Why Today's Version of Dating Is Absolutely Terrible for Guys

Hey guys, old fashioned 22 year old male romantic here. Finishing up my Master's degree in Engineering. Been on a few dates each with a few different women that I met online (Bumble). One girl I dated for 3 months, and after one of our 5 dates (the last one) she never texted me again for no reason whatsoever. I thought we were developing a nice connection but nah. Didn't even have the heart to text me and say "hey it's not working out." Pretty much the same thing happened with the other two girls, except those situations only lasted about a month - 1.5 months. The point is, a girl can be dating you for a decent period of time, and have no problem dropping you just like that when the next best thing presents itself. She won't have the decency to tell you either. She'll leave you wondering.

Got onto OkCupid because some girl I know recommended it to me. I spent a lot of time analyzing profiles and coming up with personal messages for about 50 different women and only received about 5 responses. For those 5 people, we got into good conversations for a few days. Then 4 of them ghosted me out of the blue, one of them gave me her number and texted me for a while and then also ghosted me. This must be the worst site on earth for the average looking male. I'll be deactivating it soon. Again, women can't ever send the first message. Why would they?


Why today's version of dating is absolutely terrible for guys

Pretty much guys, if you're dating online and you're average looking, you're f**ked. You might think you're good and land some dates, but she'll leave you once she finds the next best thing. Even if it's been a few months, don't get your hopes up. The numbers game is seriously stacked against guys, and it's exhausting. And here I was trying to value relationships and wait for the right one before I lose my virginity, that ain't happening I guess. I'm just so god damn frustrated right now. All of this rejection is starting to make me feel worthless and that I have no purpose in life. Sure it feels good to be athletic and academically successful, but being unlovable is by far the worst.

I really wish the dating world was what it was back in the 1980s and 1990s. I feel like girls didn't have such inflated egos and ghost you. They were more direct and actually had some semblance of how morality works. Now each woman has 43223525235 options, what's the point? Even if a miracle does occur and you click, how long will it last before she does something irrational? If only I didn't have sexual urges, that'd be amazing. Guess I'll be spending the rest of my life working on medical devices and then traveling around the world by myself. I guess that's not so bad. Reaching that point of knowing that I'll always be a virgin forever unless I hire a sex worker is really really getting to me though. I truly wish I had just never tried in the first place.


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Most Helpful Girl

  • Being "attractive" is not the number one thing in dating when it comes to "meaningful relationships", I've rejected plenty of attractive guys because their personality turned me off or because we simply didn't connect. Im not gonna keep seeing a guy that I have no connection with. I've gone on dates with guys who had average looks too. You're not fucked at all. None of my friends are even dating super attractive guys either when they could.

    You can't go on a dating website expecting to find something serious. The whole thing itself is based on looks.
    Clearly you seemed to have had a disadvantage so far when it comes to meeting girls in real life due to being in a place thats 80% male. Try to look for other ways of meeting girls in real life.

    Also, clearly you managed to get some dates, so perhaps its not your looks thats an issue but rather something about your personality or conversations thats not reaching them. Many like to think there must be something wrong with the other person and not yourself, or just your looks, but not your personality or approach, which i personally think is more important than anything else, its a make or break for me.

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    • Believe me, I've tried to do some introspection and I honestly have no idea what I might be doing wrong. I don't think I'm a bad looking guy. I'm 6 feet tall, but skinny (like 150 pounds) and have decent skin. We have good conversations, but I've always had a hard time taking things to the next level. I've kissed girls before but nothing more than that. I just don't really know what I'm doing. I kind of hope to meet a girl who is a little bit older than me at some point. Being inexperienced definitely isn't helping one bit in addition to the types of people I've encountered. I just don't know what the right approach is anymore. Sure I'll meet girls once I start working, but I feel like that atmosphere presents even fewer options

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    • " I've rejected plenty of attractive guys because their personality turned me off"

      To be fair the fact they were good looking is why you gave them a shot/chance to be rejected. It's not the #1 thing but it helps to get a foot in the door.

