slavery will hate liberty, and will try to force them , that's what slaves think how should world work , by force
      While I think nudity symbolize slavery , I won't try to change it by force, cause I don't think it should be done by force

      I have bad news for you, Islam is the fastest growing , more Muslims will be in your country , more converts too :D, and you will have more NIQAB in your country

      I can see European panic about it , but can't stop it , cause it's coming from natives

  • Sure, fuck those terrorists if they don't know who you are you shouldn't be allowed to vote

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  • im ok with businesses banning disguises but regular public should be ok to wear whatever you want.

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  • I wouldn't in my country because we don't really have a problem. But if I lived in a country where people take advantage of it I would.

    At the end of the day you got to look after yourself and your country first.

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  • There is no difference between that and prohibiting people from wearing a cross dangling from their neck.

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  • Well I do wonder why they wear those in the first place. Maybe those women are hideously unattractive. Imagine me sitting there eating a sandwich and she walks by without her burqa.

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  • Definetly not.

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  • No, they can wear it if they want to.

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  • I support it...

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  • not personally, i like them

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  • Nope. I'd rather vote to keep fat women from wearing bikinis and yoga pants. Let the down votes commence.

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