If any more females want to down vote my comment, can you please say whether you are down voting simply because I disapprove of abortion or if your down vote is based on some other reaction to the comment.
I didn't downvote you and you have the right to hold whatever opinion you have about abortions. But I would think that most couples would eventually discuss the issue together and if a girl had a abortion in the passed and he was totally pro-life, it might be a reason to not date after all.
Actually, we got engaged and later married. But the marriage ended because she decided she did not want to be married, or even in a relationship, with anyone.
That will do it. I'm sorry.
I am opinionated but I am also tolerant of those who disagree with me. I dated an extreme liberal for two years, and tolerated all of the political disagreements fairly easily.I have learned some lessons and moved forward.
Telling him so she can save herself the embarassement of potentially not agreeing with him about something thats for some reason a political debate even though its her body... Sounds legit. I also like to tell people my most personal things just from the shear fear of them accidentally making a fool out of themselves by uttering opinions about the subject that they otherwise wouldn't if they knew i have something to do with it. I like to take responsibility for other people by making sure they dont completely fall on their ass, thats definitely my responsibility towards others... Im not even gonna touch on the fact that you want her to tell you so you can "streamline" your opinion on the subject. This was Not wiser man.
@Jackieboi We had already been dating for about 18 months and got engaged a few months later. It was time for revealing our most personal things. That's what happens in good relationships.
Hey, opinions and people change. You have women who never wanted children and now they are some of the best moms ever.
Good relationship or not its none of your business. And you're really falling double on your ass for not understanding why your answer was self centered even though i kinda said it through sarcasm.
@Jackieboi Yes, I understood your sarcasm and judgment. If you think that my only concern was for my own feelings, then that suggests that you really don't know me. . . and you clearly don't.
Hey no judgement, you can probably remember tons of times i agreed with you. But i had to give a thumbs down when i saw that 4 guys gave you up, just to give a more correct sample. Someone asked yesterday why someone would keep their relationships a secret for other guys and this is a perfect example... Its because some if not most guys have such deep conviction that theyre microscopically better than gals. Think about it, how do you feel about people who have opinions on things they are utterly clueless about? Say if women everywhere started having opinions on being kicked in the balls. There are some already who think thats a valid thing for them to have an opinion on, and how do you feel about them? Lets say now that women ran the world and decided to make a political thing out of it all while were left helpless and more or less have our opinions on it ignored. Thats what you're doing to women when you think you are in any sort of position to have an opinion on abortion. You knew about the flowers and the bees before you stuck ot in (disregarding if you're tricked into it lets say she lies about the pill or whatever). Thats the abortion part. Now about the part where you feel she should stop you in your tracks when you start talking about something that she doesn't agree on (you talking about abortion and she knowing she had one). Its self centered of you to say that she should tell you so to spare herself from later embarassement. First of all because she can simply choose not to tell you, ever, its non of your business. Second of all its The game... For lack of better words. She is constantly making decisions about wether or not you are a potential partner, just like you. So you see what you are actually saying is that she should stop you from telling her things you know will male her less inclined to continue seeing you as a potential partner... Its selfish on so many f levels and its sad that you, im thinking "refuse", to see that🤔
I keep them a secret so as to not have to waste my time constantly explaining things like these that are Obvious to women yet for some reason not most guys.
Cause if i dont the little fuckers dont respect me since i dont hold up to their retarded back ward ways of thinkinh
@Jackieboi 1. I don’t date women if I think I am superior to them. I always want an equal partner in a relationship.2. We will simply disagree about this, but I am not clueless about abortion simply because I am incapable of giving birth to a child. That’s like saying that you need to be a chicken to have an opinion about eggs. If you are right on this point, then Row v. Wade is invalid because it was decided by nine MEN. The fact that I am a man means that I am clueless about the subjective experience of pregnancy and childbirth but that does not mean that I am clueless about the moral ramifications of abortion and appreciation for the value of life.An unborn child is the result of my sperm and her egg and it is as much my child as it is her child. I have a right to have an opinion on abortion, in general, just as I have a right to have an opinion on murder. Many people will disagree with my opinion but the fact that we disagree will not cause me to say that they have no right to have an opinion and I will respect them even when we disagree.3. I have disagreed with partners on many matters over the years. I have never backed away from expressing my opinions. And I have never hidden my concerns so that a woman would be more inclined to accept me as her partner. In this particular case, we had been dating for about 18 months and we became engaged a few months later. Our relationship was far beyond the point of trying to make a good impression.
