Choose Your Career or Have Kids?

Choose Your Career or Have Kids?

I come from a long line of women who are quite dramatically split down the middle when it comes to deciding on having a career and no kids, or having kids and being a stay at home mom or kids and career both. The reason I say the line is dramatic is because those with kids, really had kids. They wanted kids as a sort of dream realized or more accurately, a dream fulfilled. Those that didn't want them, could not be swayed no matter how many pleas or more accurately, threats about loneliness and being eaten alive by cats were made.

This question is by and far one that is almost exclusively heaped upon the shoulders of women since the moment it is discovered in the womb that they are going to be born female. "Oh, she'll make a great mother someday." "Oh imagine it now, we'll be able to have grand kids." "Oh, let's get her a baby doll so she can practice for later." It is a low lying stress applied to a woman's life and the longer she is a female on this earth, aka, the older she gets, the more intense that pressure gets to do as some like to claim is the "duty of all women" to bear children. The duty? Really? A woman can make no other accomplishment in life unless she has kids? Now imagine you are a woman who cannot bear children no matter what herculean medical interventions you throw at the problem--are you less of a woman, not a real woman, incapable of achieving anything in life? That sh-t is harsh to both those who physically cannot bear children and those that simply don't want children.

Choose Your Career or Have Kids?

Look around at this planet we have. Not every woman is cut out to be a mother. They just aren't. Being born with a vagina or a penis, no more makes you a great mother or father, or even a decent one. We should at least have the expectation that those that do want children, first and foremost, actually want them, and secondly plan to do everything necessary to ensure the health and happiness of that child. If a woman literally says, I do not want kids, there should come with that the express understanding that this is a person neither ready nor capable of having children and giving them the life they should have.

Worse, if a woman says "I hate kids," why should the reaction to such statements be, you...YOU, should definitely have a couple of them. This is a set-up for failure. The pressure these women have put on them to have kids as if that will solve something for them, is crazy. What business is it of yours to pressure someone to have children you, yourself, will not have to deal with or raise or provide for? So what if at 55, one woman feels as though they should have had kids---they are an adult, and they made their choice, and what of it. They will have to deal with that feeling, if it even comes because some women even at 40, 50, 60 and beyond have zero regrets about not having children.

Choose Your Career or Have Kids?

Those that choose a path of having children and being stay at home moms tend to really want that job. They feel it in their bones. You can see the love and devotion they tend to spread between their kids and it is marvelous to see, and yet, some still don't consider that, the act of raising good and decent children to accomplish something in this world, "an actual job." Can you imagine as a woman being told or guided and believing in having children is part of being a woman and then being told afterwards that the act of raising them and caring and nurturing them is not worthy of someone's approval. These women are busy trying to groom the future of humanity, and this is not worthy, but rather cause for their condemnation.

It's the pointed questioning that some of these women go through, like how could you even leave a job to be..."a mom," like its some kind of disease they must be quarantined away from. Being a stay at home mom means you know who your kids are with, where they are, what they are learning, how they are growing, what foods they are eating. You never have to wonder or be fearful and set up nanny cams because you have no idea what allowing a stranger in to take care of your kids will do. This is the security these moms provide, and trying to shame them because they want this knowledge and to devote themselves to raising what they literally grew inside of them, is crazy.

Choose Your Career or Have Kids?

Finally the mom who does want it all, home and career. She's spent the better part of her life investing in an education so that she may have a career, so why should she then have to choose between child and career? When things are important in life, you make time for them, and in many cases, that can be 2, 3, 5 things. Difficult, sure, but not impossible. Many employers feel that this is a mom to be punished for this pursuit. They tend to shy from promoting such women. Some women feel that they literally have to hide their pregnancies at work for as long as possible so that they can continue on their career path. You have some employers who literally say that these women can't do both and won't allow them to or at least position them in such a way that their will be no growth for them after their child is born, yet this is something that rarely happens to a man who decides to have children.

It's such a double standard between these things. Women "should" have children, they "should" have a job," but when the two combine, everyone seems to scatter in their thinking what is right or they fail to view a woman as an individual and focus on her merits and how she specifically is doing her job as opposed to how other previous women who have had kids have done their own. Choose to have kids should not be made into a crime.

Choose Your Career or Have Kids?