    • it is for online dating, that's for sure. That's the thing that pulls you in

Most Helpful Guy

  • "Pretty much guys, if you're dating online and you're average looking, you're f**ked."

    First of all I want to say I am sorry you have had such a difficult time.. that sucks. I will have to disagree with you on your statement above. Guys who have problems with social cues or have other issues communicating or relating to the opposite sex usually end up blaming "THEIR LOOKS." Your inability to have self awareness and the ability to seek feedback is probably what is hindering you. Just know "average guys" all over the world are not going through the same things you are... sure there might be some but you are making a blanket statement that all "average looking" guys will go through the same thing because in your world you feel as if "everything" else is on point.. and it's probably not. I would find some of these women and ask them so that you can get some reflection. To say they just went after the next best thing is also an excuse for you not to do the work that is necessary to actually attract and keep someone in your life. Get FEEDBACK.

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    • I did try to get feedback before and i got the predictable "it's not you it's me" type of crap. And yeah I was incredibly frustrated when I wrote this post so some of this is an exaggeration. I want feedback and want to know what I'm doing wrong, but it's hard to get feedback when the girl ghosts you... I'm not sure dating is for me. Clearly I don't have the personality traits/qualities that women want. I'm sick of asking for advice and getting attacked by different people, it's just not worth the unhappiness. I'd rather continue doing things I'm good at and just enjoy those parts of life while forgetting these parts of life. I've honestly considered getting a professional and getting it over with so to speak, but I feel like in the long run it'd only make me feel worse. I don't know anymore man, I'm just not happy overall right now

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What Girls Said 13

  • Okay, but isn't it awful for everyone? I think the main problem now is a lack of honest communication. It comes in with the whole Madonna-whore binary idea too. For example; I am generally not particularly emotionally available from the off, and I have learnt that this is very important to communicate, so I tell guys from early on that I need the relationship to move at a slow pace emotionally, because if they get too invested too fast, I run. Men ignore this, and then start acting my boyfriend within a matter of weeks, after only a couple of dates, and so, I end it. I think it's not to do with "women's egos" per se, but more with humanity's collective egos at the minute. Women aren't the ones to blame, all of us are. We were the first generation raised by parents who were divorced, or in non-nuclear families, and one of the first generations that have been taught that what we want trumps what society demands. I don't think that's necessarily a bad thing; why settle for a relationship? Why look for a relationship? We should be looking to just meet people, and if a relationship develops, that's because of the person and what they mean to us, not because we just want to be loved.

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    • Nah, I do think men have it a lot harder in dating still in the 21st century where men and women get equal pay for the same jobs, but men are still expected to follow old fashioned dating. Men are still expected to initiate contact, continue and initiate conversations over text and constantly entertain her, plan dates, and expected to pay for the dates.

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    • I agree about the lack of communication part, and honestly I may have met a girl who was just like you; however, she wasn't upfront about that at all. It would've been nice to know that's how she feels comfortable developing relationships with people and not be ghosted out of the blue. Relationships are way too complex for me at the moment, and I enjoy not being a part of it. I've never had a good time with them, just awful experiences that make me feel worthless. I'm infinitely happier by myself. As much as I want to have sex with a beautiful woman and feel loved, it seems like a waste of my time right now. I hope that some day I feel differently about it, but right now it's just way too much to think about and too much bullshit going on. I try to be good about communication in terms of wants and needs and how I see things going, but that communication is never reciprocated. If the women I met were straight up, I probably wouldn't feel this way

    • But when you're dating a woman for a month or three, and realize that you were no more important to her than a piece of dirt, that makes you feel pretty fucking shitty. And when that's all you've ever experienced dating becomes horrible for your psyche

  • You should try to meet people in real life. Don't bother with online dating. Online dating is for experienced and jaded people trying to find something "perfect."

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    • I think that's what I've learned! It's just while I've been at school and kind of realized through my experiences that it would be tough to meet girls here, I thought online dating could be a bit easier and fun, and it turns out I was dead wrong about it. Hopefully once I start working and if I move (I might be moving to Boston in the summer if that's where I land a job) I'll meet a lot of new people. Hopefully something will happen for me

    • raspberry usually has good advice.

