Chivalry is Dead Because of Women, Not Men

[Puppylove94]

I have always been someone who wants a guy to be chivalrous, as most people already know on this site. I like when a guy offers to pay for the first date, opens the door for me, makes romantic gestures, etc.

Unfortunately, this isn't very common anymore. Although you get some men who like to do this for their women, it is slowly dying out. Even though most people are quick to assume it's the men who are changing, i beg to differ. I think it is due to the women.

1) Tinder

This app is a detriment to society. I used to love it- i would be on it all the time. Men use this app to get what they want. Whether it's company, sex or just someone to boost their ego. They can get instant attention through this app while not having to make any commitments.

Also, when the app originally started out, men would take women out and actually pay for their meals. Women started to take advantage of this and literally use their date for free meals. They would have the meal and never talk to the guy again. Why would a man keep paying for a woman if the gesture isn't returned?

2) Women are a lot easier these days

A lot of women don't care about men making a commitment to them before they sleep with them. If a man doesn't have to sweep a woman off her feet to get her into bed, he's not going to. This also hurts the women who do expect that. Men aren't going to work for something if they can get the same result easier with someone elsewhere.

3) Chivalry isn't just about getting women in bed, it's about kind gestures

Women are so caught up in feminism and saying they can do things themselves that men get confused. They've stopped the kind gestures to avoid being called misogynistic.

This picture pretty much sums up this point.

Chivalry is an awesome thing. It isn't about losing money or getting sex- it's about showing someone you want to be with them or that you can think about someone other than yourself. It's about showing appreciation and wanting someone to feel special. I think men lose sight of that because of a few bad experiences they've had.

[AleDeEurope]

If being chivalrous isn't gonna have any effect on the girl, then why be chivalrous? Many guys think this way, which makes sense. Nature says "what is not used, will disappear". If making no effort will have the same chances of getting a girl while being chivalrous, why would a guy go out of his way and make some sacrifices if it's gonna have the same effect as doing nothing?
If women would keep valuing chivalry, and appreciating it, there would be more men who will keep doing it.

A big problem is also that women don't appreciate it no more. A thank you or a smile is all we ask for. Not appreciating it will make you look like you don't care about it, or that you think you're entitled to it.

I do consider myself a chivalrous guy. I was raised that way, and I believe it's not just something you do to women, but to men too. It's just an act of kindness. So not being chivalrous would be difficult, but I understand why so many men just aren't, since it doesn't pay off.

[Puppylove94]

You have a great way of thinking. I promise you you'll find the right woman who will appreciate it one day

[RainbowFanGirl]

I appreciate it. It makes my day really. Many of the guys at school slam the door in my face or if I hold a door open for them they don't think anything of it either. I think it's just the fact that people are getting more apathetic.

[AleDeEurope]

@RainbowFanGirl Same here. It feels really good when a stranger smiles at you just for holding the door for them.

[MusicLover8098]

Yes!!! Chivalry is not dead, all we want is a little appreciation! 😊

[AleDeEurope]

@MusicLover8098 Exactly. And we don't want it to stroke our ego, we just want it to know that it's having a positive effect on you.

[MusicLover8098]

True. I love to see people happy and do things that have positive effects on them. But with most people assuming I want something in return or I'm just trying to "hook up" with a girl. It's so hard to even do that these days sadly. And still I don't give up. Just hoping there is a girl out there who would appreciate me for who I am

[FatherJack]

" A big problem is also that women don't appreciate it no more " Yes , precisely... or even attack you for it !!!

[MusicLover8098]

I think many girls still appreciate it, but the ones that actively attack it are insecure with themselves and are afraid of being seen as "weak". Sadly, with the whole "nice guy" backlash going on, it seems like we are living in one of the worst periods of history to be a chivalrous person.

[orphan]

Iirc you went on a long rant about the importance of splitting the first date bill. what Changed?

[AleDeEurope]

@orphan Splitting the bill doesn't make you chivalrous. There's many other factors.

[orphan]

offering to pay for the first date does help your case... something you're vehemently against.

however, I don't think you've been on many dates, or have much experience with ladies in general. I reckon a lot of your "advice" comes from keen logical imagination.