The bottom line is there are no shortages of women having children on this planet. A scant 28% of women by the time they are 30-34 do not have any children. There is absolutely no danger at this moment in time of the world's population getting smaller. In fact, the danger has always been in modern times, that we are slowly but surely suffocating this planet by over populating it. Having a child is a lot of work, a lot of money, and dedication and those that want them should have them and those that don't, should be left to their own devices to make their own personal life choices. And for those that want both career and family, we need a system that allows this to happen. We need a system that doesn't punish mothers or fathers for that matter for taking time off to raise the futures of this planet; there are a few countries around the world that allow for this practice, and the world hasn't crumbled to it's knees. Let people decide for themselves what choices they want to make for their lives and their families. It's not your business to decide for them.

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Most Helpful Guy

  • My only daughter died a week past her 20th birthday. Even tho I had a successful working life I have no children.

    Seeing people with kids and grand kids makes me feel like a huge part of life was taken from me.

    Have kids. Make your family the top priority in your life. Even when they become rebellious as teenagers they will come back to you and bless your world more than you know. :)

Most Helpful Girl

  • I would pick working at home while having kids.

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  • www.ma.utexas.edu/users/m408n/AS/2-6-2_1.png

    First of all, people need to understand "asymptotes" and "marginal change" within the context of economics.

    A friend of mine is a "life coach," and what she means by that is really, "Unlicensed therapist." She often preaches the point she tells her couples, "The woman SHOULD have the CHOICE as to whether to be a STAY AT HOME MOTHER or WORK AT HER CAREER." According to her, if a man doesn't provide his female partner with such an "option," then he is a failure of a man, and his female partner would naturally and understandably "resent" him.

    That's all very "idealistic," "normative" and "constructivist" (even if it's really just expressivist masquerading as constructivist). Let's instead just discuss economic "realism" in non-normative terms.

    I'm a seller of goods and services with an economic market. I need to understand how to "price" these goods and services.

    Assume: $50,000 per year = median gross income per laborer
    Assume: 40% effective tax rate (Federal, State & Local, Soc. Sec., Medicare, Unemployment, Disability).
    Therefore: $30,000 per year = median net income per laborer
    Assume further: ONLY MEN participate in the labor market.

    I'm a landlord. I have a one-bedroom for rent. Who may my renter be? A single guy. A male/female couple. Yet, how much can I charge them? I "want" to charge them X, but the market only supports a price of Y. What is "Y"? Y = 33% of the "net" household income per year. Net household income = $30,000. So, the "rent" I can charge is limited to just $10,000 per year.

    Now, assume both men AND WOMEN participate in the labor market.

    Now, net household income = $60,000. So, the rent I can charge for the same exact apartment is $20,000 per year. (This is the economic market men and women live in).

    So, when women like my friend say, "Men SHOULD offer women the CHOICE," what I hear is, "I'm bad at math. I think men should pay 66% of their median net income towards rent, and then try to pay for food and other expenses for both people, and if there's no enough money, work more than 40 hours a week, because the woman SHOULD have the CHOICE."

    Unfortunately, society will realize that the solution to the problem, is to simply STOP HAVING CHILDREN and REDUCE THE POPULATION (lowering demand pressure for goods and services, lowering competition in the labor market, and increasing real wages).

    • Also, shouldn't it be both the man and woman's decision? I mean, you are a couple. You both have to raise the child to give him/her the most optimal living environment. Sure, you can decide, as a woman, to have a child, but to expect the man to not have a say in the matter and pay for your ass and the child's is selfish, ludicrous, and detrimental to the relationship of everyone involved. He'll resent that child and probably not love you as much. He'll feel like a "bank account" instead of a provider or father even. So your so called "life" coach doesn't no shit about what she's talking about or life for that matter.

  • Just because your family has a long standing split between the decision, does not mean you need to follow. You can have either, or both, if you choose.

    Sadly, I find your take more focused on what other people think rather than what you think. Yet, none of it is based on what people you actually know in-person think.

    The internet allows the 7 billion insignificant people on the planet to voice their personal opinion on whatever topic they choose. So while you read online about people saying "A woman's duty is to bear children", you don't really know where that's coming from. It could be a 12 year old kid trolling you for all you know.

    Yet, in real life, I have never NEVER EVER heard anyone in real life say that a woman is selfish if she doesn't have kids, or that a woman's duty is to have kids. Much of this so-called pressure to have children, or the expectation that society demands children from women is often a self-created perception, or regurgitation of someone's blog halfway around the world in some 3rd world country with dinosaur era views.

