Why Don't Guys Want to Pay for the First Date Anymore? (Page 2)
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I feel as though if I send the invite to have breakfast, lunch or dinner then I should be the one who pays because it was MY idea for us to go and eat. Now if he sends the invite then he should pay because it was HIS idea. Now if we both decide to pay for our own meals then we do so, but that often doesn't happen.
Seems like a good principle :)
I try my best to be fair when it comes to that :)
How often do you see girls asking men out? how often do you see them paying? Exactly. The only acceptable or reasonable thing a women would ever maybe do is split the bill.
Usually the guys that are hesitant about paying have had bad experiences in the past. Like the entitled women you mentioned who just use them for their money. I've actually heard of some women putting a guy's number in their phone under "Free Food" (It was meme but it probably came from some sort of truth)
While I am quite happy to pay for a date I went on a few this girl once who wouldn't let me pay for anything, even my own food or coffee or clothes (there's a list but it's long...). But as it turned out she was an attention seeker and this was just a way of trying to make me think I owed her something. So it can be a double edge sword. maybe also be why guys don't like paying for the whole date as they don't want a girl they like feeling like they owe them something?
Exactly đź‘Ť
I really appreciate how fair to guys you are with this myTake. You're right: If I ask the girl out for dinner on a date, I don't mind at all paying for both. (In fact I'd pretty strongly object if my date wanted to pay for her half.) But I would also appreciate the fact that she offered. For me, especially if it's a first date, or the first date where we had a meal, I just feel like I should pay and I don't feel taken advantage of by paying for both. If the relationship develops further, then splitting the bill is fine. Or if she rings me up and says "I want to take you to dinner" then she might pay for both. The main thing is that no one keeps score.
Very nice take! I would say though that some guys could be doing things on their own that would help them. For example, WHY would you ever ask a girl to a "fancy" restaurant for a first date? NO! Fancy restaurants are for girlfriends--NOT for first date girls. There will be PLENTY of time to go to the latest "in" place in town fronted by the hottest celebrity chef AFTER you're already going out and having sex regularly. First dates can and SHOULD be less formal, cheaper, more relaxed and more conducive to getting to know each other. We're talking coffee, drinks, pic-nics, pizza. . . that kind of thing. And with that in mind the bill should be low enough that it honestly doesn't even MATTER who pays it. That's why I'm usually not fussed about picking up the full tab.
That's why you should take them to Starbucks or something cheap
Exactly! That's a good first date!
I had 4 dates lined up in one week. I paid for all 4, total cost maybe 300$. While one of my dates also had 5 dates within 2 weeks. Her total cost 0$
Unfortunately women will always expect it because there will always be some joe blow waiting in line to pay for her
Yeah I wish we didn't expect it. :( I mean it would be a pleasant surprise.
Damn, why do you spend so much on dates? Just take a walk in the park or drink coffee. Or split the bill. Why would you want to end up with a girl who expects you to pay for her?
That is why my first dates are always free, or a cup of coffee. It really weeds out those gold diggers!
@genuinlysensitive it does. it really works. my relationships have become so much better since I did that.
@hahanoway yes agreed. That works however you'll have to go on a date eventually. I was speaking to each of them for a while before we decided to go out on a date, maybe thats why. But nevetheless the bill was expected to be paid by me because she would just wait for me to ask her, because it's more 'lady like' and obviously that puts me in the position to pay for asking her
@genuinlysensitive yes defiantly agree. But eventually you'll have to go on a date a little more substantial.
Rather I should of said , first real date...
Rainbow
If it went back to a pleasant surprise rather than expecting it, it would mean so much more. Because women would also think, wow he paid... he must really like me. Rather than he has to pay or ill make faces and have a negative connotation towards our first date
But it is what it is... lol... can't really change the mindset of a wave as large as the dating scene
And like i said, if I don't pay - she can always justify it with other guys who would pay and there is a plathora of guys like that - covering more than just dates. Trips, clothes. All kinds
No, it really doesn't put you in the position to pay for her. You could have just split the bill. I always do that without any problems. I only pay once we're in a relationship.
I completely get what you're saying in terms of social expectations, but read what the other dude here that I responded to said about it.
And if she dumps you because you split, then she wasn't really attracted to you anyway.
May I ask which state you live in?
haha I'm guilty of the same thing. but did she really tell you she never paid? lol
@lambdoor yes lol we talked about paying on first dates. We went to a sushi place and it was medium expensive type of place
And i noticed the mood immediately change after the paying talk lol. Like it didn't so much change or taint the entire night. But it surely was enough to feel a wave of rifts on a smooth surface
She did say she didn't pay for any lol. So also said how she sometimes accepts even though she is not really into the guy because she knows she isn't paying so it's not a lot of work for her to go. Get picked up, paid for, sit and get dropped off
@hahanoway it's not that should would dump you or that it would really make a difference in the grand scheme of things - with some girls yes - but it's more that it sometimes put a spotlight on a situation where a spotlight is not needed
It takes away from the perfect date night that often times is the message you wanna leave her with
Hahaha girls are tricky. Sometimes its cool. Sometimes its not EVEN if they say its cool
lol why did you talk about paying on first dates? What exactly did you say and how did she respond?
