Women should pursue men just as much as men pursue women — and maybe they already do

[Robertcw]

Who does the asking?

I was reading this: https://preengaged.com/guys-have-you-ever-asked-why-wont-she-pursue-me/

And I was generally displeased with what I read. Not because it has any sort of anti this or anti that, but simply because it seems logical to me to not delegate expressing interest to only one gender (and what about lesbians?!).

Personally, I have been asked out by women. I’ve actually been on more dates via that route than me doing the asking. The later rarely works for me.

It’s great. Obviously. It’s way easier and makes you pretty spoiled and lazy. So I can understand why people would want to have someone else do the pursuing. But here’s the thing.

Any time you remove the burden of doing the asking and risk and risk taking it makes you insensitive and unable to understand the perspective of someone on the other side. It might even give the false impression that the opposite perspective is equally as active as the other.

By this I mean this: if you are often asked to do things by interested members of your sexual preference it becomes an easy (though incorrect) leap to assume the ones doing the asking have as many options as the ones being asked at any given moment.

Balancing out the asking more evenly to a 50/50 ratio would make both sides more capable of understanding the others’ traditional experiences by virtue of literally being placed in another’s shoes by carrying out the actions of the foreign group.

It would also expedite the process — speeding up the weeding out of disinterested people, as well as more evenly distributing the rejections to more people. And, more evenly distributing the positive receptions and responses.

Win. Win.

This is somethine currently spoken of in feminist circles, and yeah I totally agree and think it’s a great thing.

I would love love to hear people’s thoughts on this. Doing the asking can be exhausting and fatiguing. Best to evenly spread the burden, MHO.

The opinion on insecurities and those doing the asking is probably also true, but that only matters if the latter argument of the man being the sole provider holds salt. And that’s another area where I see no logical reason for this to be exclusively so. Aside from the act of breastfeeding, there’s no reason women have to stay home with children.

Further, insecurities can be patched via positive life experiences, like, say, going on a great date and making love with someone you are attracted to not infrequently.

[Browneye57]

You're a weak-suck guy. Women loath that.
If you can't or won't lead, and be the man, she'll take over, but instantly lose respect for you. When she cheats or bails cuz she's bored to tears with you, you'll wonder just what the hell happened. You'll be left crying in your beer wondering what went wrong cuz you thought you did everything right.
No, women loath girlie-men.

[derek2017]

no you're an old fashioned guy!! just imagine girls coming to talk to you and want your D it would be awesome wouldn't it? it doesn't have to do with manliness, it has to do with more oppurtunities for guys and girls to have sex and relationships more often!!

[Browneye57]

@derek2017 - You'll see.

[Robertcw]

Really? A weak-suck guy? Piss off.

[Gothd011]

I believe you and you put my mind at ease a bit. the fact I prefer alpha males is probably why the rare occasion I do ask a guy out it seems to upset them more than flatter them. I am an alpha female myself and am learning to be less straight forward and keep myself. "softer". So they can lead N I have no problem following.

[Browneye57]

@Gothd011 - And there ya go. Asker is definitely weak-sauce. LOL

[Robertcw]

Smh.

[Robertcw]

by the way, as an editor did you select yourself as most helpful guy? What dick move.

[Browneye57]

You just keep whining don't you? Dear god. Newsflash sonny... I'm not an editor or a moderator. Go figure eh? The bottom line is that women are drawn to the strongest, richest, best looking guys, the ones that can LEAD, make decisions, and make things happen. You know, the dragon-slayers. If you can't or won't, she will, but she'll never properly respect you, she'll always think you never lived up to your ability, that you're weak and girlie-like. This does not bode well for a successful relationship, and soon she gets bored with your weakness, and seeks out stronger guys. If she gets the attention she desires elsewhere, she's highly likely to shut down sexually, cheat bail or any combination. And you'll be standing there wondering what the fuck happened. My crystal ball is almost uncanny!