[AleDeEurope]

@orphan You're gonna tell me how much experience I have or don't have with women? Ok then XD

[orphan]

@aledeeurope you're welcome

[ElissaDido]

The whole Male- Female relation is superposed to have compromises and give and take process.
Women can't ask to be treated like men under the name of equality , and ask for special treatment at the same time!
If you want a gentleman, you have to be a lady!

Great MyTake! I completely agree with you

[Puppylove94]

Thanks 😊

[TavionRiley]

👏👏

[hellionthesage]

Yeah but before their was reasons to be chivalrous now their is not. She won't appreciate it will take advantage of you and expects you to do all of this, its not a kind gesture its your job, she is entitled to you doing these things for her meanwhile what is he getting out of it? Is she acting like a lady? Maybe cooking for him or doing something that is out of her way to show she is interested and that she cares like what would have happened in the past? No. Its a one way street, its like working without getting paid, whats the point? Women destroyed chivalry because they decided they where entitled to the treatment, they then decided that they did not have to reciprocate, you know the whole "I don't exist to make him happy" mentality (funny because most women seem to think that this is exactly why men exist). If its one sided its not going to happen and that's the problem women seem to think they shouldn't have to do anything in return, they don't have to respect the man, they don't have to show interest or appreciation they just think they have to show up be doted on and then that's it. That's why chivalry is dead.

[Anonymous]

I'd agree that women killed chivalry, but it's not the way you think.

Guys haven't stopped being chivalrous because they 'don't have to'. Most guys cannot get laid easily, cannot get tons of good matches on tinder, etc. Sure, a few guys are like that, but not most.

Most quit because it doesn't help any more.

The guys girls are hooking up with are -not- the same guys they would have dated. Those guys would have been -taken- in the past. What's changed isn't that Joe average can now snap his fingers and get laid, where he used to have to woo the girl. What's changed is that Jane Average now rolls her eyes at Joe's attempts, sees them as desperate, and hooks up with some star athlete with muscles, who is also hooking up with a half dozen other girls.

Even girls who are dating view a lot of chivalry as desperate. It came from a time when people were more monogamous, for one, and two, where men were in a position of power. Because of that power, chivalry seemed benevolent. Given the relative bargaining power of young men and young women in the dating/sex market today, it seems desperate.

[Puppylove94]

I see what you're saying, but not all women women are like that. Like I said, it just takes a few bad experiences for men to just turn off their chivalry

[Opinion Owner]

Quite a few women like it in theory. By which I mean, they like it when a guy they are attracted to behaves in a chivalrous way. The problem with most romantic gestures is that many women DO see them as week and 'needy'. So when some guy they are head over heels with and think is out of their league does it, it's incredible, because this amazing guy is desperate for you! how amazing! But when an average guy does it, one you're not in a relationship with, most women go m'ehhhhh. Not all. Most.

[Puppylove94]

Fair enough

[Gommers]

I think most men can get laid easily. I know 3 or 4 women that I'd sleep with that are interested in me right now. I think what men really believe but don't want at the front of their [our] minds is that getting a lifelong relationship out of the women our age range is statistically sitting on that fine line between improbable and impossible. I don't think most men want to just go out and fuck, if we did it would be a much different social climate and there'd be 0 general respect for women. I'll gladly respect a woman that genuinely respects herself, not one that pretends to and has to show off so that it looks like she's got some value to the world and to herself when really she knows she's just a sentient cum rag.

Seriously man, I'm pretty sure it's never [in our civilized recorded time] "just been about sex".

I know for a fact that you probably know a good handful of women that would fuck you at the drop of a hat, but you're not into the idea of them. Just like everyone else.

[Opinion Owner]

@Gommers I know a few, now. When I was 20, not so much. I think there are a lot of guys walking around who have zero women who would fuck them. Actually I know some guys like that.

