Do you think relationships with modern women are worth it? Girls, why do you think some men say you aren't worth it? (Page 2)
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"Modern women" do you mean U. S women? Because from where I am from, in Europe, women still pretty much have high family values and tread their men good. Not that American women dom't, but apperantly a lot of men complain.
Anyway, modern women from outside america i'd say still value their men a lot and traditions, even though we are more independent business and financial wise
I agree with this..
I guess I'm confused by all this Mumbo jumbo. If you care to explain how you would define a modern woman (according to you) that would be great.
Don't mind to bring you more news but ONS, friends with benefits type relationships and even casual dates even existed during my father's time who was born in the early 50's.
High expectations, good career, good pay.
Basically I just mean the modern relationship.
I see. I don't really ask too much in a relationship except not having a sleeping around past (since I don't have one either) and working at least. It makes sense that I would want the same in return.
Nothing wrong with wanting to have a career though and get paid. I'll with done with my major towards the end of this year and if someone is nagging about quitting college because I'm suppose to only stay at home 24/7 and keep popping babies when I'm not even ready, they can take a hike.
I find it pathetic that we have to either be called modern or traditions. How about just a woman that wants to do what she wants in life whether it's getting married at a younger age and being a housewife or having a major and taking her time and is happy with her choice. Neither of them are better than the other. They are just different lifestyles.
Those are not your only expectations. I don't know you but most girls seem to really play down their expectations.
Pay isn't an issue to me except for the way most women want the guy to be the main breadwinner and to be successful. The better the woman's career, the less impressive the guy's. This makes women more and more demanding at least imho.
Agreed.
Don't it's the fact of them wanting only the man to be the breedwinner but rather that's what men want once a baby gets involved. It's usually us that has to either quit our job or limit our working hours when a child is involved so basically this limits our enhancement towards the business world for years until what? the child is 10 years old? That's still 10 years of our life limited.
don't think... there have been posts about guys complaining about women that choice having a career first and then family, not realizing that if we want both a career and family, we have to then work less hours while being stuck doing more household chores and he's not even helping with the chores... how is that fair?
So in a way if he's not even going to help with the household chores 50%, then it makes sense why he would have to be the breadwinner at least.
I think it depends on the character of the guy.
It takes a smart, open-minded, non-misogynistic and respectful guy to date a modern women.
I'd call myself a modern woman, meaning I like things equally. And still some traditional roles in the bedroom or special occasions.
I wouldn't want to get a guy who thinks women are only good for domestic work and fucking. No sir, if you think like that, you're a low quality breed
That wasn't what I meant. Quite the opposite in fact.
What the hell is up with that poll. You have a choice! Don't date modern women if you hate that. Be single. But yeah, you would just complain then too.
Here you complain and say you have no choice but you don't even look around you properly. I have never dated because guys find me ugly and aren't interested. All I want is a long-term relationship and give my everything.
And you can't blame everything on modern women, that is just stupid.
I'm blaming modern people. I think people these days are just... flaky. They divorce more, lie more, cheat more, leave more. I don't trust any of them really. I'm only focusing on women because I'm a straight guy.
I understand you only has experience about women. Like many women feel men are not trustworthy. But anyways it's pointless to generalize and blame a large group of people for few things you yourself have experienced.
Frankly, men have only themselves to blame when they all always fall for mean girls and ignore all the signs that are saying she isn't worth it, while ignoring also all the worthwhile girls who just really, really want someone to be with. Men like the punishing pushy and demanding women.
Nah. Thankfully feminism allows me to shag women without ever commiting to a relationship. Because women can earn their own money they are no longer a burden for men to carry all our lives. Equal rights mean i can happily let her pay her way or buy me dinner (steak if she wants to get lucky) Thanks to women being able to choose if I knock her up as I dont gey a say to her keeping the baby or aborting it I can wash my hands guilt free after all its her body. Why would I bother getting married with the divorce rate the way it is and how men are treated in the courts ie alamoney and child support and lack of rights to your children. Maybe wait until in my thirties and marry a twenty something year old girl. Time is on my side. What a great age we live in its never been better to be a man.
modern guys want to be whores, modern women want to be control whores, i dont see what your getting at here? Everyone is a whore. Everyone thinks they deserve everything and they are god, dating anyone is hell and its a curse of god being horny and depressed in a life of superficial misery. Love is a fairy tail and mostly everyone will soon realize.