[Robertcw]

Well I appreciate the advice you have based on life experience, and I know you’re not an idiot. I definitely didn’t pick your answer as best guy so I have no idea how that happened. But aside from that, this take isn’t about what women want — and that was the whole point. The point of the take was push women outside of their comfort zones and have them take more accountability and more evenly distribute he courting ritual. When I wrote this I didn’t care that some women don’t like doing it. That’s why I said that being asked out is easy and makes you lazy and spoiled. I’m trying to cause cultural shifts here, not work within tradition.

[Gothd011]

It not a question of traditions. It a primal thing. Look at how nature works. I understand we have ways to expand the band a little bit. we no longer have to run around barefoot and live in huts. The basics still stand. If anything ignoring this is probably why the world is so confused. Honestly, dating should not be this hard. We don't need pigeons to send messages and love letters anymore. This is the most connected we have ever been yet we are the most disconnected. it almost as if we are dying out as a human race. Yes, evolution is happening every day. But. a woman need to feel safe in some form. A man should want and have the need to do that.

[Browneye57]

Okay. But you're changing nothing. I guarantee it. Consider dealing in REALITY and not some pipe-dream goofball hairbrain fantasy you make up. And while you dont' want to talk about what women want - that is EXACTLY what motivates them - WHAT THEY WANT. If a woman wants to get with a guy she'll break every rule in the book to get to him. If she doesn't she'll make up a new rule every day why she can't. Quit hoping some hot chick is gonna come after you - it just ain't happening. Work on being awesome, up your game, your looks, your pocketbook, and you'll gain the necessary confidence through the effort. You'll have all the pussy you can handle, I guarantee it.

[Robertcw]

That’s not what this is about, but okay. I never said I struggled especially stringently. I have struggled with mental health issues in the past due to my childhood, but that was separate from ample opportunity. This is about changing traditional values. You say I won’t change anything, and some people believe it’s all biological — but I don’t buy that. I do believe testosterone makes it easier to find motivation to pursue people, but it isn’t the only way to motivate people. This was written only to voice my opinion which is critical about the customs of men being the sole approacher. @Gothdo11 What exactly do you need protection from? Do you live around bloodthirsty gangs? Wild bears? I walk down the street and see sidewalks and birds. In any case, even if you did need protection, why would a woman doing some initiating imply that someone else was weak? I don’t see how one gets from here to there.

[Robertcw]

@Gothd011 *

[Browneye57]

Up your game, your looks, and your wallet. They'll come knocking. DAMHIK. :)

[Gothd011]

@Robertcw You miss the whole point. And to say that biology has nothing to do with how males and females think just speaks volumes. We are very different in the way we think. It was not some freak accident. It 2019 and yet their sites like G@G for a reason. Woman reading those stupid love advice books. Men trying to change approaches or XYZ. that "safe" part is more of like steadiness. a steady person a strong person. Do I look like the type who need someone to save me? No im perfectly ok speaking and defending myself. My father didn't raise an airhead. I also so have a strong idea of what Im looking for in a partner. I like alpha males. It fits my strong personality. So yes a man who takes the risks of approaching me would have a better chance with me and if nothing else they earn my respect. Anyone who self-assurance and confidence do not worry about rejections. Rejections are just part of life struggles. On the flip side I have no problem approaching the man but seriously most guys find it off-putting. Sound like you just want to sit and see who comes by. Nothing good coming from waiting or sitting. Women do purse guys. we just do it differently... either your sense is on point or you miss them.

[Browneye57]

@Gothd011 - Another one that gets it. Bravo!!

[Robertcw]

She’s the same girl as before man — lol. I am still surprised you’re both taking this take to be about me personally, as if it’s about me wanting advice or what I want to happen to myself. This take is directed at everyone as food for thought — nothing more than that. I can’t make it any clearer.

[Browneye57]

You wouldn't be writing it if it wasn't your personal opinion. Changes nothing. Hopefully you'll get it, we surely hope so. If you want a great gal then ya gotta go for it.