    Note in your Take, that you do not actually say your friends and family have been telling you these things. In fact, you even say in the first paragraph that your family members who didn't want children could not be swayed to change their mind. Yet, the rest of your Take, you're only referring to "they", which I assume are the people on the internet. You can find no end of people's opinions here, and you have CHOSEN to listen to a specific group of opinions, while ignoring those who say you can be anything you want.

    Here's an important lesson for you. Worry not about the opinions of people who do not matter in your life - particularly those in the online community.

    • Aside from just stating facts about my family, this was a take about women in general "having" to come to a decision about whether or not they choose or do not choose to have children. I've felt the pressure to have kids from friends with kids, from certain family members, and so have so many countless other women. Just because I didn't go into long lengthy details on my personal life as this take is already pretty lengthy doesn't mean those family members without kids never felt the pressure... in fact, it illustrates that they were pressured, but in their case, could not be swayed. People who don't even know you, and ones they do will always feel like the should weigh in on your fertility or lack thereof. I tried my best to illustrate that no matter what decision you make, there are people who will create negativity around it, but ultimately the choice is yours and that people should back off from trying to assume they know what's best for someone else in their life.

  • It is a decision women have to make initially and I chose to study to a high standard up to age 22 where I am in a good position to go to university whenever I want, I then decided to have my children, fertility issues in my family drove that decision but it's not the end of the world; children go to school after their 4th birthday leaving you plenty of time to make a career for yourself once that happens which is the plan in my case. It depends on what your main focus in life is, family or financial security, rarely both unless you want to neglect the family aspect for a considerable amount of time. I have no doubt that pursuing a career would be easier without dependants but being a stay at home or part time working parent just wouldn't be satisfying for me - financially or mentally. It all comes down to motivation.

  • i look at it this way: some women have the "mommy gene" built in, but i most definitely do not.

    my mom, my aunties, and my younger sister are all fantastic mothers, and they knew early on that kids would be part of their lives... as for me, i kinda just assumed i'd have a big family, since i came from one. but it was only in my 20s that, though i liked other people's children, kids were not for me.

    every time i envisioned my future, i saw books, cats, a boyfriend or husband... but no kids. i wondered if, perhaps, i'd missed some major social cue, since i wanted to want them. but, as the years went on and i never once thought of getting pregnant as this joyful, magical thing; rather, the idea terrified me. and, the one time i thought i might have gotten accidentally knocked up, i had daily panic attacks and was so overjoyed when my period came that i sobbed hysterically for two hours.

    i have no maternal instinct and, at 30 years old, have never experienced "baby fever". that said, those who want to be parents should be able to do that without being castigated for it... ditto those who don't.

    • Couldn't agree more. I've known since I was very young that the only way I would have kids is if I adopt. I've never wavered, never felt like just because the "clock is ticking," I should just find some guy and have kids. I don't like when people try to make it seem like my life is over if I don't biologically have kids. It's like excuse you, I'm very accomplished in my life and I'm not going to apologize for making decisions about my own life which these people aren't apart of. We've come a ways as a society where there is considerably less pressure on women to marry/have kids vs. say the 1950's, but it still happens a lot.

  • I like how you ended on that it's up to the person to decide :)
    Agreed!
    As someone who wants both a career and little ones, it's all about choice :) and people should understand you can pick one, none, or both, heck you can even take a break from the job and come back-it's just not black and white.

  • I want both really, and I don't understand people who think that's selfish, because I would preferably be in a relationship where careers/ childcare was split equally because both a mother and father are parents and equally should spend time with their children/raise them. But, they should also be able to have their own ambitions and be able to work and earn their own money. However if I had to choose one, I would pick kids but then I'd go back to work once they were at school age

  • I'm both.

    Don't get me wrong, if money was no issue, I would choose to be a mum. However, nowadays having a family can't be done off one pay cheque. Hell, running a house can't be done off one pay cheque.

    I've had a string of fairly shit jobs. I don't mind being bottom of the pile but it highlighted issues to me for the future. Like "what if my kid is sick". And it sounds daft but having a cat highlighted this. The few times I would ask for an hour or two off work (made up at a future date) so I could take him to the vet made me angry. I didn't even get time off for myself to go to the doctors, but my cat is my baby and keeping him healthy is a huge priority.