  • That's not the problem with dating in general, it's a problem with online dating. It's pretty easy to simply ignore someone online.
    If you're starting to hit it off with someone close to you IRL, you'll find you won't be ghosted half as much.

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    • Sure someone can ignore an online message, I understand women have hundreds if not thousands of men messaging them on OkCupid. But once you start dating in real life, for multiple months, that seems ridiculous. Women have too many options nowadays. Men have like a.1% chance of actually having an LTR with the woman they met online since she has over 100 other guys talking to her. It's absurd and not worth it. I just don't know what to do anymore. As I get older it'll only become more difficult to get women that I'm interested in. No more college atmosphere

  • I don't disagree that online dating is terrible for most guys, and ghosting is mean but damn.. you've only seen her 5 times in 3 months and you thought things went great? The only excuse I can think of is when she lived more than 3 hours away.

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    • I'm in school and she has a full time job and lives a few hours away yes. So we were only able to go out every 2 weeks or so due to that. But we talked on the phone daily after classes/work for her. I don't know, based on my little relationship experience I thought things were fine. I don't really know how to determine what is good and not good though. I've never had a real, extensive relationship so I have no f***ing idea how to gage that.

    • Ok, if she picked up the phone daily to talk to you I would have thought things went great too.. if you ask me, I think good is when she wants to spend every free minute with you either physically or on the phone or Skype. My cousin who's in a LTR relationship videochats all the time even while doing homework. It's extreme, but the infatuation stage is temporary insanity.

  • The old version of dating where the richest man in the village bought all the bride's and everyone else's only hope of getting laid was to be a Shepard (sheep) or a a soldier (war prizes) was much better for men... Hey if you like that, Mormon is still an option, they don't give any women options to all but the most affluent leaders either.

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    • Utah seems like a decent enough state haha. But seriously I'd feel even worse marrying somebody that doesn't truly want to be with me

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    • Wow, are you actually a woman? You have an uncommon understanding of societal norms and needs. Not necessarily a good or bad connotation, just an understanding that usually doesn't come from many women.

    • @Charleslvajr well my boyfriend does say "how did I get a girl with a guys brain in that body" lol but that's the thing, life experiences change perspective... I've had a weird frickin life so I'm probably different from most women. But that is the point everyone isn't the same but a lot of people will respond to the same stimuli the same way. If something isn't working and you want a different result, try something that seems crazy to your current methodology. Just don't go too far down the rabbit hole ;)

  • Omg I feel the same with guys. Some of them just randomly stop talking to me and I have no idea why. I think it tends to be because I don't do hook ups. I literally pretty much have the same feeling as you but am a girl. Although guys do take me out and I have options, it feels like a lot tend to ghost me when I won't go farther sexually with them. I am saving my virginity till marriage and honestly feel the same way like I am like I am soooooo sooooo done with boys and am just going to focus on myself cause the only boys I ever get along with tend to be players and will take me out and stuff then expect me to get with them and when I don't they ghost me. Like I am not going to hook up with you if you won't even commit to me... In fact one guy I was talking to, I cut him off and he made a fake snapchat and posed as a random person and tried to pay me $1,000 for a nude cause I would not send him one no matter how hard he tried. He would threaten to stop talking to me, etc and I still would not do it. I did not send the nude when he offer $1,000 by the way.

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    • Jesus that's weird and irrational as fuck to offer that much money for a nude picture... doesn't the dude realize he can just watch porn for free? Wow. Glad someone feels similarly though. Believe me, there are guys who aren't just in it for the sex. Interestingly it seems that a lot of men and women are just in it for the sex now and don't really give two shits about "love" anymore. Makes it pretty damn impossible to find it today

    • I had no idea women were in it for sex too, I usually feel like the guy is the one like that. oh the guy that tried to pay me I was on and off with for 4 years and he would say tons of weird stuff to me and I knew him since I was 14. I thought the same thing about him watching free porn but he just wanted me that badly. Got really pissed when he told my friend how he wanted the pics so he did not have to bother me anymore. Like some guy got pretty close to taking advantage of me recently. This one guy (different guy) that almost took advantage of me, the last time I saw him he tried to take my bra off and I would not let him, then at the end he said "I'll text you later" and still hasn't texted me after 8 days. My conclusion is that he realized he could not get any further and won't talk to me anymore. Omg I know what you mean like it is hard enough to find someone you even like, then the one I tend to like is always fun but when he is fun he tends to be a player, oh great..