But yeah, I do the same, I often accept dates thinking, well if it doesn't work out at least I got a free meal lol.
You don't have to pay. Stop acting like it's our fault. If men decided not to pay then there's nothing women that expect it could do. Just finally act like a damn adult and pay for themselves.
@WhaChaChaKing lol paying is not even half of the issues. Some of these girls won't even consider you without a ride to pick them up
Lets put it this way
No ride
No paying for dates
That's going to hurt your chances pretty bad. Of course they're outliers, such as knowing someone for a long time, organically connecting to the core
@lambdoor haha yea Im fully aware of going on dates with borderline liking someone or maybe not even... just for the date lol
I brougt up the fact, casually not directed at her, how first dates are always interesting. In the sense that we get to spend time together alone, romantically... and how who covers the bill is always a hot topic
--> she looks up and down lol (by the way this was before we ordered)
--> she seemed to go random on the sushi menu lol like order this and that and this. Not too much but could of been a little less hahah
--> then she said how she doesn't bring money only credit cards lol
so splitting the bill is a little funky and odd with a credit card haha
Another girl i dated was even nore funny lol. Ill tell you about her too
hahah yeah please tell me about the other girl, too.
Those girls don't sound like they're worth it anyways. Seems like you're getting a big sign early on they're terrible.
good take. really appreciate the effort you put into understanding the various reasons guys do or don't want to pay.
as i said in my response to your previous questions; i always offered to pay for the first date but really appreciated when a woman offered or demanded to split.
Yes, you're welcome. :)
Is it more attractive when she offers?
it is to me. i like a woman who is independent and doesn't subscribe to old ideas of gender roles
Personally I'll always offer to pay. Cuz if it's someone I want to take on a date, it's worth it. I work, I have money, I can pay for our meal. If she wants to, I'm not gonna stop her. Or I'll pay for it and she can leave a tip. That's always fun. I feel like this shouldn't be as big of a deal as it is
đź‘Ź That's awesome
Sure those are reasonable observations. I'll add a few more opinions... 1) You should start a relationship wanting to work together. That means not only should you not enter with an heir of entitlement as you stated (extremely bad), but also not a reluctant willingness to contribute and just try to scrape by on the bare minimum... When that's your motivation, it's conspicuous. If you genuinely approach the situation wanting to pull your weight, then it shows character. You win points for being true. Ultimately for a relationship to last you're both going to have to be self sacrificing so start by showing you're capable and not some selfish little girl. 2) When you expect to be compensated for your company, you come off as cheap and unclassy. You look like a whore... If you market yourself as a whore, you're going to get treated like a whore.
I agree... And I know many women who are 'feminists' yet they expect for the guy to pay... which doesn't make sense to me.
Yep I thought feminism was about female liberation. :/ They should have no issue splitting the bill ya know?
There are lots of instincts and feelings surrounding the courting process on both sides. But the reason is really just economics. Paying for a date with a woman used to be the norm because men far out earned women, so if you wanted to take one out, you had to "take care of her" on the date. This gave pleasing feelings to both genders making women feel protected and men feeling like providers... But it had nothing to do with those feelings.
Today, such feelings still push men to pay and women to desire that he pays, but because they are no longer based on an economic reality of how genders earn and are provided for, the practice is loosing grip on the dating world.
Well if it has nothing to do with those feelings then why did they answer my question in that way?
Feelings are often an afterthought of our financial situations. It's not that they don't matter, it's just sad that they don't.
Well I believe it is
I think it has to do with:
1. Women not taking dating seriously in modern times.
2. Women chatting wit multiple men at the same time to see who will give her the best deal for her pussy and therefore has no loyalty to any man and can ghost you at any time.
3. Loss of money if a woman does decide to ghost you and go for another nigga.
4. Women sleeping with other men while you are giving them money to go out on dates with them.
5. Women giving up the pussy for free for attractive men but expecting you to pay.
6. Bad taste it all brings of making it seem that you are paying a woman for her time thereby implying her time is more valuable than you and she is doing you a favor by going out with you.
7. Sex cultures mean that if guys just want sex they can find another girl who is willing to give up the pussy for free.
I agree with every last point. I am just glad there is finally a woman willing to stick up for us on this subject.
Maybe all of those stubborn, hypocritical women will listen to YOU, because God knows they won't hear US out.
Thanks I'm glad you liked it.
It's up to those in positions of privilege to speak up for those who aren't. There are some areas in life where men are privileged and some where women are.
@snowangle but that's doesn't give the person a right to treat someone less of who they are
@CancerianMan81 I don't think you understood my comment lol. I was saying it's good for people in a position of privilege (RainbowFanGirl, in this case) to speak up about an issue that benefits her but is unfair. Likewise, in positions of life where men are privileged, it's important for men to recognize that and bring attention to it.