[TesticleMonster]

lmao no its not that women are easier, its that they're more difficult. i don't know what it is about women that makes them place connotation something positive and make something desirable out of something negative. this whole idea "men want a challenge". i mean sure, we want a girl who's coy and playful, but we don't want a girl who is CHALLENGING. Literally that word, when used in the context of a person, means draining, grating on the soul. A challenging person to be around is not who you want to date. A difficult person is not someone you want to date. And the word "easy"... how the fuck is easy a bad thing? i figured it out, its not the word easy that is negative, its the word women. place the word easy next to ANYTHING positive, and its a good thing. Easy money. easy ice cream. easy blowjobs. literally, the exact same thing as easy women, but without the word women in it, sounds 1000x better. taking it easy, on a beach in hawaii. now put it next to something negative. easy debt. easy chipotle induced diarrhea. easy telemarketing. fast and easy pop up ads. just insert your credit card and pay 10 easy payments of 19.95 for penis pills that don't work. its 100% snake oil! so women are the biggest culprits of misogyny, because they themselves are the ones that perpetuate the negativity associated with "easy women". and they do the opposite thinking its going to help, but the opposite is just being difficult.

but if someones gonna be difficult all the time why bother being nice to them? thats why chivalry is dead. no one gives a shit about pleasing someone who openly and explicitly doesn't give a damn about pleasing them. you want us to chase you? fuck off. this is what it ends up looking like.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eirBtt7wIDU

[Puppylove94]

Easy women mean promiscuous women that sleep with anyone. If you like that sort of thing then go for it. But that easy ice cream will taste way better if you had to work for it.

And easy day will feel a lot more mediocre than if you had to work hard and get shit done. It makes everything worth it in the end and you'll appreciate it way more.

[TesticleMonster]

so name an easy woman. and no. there is absolutely no correlation between the taste of ice cream and what you have to do to get it. in fact, if you have to move mountains just to get your hand on some fucking ice cream, i can promise you by the end of the ordeal, it will taste bitter and unfulfilling. if there is an ice cream parlor on the other side of town, cut off by road construction on all sides, a toll booth, a car crash and 3 miles of traffic, and then once you get there, they make you talk to a voice mail machine for no other reason than to make the process of getting ice cream more difficult because they irrationally think it will make it taste better, then the call drops and you have to call them back---well lets just stop there, because NO ONE IN THE WORLD will ever get that far. they'll just go to the ice cream shop thats nearby, that has better ice cream, cheaper, and actually caters to their needs and convenience. because its fucking ice cream. there's always another shop.

[TesticleMonster]

just like there's always another woman and she's the woman who's getting all the men you push away with your irrational bullshit.

[orphan]

that's interesting. cold water is so much better tasting when you're exhausted after a sweaty workout.

[TesticleMonster]

@orphan you don't work out to make water taste better. you drink water to soothe the parchedness of working out. there's no way you can twist this metaphor. sex is nourishment. you don't improve nourishment by starving yourself. you satisfy your appetite, and you move on with your day. like a normal human being.

[TesticleMonster]

i refuse your wackidoodle sexual anorexia. i eat what i want, when i want, and if its not available to me, i eat somewhere else. period.

[Anonymous]

I'm a woman and I agree with the idea that women killed chivalry.
In a nutshell, it's not wrong for women to be independent and equal when it comes to workplace, for example. The problem is, women confuse workplace and marketplace equality with romantic and intimate sphere of lives.
I have seen so many women freak out when a guy offers to open a door for them or pay for the drinks. If I were a guy and that happened to me, I would say- forget it. I won't do it again. Another problem is that men have no problem with women being women. They, in fact, encourage that.
Women, on the other hand, hate men being manly and try too emasculate them. Guy giving you a complement? He must a creep. Guy trying to help you carry heavy bags? What does he want from me? The list goes on.
So I blame women for that.

[sedrftvgyhujik]

with the bag one though if your not in a public enough place don't know them and haven't already struck up a conversation you could genuinely think they want to nick your bags?
Chances are they don't but you never know there are some people in some desperate situations!

[JohnDoe3000]

I always had the impression that how creepy/unwanted/sexist a woman perceives a man's actions to be is inversely proportional to how attractive she finds that man.

Most women would not like living in a world where men were not allowed to approach women, flirt in the workplace, be chivalrous, etc... They say they would like such a world but they forget that the laws would also apply to attractive men.

[hexsnowflake]

thank you for saying this, i agree completely :)

[RainbowFanGirl]

I would love if a guy tried to do that for me. I would think it was kind.

[TheEnd2]

When feminism first started out there was a saying in society women and children first. In today's society that saying is ever man for himself. That's what feminism has done. When women quit acting like ladies guys quit acting like gentlemen. The saying if you got it flaunt it sexually objectify yourself when you flaunt it. Girls complain and are surprised when guys view what they flaunt, only want what they flaunt and only see them for what they flaunt. Girls are there own worse enemy. They have created most of what they complain about through their actions and will only get worse as long as they continue the same behaviors.