  • This should be titled why online dating is bad for men. Today's actually dating is horrible for some for other reasons. Women do have the advantage on dating sites and such because their is a much higher volume of men than women. The reason a lot of them probably didn't respond to you is that your message was probably 1 of a 1000 and nothing was unique or stood out about it. You said you've had months long relationships that failed, but don't say why. You seem to be the common denominator in that so I would definitely try to evaluate to see what is going wrong. I highly doubt every single one of them quit talking because someone better came along something else probably turned them off.

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    • I really tried to have the messages stand out! I went on their profile and sometimes I was like wow this person and I have a lot in common! And I'd write her a few sentences if not a bit more than that. Interestingly, I had the most success when I wrote a simple "Hey." Seems ridiculous but it's true! Look, I understand that I probably got a little too excited with a least one of my relationships and maybe the girl thought that it came across too strong. I get that. I've done a lot of introspection and honestly I have no idea why it happened. I'm brutally honest with myself, and I'm a perfectionist with everything that I do. I'm hard on myself, I think I would've realized if I fucked something up bad. This is a total mystery for me. I'm pretty sick of being attacked by women on here. It can't ever be a coincidence that maybe those 3 women had something going on with themselves, always has to be my fault apparently

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    • what does that say about women then? Less unique and boring than most guys then

    • @MrNameless Or the women you're dsting may be that way. It could be that you're choosing women who are more likely to ghost, or just attracting women like thst. If you finding them on Tinder or Bumble that wouldn't surprise me. Most people use that for casual hook ups, or basically to get laid, and if you're not looking for those thing because you've been holding onto your virginity and are holding onto it then that may be why they're ghosting. Not saying it's riht it's just might be why you're getting ghosted.

  • Please do not try to romanticise the past, I'll tell you that the past was likely just as shit as the present.

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    • That is not true, at all... As someone who dated in the 90's and have a number of older friends who dated in the 80's, things have gotten WAAAAAY worse!!

      I got asked out on a regular basis in the 90's and because of the AIDS scare there was some expectation of not rushing into bed and actually getting to know someone a bit first.

      In the 80's it was fucking crazy from what my friends have told me.. like super easy going, people hooking up and hanging out, no real STD's to worry about, reliable birth control.

      Things have changed dramatically in the last couple decades or so because of the internet. Women are seriously crazy narcissistic compared to what they used to be like.

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    • @Charleslvajr I mean feminism has ruined everything. As simple as that. And the double standards of every day life are just disgusting. Women complain that they are judged because they've had several sexual partners and guys aren't judged at all. But once they find out a guy is a virgin they run for the fucking hills. Nobody ever talks about that. God forbid you say something that could be construed to be an insult to a woman at work, she'll find a way to get you fired for it. No wonder MGTOW is rising so much. Back in the 80s and 90s, nobody had to worry about that shit. Dating and marriage were much simpler and the divorce rate was much lower back then (I think, it would make sense)

    • the Divorce rate was actually higher interestingly. As soon as it became commonplace it skyrocketed and nowadays it slowed down considerably

  • well do you think it's better for the average-looking girl? Seems like all guys want today is just fast sex, no strings attached. Guys won't commit anymore. It's quantity over quality for guys.

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    • With the sexual revolution and the sexualizing of EVERYTHING, sex is easy to get. Again I say, why commit to endless responsibility with little benefit when you can get the benefit for nearly to effort?

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    • You're demonstrating exactly why it's better to not. Who wants a lifetime of being attacked and belittled by someone who never takes a moment to know anything about you? See, you're attacking me for answering the bloody question and of course you know nothing about me, in the least. That's the lowest pitiful behavior for an "intelligent" and "educated" human being in the course of discussion about a topic.

