Why do many guys think they are entitled to effortless sex from women?

[Anonymous]

I notice on here that many guys will act quickly to call a woman “prostitute” or “golddigger” simply because she wants to be courted, taken out to fancy dinners, before having sex.

Obviously there are women who hook up even with men who disrespect them and hit them. So saying that there are women who have sex without expecting anything in return isn’t a valid argument.

To me, a man who chooses the “freeway” shows that he doesn’t value me enough to care to impress me. That in itself is a turnoff whether I am looking for something serious or not.

Again, Why is it wrong for women to expect to be treated generously before hooking up, but not for men to expect sex for nothing?

[Douma]

Ver well said. We live in a world where some woman pretend to know it better then other woman so man will only look at them and they have all the benefits. I did a test but man really do not mind see a woman alone or suffering or prepare her own roof at all.
Man brag about all they have even a woman has nothing.
Man are selfish and only want benefits and to have it easy with woman and they find plenty easy woman. So they bring water to the sea where is plenty water already and still they think they are social. They are not and never will be.
They for sure want only benefits.
Man want no love and hate romance and hate romantic woman and call them materialistic while they choose woman from the left wing also.
So man are boring. They have political relationsships and need propaganda and join a secret society and think they are special while they are not and never will be and they destroyed all countries but claim they made the countries and deserve credit so it is a political issue for all people who talk that way and they like political benefits while the government ignores who needs help the most and even bully and mock and discriminate those people who stand no chance in society ever. so government is all about money and benefits not for the good of all human beings at all and it is one market business and they are sadists and have joy in hurting peoples feelings and bully them and higher people to do that and those people who they attack this way do not imagine this but to whom do they go and talk about it in our society where is no place for them to go. So in a way the government secret like to get rid of those people and where must they go , they are for sure not welcome and nobody was happy when they were born at all.
Benefits always go to the same people.
They have the warrenty over all people to say their opinion and yours is never heard. The unmarried people are vulnarable. So those who marry do that for power to look good and get credit. But that by itself is prove they are not good at all because otherwise we would not live in devision and seperation where some get help and others by the same get attacked what is not sociay to do at all. It is almost if the commercial says to marry a criminal is the best because they do unjust to many people and get a high status in society with the votes of all criminals. Perhaps the land is called criminal country in reality. With a criminal flag and a criminal hymn. It is time we look it up just in case you nev

[Douma]

You never know.

[Meninist]

This male bashing is pretty tiresome. That’s fine if you don’t like men, just stay single forever. Thanks!

[Douma]

@Meninist No problem. Thanks. Ever seen a man with a dig?

[Meninist]

With a dog, do you mean?

[i_love_stars]

I cannot comprehend what that means. Would you please care to summarily explain what it is, please?

[Paul09]

We are all humans and think differently. But yeah bashing all men, and being sexist is not a good look for you. There's good people and bad people. Some ate self centered, and some are not.

[Bert-7]

The question was about men not willing to pay for women anymore and we ended up in Nations politics.. lol

[Asker]

Look at all these lazy, entitled guys getting mad lol.

[Berethor]

"Entitled men", said the woman who think that men should pay for her fancy dinners. :)

[Paul09]

So you are basically a huge hypocrite. You tell people to not do things, yet you are doing it yourself? If you are sour like this, life is gonna suck for you.

[Papavera]

Lol. Love the guys answering 'women are just gold diggers'. Or, 'feminism'.
My dear men.
What exactly are you saying? That sex is the only thing a woman has to offer? Or maybe, the only thing that you care about, when you're with a woman?
I see how the asker's question might have sound wrong, mostly 'taken to fancy dinners' part, but I think she's got the point. Most of you decided to focus only on that part, but completely dismissed the 'courting' part.
If you want sex, make her want sex. What is wrong with dedicating your time to someone, meeting a person, before you ask for sex.
No, she does not owe you sex if you take her out for a dinner. If you want to pay for sex, hire a hooker and call the situation by its real name. That's not what dating is.
'I paid for dinner so it means we'll have sex' translates to 'I didn't invite you for dinner because I like talking to you or because I like your company, but only because I want to fuck you.'
Hell yeah, if he wants sex, he has to impress me.

