Should we make efforts to return Men back to their roots?

[AvaOneLasTime]

Men should be men. And I hope men WILL be men.
What I mean is that today's men are not as manly, masculine and dominating OVERALL, as before.
I am talking about on an average.
Today's men fall into porn, submission, oppression, they are lost in their life, ways and dreams. They take pursuing women too far, some would even crawl for women, and never in even their bravest dream, they have seen themselves as the ones who women would want to go after.
If course I am not talking for all men.
But the number of men I am mentioning is not a minority.
Men also tend to be less educated about women, than vice versa. I have seen it numerous times, and I sometimes think it's purposefully being done in school for them. Men are less encouraged, as opposed to women, we see all those efforts about 'female empowerment'. And yet, despite all this, it reflects and backfires on us women, because many polls tend to show we are more and more unhappier lately.
Perhaps neglecting the one gender for the other led us to nowhere.
Should we start teaching and encourage boys once again, of their masculinity, instead of calling it toxic?
Make them embrace it and improve it on their own. Know who they are, help them identify what they want and encourage them on the way.
Being dominant and realise most women actually like that. Being protectors, not just cash providers.
Because when people say things like - that old man is from the time when men were MEN - it does speaks volumes about the path we are walking on now, and the direction we are headed to.

[TimCL]

I partially/mostly agree, however this discussion is far to big to be done in these small message boxes! I have however, stayed around to talk about it!! This is a very interesting issue you’ve raised here and your not the first to speak about this publicly. The impact of the extreme idealism which have come to be in the last 10 years or so, has been a big topic of conversation in many recent academic discussions on society. The most prominent voice, and who i would call a spearhead for the thoughts you just expressed, is a Canadian clinical psychologist, Dr Jordan B Peterson. I'd recommend you watch some of his lectures about the role of young men in modern society. He gives an in-depth explanation of what you summarised in your question, it is absolutely fascinating, and in my opinion, a completely accurate explanation of how western society has become. I'll try find a link and add it as an edit if i do.

[TheFlak38]

And here what she will do now: She'll start watching Jordan Peterson and then come back here on gag and make posts with everything he said but present all these words as her own ideas to virtue signal and make conservative men to bombard her with compliments and cute emojis.

[AvaOneLasTime]

@TheFlak38 No, i am working on Did you know, Part 2. Seriously, after 31 years, you still can't read women? I feel sorry for you. Or do i...

[Derekk]

I completely agree with you. This social experiment to play around with biology has gone on for too long, and the consequences will be dire for future generations. Men are often shamed for being chivalrous, don't know how to be romantic, and can't even get their shit together to properly support a single woman let alone a family. The proliferation of porn is just a symptom of it. If they aren't getting laid or having any kind of sexual encounters, porn is the result.

[NamerOfStars]

So we need to go back to ignoring men's desires and needs to better please women? That's how this whole mess got started.

[AvaOneLasTime]

People keep seeing things i never wrote...

[NamerOfStars]

If you don't want your brevity to lead to misunderstanding, then be thorough.

[AvaOneLasTime]

I am pretty sure i was and that i MEAN only what i WRITE. NOTHING ELSE! Is taking words out of context some new 'meta' i don't know about?

[NamerOfStars]

" Today's men fall into porn, submission, oppression, they are lost in their life, ways and dreams. They take pursuing women too far, some would even crawl for women, and never in even their bravest dream, they have seen themselves as the ones who women would want to go after." "Being dominant and realise most women actually like that. Being protectors, not just cash providers." You don't exactly leave a lot of ambiguity here, much as you might want to pretend otherwise.

[AvaOneLasTime]

Most of the people didn't seem to have a problem understanding what i wrote.

[Bel88]

I've noticed that there are many on GAG who have comprehension problems, and either completely misunderstand what's being said, or see more in the text than is actually there. One of the hazards of being on this site.

[AvaOneLasTime]

@Bel88 I didn't notice it until now :D

[Djaay]

AvaOneLasTime... Bel88... This take does have its relequishing effect towards those who are offended by it than those who insidiously are'nt affected by such an insert. Comprehension is understading thoroughly whats being articulated. Its adressed to women about men and for men to absorb as women feel fit for us to be under the umbrella of feminism in a attempt to gain men back once again by those women who miss what other women have taken from them without once taken full responsibility and stating that women have fucked up all civilization mostly for themselfs. What i will articulate about is a lot of bad men who have given women nothing but a rash of Hell in ways unduly or unethical have gave way to women fighting back in ways that honestly they should but stop way short of being honest about it or right in terms of humanity.

[Oigit]

C: If anything we need to keep on the path we are on to help keeping a lot of men from turning into the mess we have been for many generations. Everything from the high suicide rates, high rates of addiction and anger issues didn't start over the last few years. You can trace them back many generations and if men are willing to look at their grandfathers and fathers they might be able to see who unfortunately passed those issues down.

Because for generations the ideas passed down turned a lot of men into walking pressure cookers. We had no idea how to deal with mental and emotional issues nor where we taught. So that pressure kept building and there wasn't a pressure release valve to release the pressure before that pressure cooker blew.