When approaching a conflict in a relationship, there are different ways to address the matter. I had no idea that my then-girlfriend (who had been raised as a Catholic and who had attended Mass regularly until only a few years before I met her) had consented to an abortion. I thought that she was against abortion and that she would agree with my opinion on the matter.If I had known that she had experienced an abortion, I would not have said to her, “I think that everyone who agrees to an abortion is a murderer.” I could gave certainly expressed my pro-life position without saying something that strong, something that ultimately caused her a few sleepless nights as she relived the past and her feelings of guilt about the abortion.Yes, we all have secrets but when you are approaching marriage, it is time to lower the defenses and to bare your soul to your partner. I had already told her about my arrest when I was 20 years old, about my depression and history of several failed relationships. I had not withheld any secrets from her.When you are in a relationship and committed to being together for the rest of your lives, “the two become one.” I’m sure you have heard that expression many times. It means that her happiness should be as important to me as my own happiness. It means that we should share common goals. It means that my history is my partner’s business and her history is my business. For the kind of commitment that I seek, I simply do not accept that either of us has a right to withhold information from the other.4. I do not refuse to see the points you have raised. I simply do not accept them as being applicable to my life and the relationship that I want.
Agree to disagree, i think we are clueless about abortion because we dont know how it affects our bodies and hormones, we haven't been through it. Im not witch hunting, as i said i agreed with you hundreds of times on things before and i value your presence on gag! But once again i just cannot agree with you that its any of our business. Did you know that females are genetically coded to be sad after abortion? I can only imagine what it feels like to be sad "with no reason othe than your body telling you to feel that way"... Anyway the abortion questions is actually a little besides the point. Because the point is that you expect gals to stop you if you are tellimg them an opinion they dont agree on. Continue doing that and you will continue shooting yourself in the foot.
Would you be bothered if women stary having opinions on how many times your balls have been hit hard? I mean they should right? Because in the end it has to do with the quality of the sperm the recieve, so they should definitely start having opinions on and preferably make it political too! 🙄
@Jackieboi Actually, I never said that she had a responsibility to tell him that information. I simply observed that telling him would eliminate the spectre of the situation which happened to me. And, yes, after 18 months of dating, I do think that she should have told me about having had an abortion. We will simply disagree on this one.
You didn't have to say it. You answer shows that you expect them to be embarassed about it. It shows you expect them to tell you at some point, like its any of your business. And it shows you expect them to stop you because, like you said, it would spears you two the embarassement, you just dont understand that you're the only one who should be embarassed. Thats where all the female downvotes come from, they just didn't consider it worth their time because its just so fucked on so many levels that theyre not even sure you're gonna end up getting it.
You are indeed older yet wiser!
Their downvote is simply against you because you stated you were against abortion. Women think ending another human life is a choice. They want to use the whole libertarian philosophy of doing as you see fit unless it impedes on others and abortion ironically does just thatIf women want plastic surgery or a sex change or gender change or whatever else then theyre free to do so, ending a life due to inconvenience isn't an option.
I think it has more to do with the subliminal thinking that they should stop you from saying something they dont find attractive or agree on "to save herself future embarassement". can't be because "ending a life is wrong" because he agrees on that...
@Jackieboi I never said that a girl is obligated to reveal that to a guy. I only suggested one potential advantage to making the revelation, based on my real experience.
tara987 So there's pro-life and the other one's called pro-death right lol?
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I just don't think anyone wants to get an abortion. No one is pro-abortion. If a guy is pro life, then a girl will have to take that into consideration when she's dating him.
If you actually read the 14th Amendment of the U. S. Constitution word for word, it actually states in plain English the exact opposite of the Roe v. Wade ruling.The Original Amendment, as written, states "No person shall be deprived of Life, Liberty, or Property except as punishment for a crime."Even so much as a ZYGOTE is Metaphysically, Philosophically a Free Moral Agent, and as such has an Objective Moral Right to life.I therefore would throw the entire law at the woman for deceiving me, sexually assaulting me, and endangering my future offspring by her evil actions, AND for denying me my Objective Moral Right to marry a woman who is actually an Objectively Moral person; Certainly I have an Objectively Moral Right to marry a woman who is not an abortionist murderer.Fortunately for me, the Chinese woman I'm currently talking to considers all Abortions, except Accident, as Murder, even though she is an Atheist, so we agree on this Objective Moral Principle.
Glad you found her then.
You make a good point. If I had an abortion, I would be pro-choice and that subject might come up (probably would) in a relationship. At that point, either person could leave the other.