[Chaz269]

By the same token, if she wants to be with me, she can buy me gifts and pay my way for a night out or ten. You think dating is only about men impressing women? Haha! Impress me! Show me ANYTHING that every other gold-digging whore hasn't already offered. You really think you're special? Give me one example of something wholly unique and entirely extraordinary that you've done for a man, that no other woman has ever done before you.

[Chaz269]

Hahahahaha!

[Papavera]

@Chaz269 Are you kidding? Where in my answer did you read women should do nothing to impress men?

[Papavera]

You're really just turnign aside my words the way you like it. It's pathetic.

[Papavera]

Women waiting for gifts and entertainment... lol. Entertainment should be both sided, why would you date her if you're not having fun with her. And gifts... really, you men, at least here on g@g, because I haven't experienced it irl, have very unhealthy view on women and what do they want.

[Papavera]

@Chaz269

[Chaz269]

I don't need to turn your words aside. You haven't made a relevant point yet. You're just another selfish female who has a lot to say about what men ought to do but says NOTHING about what women ought to do.

[Papavera]

Don't make me laugh... I don't have to justify every 'I want him to' with 'In return I will'. Which doesn't mean I don't do it irl.

[Papavera]

All my points are relevant. Only you refuse to see it, because you'd rather believe that women are selfish bitches than maybe you could be the one doign something wrong too.

[Markfish]

If she wants to be courted, she better make me want to court her.

[Papavera]

@Markfish Or maybe they should bith just impress each other at the same time without thinking if the other person started courting earlier. Seems reasonable to me.

[Markfish]

Meh, although I say that, women don't really have to impress a man. She just musn't have this mindset where I have to earn her and pay for things, that's enough.

[Asker]

People who have higher standards will be l respected. Guys who think they’re entitled to women can go find another chump girl with low self esteem who will give it up without expecting effort on his part. I’m sorry but, it’s not my fault for having higher standards. This is exactly why many men don’t respect women.

[AwesomeCookie]

Girl friend, it's all relative to expectations. I believe the word you are looking for is called "courting". Women and men both should be courted by their admirers. Set your expectations for a man to spoil you, and don't step down cause he won't. Want to be placed on a pedestal and worshipped , then so be it. Just understand that when expectations are high, expect to be disappointed many times over... but having high expectations as such will weed out the men who don't fit your criteria. Believe me, he ain't keeping you for the long haul if you're giving it up even for an expensive meal. There's gotta be more to you for him to want to spend the big bucks anyhow.

[Asker]

I agree sister. I am glad you understand that there's no ill will in expecting to be courted.

[jrallen175]

Well I hope you'll put the time, effort, and money in courting also if a guy crosses your path. Not likely to make it very far otherwise.

[Asker]

@jrallen175 courting is a guy’s job. If he wants to get the prized possession, he needs to work for it.

[jrallen175]

That's bullshit. Women are not possessions and of a girl wants a guy she should do done courting too.

[Xoxocutekitty]

Its not wrong for you to want to be treated a, certain way before hooking up. Your body your rules. However, don't complain if the guy you like, would rather hook up with someone else who has "lower standards" or is just lower maintenance. That kind of girl is less likely to feel disrespected in a relationship over the small things. There will be fewer, "but you used to treat me this way" fights, and more time, appreciating each other. There are guys willing to treat you how you want, but you're going to repel many who, are just looking to have fun, and then get to know, you.

[LoloWaye]

That just means he isn't the guy for her. There's no reason to lower standards for a situation you don't want just to be with someone.

[LoloWaye]

I did the whole hooking up thing and those guys did not respect my body, time or feelings. So I can see why OP would rather someone get to know her first.

[Mr___A]

First of all, The opinion i'm gonna give is not precisely mine. It is a reflexive one.
I'm a gentleman, but not one of those you imagine.

First, women want sex equality AND gentlemen? nonsense. Sex equality is the END of gentlemen. In sex equality, consider you are socially equal to men, in seduction too, then. Those women want too much, i think.

Then, some (in there) consider that " a pussy must be earned with a long seductive period". And thy think they are gentlemen? Your are just saying 'I got for hunting pussies, and sex is my trophy". Classy! I desagree.