    • @Charleslvajr Not to mention what happens to guys when a divorce happens... marriage is an absolutely horrible decision for men nowadays. Way too risky. Sure there are financial benefits if it actually works and you stay together, but the divorce rate is pretty high nowadays. Basically dating and getting married suck the finances right out of you and the detriments greatly outweigh the benefits

  • Why don't you just stop worrying about dating and concentrate on your career. The fact that you're so anxious to have sex may make you less attractive to some women.

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    • I'm not anxious to have sex. I'm anxious to be loved

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    • I often find it nowadays that the more harder you try to impress a girl, the less natural and more awkward it will be and it will likely sabotage the relationship.

      You just have to play it cool and act natural. Many times love just comes in our life when we least expect it.

    • @MrNameless Yeah. I think I've finally had my epiphany that it's just not for me. No matter what I do, I always seem to have trouble and feel upset about it. Not to mention the amount of money I've wasted so far on dates. Not like I go crazy for them on first dates, but over time it adds up. No more dating means some extra money saved up for traveling or to spend on Christmas gifts haha. I'm just not happy in the dating world, and I think the way to happiness is just to give up. Can't keep doing this to myself. Waste of time, money, and energy that could be put towards something else. I've read into MGTOW and although i don't think I'd ever go as far as avoiding women entirely, I absolutely understand and respect where they come from. What I've experienced is 100% what they say the vast majority of women are like. And although there are always exceptions, knowing that most are like that is enough for me

  • Yeah caouse online dating is the only way to date people...

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  • agree

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  • Maybe you should try meeting people in real life? For example by doing something you care about or want to try (hiking, dance, some charity or whatever really), and then meeting people you will natually talk to anyways.

    Most of my friends (me included) would be more serious about a guy they met in person, whom they have something in common with. It also helps seeing the person regularly.

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    • I met some girls at school where we had classes together, but we didn't have much in common. I don't know anymore. At this point I'm exhausted and frustrated and I really don't know what I'm doing when it comes to dating. I think I'll just give up for a bit and hope that something changes sooner rather than later. I've wasted enough of my time and sanity on it

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    • @WhistleForTheChoir Yes, actually. Maybe it happens more often for a Channing Tatum, but that doesn't mean it doesn't happen.

      I guess it is sort of like dating apps, in that most people never reply back, but then some do, and even among those who do, not every relationship willl last. Except dating apps not natural.

    • Uh-huh, yea sure.

      The fact is, is that men have to put in a lot of foot-work to get women to give them a chance. Even if the woman does approach first, the man is still expected to take the initiative from then on, and honestly, in 100% of the cases I know about where a woman approached a man, she was looking for a fling and using him for sex.

What Guys Said 31

  • Cheer up- you're going to be earning a very good salary very soon and will have lots of opportunities to meet women who will be happy to be your partner. It's often darkest right before dawn.

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    • Thanks man, I guess I am thankful that at least some parts of my life are in order. I just wish that I didn't care about this though. Why can't I be like those girls: not really caring about the guys they date, sometimes just looking for free meals, and then moving onto the next one without a hitch? Why do I have to get so invested at the first sign that something fantastic might be possible? I hate myself for that and I always will. It's such a stupid way to be, but I feel like I almost can't control it. I can't just be like "yeah she seems amazing but I'm not going to get invested." At this point I feel like I'm so far gone in terms of how negative I feel about it all, that I've pretty much made my bed. I want to believe there is someone out there for me, but at this point it doesn't seem realistic. And if a woman just wants me because I'm making good money, no thanks.

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    • Just focus on getting a good job (no doubt you will). As you know, the truth of the matter is that guys that make good money usually get better women. Just find one that's compatible.

    • And aim for the younger ones. The older, jaded ones usually just provide headaches with constant demands.

  • I just wrote an academic paper on the effects of technology (online dating) on mate selection. That doesn't mean I know everything, but at least my opinion is based in facts.

    1. Over a third of new marriages in the US begin online, and that percentage is sharply trending upward.

    2. An offline marriage actually has a HIGHER chance at divorce and a LOWER chance at satisfaction compared to an online marriage.