So if your idea if your idea returning men back to their roots includes being so much of a man we don't have the skills to deal with mental and emotional issues I'm going to have to pass.

[AvaOneLasTime]

No? I never wrote that, but if you like to read and see what you want, make the conclusions which YOU like, we can't stop you. if you are already convinced the current path is the right one, then maybe it is right FOR YOU and it only proves my original point, of where men are today, and what years of control and manipulation did to them. You are the desired specimen!

[Oigit]

In general I react pretty quickly when I hear or say anything mildly subjecting men should going back to their roots. It's comes from years of having a messed up head due to having a lot of things buried mentally and emotionally. I think there are a lot of men that want things to back to the way they where and don't really know what they are asking for. In a way got lucky. Because I made the choice to go into therapy and work through a lot. A lot of the guys who want things to go back to back to the post don't realize that both themselves and the people around them paid a high price due to how things where in the past.

[AvaOneLasTime]

"A lot of the guys who want things to go back to back to the post don't realize that both themselves and the people around them paid a high price due to how things where in the past." And that is a justifiable reason to ignore the current problems we have. Right...

[Oigit]

I think it's like a lot of things. The best thing we can do is find a middle ground and work from there. But like many issues people don't want that. They want to keep fighting. Because they have to be right. As for my concern. I was kidnapped a molested as a kid. When sexual assault happens to a child it pretty much stops their mental and emotional coping skills from developing. So I had no way on dealing with the other major negative events in my childhood. When you add on top the idea of being a man and thus I was expected to not be effecting by strong negative emotions, I buried everything. So drinking myself to death, sticking a needle in my arm and overdosing or taking my own life where very much extremely likely. Because going to therapy and dealing with my issues meant I was not a traditional man. Because therapy is a sign of weakness. Though anyone that has gone through therapy will tell you a weak person avoids it. Due to a big part of it being bringing everything up and dealing with it. So you have to face it and deal with everything that comes with it. Not leaving it buried and act as if it didn't happen and isn't effecting you. So I'll gladly not return to my roots and be viewed as a weaker men buy some. Then do everything over and leave everything buried.

[AvaOneLasTime]

"Because therapy is a sign of weakness." Where exactly i said that? YOU DID!

[Oigit]

I also didn't say you did. The idea comes from the old ideas of a man being a man. Because in a lot of ways it comes back to being able to deal with everything and being strong no matter what. That kind of thinking is very much rooted in the roots of what it means to be a man. In a way it can be hard for women to understand. Because yes men and women are raised differently when it comes to emotions. Woman are taught that they can be free with them and are taught how to deal with them. Men are taught that we are suppose to more or less be a unmovable rock that is supposed to be strong no matter what. Even if it mean swallowing our emotions so that we don't show them. Of course there have been a mountain of physiological studies and experiments that show how destructive this is and prove it beyond any reasonable doubt. But people want to ignore the science and turn time back. Also people are also too willing to ignore rare people like myself who are willing to openly talk about there issue as what issues lead to it. If you want to find a man who is connected to the old ideas of what it means to be a man go ahead. Just don't expect everyone to think all men should return to their roots. Also if the man you end up with does have a break down, just remember I said it could very much be a consequences of his inability to deal with is emotions. Due to him being a "real man"

[AvaOneLasTime]

I will tell you the same thing, i said in another opinion - "I am pretty sure i was and that i MEAN only what i WRITE. NOTHING ELSE! Is taking words out of context some new 'meta' i don't know about?" The people who voted with "Yes" probably understood what i asked, by actually reading carefully and realising i didn't SECRETLY mean something else. I never proposed a trade-off/barter or exchange, one qualities for another. If thats what you thought, then... that is you.

[DonkeyDan]

Yes for sure, but there are still plenty of real men in the world, most of this new man thing is with the younger generations because it is beat into them from every direction that being masculine is toxic. It's total bullshit, you can be a good guy and not surrender your balls to the modern agenda. I believe wonen should have a voice, but nobodies voice should be heard over anyone else's. Right now all we are hearing is the radical voices and that is far more toxic than masculinity. When will we ever to learn to respect one another and see eye to eye without surrendering to being beat down, but also not acting like dicks.

[Bel88]

I've got a better idea. Why don't we all just move on from concepts like "masculinity" and "femininity" (whatever they are), and just be... gee, I don't know - people perhaps?

[TimCL]

I get what your trying to say, and i can’t say i disagree with the idea. However the reality is, that these traits of personality are literally built into DNA, the same goes for every other sex of mammal on the planet. Both sexes inherit gender related personality traits; males are generally larger, and more aggressive than females. This pattern is related to greater production of testosterone and has come about as a result of hundreds of thousands of years of evolution. Generally speaking, the same goes for certain inherited traits of females. These traits are exactly what makes us human and i think if you look at it from this perspective, it's simply not possible to 'move on', as these are not just 'concepts'. They're the traits that have kept us humans from going extinct, for thousands of years.

[Bel88]

@TimCL How can personality traits be "built into DNA"? Personality is determined by a person's experiences, not their genetics. DNA is simply responsible for the creation of proteins.

