Feminism has robbed WOMEN of access to masculinity. Agree or nah?

[Kaazsz]

I have done what men have always told me not to do. I sought out female opinion on dating, sex, love, relationships. I did so by reading books by women, directed at men to help them date.

I’ve also read books by men written to help men as well. After reading both genders write books for men to help them date, I've realized they are saying the same exact thing.

Women want “masculinity” in men. And the books have to spell it out for us because we don’t even know what masculinity is.

In both cases, whether it’s a male writer or a female writer, the basics are always the same:

“Unleash your inner and natural masculinity.”

All men are born masculine. But society has demonized masculinity. Even us men hate it. When you tell a guy who isn’t the most manly guy around, that he has to be masculine to get a girl, it hurts. It feels like you’re telling him to be someone he is not. It feels like you’re telling him that he must become a bad person to attract women.

Now after reading so many dating books, I think that even the lowliest guy can be a shining beacon of masculinity. Easily. It comes naturally to us men. We have simply been programmed by feminism to hate ourselves.

Society has been programmed by feminism to hate men and masculinity. And what these books do is attempt to undo the damage done by society to men.

And women suffer because of this lack of masculinity. Sure, us guys we know what’s up. We know there’s this subtle undercurrent of hate against what makes a man a man. But we also know that what makes a man a man also makes women horny.

The female writers I read who offer help to men, say they had at one time hated men too. But after realizing what happened to men, and realizing the only way to fix the male/female dynamic is to help MEN.

Women don’t need any help dating. It’s MEN who need the help. Because society has brainwashed us to HATE ourselves.

Women need masculine men to be happy. But masculinity has been vilified and demonized.

[Lliam]

Nah. The essence of feminism (women's lib) was to gain equal opportunity and fair treatment for women. At the time it was sorely needed. Women wanted liberation from victimization (the Madmen attitude). They wanted to be treated with dignity and respect. They wanted to be seen as capable adults as opposed to empty-headed servants and sex objects.
Women's lib also gave women control over their own bodies. Birth control methods allowed them to embrace their sexuality as men had always been able to do. Hurray for that!

However, I do take your point about how schools and society has denigrated masculinity. Boys are taught to fear guns. They are drugged if they are too loud or rough house. Kids, in general, aren't even allowed to play outside without supervision. And yes, there are those twisted parents who raise their children as gender neutral with gender neutral names. People who embrace such things tend to identify as liberals, but the terms liberalism and feminism are mere scapegoats.

I'm all for empowering women, but society has taken a wrong turn. I don't blame that on women, women's liberation or even liberalism. There is something more insidious at play. Feminism, gun control and the encouragement of transsexuality are merely some of the various means/tools/excuses being used to create a meek society that will accept greater and greater authoritarian control. There is a nefarious social engineering program going on and it isn't liberals or feminists who invented it.

[Kaazsz]

Who invented it? Personally I’m one of those liberty crazies who believe in a free market. So I’d like to know who is behind all these but job liberals. I used to be one of them so I know them all too well.

[englisc]

"I have done what men have always told me not to do. I sought out female opinion on dating, sex, love, relationships."

Yup. And you're still focused on gaining approval from women, and on how this affect women - which is the reason for all of this.

[Kaazsz]

Are you incapable of reading comprehension? The advice from men and women is exactly the same. You’re still a broken man, brainwashed by feminism. You think you’ve rejected it entirely and yet here you are spewing nonsense at me with no actual logic or rational statement to be made. Only ad hominem time wasting. “Hurr durrr muh approval from women!” You feel that way because feminism has taught you to hate women. You’re brainwashed bro. You can’t listen to a woman because you have beliefs given to you by feminists.

[englisc]

I can listen to women - but not about how to act like a man. Not because I think they're stupid but because women, not being men, will never fully understand masculinity. They can only understand it based on the things they find attractive in a man, and when it comes to dating and becoming more attractive you have to care about what they think to some extent, but masculinity isn't all about what women find attractive in men. As long as you're fixated on getting that advice from women you'll never get it either. And you've said multiple times in this take that "we" don't understand it, that "we" hate ourselves etc. Suggesting that you still kind of think that way.