    That's not to say that online dating is perfect -- it's not -- but it goes to show that the fancy newfangled internet isn't ruining modern marriage.

    A couple suggestions:

    1. Use paid sites that cater more to people looking for something serious/long-term.

    2. Go on cheap first dates. Always.

    3. Don't go straight from messaging to the first date. Schedule a phone call or a little Skype call first. You'd be surprised how good this is at weeding out serious daters vs. daters who are just playing around. It'll also give you one last chance to look for red flags before spending the time meeting her.

    4. Know your worth, believe in your worth, and don't let some of these GaG fucktards convince you that all women are evil/deceitful/hypergamous money-grubbing whores -- because you're better than that, and so are a good number of the women out there there.

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    • Can definitely agree with the first 3. In one of the month long relationships I could tell something was off because we made a plan to talk to each other and then she just didn't pick up her phone and never called me back that day. Texted me the next day as if I never called her. Talk about putting in minimal effort. The last one is a fair point, but to be honest all the women I've encountered have pretty much fallen into those categories haha. At least the one's I've tried dating.

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    • That's true. When you know the important stuff and want all of them to be met, you have more chances to meet the right one online that offline. I was just wondering if your data also shows a discrepancy between young adults (say 18-27) online marriage and old adults (>27) online marriages like it exists in offline marriages or if it doesn't matter at all, because the young adults who use online dating sites are ahead of their peers and know exactly what their looking for which didn't change over time.

    • @bubble_tea nothing I read indicated much variance between age brackets. You are right though, in the sense that people who look online *tend* to think/know more about what they want. It makes sense since they're actively seeking out potential mates.

  • You think only dating is absolutely terrible for guys? That is just the beginning. 70% of men 18-35 are single.
    The divorce rate is 90% in some demographics.
    Men are opting out of long term relationships with women as a defensive strategy.
    It is a response to changes in law that have disadvantaged men, as well as almost 60 years of unrelenting hatred that has been vomited over men by Feminists.
    Intelligent men have done a rational cost/risk/benefit analysis and reached an evidence-based conclusion that interaction of any type with females (especially romantic/sexual interaction) is too much legal and financial risk... basically financial and emotional suicide.
    Hence, the only way for men to win is to not play the game.
    The men of the western world over, have withdrawn from the field and walk away.
    www.foxnews.com/.../why-men-wont-marry.html

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    • The fear and disdain for black people in that cartoon is pathetic.

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    • @Charleslvajr I'm not arrogant

    • Talking about DodgersGM who keeps coming up with pathetic complaints.

  • So is the second sentence meant to make me think that you are somehow qualified or something to have an opinion? What does your studies have to do with the opinion that you are trying to give? The answer is nothing.

    You've literally tried only online methods of dating (or at least that's all you mentioned here) and based on your lack of success you're calling out these methods as bad? Sounds like you're trying to masquerade anecdotal experience as some kind of general fact.

    Also you say that you wish things were like back how they were in the 90s and 80s despite the fact that at that time you were a child who probably wasn't even interested in dating due to your age. So I doubt you know really much about how dating was back then. Furthermore, seeing as you have only chosen modern ways of dating (apps and sites etc) I personally think you would have hated dating back in the 80s and 90s as you haven't even bothered to try those older methods. It's not like you can't still go to bars and meet people in person like people used to. You're literally avoiding doing that and trying to blame your laziness on technology, which is precisely why it was created in the first place. This is pretty hilarious.

    If you have such a problem with Bumble and Tinder etc. go meet people at bars. It doesn't seem like you have the confidence though, you just wish that other people were on a more even playing field and that everyone was *forced* to not have to use technology. That kind of mentality is just selfish.

    "Reaching that point of knowing that I'll always be a virgin forever unless I hire a sex worker is really really getting to me though." This made me laugh so hard. You might be very unattractive, but hating apps for giving you a place to literally hide from the world and create the kind of persona you want people to see is not something you should be complaining about. It's something you should be praising, seeing as you don't have the confidence to meet people in person like people did 20 or 30 years ago.