    I decided to start a business. This way I can look after my future children and I hope to be able to build a business that provides employees respect and flexibility. Hours would dodge rush hour meaning parents could do the school run without begging, if a kid needed to go to the doctors, work from home is an option, etc. I want to provide a business that allows people to be people not just slaves.

    On a more personal note, since we've had my cat my dad has worked from home (coincidence, my dad is disabled I'm his Carer) and I recently too. My cat cannot go a day alone (he has abandonment issues) so if I did have a work office he would have to come with me to work or me work half days. No job would allow this even though sadly it's what he needs. Right this second he is curled up with me having a cuddle with me and his catnip.

    Work places sadly aren't geared up for people's lives... something I hope to change. With the only exception being pets at work other than mine (allergies and it wouldn't be a daily thing) I would extend all of my expectations to my employees and strict reviews in place to make sure no abuse was happening.

    It's sad that this is the world.

    • There are some family and pet friendly work places, but sadly, yes, they are far and few in between. I was lucky to go to a school as a kid with extended hours so parents could actually get off work in enough time to pick up their kids from school, but my sister in law works a job where the offer the bare minimum for everything when it comes to maternity leave and they require parents who do office hours at home, to have a caregiver lined up because they feel it's too distracting even working from home to have a kid running about. We just don't support motherhood in this country. It's like, pro-life, have children, but when the children are born, forget about them and their needs and the needs of their parents including the fathers who rarely if ever get any time off for anything kid/baby related. I hope you get your dream to create a workable company.

    • I've spent my working life (since 16, legal age) being abused by all but 1 company I worked for. And I worked for 4 and a volunteer for 3. 2 of those I was an apprentice, on apprenticeship wage (£2.46 an hour aged 18+ - min wage here was £6.36 at the time) and 3 I worked for free. The other two were min wage. I wasn't allowed to go to doctors appointment, even vommitting at work wasn't enough of a reason to go home. I've had to work through bladder infections when passing blood stacking shelves to having 32 infected mosquito bites and being sick in a kitchen sink (while working in the kitchen) through to being sick before work and still made to walk 5 miles to deliver vouchers... I've been truly beaten around by my employers to the point I will not return to work no matter how poor. My company will succeed. My company will promote decent values. But my company will not accept reloaders. I've worked too hard to be taken for granted anymore.

    • For 2 years I worked 2 jobs and went to college. And everyone expected everything. I also had a relationship during one of those years. If it wasn't for my boyfriend I would have lost my mind.

  • I've never planned on having kids and no one has ever mentioned my doing so not even me dolls to play with. i feel not have i ever felt any pressure to be a mom

    just throwing in my experience. not saying you are wrong for your experience.

    • i dont see myself as a mother i prefer to contribute in other ways. and i dont really want to get marred so it would not be an ideal environment anyhow.

  • Every individual has their own plan. Some women are okay with raising kids and working while others would prefer to do one or the other. I personally plan to prioritize my career and then maybe have kids later. For now, I'm just focused on finishing college and getting the job I want.

    • Studies indicate you are more the norm, than anything else. With no obligations anymore for women to get married as soon as they leave high school and start having children, more women throughout the decades have of course gone on to college and to establish careers pushing the average age that women who chose to have children, up to 25, 28, 30.

  • Okay, first, why the fuck do so many women think that being a man is the easiest thing in the world? Why? Do you not think that expectations are heaped upon men the second people find out their mother is pregnant with a boy? Do you think that we do not have responsibilities? That their are men working two or three jobs to put food on the table for their family because they love being a walking talking paycheck to their family?(Hence 80% of all spending in america is done by women despite the fact that men work and earn the most). How solipsistic does one have to be to ignore the massive amounts of expectations on others while thinking only of themselves. The reason why people expect women to be mothers, and men to be fathers, is because biologically speaking the singular purpose of existence is reproduction. That is why you exist, that is why you have a womb, because your function is to reproduce. Society pressures reproduction because its a biological drive but also because without people their is no society. So thats why that exists. This applies to men, they get asked why they don't have a girlfriend, why they are not married, when are they going to have kids so your claim this only happens to women shows how self absorbed and self centred you are. Maybe you want to get your head out of your ass and take a look around next time, prefferablly before you say something so incredibally stupid. As for being career oriented or family oriented, their is a reason why its one or the other, either you focus on career and work all the time (don't know why women think this is some kind of a privilege, its not its a responsibility) or you spend your time with the children, because children need a parent if they don't they grow up dysfunctional on account of them being a secondary priority their entire life when they needed a parent to love them and be dedicated to them (in fact I am fairly certain the trying to do both is what has created so many self centered people, they learned it from their parents who where to self absorbed with their careers to ever actually put the needs of others (specificaly their flesh and blood children) first.). Its called responsibility. Thats why we do things the way we do.