Check out this video where Jack Donovan explains what I'm trying to say here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i-JWqHlKpU8

[Rica_ChicaUSA]

AGREE 100%

As a woman, I will say that I want a masculine man - a man who doesn't care what society says and stays true to himself no matter what others think. Like, if he has ever liked a girl before who was a hardcore feminist, he didn't try to be more feminine for her. No. I want a masculine man who doesn't give a damn what society tells him and doesn't kiss anyone's ass.

[Alex_988_2]

lol but men love to kiss their womens' butts while fucking them

[Moonchild714]

@Genericname85 @OlderAndWiser Couldn't have said it any better. @Lliam I agreed with much of what you said just not so much the Gender Neutrality and TransSexuality parts, but that's each their own beliefs. I work with those Populations...

[Lliam]

Thanks, Moonchild. I do disagree with people who deliberately raise their children in gender neutral households. But I do support full LGB rights as well as Trans rights within some limits. I'm friends with some trans folks and understand the situation. I do oppose their participation in competitive female sports. I also oppose letting them use female only facilities unless they are fully transitioned. My point, though, wast every good cause gets co-opted by nefarious social engineers and used to advance a toxic agenda. That's why we have to beware not to condemn good causes entirely. We have to learn to discern how they get spun off the rails.

[OlderAndWiser]

I appreciate your kind words!

[Moonchild714]

@Lliam I do agree with this further explanation. Thank you it was kind of you to take the time to explain.

[Moonchild714]

@OlderAndWiser I appreciate you guys having the insight into Feminism. It's been turned into such a Negative people have No Clue what it means. So thank you.

[Lliam]

@Moonchild. The fact that you understood what I was trying to say is impressive. Most people I know personally would have argued and called me names, at best a conspiracy theorist.

[Moonchild714]

Thank you for MHO.

[OlderAndWiser]

You are right except for one very important point. Men are responsible for how they act; not women! The cause is not women; it is up to each man to ignore societal pressures and to express himself. After all, that is a part of what makes us men.

This is like women blaming men for the uncomfortable shoes they wear!

[Kaazsz]

I’m not blaming women, I’m blaming feminists. I think a lot of us are lost. We don’t even know how to go about expressing ourselves or taking action. Many of us have taken on the belief that masculinity is bad and evil. People act out their beliefs. And when men believe masculinity is nothing but evil, they have no choice but to suffer. There has not been any perspective granted to them that would reveal to them the true and good nature of masculinity.

[OlderAndWiser]

It is the responsibility of men to accept the role of fatherhood, to be involved in their children's lives, and to raise their boys to become men.

[Dargil]

Worst than that. Feminism has made authentic masculinity culturally repugnant.

[Kaazsz]

I don’t know that society even knows what authentic masculinity is, ya know? Like it could be right in everyone’s face and nobody has a clue. But I see your point and I probably agree with you. You’ve said exactly what I think. My only problem is, is that I’m not sure society is capable of identifying or defining what authentic masculinity is. I know that if I were to do a mytake on it, the girls would love it and the guys would get angry and probably call me names. It’s us men ourselves who have been brainwashed the hardest. At the very least, the female pussy still knows what authentic masculinity is. Though they see it very rarely. Among the male population the idea of masculinity has been lost entirely.

[Dargil]

I think there are instinctive feminine and masculine roles. Take away the cultural underpinnings, and those roles are restored. They never disappeared completely in rural life and reduction or elimination of social supports restoration of traditional roles. I envision social/tribalist movements that discourage social media and other misandrist cultural leanings. Look on YouTube for Tucker Carlson's presentations on the decline of men.

[ColHathi]

nah.

[genericname85]

you have to distinct "feminism" from social justice warriors or feminazis. feminism is what gave women the right to vote, get education and generate their own income. everything beyond that, i don't call feminism, i call it social justice warriors or feminazis.

[bangyourhead]

yup.

[morrowlow]

Who cares? they've done it to themselves. I'm good

[JesseJayNeak]

Agree

[8michael2]

Good work!!