Some (in there again), consider that a women respect herself only IF she makes it hard to get in her pants, and the other (the "easy ones", brrrrr) are just sluts. What kind of prehistoric judgment it is? If find very rude and vulgar. You are nobody to teach a women (or a men) if she respect herself or not. Begin with respecting others, and then look if they respect theirselves.
Women that respect therselves KNOWS what they want, and what they need, better that anybody else. Let them in peace. If she want sex on the first date, it is her pleasure, not yours. Respecting yourself isn't about respecting social beliefs (unfounded, in addition). Believe what you want, it is ok, but don't judge anybody.

"So saying that there are women who have sex without expecting anything in return isn’t a valid argument"
I disagree. It is completely valid. Yes some women bow before the desire of men that don't respect her. But don't say that as they were the only ones that have sex on the first date. It is a false short cut i think.
Many girls love sex, and don't want to wait any longer, just because they desire a man.
And some men bow before the sexless relation their partner force them to have. the woman is disrespectful then. And some women bow before the sexless relation their parner forces them to have... The man is disrespectful. Don't just watch at that situations you prefer. Look at all of them. Things are more complex and interesting...

I would say to answer : It's ok for me, that some women want to be seduced before sex. But it has not to be a social rule. Only a matter of personnal taste. I don't fly away before them. As much as it is okay for women that want to have sex on the first date.

[Mr___A]

But, we are talking about men+women. And THAT is the problem... What about women+women? If lesbian have sex on the first date (and I know some that do), who is disrespectful of the other? Woman or woman? Nobody. It is NOT a matter of men and women, but knowing what you want, and trying to reach it.

[TheUglyMan]

I think you have a good understanding of the power women possess.

But you must understand how vigilant a man is to the type of men women go for.

If a man trys to act nice and respectful and do all these dates and stuff. And try court a women and it constantly leads to nothing (we've all been there brothers).

While the fuck boys in the night clubs and the buff guys in the gym get chicks for being pricks. And being absolutely nothing. Dudes notice this and it has some sort effect on them.

The man will notice this pattern and will eventually not see the point of courting a women because they throw themselves to other guys so easily for not courting. Guys will do what's effective and what works. Also it depends on what the guy wants.
Why court constantly if there's no point? Just another investment (financially and emotionally) down the toilet.

The sense of entitlement can come also low key from jealousy and frustration. By seeing thre fuckboys and buff guys in the gym get chicks so easily. While you put in so much effort can get to persons head.

That's just what I think.

[Asker]

No one is entitled to anything. Feeling entitled is a whole different story. Women who go on a date knowing that it isn't going to lead anywhere before it started are definitely deceiving, gold diggers. Unfortunately, there are chicks like that in this world. However, not all girls are like that. You should be able to tell what type of woman you're dealing with by observing her actions.

[TheUglyMan]

Most women are master's at lying, hiding shit and manipulation (especially emotionaly) So it will be hard for a man to tell the type if chick she is. And also what's wrong with being a gold digger? I'm not really the type of guy to shame women for being gold diggers. I don't see why not as long as they straight up. If women are using a beta man to be courted and pampered and to get free shit. And uses the alpha fuck boys in the night clubs to suit her sexual desires that's fine. I just want you to understand why a man might get the sense of entitlement. And how some what the hook up culture has effected male dating tactics in this day and age. And why courting isn't as an attractive way of getting with women to men than it used to be.

[Asker]

Golddiggers are deceiving. They are essentially prostitutes. I don't have anything against them as long as they use protection and don't spread STD's. However, it does bother me that people equate having high standards and not sleeping with just any guy who thinks he's entitled to it to prostitution. A prosititute's primary objective is to have sex only to extract money from someone. My primary objective is to have sex with someone who deserves it and works hard to get it. In essence, a guy who doesn't think he's entitled to it. Because there are many girls out there with low-self esteem who just give it up for free, men assume that every woman is supposed to be like that.

[Berethor]

Low-self esteem, because they don't jump at 55 years old man who offer payment? like you?

[TheUglyMan]

I see i guess it depends on the women in the end

[TrueCelt]

Hm... well. I think you need to look towards feminism. Because, if I buy you a bunch of really nice things and treat you generously, unfortunately, that's not equality. I'd like to have nice things bought for me, instead, or as well. You've got equality. Now live with it.