    • As for your claims about employers, no thats incorrect don't be stupid. Their are laws that prevent that from happening, most women choose to opt out of work and thats why their not promoted because they end up leaving companies for years. Are they suppose to just put everything on hold just for you? Thats selfish to the extreme, if you want the job go for it but do the job, don't bitch that you can't get pregnant be off for many months or years and then pick up exactly where you left off. They have responsibilities and obligations they can't put their lives on hold for you. Also over population isn't a issue, in fact most countries have a negative birth rate (keeping in mind that you need ot have more then 2 births per couple in order to have a birth rate so it doesn't matter how many don't have kids, what matters is how many others are having).

    • I notice the ones that up vote are the men and the ones that down vote are the women. So, where is this "equality of the sexes"? Only if it serves women more it seems. That's why the first term in Feminism is "Fem" short for "Female".

    • @MrMysteryMan Yep, in fact ism actually originated from a term meaning devotion so feminism literally means devotion to women. Its hypocrisy but what can you do but call it out when you see it? I do find it funny how women are the ones down voting, and all because I stated that these same things happen to women. They apparently feel that only they can be "victims" and that only bad things happen to them and no one else.

  • There's no shortage of women having kids in places like Africa and the Middle East. In Europe though we have on average 1.3 per woman. This is why we'll eventually become minorities in our own countries, and the West will be majority Muslim. Real smart.

  • OK I'm going to agree is a decision that women have to face. To put all their efforts into work or all their efforts into their children. Men don't really have that choice, until they meet their future wife and see where her head is at by way of how you BOTH want to raise your family. See, the thing about these views on how children or families should be raise and how work should affect help with this, is that it's backwards view of how WORK and FAMILY life should go together. Neither should go together at all, and neither should be built around the other. Work is how we pay for the lifestyle we develop. The lifestyle we develop needs a method of funding for it to work they way we want it to, depending on how extravagant we want our lifestyle to be. So, to blame work for not being able to have a better life with your children, that's just passing the blame off on something that has really no input as to how you should raise your family. Work is just a means to an end. A tool we use to gain comfort for our lives or to go on that trip that you planned for your family, or to put your kid in a better educational environment, or to get that new bike they always wanted for Christmas to get that special "memory" of your child. A person that wants to raise a child and to how well off that child should live, then that's the decision that influences how much effort you put into your career. I don't agree though that you have to sacrifice your child for your career if you live in a household with 2 parents. Both of my parents worked as teachers, with extra hours, being my father was a Lion's Club member and also a minister. My mom had to make sacrifices for sure, but she also achieve a very comfortable and enjoyable career, and I still felt loved and cared for as her son. I don't think any of us suffered. This is coming from a "for lack of a better term", African American living in North America. I live in Canada, so it might make it a little more easier of an environment for us. However, because my parents came over from Barbados, they had to re-educate themselves through the Canadian educational system, get their degrees again, to even be able to teach in the Canadian system. This was from coming from another country where they were fully educated and had established careers. She had to go to University, while raising (mostly on her own) 4 kids, because my father worked so much and so many hours. So please ladies, don't give excuses.

  • I am none of the above lol o_o

    I'll support my husband and our family of two. I feel satisfied when my home and family is happy. Work is never a priority to me. I sound horrible... but I feel more fulfilled with making my family happy.

    And for children.. I feel like its over populated and evil. Every birth equates to suffering. I have gone through a lot... why would I consciously put my flesh and blood through pain... I can't do it.

    And lets say I get pregnant then career will go out the window. My career and goal always would be my family.

    I like the simple things in life :-) ...