Well that's... um... cheered me up?
I agree but not completely there are some girls and guys like me that aren't whores as you say. We wait for marriage. Love is not a fairy tale... people only make it out that way because everyone so focused on their goals their dreams by the time their done they have no time for someone else. People cheat, lie in relationships. That's why their is no love. People always want the next thing better.
Everyone is afraid to get hurt now. People are uncommitted. They have a girlfriend or boyfriend then have side hoes? The reason why love isn't love anymore is because of that
We should definitely go back to chivalry and courtship. Those days were way better :)
@Buttercupbrownie What do you mean by that?
Love is a fairytale. Its not permanent. Science has proven you can still love someone and cheat on them. Which then makes love pretty fucking useless. Its completely separate from honesty, loyalty, and respect. None of those things are required to feel love or be in love. So love is useless unless its platonic
Um.. you can still hook up with women without wanting anything serious. You'll find a large chunk of "modern women" are sick of the guys who fall in love after getting some, anyway.
I didn't see anything like this in the options, so making sure you knew that.
I've given up on relationships so far, but not because I don't like modern women, I actually prefer an independent woman, but because I don't want one right now, I have trust issues I need to get fixed, I prefer to be single and be with more women than just one, I don't want drama, and I don't wanna get cheated on, something that it's way too common at my age, with both men and women.
I've had almost zero interest in 99.999% of the girls I've met in my life (and I've met a heck of a lot). The kind of girl that I'm looking for, I don't think even exists anymore and if she does, it's got to be in some random city that no one really knows much about in Japan somewhere or something.
What are some characteristics of the type of woman you are looking for?
It's more that I know what kind of characteristics I avoid rather than ones I'm looking for. However, as far as ones I'm looking for, someone who's patient, considerate, is good at starting and continuing conversations and even intelligent ones (and not just keeping them going by talking nonsense), she's compassionate and doesn't gossip about others, someone who's understanding and willing to hear new ideas even those different from her own and is interested in sharing her own ideas on things, someone who's confident and has their own passions in life but still depends on others to help keep her confidence up and isn't completely self sufficient (otherwise there's not much of a point in a relationship, at least to me), a girl who's still fairly innocent on some level, someone who's smoking and drinking free, someone that I find attractive (at least her face. the rest is just extra), someone who loves kids and would make a good mother someday. There's other things, but that's the gist.
Not japan, I have heard its even worse there then it is here.
It's becoming worse. Women in Japan are filling a lot of the positions that guys used to occupy while guys are slowly falling into the hikikomori (shut in) lifestyle.
So most of the characterisitcs are of people you consider good and wouldn't mind calling them a friend, regardless of gender. The only thing gender specific is your attraction to her and how you both care for your children. Unless smoking and drinking is something you don't mind your male friends to partake in, which I would find odd, but I guess possible.
Do you find those non gender specific characteristics harder to find in women than men?
For the ones that I mentioned, though there are others, sure, I'd agree.
I'm not sure what you're getting at, exactly. I know what you asked, but I wish to know why?
I'm assuming you agreed with many characteristics you enjoy the company of are not gender specific. If not, let me know.
I'm not really sure what part you aren't sure I am getting at, but I'll try to clarify.
I don't really see much of a difference in how men and women act in terms of good personality and good friendship. I don't understand the difference between boy/girlfriend and friends, other than sex. So I look for the same characteristics in both genders when I cast judgement on them. If I have a physical attraction to a person with the non gender specific characteristics I like, then that can have potential for a different type of friendship.
So I guess I'm curious if you see men and women differently in terms of having friendship qualities. Not that I'm saying you would want to be friends with the women, just that can you recognize those qualities in women in the same way you can recognize them in men. And how prevalent are the qualities in each gender.
I'm a girl obviously so I can't answer for guys... but I'm curious to know what you mean by "modern woman"... as opposed to what? Traditional women?
By pure definition, if women are "modern" aren't all men as well? Just sayin'
They are also modern and maybe men are worse but as you said, I'm a guy so I can't comment on the girls experiences.
Frankly I can't see the point of having them with men. I always earn more so they cost a fortune both during and then the split up, they don't do anything (inside or outside) and basically complicate my life. I've spent 13 years in long term relationships and its bloody hard work. I don't think its men or women... just that either way they're hard work and its not worth it at all stages of your life to put that effort in... sometimes you just want to be free and take it easy
What do you mean by: "I always earn more so they cost a fortune both during and then the split up, they don't do anything"?