[Rainlovella]

Both sides are in the wrong

[djmzes]

U r entitled to sex only from ur wife...
Simple as that
If your wife refuses to, it will break ur marriage and God did not put that desire in women as strong as men... so women do not try to understand you will never understand why.

[lastchancemotel]

I don't know. I believe it should be even both ways and look for a woman who believes the same. I'm out to find a partner, not just a nother lay.

[mattLB1993]

Because they are uneducated In the way of proper sexual attraction. Sex is more than just the act, it's mental and physical simulation that so many men don't understand. How to set the mood, setting up the right scene and atmosphere to help ease nerves and provide the right place and time. Some men don't even understand the value of even maintaining basic hygiene so that they are more appealing. It's a lack of understanding and knowledge that's why they feel rejected and call names

[Paul09]

Wrong subject, and wrong gender... 😑

[babylips14]

OP, Do you practice courtship?

[sugarchateau]

This isn’t girls versus guys.
Girls read too much into things and guys don’t read enough into it.
Ultimately, there are going to be personalities where some people expect certain things on both sides. The part where most are having an issue is communicating that we are all struggling with basically the same shit just opposite genders.

People who want sex will want sex, people who want to spoil will spoil, people who are materialistic will be materialistic..

[Quentin_]

Well said 🙏

[i_love_stars]

Reminds me of "Nobody exists on purpose, nobody belongs anywhere, everybody's going to die. Come watch T. V"

[Asker]

People who want higher standards will be Moreno respected. Guys who think they’re entitled can go find another chump girl with low self esteem who will give it up without expecting effort on his part. I’m sorry but, it’s not my fault for having higher standards. This is exactly why many men don’t respect women.

[Berethor]

Give it up without expecting payment, because she might actually want him for what he is.

[sugarchateau]

No one is asking you to lower your standards. Now, in this moment of me seeing you responding as if you feel threatened and upset could make me think you are just an angry and thoughtless person. I could just sum up your entire being based off this one experience with you, because this is my only personal experience with you. But here's the thing about all humans, male and female... We don't know everything, especially not the entire life story of someone else. And people are allowed to express and share many feelings. We are in no place to judge, even if we have our "high standards". It doesn't make you any less susceptible to what everyone else experiences. It just makes your priorities different. Moral of the story, the side you see within a moment that a person vulnerably exposes... is not the entire picture. Stop assuming. I won't assume that you're a closed-minded and, instead, remember that you are just as human as everyone else. Not capable of reaching perfection.

[sugarchateau]

@Berethor Yes, some people just want what they want. There is definitely a difference between priorities and desire.

[babylips14]

It's wrong to judge people just because they share a different perspective. Reasonable minds can differ. You should say the same to the people trying to discredit the asker on every single comment and calling her different names.

[MargaritaPeach]

Sex for nothing? There is only one thing that men OR women should be 'getting' from sex: pleasure. And if it's not as pleasurable for you as it is for him, try something new. So he isn't benefiting from sex any more than you are. You're BOTH getting lucky. Equally lucky.

[rahul_24]

Straight to the point. Well put

[Unit1]

Women like you give me hope after reading a question like hers 😌

[Asker]

If a man wants that pleasure, he needs to work for it. Otherwise, he thinks he’s entitled to it. Of course, I et pleasure out of sex. However, I know what my worth is and I’m not going to give it up to any random guy knowing how hard it is for many guys to find it :)

[Asker]

You decided to focus only on that part, but completely dismissed the "courting" part. Why is it okay for men to expect free, effortless sex and not for the woman to expect courtship and effort from the guy? Give me one good reason why I should give it up to any man who walks up to me and says, "let's fuck". Come on, I'll wait.

[FMJ_Guy]

Who ever said it was wrong for you not to expect to be respected, and treated well?
If a woman posts, here, complaining that guys just 'used' her, I am not just assuming the guys were punks, but maybe she was too willing, and didn't consider that he might be a d-bag user!!
Women have a responsibility to themselves, their bodies, and it is just CRAP, if she hooks up with someone that is a user, a loser, and then complains, later, because she just chose a bad guy because she was drunk, or just made a bad choice!!
I don't think that most guys assume that they are 'entitled' to sex, and now, more than ever, I think many of us are afraid to connect, with the 'MeToo' thing, and the 'harassment' things, in the news!!
Who needs that?
I think all those things, now, make most guys want to just watch porn, and not even take a chance of being charged with something!!
Once you get charged, as a guy, it follows you FOREVER, and destroys your life, even when you didn't do it!!!