[QuestionMan]

I was having dinner with a female friend at a restaurant a few months back and I pulled out a chair for her and she looked confused as fuck. She said no one had ever done that for her before.

[Puppylove94]

I had a guy open the car door for me once and had that reaction too lol

[TadCurious]

Whether you want to call it chivalry or just common courtesy (which is what I prefer) I agree that we've gotten coarser as a society. I'm from the South, and it was just ingrained in me to open doors for girls/women and treat them with respect. But that doesn't mean my view of women is stuck in the 1800s. I want women to be strong and independent and to achieve whatever they want to achieve in whatever field they choose. But certain biological facts will always be the same, and we don't have to throw courtesy out the window.

[Relentless_Hippie]

I'm glad my boyfriend was raised to be a gentleman. Ladies deserve gentlemen and gentlemen deserve ladies. Other people can have each other, but ladies and gentlemen should never settle for less. If we see more of that, then the rest of people will learn and start having some class and put love back into dating.

[RainbowFanGirl]

Same. That was just how my boyfriend was raised. I was raised to be repectful too.

[Relentless_Hippie]

@RainbowFanGirl Exactly. Let the rude people have rude people, let the trashy ones have the trashy ones, but ladies and gentlemen should always stand for what they're worthy of.

If the bad girls and guys try to go for the good ones. The good ones should have enough sense to demand more from themselves and hopefully that would spark a much needed message in some people's heads.

[Mil00]

It's a people thing, there's no specific gender to blame. I've gone out on dates with guys that act extremely nice, they act the way that they know that I like. By the end of the day, they are expecting me to give it up to them. Once they see they aren't getting a thing from me, that's when the insults start flying, and the "you owe me because I spent money on you.." The thing is they are the ones that asked me out on a date.. Why should I have to have sex with someone, just because they wanted to take me to IHOP? I've got the same reaction from women, she said I should do something for her because she asked me out on a date.. Today people are only nice temporarily, they are only doing it to get their way, there's no more genuine kindness. That is the problem.

[steven7890789]

Lol, expected you to have sex with him just for taking you to IHOP?

[Mil00]

@steven7890789

Yess

[kitty71]

I totally agree on the number 3. Indeed chivalry is dead because US women. Sorry but that is the way it is. Some women had become so independent that they say "we dont need a man for this or for another thing" we can manage ourselves. Therefore a man hearing that, they stop trying to be the gentlemen, and treat women like one of their own. So, ladies do not complain later if a a man is not being a gentlemen with you, cause US had asked for it.

[Puppylove94]

I'm in the US lol

[kitty71]

When I said US I meant US as women not US as the country. sorry for the confussion people

[Puppylove94]

Ohhh Hahahah okay makes sense

[feminismisnarcissism]

it's not womens' fault. It's FEMINISM'S fault. that means feminists are to blame... and that includes male feminists, also known as "white knights", "simps", "puppydogs".

And even then... that means I simply BEAT YOU to the line, I don't let you go first, it means I hold doors for strange men, not strange women, because the former say "thank you" and the latter act entitled... etc.

But I still perform chivalry for that rare, rare woman that is anti-feminist. So rare it's like findiing the holy grail-for that woman, I'll lasso the moon. :)

[John_Doesnt]

Chivalry isn't dead for me; I just hide it or reserve it for that special lady. I always open doors, carry heavy stuff or stand when a lady enters a room on the first few dates.
However, if she turns out to be a bitch and complains about how she can do those things herself, then chivalry is dead.
I will also cease my chivalry if a girlfriend insists on the double standard: I do all the hard manual labor, but she refuses to do any of the women stuff like cook or vacuum. I'm not gonna do the guy stuff if she won't do the girl stuff.

[ginny_weasley]

I think women just need to know the difference between "I don't need your help" and "I can handle this but thanks for offering." I am still glad that my boyfriend is chivalrous. We knew each other for four hours before he asked me out. And he insisted on paying for lunch. As a feminist, it's sad the bad eggs ruined the whole bunch. Oh well. Just be nice to everyone.

[ginny_weasley]

By the way, good my take it broke everything down really well.

[Anonymous]

GREAT take. Honestly real good.