@snowangle what do you think privilege is from another person only thinking of yourself because you think you are better than anybody you want equal opportunity take away the damn privilege
@CancerianMan81 Lol... that's what I'm saying...
nobody gets anything for doing nothing you earn it by putting in the work period
apparently you wasn't paying attention to what I was saying
it's us men that already know our position but not the women they don't know where their position is that's where she's coming from
she ain't laying the blame on the men like you are
@snowangle Oh I'm not that privileged just saying lol
I was just responding to that myTake and using answeres I received from guys as an argument.
this ain't got anything to do with men being in the wrong this is women's problem is where she's coming from
@CancerianMan81 Omggg. I agree with you. I agree with Rainbow. Read slower next time! Sheesh. xD
@snowangle
Just for the record, I agree, and I appreciate you saying that. He was trying to make an argument out of nothing.
Thanks bud. Haha :)
@snowangle alright and I'm sorry if I got a little bent out of shape
you just got to understand that I'm just getting sick and tired of this men vs. women bullshit it needs to fucking end if us men and women want to be equal
@CancerianMan81 I agree but I think you're defeating the purpose by picking fights over nothing. :P
@snowangle well alright sorry okay
I appreciate you thinking from the male perspective. That's a rarity in itself. That said, I'm of a mind that women are biologically wired to want a man to provide, regardless of their own ability to provide for themselves; so, I think a man should always pay for as much stuff as he can. Just the cost of doing business. I think if a man does not do so, the woman will lose respect for him, even if she believes as you do. She may not even realize it, but I'm sure of that.
We try to escape gender roles, but you know, these things are ingrained in us for 150,000 years. They don't go away just because society says something. Good luck getting a guy not to auto-check out a chick who's showing a lot of skin. It's just nature.
I pay, I don't mind paying, but unfortunately, due to being used for free dinners by way too many women, when you go on a first date with me it will either be free or a cup of coffee.
I really agree with this: "So, if he pays, it’s a privilege, not a right. Cherish it..."
People need to do more cherishing, and less competing, and playing the victim in relationships.
Someone who gets it. Guys dont mind but being Expected to pay is shitty. Many girls say they shouldn't be expected to have sex on the first date, but on the first date, they pick the restaurant, food, after activity and in many cases, get driven around too... they dont do/pay shit. You can't do all that picking and tell me no sex... if its no sex, best believe this ain't even a date.
Some girls require a certain amount of dates before sex, thats fine and dandy... take your time... but during those dates... best believe the only thing im spending is time. I dont know if you are worth my hard earned money. When thats proven, either by entering a relationship or something... then i guess she is.
You made a lotta valid point there kiddo... chivalry is dead, women killed it, dunno why most complain.
Yes, these points are exactly the points some of us (myself included) were trying to make. So I think this is a great myTake: you explained it really well!
Thank you
There we go. You got it figured out.
media.giphy.com/media/DypHcxyEqRzHi/giphy.gif
Thanks!
You have nailed it in all points- couldn't have said it better myself. I must ask though, what has led you, a woman, to speak for men that have been oppressed on this subject?
Well, I grew up with a father who used my mother for her wallet and I've noticed woman doing
The same thing. They always say they want a "sugar daddy"
and stuff which just seemed wrong to me. I've always believed in splitting the bill or fluctuating between us when we go out to eat. I just think it's the right thing to do.
Guys want a traditional women who will cook and clean but get upset when they have to pay... That's a bit hypocritical.
I personally have no problem to pay if it's a cheap date like a drink or a mcdo if no I can't pay. I have no money so if he want go to a restaurant he must paid for me.
That's kind of true.
yes, that's for that so many guys like Asian and European women cause they're generally more traditional.
Er... no.
Guys that specifically want traditional women aren't the ones that are going to complain about paying for a first date.
It's the guys that are trying to adjust to the feminist view of modern society where women are equal to men, make their own money, etc. that will now question why women still deserve all the little perks they used to get when things played out in a more traditional manner.
You can't demand your cake and to eat it too.
@HorrorFan No, trust me they all doesn't want to pay on date even the one who want traditionnal women. I've seen it often
I bet you wouldn't date a guy who didn't have much money... but yet women have no problem dating in university, or starting out in their career because the guys pay. I hung around dozens of women in my younger years and they all laughed how easy they had it. Almost all divorced with kids crying for the good guys.. practically yelling now it's time for a good guy LOL now it's too late.
@CrashDF You don't make any sense dude. I won't date a guy who have no money cause how are we supposed to live? And when we'll have kids how are we supposed to pay their food and their studies? With ghost money?
Think before writing, that would do you some good.
The reason is because women didn't have jobs or cars or income to even go on dates. Therefore it was more of a necessity than actually chivalry. But yeah, I agree with everything here
Ah. That makes sense.