[Asker]

Do you believe in courtship?

[Tdieseler]

Why do many women think they are entitled to be "courted" first before sex? We don't have to. I certainly don't. But we can always make an agreement according tot he 90-10 theory.

You want your courting, i want my sex. we shake on it.. we do it.

by the way... no man expects sex for nothing, and i believe i speak for all men here when i say that we are giving, from the moment we approach, to the moment we die because we have had enough of you.

Its because you women don't give jack shit but what you want to... thats why you don't see it. You think it doesn't take time and effort to plan the "courting" you want? and maybe money? when we could use that money on a video game, and some shoes, and take the time and effort to play it or try em on. And you think its all nothing? You try having sex in exchange for courting then... how bout that.

[hasrett]

I literally opened this topic only to see if you left a comment here.

[silverqueen]

^ Lmfao!!!

[Tdieseler]

@hasrett are you talking about me? like you clicked on it just to see if i said something? if you did... im blushing.. if you didn't.. im STILL blushing... i got 12 male up votes... girls GOTTA be hating this comment. ... ugh... damn...7 of them hate it. whoo-hooo.. means i am going the right direction lol. Thanks for the mention hasrett

[Asker]

And you think preparing for date doesn't take time and effort on our part? You do realize how much money women spend on hair, make up, nails, nice outfits, and jewelry, just to make a good impression, right? Just to look attractive to you. Of course, you don't see it that way because you guys only think about yourselves. You don't think about the efforts women in general have to make from buying tampons to other kinds of grooming. Just throwing in my $0.02.

[Tdieseler]

Do you realize how much of a shit we don't give? that was what i said in my original opinion before being attacked. Guys Don't Give A Shit. As long as you don't look like a homeless hobo with tattered clothes... we are good. we want you, not what you wear (hahahaha we want you naked... ok.. ok.. joke... joke) but who you are. and that is how we pick who we wanna be with. not by the size of your nails... the bulge of your "clutch", the sparkle of your glitter... we don't give a shit... we want a bad ass bitch who will get into it for us... that way we become bad ass men who will stop her... because "we got this"... its a simple equation. Read my Takes... every time i mention some moron who is all made up, i tell my fellow guys to run... im boycotting the whore business. increasing the spiritual... and maybe physical.

[Asker]

My apologies. I misunderstood your opinion to be that women don't put effort on their part.

[Tdieseler]

Do they? The way i see it, they have a choice... its the impresSor (the male) that doesn't have any. and im revolutionizing that. because guys spend time too even before the female knows she's the target. if you mean effort like she picks a good dress, pulls out her best make up... etc.. that ain't SHIT compared to what guys do. and that is why guys like me... we don't care anymore. Do you want me to tell you stories of how many girls that i went to bed with and they looked like Cinderella... and i woke up to them looking like an Ogre cuz the makeup wore off? my theory is.. let your partner see you at your worst... and if s/he loves you like that, when you apply the extra shit, just makes your love hotter. because it means they accept YOU.. not what YOU look Like.

[vishna]

Hmmm I don't hook up, so, I can't speak on that.
But as a woman in a relationship, I think I don't understand how guys think just because they're hard that means I'm turned on.
It's much better when the time is taken to get a person really turned on.
If I'm already in the mood, no biggie, things can go faster.
But I don't understand how some guys think I'm ready for sex when 5 minutes ago it was the last thing on my mind.

[devilman666]

I believe this boils down to biology. The male brain is developed to allow for sex whenever the female is ovulating. Males tend to be turned on easier, which is also why their bodies have to produce so much semen all the time, to be prepared for reproduction at any time a female is ready and waiting.

[vishna]

@devilman666 I know but it's like wouldn't guys understand (beyond the virgin/no experience phase)? I've had bfs get upset I'm not dtf after 5 minutes of 'foreplay' it's just weird. I dunno why I was downvoted? If anything it's a tip...