I kinda agree. I don't understand why you're not appreciated for being decent and a sweet person as well as confident/attractive?

I think sadly a lot of people take the good guys from their social circle for granted versus people who don't care as much (whether in or out of the same social circle). Women seem to send mixed messages.

Can u see my question on blueticking? www.girlsaskguys.com/.../q2100930-why-do-women-bluetick-read-a-message-not-reply-to-good-people-see

[Opinion Owner]

Thanks, and I mean it, really really good take! Be great to hear your thoughts on my question?

[GigiMary]

Society moves on, you know? I happened to get a chivalrous man, but I imagine he is part of a dwindling batch!

I do love it when men are chivalrous, though. My mother tells me that when she was younger, when she was having trouble with her luggage getting off a plane, every man in the airport would try to help her or anyone else with trouble - from an old lady burdened by her suitcase, to a young woman looking for a cab - they would help. The same just doesn't happen anymore. It is sad, really.

[EnglishArtsteacher]

I agree with a bulk of this, except for number two. My parents, and I were JUST talking about this last week about how women are too picky, so if anything, it's just the opposite-Women are much pickier these days, BUT, for the wrong reasons. Instead of being picky due to finding the right personality, morals, religious beliefs, compatibility, and so on, they're picky because a guy is "too nice", "too good", not wealthy enough, not good looking enough, or some random bizarre reason which shouldn't correlate with relationships. I personally wish women were easier, so I guess I wouldn't be a good candidate for a chivalrous man (Whoops), but I also agree women have ruined this to a certain degree.

Not a bad take though!

[sedrftvgyhujik]

I try to be helpful now and then such as capturing and safely releasing countless spiders and opening doors for people on crutches and conversely Iv been perfectly happy to let women help me in the past for example one helped me fix my iPhone, one helped me get off a mountain safely in a snow storm that i relay appreciated , one let me borrow her perfect notes to study from, but most often directions!
Id call that mutual chivalry i think?

[Puppylove94]

Yeah definitely. What about dates. Would you pay for a first date?

[sedrftvgyhujik]

Depends?
Where are where going and who asked who and who has cash on them or is she is very well off or struggling a bit?
I think you'r both suppose to offer but if she keeps offering i'm not going to insist.
I'm actually genuinely not keen on restaurants though especially for a first date so id be much more likely to suggest coffee and what you do with the bill for 2 coffees and some sandwiches isn't such a big deal unless you go somewhere ridiculous or your broke so id offer to pay and if she offered I offer again then stop after that or say we split or flip a coin or something?
But if I invite her to coffee and she says it has to be dinner then she is now the one inviting me so she should pay also I'm now having doubts and wondering did she just want a free meal or something since she suggested something much more expensive and if I get convinced enough it's that then I will want her to pay because I get annoyed if I think i'm getting used! unless she is clearly broke and i'm doing

[America1st]

If you are old enough to remember, the feminist movement caused most of this problem. They thought that if a man opened a door or pulled out a seat the men were saying they couldn't do it themselves or they were the weaker sex. Stupid thing like that. These self absorbed activists ruined it for the rest of the women. I still believe in chivalry and it's amazing how suprised some women are when I do thes things. Every single one of them loved it. It's simply a man showing respect to the lady. Nothing else.

[RainbowFanGirl]

So, chivalry is basically an act of kindness? We need a lot more of that in this world. I've held doors open for people but it's like they feel entitled to it. The world is getting more and more apathetic by the day.

[Puppylove94]

Exactly. Completely agree

[RainbowFanGirl]

My boyfriend was raised to treat people with respect and he is chivalrous towards me. It may be because of the fact that I'm not a bitch towards him or because he loves me.

[Unit1]

Is he chivalrous to the others? If not, that's something to think about twice.

[alfonsosloan45]

okay, with that logic, be kind and pay for my meal.

[RainbowFanGirl]

@alfonsosloan45 Nope lmao
My boyfriend pays for my meal and for his birthday this month I took him out and paid for his. If that was the point you were trying to make.

[Shorty1991]

I don't agree that chivalry is completely dead. There are still guys out there who help people when they struggle. For those who say its completely dead, that's coming from guys who have taken time to help a woman and she's went all aggy on him thinking that he has an ulterior motive. Those men, then go and class every woman the same. Just like they do when one woman gives them a hard time. They class all other women the same.