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    • I bet you're a liberal cuck

  • check it out dude I say a lot of stupid shit just to get people mad sometimes but I recommend you read this whole reply and ignore every other person on here because I'm about to tell you where your screwing up.

    First, your probably a young guy if you still got the v card, I don't know, but I seriously regret that it took me until age 25 to learn this. If you know your not the most handsome, you just need to get over it QUICK. Get off those stupid dating sites, stop working on your approach, and forget about going to the gym to get a six pack.
    Take all that pent up energy and sexual frustration and focus it on MAKING MONEY. and as much as possible. Research how to make money on the internet in your free time. If you want it bad enough, you will eventually get it, but it won't be easy.
    Though, with that said, your motivation shouldn't just be to get women, think about EVERYTHING you could be doing that you can't do now if you just had the money. And when your success peaks, the females will follow. I wrote a question like this a year ago before I had this epiphany. Your energy used in the chase is poorly spent, so redirect it. Then not only will you pull girls, but they'll do anything you want.
    Don't listen to anything they might say about this answer. I know what IM talking about, because the world taught it to me, not the internet. Don't blame the girls for not liking you. Blame yourself. They are just as shallow as we are, for their own reasons.
    Let that thought sink in, and let it be your motivation to become FILTHY FUCKIN RICH.

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    • That's what I'm learning man. I've had a few interviews recently for positions that start at 70k a year (according to Glassdoor) so that's a start. I'm on my way in that department. I'm definitely channeling my energy towards productivity, that's the only way to go.

  • I wouldn't recommend online dating. In fact, I wouldn't recommend chasing after them at all. If they want you they can come to you. But don't waste time and resources on them otherwise.

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    • I agree, but I at least want to try sex before I die, you know? I've all but given up the possibility of finding a meaningful relationship

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    • I mean I was in college for 5 years. Never really came across anyone I was interested in. It was an engineering school after all, with about 80% guys. Not exactly a great selection here

    • Well look elsewhere.

  • Almost everything you say I can relate to or sympathize with.

    I've made a concerted effort to back to the RL route (coworkers, girls I meet while out, neighbors even). But RL dating is full of the same flakes and ghosters.

    It's a hellhole these days for any average looking 30something.

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    • I should be fair. I do know some really handsome dudes who have their struggles too. They get way more dates than me, but they also have way more failures as well.

      I think women these days aren't just looking for that spark, but rather an H-bomb to really grab their attention.

    • Yeah the tough RL part for me is that the engineering school I'm at is 80% dudes, and the girls there just aren't that appealing in general. And at this point, after all the online dating nonsense I'm just not about putting myself out there. I had a couple of dates going back to when I was in high school but we were so young and it was silly to be dating at 15, so I'm not really going to count those ones. Agree with what you're saying 100% though

  • They'll only want you when they need a plan B after pushing out big headed babies for other men. Plus; stretch marks another mans baby gave them.

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    • Precisely. I'd rather die first than be their plan B

  • I wanted to comment and say something about the online dating but :
    @Chrysis and @HamAndCheese said everything I wanted to say !

    Enjoy your life... go travel and meet beautiful women around the world !
    Trust me. its worth it.

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  • Your experience is just that -- your experience. Almost all the young guys I work with have happy relationships with their girlfriends. There's a problem, but it's not the modern dating scene, and it's not modern girls. It's you and your negative attitude. Girls can smell your desperation from a block away.

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    • That's fair, but I will say it's pretty god damn difficult to stay positive when this is all you've ever experienced and there doesn't seem to be any hope for me in terms of dating prospects. I need to give up for a while and probably see a therapist to figure out why I'm so unhappy and so unsuccessful. This kind of crap makes me feel borderline depressed

    • A therapist could help if you can find the right one. One helped me tremendously in my 30's. Don't wait that long.

  • No one ever said women are decent people. Some are. Some aren't. But what's often truer than not is that you give a woman a way out of a potentially awkward and confrontational situation and they'll take it and run. They'll rationalize it as "I don't wanna hurt his feelings" or "I don't owe him an explanation" or even better "guys do it too", but at the end of the day its pure cowardice and they don't wanna deal with confrontation. It's easier to put you overboard and forget about you instead of giving you an honest explanation. That's life.