[Markfish]

Shows you aren't sexually attracted to the male body.

[vishna]

@Markfish You just pulled that out of the air. I'm attracted to male bodies : p Give me Jason Mamoa on a platter any day yasss

[Markfish]

If you where sexually attracted by the male body, you should be ready for sex by looking at a naked guy in front of you.

[vishna]

@Markfish trolllllolololol

[Markfish]

Not trolling at all

[crazy8000]

That's actually part wise right and not trolling. But this isn't popular to talk about because of society bios and female stigma. Some people doesn't get atracted of just seeing a naked body. or for that matter of that person's body they are looking at. Also you can see on a female body if she is horny in more ways than a male body if you know what to look for.

[Markfish]

What are you trying to say?

[devilman666]

As a demisexual male, I'd like to point out that sexual attraction can be based off of much more than just physical attraction, for me physical attraction plays almost no part in it. Demisexual means I feel ne sexual attraction for anyone without first having romantic feelings about the person, it's part of the asexual spectrum.

[VIVANT]

I don’t know why if you both want srx why he is supposed to impress you for both of you to have to sex. YOU want sex don’t you? If you don’t want sex don’t hve it but if you do then you are getting what you want so why are you supposed to get dinner out if it?

When you add treats into the mix it’s like he’s bribing srx out if you... You either want sex or you don’t.

This is part of the idea women put out for a price... you’re not putting out or giving it up or giving in... you either want srx or you don’t. You’re not needing him to prove your value to yourself do you can have sex. You want it or you don’t.

Women who “give it up for free” probably actually want sex and are not using it to make themselves feel valued.

Are you having sex bc you want sex or are you bartering your body for other goods?

Or are you talking about dating? Bc you only mentioned sex it sounded like hooking up after dinner.

If it’s datujg well doesn’t it go both ways?

[backdoorman]

Yes, a woman who gets it! Thank you! Are there any more women like you?

[Unit1]

Women like you give me hope after reading a question like hers 😌 @backdoorman I saw a few others here. They are on their way to become unicorns if they aren't already 🦄🦄🦄 That's what "dating" has turned into. You'll have to find your unicorn in a crowd of people.

[Silver158]

she gets it. Unfortunately a lot of women today seem to think that just because they have a vagina that men should worship them and give them free shit in exchange for having sex with them.

[Unit1]

@Silver158 Those are not the type of girls you would like to have anything long term with anyway. Press the red eject button and avoid!

[Silver158]

@Unit1 damn skippy

[Silver158]

@Unit1 the thing I've found with that type of girl is they're usually terrible in bed. Like either don't know what they're doing, don't want to participate in foreplay (want you to go down on them but won't go down on you for example), are generally unenthusiastic or will just bend over and refuse to move until you're done.

[Unit1]

@Silver158 ewww they may be the type, who will get fat after marriage. Just saying.

[Silver158]

@Unit1 or even when they're in a relationship. but hey I know guys who are like that as well.

[Asker]

It’s called having high standards girl. I know my self-worth and I’m not going to make it easy for a guy to get something valuable from me. It’s that simple.

[Silver158]

Sex isn't really that valuable if you take into account that the supply and demand is quite even.

[Maddie03]

What about the other type of woman who doesn't need lots of money spent on her or lavished with gifts before sleeping with him but actually just says no, im not ready yet and waits until she feels comfortable with him before having sex?

[Eikz1000]

I respect and admire that. Sex shouldn't happen until both parties are ready. I just usually make up my mind before the woman.

[TrueCelt]

Well said

[Asker]

I believe that a woman should have Sex with a guy when she feels ready, but to me and many other women, part of that “getting ready” process is to see the effort the man has made into getting with her to begin with. If a woman just gives it up for free without expecting much effort from the guy in return, then she has very little self-worth and it just makes it easier for guys who don’t think much of her to begin. They perceive her as being “too easy”.

[Eikz1000]

I'm don't exert the effort to get in her pants, the effort is to show her her I care, that I give a damn about her as a person, I don't disagree with waiting until you are ready I disagree with the notion that the effort is an attempt to get into your pants not to make someone I care about feel special.