[spacedanty]

this is kinda stupid, its true to some extend but some women like to be dominated, some like to dominate and some like it in the middle. if you think that a woman who likes leading/dominant men would not cheat, you are fooling your self man, its all about character and some women are hoes. Women don't initiate because we say that its the man that should do it even though every person would have the same feeling when approaching someone they don't know.

[Texaskid1]

I would say that woman do pursue men they just do it differently than man do. Woman will always leave themselves open to a guy that they are attracted to. Long term the man will still need to lead. But I have seen many a female flirt with a guy that they are into. A lot of men say woman don't purse guys but I think they do. A woman's communication style differs from ours. But is you are observant you can see how a woman will treat a guy that she is into vs a man that she is not attracted to. That woman who is smiling at the guy, batting her eyes , messing with her hair and asking the guy a lot of personal questions is - lo and behold - pursuing him. I can see where RobertCW ( the original asker) is coming from. He is from a different generation. I wonder if this whole #metoo thing and it's obsession with finding rape under every rock has something to do with why many young men are not approaching woman they way that they used to back in the day. I remember watching an uncle of mine - an old school type - just get a girl's number like it was no big deal. He showed me how it was done. It was a different time and a different culture. I have heard of young college men being advised to not approach woman on campus , to not be alone with them in room ; much of this stems from a fear of being falsely accused of rape or sexual harassment. Have you seen how campuses treat these young fellows who are accused? Guilty until proven innocent!!! If I were a young lad raised in this culture I would probably have the same line of thinking : "To hell with it , if she wants me let her come to me. I don't need the false rape accusation"

[Browneye57]

@Texaskid1 - here here! Bravo, you get it.

[Silent_Bob]

Spoken like a true caveman.

[Browneye57]

@Silent_Bob - Cave man to you, traditionalist and highly successful MAN to me. Eat shit.

[derek2017]

@Browneye57 nope you're still a caveman! and personally i think women are weak, because of all these feministic bs we should expect them to be strong and shit! well im not buying it and i will always look at them as weaklings!! If they were indeed strong they could come talk to a guy and not do all of these bullshit signals that we are supposed to notice somehow!! Like if i looked at a girls direction for one or 2 times she would instantly understand that i like her!!(im being sarcastic). So until you (women) come and talk to me dont expect me to let you do anything by yourself or treat you like my equal, you're not my equal!! If you were you wouldn't run from things like talking to someone or admiting that you're wrong!!

[derek2017]

@Texaskid1 but i agree with this guy

[Jean-Marie_Céline]

Fascinating myTake.
My girlfriend was actually the one doing the pursuing, and I can see how it's empowering.

[Robertcw]

Thanks man!

[MzAsh]

If doing the asking is exhausting to you, then you aren't that into the girls you are asking. Women want to be pursued by men who are happily willing to ask them without being fatigued. I mean, geez if asking a girl out wears you out then you need to work on your stamina.

[Robertcw]

🤔. Lol. Why not just help a guy out and lighten the load a little bit? Lol.

[MzAsh]

That’s when women are supposed to signal interest. It kinda seems you just aren’t up for the task. Women will think you are either not interested enough, lazy, or too much anxiety.

[Robertcw]

I encourage you to try it if it’s so easy. When you give it a go then get back to me. I probably have all three. Anxiety, yes for sure. Lazy, yeah a little bit. Not interested enough? 🤔. Good point. You’d think that if you really wanted something deep down you’d find a way. That’s probably right. But here’s the run down. There exists only a very very tiny minority of women on this earth that I would dedicate that much time and energy too and not care about the outcome either way because I was just soo into them. I can count the number on my fingers. I won’t go through all that for someone I just meet in the gym, say, and want to flirt with. Nor should I think anyone go through great lengths in similar situations. It’s a bit unrealistic or unreasonable.

[MzAsh]

I used to ask guys out when I was in high school because otherwise I was quiet, a bit nerdy, and unnoticed. So I had to. But guys quickly got bored and wanted to go after the hard to get girls. Something men unfortunately never grow out of.