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    • Unfortunately so

    • Show All
    • Like I said before, women can and will justify anything to ensure their self-inflated opinions. It's always somebody else's fault.

    • I wish I could favorite this. ... didn't there used to be a favorite feature?

  • You need to put your engineering skills to work, because finding women is just a problem to solve, like how to stop leakage of electrons on a chip.

    "dating online and you're average looking, you're f**ked"
    Not true at all. You just have to know where to look. If you are an engineer, then you have no business being on Tinder, because that is for sluts and fboys. You need to find the site that has women looking for a guy like you, and as an engineer, there are a LOT of women who would love to meet you. They are not on tinder or bumble or OkCupid (the majority of profiles are not active).

    "what it was back in the 1980s and 1990s"
    Unlike you, I have dated in the 80s and 90s, and I will tell you unequivocally, it is MUCH easier today. I have had sex with more college girls since I turned 40 than when I was in college (incl grad school). Women today are easy to find (look on the right site), easy to filter (start with the site with the kind of women who like your kind of guy), confident to meet, and easy to bed (even virgins, but I've dated a white one, only Asian ones).

    The sites I use have more women than men. Two hints for you on picking a site: Think like a woman, and if you don't have to pay, then it isn't worth it.

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  • Yeah, but in the 1980's you would have been far more limited in who you could meet, as the internet was command line and all dudes.

    You want to meet girls, travel to other countries and stay in hostels. If you are an engineer you should be able to afford it soon. You'll meet girls who are interesting, adventurous and open to new experiences.

    Whatever you do, don't spend the next ten years sitting in an office.

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  • I think a lot of people hold onto not being attractive and that being the main problem and then they get obsessed. Plenty attractive enough people can send you messages and things but you normally know in the first 10 minutes If there is going to sparks or if it's not working, different people click and lots of people out there, I think people are more picky on dating sites but certainly not impossible to find people on there

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  • It is terrible but most guys play along so it's their fault. Whatever ladies can be criticized for it's usually gents doing the enabling.

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    • Not really sure what I did wrong though?

    • I'm not saying you did. Im saying the male gender enables it.

  • You contradict yourself by saying you are 'old fashioned' and then proceed to go on about online dating and its pitfalls.

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    • I am old fashioned, but due to the way the world works as well as the environment around me online dating seemed like the right approach. There are little to no women at my school. Sure online dating probably isn't for me, but I don't know what else to do. Hopefully in the coming years something comes up

    • i assume there are no groups to join, clubs, dances, clubs in your school, family/church gatherings, friends parties etc etc etc etc

      Only social Media?

  • That is a shame man! Maybe it has to do with the city your in or the college you go to? If you live in CA I bet it would be pretty hard to find a girl who wants to wait. I want to wait for marriage myself even if it is hard.

    all I have to say is just keep going man, just keep going, you are one step closer

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  • Yeah man it's really hard. I hear you. It's not about "SHE'S OBLIGATED TO RESPOND TO ME ARRRRGH" or some crap. "Obligation" is not the issue... "decency" is the issue. They don't know what it's like to get constantly rejected, mostly.

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  • Stick with professionals. It costs less and you'll always have a happy ending without worrying about alimony.

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  • I'm a guy who has slept with a lot of sluts and has always appreciated women who are more sexually liberal. So having said that, I haven't experienced much at all what you've experienced personally, BUT... I have a roommate in college who's in your situation and can understand the frustration.

    But it pretty much comes down to this, you are not entitled to women just because you have your shit together. Having a masters in engineering is impressive but shouldn't be your main selling point. I'm finishing undergrad engineering tomorrow when I take my last final. I would NEVER think to immediately showcase this to a girl as it being my selling point.

    If they're not responding to you, then you simply didn't catch their interest, or they didn't find you attractive enough. It's as simple as that. You can blame the system or yourself. Which one of those options will actually benefit you? Think logic Mr. Engineer.

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    • I didn't say that as my selling point... just to describe my situation in life at the moment. That is all

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