  • I agree that not every women have to be an mother, but you can't deny that maternity is an very feminine trait, that's how it's is in nature, that's why only females can give birth and breastfeed. So choosing career over motherhood/family in not an feminine choose, it's an usually an feminist/tomboyish/selfish choose. It's true that on the global scale, there is not shortage of humans, but on the family scale, if the parents have only one child and daughter and she didn't give them an grandchildren, then she had failed her family and bloodline, and if she did it on purpose. Also a man have an full right to not be an a serious relationship with an woman who don't want to have an children. So it's less of a business of strangers, but it's totally the business of those who close to her.

    • It's interesting, your first point about maternity being feminine bc women give birth and breastfeed. Couldn't the line of reasoning be, if you aren't already saying this, that women evolved to be more caring and nurturing bc evolutionary, female humans with those traits had offspring that lived longer to maturity. And just like you won't breed an animal that kills it's young because that trait can be hereditary, the 'maternal' genes were passed down from nurturing mom to her offspring. Rather than... women got stuck with giving birth and breastfeeding because they were naturally more nurturing than men.

    • So what you saying is that women that didn't have children, have no legacy? well obviously. That also why her parents was very unlucky to have an rise daughter like that.

    • That's not really what I'm saying. And I don't understand your last sentence at all. I'm gonna leave you be.

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  • tl, dr. XD
    But yeah, that's society for you. Especially here in asia. Even your boss feels like she has the right to comment on your personal life. And she is a modern business woman who studied in the US and was a university professor. And she still said "Rosie has a boyfriend already, so she's safe. Do you have a bf?" she asked me. When I said no, she said "find one". As if: 1. I've got to be into males, and 2. My life goal is to have a boyfriend and as long as I'm single, I'm worth less? And if you already have a boyfriend, you're "safe"? Happily ever after, no possibility of things not working out in the future?

    Women in Asia for all society's concerns should only have 1 ultimate life goal: get a guy (oh, doesn't have to be a good guy, just a guy who can pay for your ass), marry him, have babies, then spend the rest of your life raising your bastards.

    Working as a teacher, believe me, some parents shouldn't have been allowed to pop kids... They don't know how to raise them properly and only creates these horrible tiny humans.

  • You think you get pressurized... just come over to my country. When I told my mother I didn't want to have children she withdrew me from school for 2 weeks, I've never spoken again. I'm still pretty sure I don't want kids and what I want to do is to adopt a 10 year old or two but since I know I won't get the support I need from my family I can't talk about it.

    I know I'm making my life a bit harder since finding someone who wants the same as I do will be hard and I don't want to be a single mum but sometimes... it is what it is.

    • Oh no, I definitely understand. I've lived here in the US for most of my life, but I wasn't born here. I have a lot of family and friends from around the globe, and sometimes it is literally like stepping back in time to hear how parents only think their daughters in particular can be happy if they are married, or married to someone rich who can provide, and they provide the kids. Makes me really glad I live here and that my family really bucked against a lot of tradition.

  • I have my career, but I want to settle down and have a kid, being a housewife and stay at home mum someday. it's not a pressure, it's a dream

  • I love everything about this my take. I chose not to have kids because I want to be a nurse. I also prefer traveling and dogs over kids. I can't come up with a single good reason why I, personally should have kids. However I can talk all day about bad reasons to have kids. That right there is enough reason to show I wasn't cut out to be a mother.

    • I want to be a nurse too but you can still have kids and be a great nurse. Dogs are a lot more dependent so if you plan on traveling it's not smart to have pets at the same time because you could be gone for long amounts of time.

    • @beautifulangel76 I have a large family that is willing to watch my future dogs. I don't want kids. That is reason enough. I'm more than just an incubator. Yes, kids are very dependent when you travel. When a baby cries on a plane, we hate the parents. I don't care what the reason is that the baby is crying.

    • I know about kids it's just that dogs are like babies they need you more. You shouldn't just get dogs and constantly leave them with your family when you have to work.

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  • I like your take.

    To me, it is not a double standard. I am 100% sure i dont want a kid. I choose over my life, things i like to do and achieve, and my career any day. Any potential partner i will have in te future has to accept that or just leave.

  • I think you can have the best of both worlds. I plan on being a nurse and having kids if I can. Not everyone is cut out for both or to be a mom and that's okay.

    • sisters a nurse and the hours are HELL. like 12 hour shifts. you're gunna be tired af when you come back but you'll stil have your off days. 9-5 jobs are perfect when you want kids.

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