[Robertcw]

I see. I now understand where you are coming from. I apologize if I came across as crude and insensitive in the beginning. I think it’s hard to generalize what all ‘men’ want just like it’s hard to generalize what all ‘women’ want. I think it’s a little silly to expect a 100% acceptance rate from approaching a person though. I think this is where many girls get hung up on this concept — which isn’t too surprising since they don’t really do it a lot. Teenage boys think this way too. “Why didn’t they want ‘me’?” ‘The other guy didn’t even do anything.’ I think the answer is they were never interested in the first place. Really. What I’m hearing on here is an almost suffocating fear of rejection from girls if they are doing the asking. Less so if they aren’t doing the asking. And they seem to be more hurt by the actual rejection. Maybe they feel things more deeply or maybe the way they are raised culturally by family and society makes things like rejection more painful and amplified than guys who might be taught to suppress negative emotions and ignore them until they go away. If so, then this highlights and even further reason we should have both genders do asking. Because this then highlights and very unhealthy phenomena of hiding negative emotion. And having other people think there’s nothing wrong in the first place. That also makes sense. If you are passive, then rejection comes at no loss of time or effort. If you are doing the asking, then rejection hurts more because you put more effort into it and actually tried your best and got your hopes up and then got them thrown down. This is why I think it’s so important for both genders to take part in both asking and being asked. I think you’re making the assumption that the experience of being asked is the same as the experience of asking — just as long as the genders doing the correct roles are the right ones. But that’s just not true.

[Browneye57]

Dude, ya got way too many feelings there. This is the realm of WOMAN. Study stoicism and get to 'outcome independence'. You can google the terms. "I think it’s hard to generalize what all ‘men’ want just like it’s hard to generalize what all ‘women’ want. " Uh, no, people are very predictable, and generally more similar than different. Sure, there will always be exceptions, but it's folly to focus on those instead of the norms. For women there's even a acro - AWALT = all women are like that. And when they whine about it, NAWALT = not all women are like that. But really they are. LOL

[Robertcw]

@Browneye57 I sure we’ll agree on this. I don’t disagree. However, that’s just my personality man. It’s been consistent since as far back as I can remember from childhood until now. What doesn’t make sense to me is if hormones dictate behavior, then how could this be? I have all the physical markers of high prenatal testosterone exposure, including a ring finger longer than my index finger, a shoulder to waist ratio of about 0.65, the ability to put on lean muscle very quickly and easily if I start going into the gym, I don’t gain much body fat despite eating whatever I want whenever I want to. I’ve certainly never had a large gut or waistline. I was also a pretty successful varsity sprinter in high school track and field. I don’t really get it. Maybe I’m autistic and have an XXY chromosome pattern? I wouldn’t know if I was infertile at all. I don’t think my testicles are small, but not a whole lot of people have seen them either. But on the other hand I don’t have breast growth at all, and I am definitely hairy. An I’m not absurdly taller than average. So maybe that’s out of the question as well? Maybe I have both high testosterone and high estrogen? Is that even possible? Or maybe I am XXY, but have an abnormally robust endocrine system? Could insulin issues affect estrogen production? Diabetes runs in my family. I never get sick so I haven’t been to a doctor in years. Maybe I should get bloodwork done I check for type 2 diabetes. I have an uncle who got that in his 20’s when he was younger. You know, the more I think about this the more I think I should get my blood sugar and insulin levels checked. Especially since my metabolism is so fast I just whatever the hell I want.

[Robertcw]

So after doing more reading I think this is actually pretty applicable to myself: news.utexas.edu/.../

I get poor sleep and have high chronic stress. I grew up in a rough family and household and was under constant anxiety and pressure each day and night. I never really outgrew it.

[Robertcw]

Honestly think I’m on to something. Looks like these results have been replicated: www.forbes.com/.../#1d192ca57dbb

And describe my behavior pretty well.