[Berethor]

Well asker, men see women as too easy depending on how many men she had, it have much to do with how much payment she taken for it. Also when a man paying, a woman can feel obliged, and rightfully so, otherwise the man had paid for nothing.

[Berethor]

I mean it didn't have much to do with how much payment she taken for it.

[Bert-7]

The feminist movement is a direct cause of less romance. I'm a old school person, French, love being romantic, charming and everything. But really is, it's not like that anymore, women are different. Man had to treat them like princess because ladies didn't had much, they couldn't work, they had no job and they also shouldn't give themself easily ( parent consent, wait for marriage etc ). In that context, it made sense.. the lady was dating only you and you could start spoiling her and impress her cuz its was already serious on a way.
Now man makes equal money with ladies who have their own career. They have sex with who ever and date multiple people. You want to spend money on someone you will be with, not just on a random girl that you will probably never see again.
In our modern society, we get to know the people first, then surprise, I spoil you.
If the man turned out to not be that of a match you can leave him, in the past you couldn't.
I wish I could still open doors and be very nice, offer fancy dinner etc... The reality is men do not get respected for that anymore. It's something from the past.

[annie616pop]

Yes, I can believe, that in your neck of the woods, everything you say is true. However, I have a different experience. I was raised in the Southern United States, five generation Navy and Marine Corp career family with an extended family or "clan" of around 300 people. Our men treat us as royalty. The full gentlemen's protocol. Boys learn this from their elders and older brothers. If they don't get it right they are taught manners with sufficient persuasion on the randori mat or ring. Result? Men and boys are no less masculine for being chivalrous. Women no less feminine for their strength, independence, and intelligence. Sir, feel free to open my door.

[Asker]

I agree. What I don't get is why a lot of these entitled guys have the audacity to say that expecting good-quality courtship before having sex is prostitution. Why?

[Bert-7]

Because the guy feels like paying for sex, when having money or but should but matter. When a guy meet a girl he wants to have sex with her to create this special connection because you ladies go a lot by your feelings and sex brings a lot of them. Anyway, so using money to have a chance to create that connection sound a lot like paying for sex in a guy mind.

[Asker]

But, it really isn't because money isn't the only thing we're after. I'm sure that other women have different objectives, but not every girl is after money. I actually want a genuine connection with someone, but only with someone who is worth my time and who will treat me like I want to be treated. Why is that so hard to understand?

[dancing_in_nebulas]

They dont care about that specific girl except sex.
Whats funni is that while they use her, they are taking the girl they really wany out on dates until they are official and other girl is dropped.

Men invest into what worthwhile to them.

If he dont date you, to him, you're just a poor investment.

[fsu19]

Sounds bad but it's true. Men only invest in who they see is worth investing in

[VegetaSSB]

I don´t know and i never felt that way , maybe some think that because they are rich or got a six pack they should be worshiped like gods and have everything they desire given to them.

[Asker]

Thank you for having common sense. I love how guys assume that expecting courtship equates to prostitution. That's the pure defintion of entitlement.

[ThoughtfulGuy75]

Another way to look at this is why do (some) women expect to be wined and dined and still expect the man to have sex with them?

Sex should have nothing to do with any of what you did in that time beforehand.

There shouldn't be any expectation of anything from either side. A woman shouldn't expect her meals and drinks to be paid for. A man shouldn't expect to have to pay. A woman shouldn't be expected to have sex if a guy does do those things.

Sex should be an enjoyable activity between two people for the simple reason that it gives both of them pleasure. This can be to show feelings for one another, or because of attraction or lust.

If a woman is giving sex as a reward for receiving things of value, she's not valuing herself. So the terms gold digger or whore or prostitute are actually fairly accurate in that circumstance. If you can literally buy your way into her pants, it's a pleasurable transaction, not a shared pleasurable experience.

[babylips14]

Women value courtship; men value sex. Women seek providers; men seek fertility (beauty), hence why you see more women lowering their standards in the looks department while men are much more critical. You see men lowering their standards or not having standards at all in the financial department, but not women. This is meant to trigger reproduction and increase chances of survival. It's evolutionary biology. If he's getting his biggest craving fulfilled (sex), why can't women get theirs (courtship)? Now I'm looking at it from a business standpoint.