I always end up paying for everything, dinners, rent etc. then you split up and they get part of my assets. They don't do any gardening/outside stuff or cooking/inside stuff. What's the point? I do all the work. i don't blame just women or men, I think it's just that people seem to want to coast in a relationship if they can, regardless of gender
How would you feel about dating a guy who earns less if:
1. He did most of the housework or
2. He signed something to say he won't take your money if you split.
It's not the money during, I couldn't make someone pay for things when they're struggling if I didn't need them to, it's just that they start taking it for granted. I guess if they offered to do housework in return that would be great and show some appreciation and a more even "put some effort in to thevrekationship" to be honest, it's never happened. Guys where I live blame money but I've said it doesn't take much to pick a flower from your garden for your partner on your way home. In reference to contracts, they're a bit flimsy, sometimes they hold up and sometimes they don't. Really it's about one partner, whoever you are, coasting through and not putting much effort in. I don't think it's gender specific, just a general trend towards laziness because you can always move on if it gets too hard.
I agree with you. Even marriage has turned into this weird, short term contract.
Relationship wit women is always worth it. And you know it.
Just you get dissapointed once or twice, does not mean we are all same.
Thats a contradicting statement.
Not necessarily. Obviously some women aren't worth it at all just like some guys aren't. What I'm asking is has the amount of women that are 'worth it' decreased and is it even worth going through all the others to find them.
I prefer an old fashioned women to be honest, as I am an old fashioned person, I guess modern women or rather ones that act with the times are rather exhausting as @justbanANNAz stated. It does not help that they have society bearing down on them to look, act a certain way and such.
As a woman who has given up a lot for a man. I would say that any relationships take work, from both sides.
Are they worth all that work these days?
I'm the same , except for the gender reversed , so as I'm doing all the work & sick of it , I will be dumping my soon to be ex wife , can't wait to be single again & stay that way !!
Some guys nowadays do not like committed relationship for several reasons, hard times, money, kids, etc they prefer the single fee life and like to have only one nitght stands friends with benefits becase theyknow those are not committed relationhip and theycan get away with it pretty easy.
Not really. I have never had a one night stand and prefer commited relationships.
I think that relationships, in general, tend to be heavily one sided. There are certain things that I expect from a man like holding open the doors for me, wanting to be with me and holding my hand. However, it seems as though the guys give and give and appear to expect nothing in return. I prefer my relationships to be on even grounds. Guys these days have to pay for the gas to come see us, the dates that we require them to take us on, our outings that we force them into, etc. And then, girls get upset when they can't afford to do those things anymore... Modern relationships suck, but... once you find the right one, it's the most beautiful thing in the world.
Completely agree. I like intelligent, sexy women not looking for a mother nor a housewife but finding a woman who gets that I don't want to be her doormat or 'provider' but rather her lover is near impossible.
Women do ask for more than they give, women simply have to be half decent looking to be attractive to most men , while women ask for a lot more. Women have a higher sexual worth than men (reproduction dynamics and risk of pregnancy make this so), thus women will require more intensive to be with a man. Is it worth it? fuck i i ask my self that question a lot, and i don't know.
As you can see "what choice do i have" is the most popular , the first one doesn't count because it is is just women voting for themselves at a high number. Most men don't have much choice, most of us will end up in a bitter resentful relationship.
Bottom line, women have far more choice, they are hypergamous, it far easier for them until they reach like 35
Of course women think they're worth the trouble, although the vast majority of men here seem to disagree. Modern women do kind of suck. Traditional women are the only ones worth marriage, but many men now are either too stupid or intimidated to find and court one.
Hay in a needlestack
This is stupid, we do not suck. The only thing that sucks is the amount of attitude and negativity in this comment...
Women now smoke too much, drink too much, and sleep around too much. Anything feminine is sexist and most of them dont how to act like a woman cause their mother was too focused on getting a paycheck.
What do women now have to offer that is worth marrying them for?
Equally... Do women want men in their lives? I get the impression they generally can't stand guys , maybe it's just the women I work with , a lot hate guys !! Yes there are more than enough dickhead guys & I'm sure as hell not perfect myself. Once I've sorted splitting from my soon to be ex wife... I can't see myself dating , I have nothing against women , but I will be happier solo , have little need for other people & I just want peace & quiet !!