[Silent_Bob]

Or maybe he's like me, he wants to make sure he's only devoting his energy on someone who wants the attention, and anyone who doesn't is a waste of energy, and when there are too many unknown variables, it's hard to really know how much to commit.

[Meoir34]

I agree with you there, i feel like often men need more encouragement because they fear rejection more than women do. I wish I could take the courage and ask guys out who I've wanted to in the past...

[dantetheexplorer]

Although I think courtship and dating should be a mutual and collaborative dance, rather than a blatant performance of one person "chasing" after another, I am amused when some women mention "because women should be women and men should be men."

I mean, if we're going down the "that's the way it's always been done" route, why don't women curtsy anymore?

"That's the way it's always been done" is never a good reason to do anything. If it was, humanity would never have made it to the moon.

[katkittie55]

No I want men to pursue me. I will pursue women I like though.

[derek2017]

lol what?

[tearout]

@derek2017 she is stupid don't worry about her she is damaged no point

[katkittie55]

@tearout Sounds like somebody is offended by... something?

[Robertcw]

Guys she was just responding to the question in my take “(What about lesbians?)” She might enjoy being with both women and men, which is fine.

[Mimouta]

He is a man with a fake account look at his profile pic

[RussianNestingDoll]

I wish it were that easy and your idea makes sense. However, it goes against the laws of nature. That doesn’t mean women can’t flirt overtly with guys, ask them to dance and that sort of thing. I’ve had guys stare admiringly at me. I’d catch them and ask them out. Then they’d got scared that I caught them because they’re married. Guys look at women all the time because it’s their nature but If they don’t ask me out after I flirted back, then there is some reason. I’m a flirt and I’m obvious but I don’t go ham like that anymore.

[Monster_Recluse]

You cannot ask the entire female population to fight against their nature just because you do not have the courage to start your engine.

[derek2017]

its not their nature!! stop talking about nature it has nothing to do with this!! and yes you can ask the entire female population to ask men out, i didn't ask girls out because its my nature i did it because girls wouldn't do that, although i had some girls ask me out through notes and subliminal signals that to me are bullshit!! look they shouldn't expect everything from us and im not about to ruin my self esteem again just to get a girlfriend i would prefer to keep myself instead of some whinny bitches that dont even deserve the effort!!! its time they start to know how that feels like cause my dick deserves more than your used up vagina!!!

[SoulfullWanderer]

No. Men need to grow up and start pursuing women again. Likewise, women need to act like ladies and let them.

[Robertcw]

Respectfully I see no reason to say this besides following tradition. It sounds stupid.

[Browneye57]

Here here!!! A young woman that GETS it!!! Bravo.

[Turkishkurd]

I have asked guys for dates.

[dy8alexUk]

Women are more forward nowadays I am sure there are lots of women out there with fatal attraction to men or nymphamaniacs who can never feel satisfied ever. i have met quite a few since I have been single hope to meet more

[Gedaria]

They already do and good at getting the guy to think they are doing the chasing !!!

[Anonymous]

It's evolution & biology. This is the case for many mammals, including humans

[Anonymous]

In Western society women should not only start approaching, but they should do 100% of the approaching because the laws are so misandrist that a guy can be charged with sexual harassment just for flirting with a girl

[derek2017]

yep you're 100% right my friend

[Anonymous]

Yes, women should pursue men more. If they are interested in a guy they should take the initiative and actually ask him out, the way guys do. But unfortunately most see it the way @RussianNestingDoll does. They think if they have experiences where guys don't respond positively it means they just shouldn't do it. But what they don't get is that guys experience exactly the same thing from girls when they approach and ask them out. It usually comes down to this dumb idea about the "laws of nature", which is just bullshit. Plus they are insecure and don't like rejection just like guys).

The bottom line is women don't approach men because they don't have to.

[derek2017]

oh my god thats what i told her!!

[Anonymous]

I wish women would pursue men more often but women are just not visual enough to do pursuing.