[ThoughtfulGuy75]

Courtship isn't buying things for someone. So you're still looking at it the wrong way. Writing poems, picking a bunch of flowers, dancing, talking all night, these days messaging all night... It's the actual activities of getting to know one another, not buying stuff. The realty is the most effective courting techniques are free, as they are sincere actions and words. Again, if you're giving it up for a few meals, you're doing it wrong! Maybe you need to rethink your idea of courting. You might actually be giving guys the impression you're easy.

[ThoughtfulGuy75]

Plus your retort is bullshit. There are plenty of hot women around rich ugly men, but very few around poor ugly men. We don't just seek beauty. If that's all that's there, we get bored and move on pretty quickly. But people should have high standards in what they want for themselves and the person they plan to spend the rest of their life with.

[tallestbassist89]

The problem why women are being called golddiggers is because well real actualy women who are golddiggers. Just watch those youtube pranks. If a regular guys walks up to a girl and asks her out or something she isn't slightly even interested. But as soon as it turns out the guy has a lambo, she is suddenly all over him. And that is fucked up. I get it why you want fancy dinners and a good life. But golddiggers show utter lack of self respect. And if you don't repsect yourself why do i ahve to respect you. And if i dont repsect you, why should i take you out to fancy dinners? If you are only nice towards a guy just because he is rich. Don't expect to be treated anything else like an object he can buy. And if money is the only way a man can show you he is willing to work for you. well what makes you different from a prostitute/golddigger then? I wouldn't mind spending every last cent i had on a woman if i knew she loved me for me. But golddiggers man.. fuck those bitches.

[babylips14]

I've watched those videos. Usually the guy will ask a girl and she'll reject him. Then he shows up in a lamborghini and she's all over him. The problem is that those girls are technically just women who are attracted to rich dudes, which isn't wrong in itself. What's wrong is deceiving someone for attaining those material things. If an ugly girl walked up to you and asked you out and you rejected her; but then she takes off her make-up and her wig that made her look unattractive and now she looks like a VS model. Would you call yourself superficial? Just something to think about.

[Berethor]

@babylips14 the difference is that a girl body it actually a part of her, same goes for a guy's D. A money is not actually a part of person, and many golddiggers go for unattractive men.

[babylips14]

@Berethor A woman's body is an external superficial quality like money is. It's no different. What makes it bad is deceiving someone to attain those things such as a pretty woman or a rich man.

[tallestbassist89]

The body is not an "external superficial quality" It is literally a huge part of you that we are SUPPOSED to be attracted to you. biologically we are ment to like what you look like, so we would want to reproduce offspring. But the thing with golddiggers who go for ugly guys is that it shows they don't care not one bit about the person. There is a huge difference. And you are not attracted to rich men you just like money. Also a huge difference.

[Logorithim]

I think of it as a marketplace. There are different segments to the market, i. e., people with different expectations.

I don't find that desire on the part of women unreasonable, and I think it is a function of the leverage they hold, knowing that men want to have sex. The courting is part of the competition with other men for her, as he is signaling that he is worth being with and, including, having sex with.

[Asker]

Couldn't have said it better! You are indeed very smart. I wish more people had the same mentality you have. I commend you for it.

[Logorithim]

Thanks...

[OlderAndWiser]

Some people don't understand courtship, and some people are bitter because of bad experiences. I don't waste time thinking about them because I am too busy having good times and enjoying life.

[Asker]

Why do some guys have the audacity to call women who want to be courted "prostitutes" or "golddiggers" if they want to be taken out to fancy dinners and dates?

[OlderAndWiser]

That is God's way of telling you who to avoid dating.

[jessicake]

Generally people don’t like to be treated like objects, but few may either not have a problem with it or never knew it was even a problem to be objectified or to objectify others so they continue to expect it. When someone tells them it’s wrong, they get defensive. Not saying that this behavior is okay on all parts, but if people choose to live their lives this way it shouldn’t effect you. Just steer clear of men and women like this is it really bugs you. I’m currently doing the same because no one worth committing would only objectify you for their own gain.

[babylips14]

Do you think it's wrong to end a relationship with someone for not being able to provide you with the type of relationship/lifestyle you once had?