I don't think there is a strong chance that she won't be able to have kids in the future. And if she chose not to have a kid at one point doesn't mean she won't want kids at a different time in her life.
Pregnancy is technically an STD. wouldn't you want the guy to let you know if he had a STD at one time even if it was something that he got better from?
If the guy doesn't have the STD anymore I don't see a single reason why he would have to tell me about it. Also, abortion doesn't really affect your ability to have kids, unless something goes wrong during or after the procedure.
That is not telling them you had one. Different points.
@VIVANT well, if you had one, then obviously you’re willing to have one.
Hypothetically:If I say I’m willing to have one, then obviously I’m willing to have one. Not bc I HAD one. But bc I am NOW willing to have one. The significant part for the relationship is if she currently believes in it. That’s it.
I don't think abortion causes infertility in most cases. I don't know if it's unavoidable. I appreciate your input tho:)
That's not the abortion but the possible effects it could have on her basically. She should explain her crying or whatever but otherwise, she shouldn't feel like she has to?
I see what you mean, but abortion doesn't 'damage' all women.
Yeah, if she doesn't consider herself damaged by it, then there's no reason to say anything. Put another way, if it doesn't result in anything that requires an explanation, then here is no need to offer said explanation.
If I were married to someone and then found out she aborted a child, I'd dump the hoe for having lied to me.
A, it's not a lie, it's none of your business. B, once you are married, of course have discussions because fertility is an issueC, unless you ready to disclose your sexual and surgical history with her, I wouldn't cast stones
Females expect complete honesty from the men who want to be with them, don't they? So why should the men not demand the same? I stand by what I said.
@Dchrls78104 stop generalizing, dude. Ya sound like a damn fool
@R_Cakes91 a proud fool who values trust and honesty in relationships!
Is that a dealbreaker for you? Like what if you met the love of your life, you both connected like you’d never had with anyone else, got married and then years later she felt comfortable enough to tell you this difficult secret? You’d just up and leave? You have to understand that it’s an incredibly intimate and traumatic thing to go through and it’s none of your business.
@R_Cakes91 sorry, I'd up and leave; I'd feel incredibly betrayed.
Ok well then just be straight up about how you feel about it.
@R_Cakes yes, it would be a dealbreaker for me. Let's just say I didn't sign on for rude surprises that should have been discussed long before we got so far along in the relationship.
But if it's in her past, how is it a rude surprise for you? Does it change your perception of a someone you love that they did this in their past? What else would you judge your loved one about for not disclosing to you?
One time a man was with a woman in my country. They got into an argument and in the heat of it she screamed that the child wasn't his. Well, things turned violent and he killed her. I can't remember if he killed himself too. It's not the only time past issues have complicated people's relationships in my country. Sorry, I stand by what I've said.
@Dchrls78104 It's different if you get pregnant from someone who isn't your boyfriend/husband than it you have an abortion with a different man before you met your current partner, no?
To me it's the same in that if you don't tell me what I'm getting myself into before I have got into it, you have lied to me. A man who had a vasectomy before he met a girl he knows wants kids and told her only after they got married would be dumped for lying to her, wouldn't he? So there...
@Dchrls78104 A man with a vasectomy can't have kids anymore. A girl who had an abortion can. Is it a lie to not tell him if he's never asked? I am not arguing with your point that she should tell him - that's a fair opinion I guess. But does it mean she is lying to him?
That was a bad example @DchrIs78104. An abortion results in NO children from a particular pregnancy. The woman is able to have children later. Infidelity isn't the same as having an abortion. It's along the lines of if you sold a car before y'all ever met. Does she need to tell you she had a car once and doesn't now?
Not that I equate children to property, mind you. This is just an example
And that I bought the car from a selfish, inconsiderate, cheating asshole:)
Sounds like you're a sensible woman
Husband material in other words?
tara987: Yes, pretty much so.
I think if you've been in a serious relationship and it suddenly comes up that your SO says abortion is murder and you've never mentioned your abortion, I think you've hit a brick wall that is a dealbreaker. You HAVE to tell and let the chips fall. I'd expect the SO would leave, as hard as that is to stomach. I agree it's past and shouldn't matter. But such a broad difference in opinion, feeling, is a killer.
@Screenwriter - Uh, no, it's not. And disclosing such is MAKING it an issue when it's not. Abortion IS murder. But somehow much of our culture accepts it. It's still irrelevant to a current relationship.
I meant future guys - not the man who she got pregnant with.
No I dont think so.