[sensible27]

No, people should be rational. Agressive or retreating,

[AvaOneLasTime]

What a choices...

[sensible27]

What do you mean?

[zoomerboomer]

Agree about 75%. I do think society as a whole should value the differences between men and women overall and I'm also tired of the constant portrayal of men as weak or dim, especially in advertisements. Yeah it was maybe funny in the 80s but at this point it's not.

But I also think toxic masculinity can exist which is where I'll disagree. What I mean by that is when men don't support each other or other people in general. Or when guys feel like they always need to be stoic, even when they're dealing with a crazy amount of stress and emotions and just need to let them out. That needs to be normalized for men's health in general.

But otherwise, yeah I think I agree overall 👍🏻

[RealMarek]

As long as the social and political elite continue to believe men benefit from unfair “privilege” and also have a population-reduction agenda, boys will continue to face a world that discriminates against them and is increasingly feminized. The education system caters to women. Even processed food and the push toward fake meat is designed to reduce testosterone levels.

[Yourfriend2021]

Men can be men but women don't need protectors anymore it seems, and extreme feminism is ruining it for all women, and men.

[TheFlak38]

"Men also tend to be less educated about women" when men had their "roots" as you call it they didn't have to be educated about women. The woman would simply keep her mouth shut and stay in the kitchen with three little kids running around her screaming "mommy mommy". If you want men to go back to their roots then I dare you to answer "yes" to the following questions:
1. Are you against gay marriage?
2. Do you agree that women shouldn't have the right to vote?
3. Do you agree that a woman's freedom must be constrained by her father, brother, community or church in order to choose what's best for her?
4. Do you believe it’s ideal for a woman to remain a virgin until she gets married?
5. Do you believe it’s wrong for a young girl to find herself by traveling around the world and trying new experiences?

Good luck to any man finding a woman today who can answer with "yes" to at least ONE of those questions. And those who do just want to virtue signal and play the NAWALT card.

[AvaOneLasTime]

Yet again, I never wrote the words which YOU wrote and you can't seriously think you are contributing to this conversation, by dragging me into six separate conversations. just because I am 18, it doesn't mean I am ignorant. Society is long past the questions you asked, but is confused or lost about the one I brought up.

[TheFlak38]

I can very much contribute to the conversation. You asked about making an effort to make men masculine again. For strange reason you don't want to accept that this also includes taking away women's rights. Could it be because you're a feminist in disguise like every tradthot? Or maybe you truly are 18 and ignorant? The feminist says that it's all men's fault. The feminist in disguise pretending to be trad says that men have to do something to get masculine in order to serve her vagina in a better way but she doesn't have to change herself at all. Women can do whatever they want and that's fair play.

[AvaOneLasTime]

"For strange reason you don't want to accept that this also includes taking away women's rights. Could it be because you're a feminist in disguise" I stopped reading right there, sorry. You get it more wrong with each reply.

[Dchrls78104]

Only now, it seems, has the truth become apparent. Why has it taken so long to register? Have the chickens finally come home to roost? You're a youngster saying this; will your parents listen? Or will their generation? You can't ask men to be fathers and at the same time use the law to force them out of the lives of children. You can't help or uplift women by pulling down and destroying men. You can't ask a man to be the leader and then oppose his decisions, refuse to listen to what he says, or do things behind his back. You can't ask the man to be a MAN and then make laws to castrate him. You can't buy a guard dog to protect your life and property and then hamstring him or file his teeth. You can't hire an Uber driver or a taxi driver to take you someplace and then grab the steering wheel. And ladies, you can't demand respect from a man if you show him none or if you give the man nothing to respect.

[James899]

Why i can't able to pm you?

[James899]

I can't able to reply to ur text's.

[LogicBomber]

In order for men to be men, women need to be women and sadly a lot of women have become entitled, spoiled, narcissistic, children who shame and attack men for existing and all things male.
So until women let men be men and stop the perpetual false victim complex... Society will continue to fall into shit.

[Juxtapose]

I am assertive and not a doormat but I just do not like to get into the dominant role. I don't have an ego or anything to prove, I am not aggressive, far more zen. Aggression and ego is for buffoons while stoic calm is a path of enlightenment.

It's a lot more interesting to me when a woman is dominant and aggressive but not overly so. Meek women who depend on me just feel so boring. I can't depend on them to fight by my side or be my equal, I would much rather have a woman who is willing to fight and die by my side rather than cower in another room. I want a woman with inner strength and determination I can relate to.

Who cares about all these societal expectations and social statuses? I want what's interesting and beneficial to me.

[AvaOneLasTime]

You see as benefits the things you want from a woman, and perhaps that is what the society wants you to be. And you may not even realise it. You don't know how you were tricked and manipulated, as you were a child, but I have seen such foul play in action. the person doesn't even realise there is something wrong with him, as the time goes.

[Juxtapose]

🤷‍♂️ it's just how I am, I identify with chill hippies more than aggressive, dominant macho men. The women I have been attracted to are much more interesting than demure, meek women. This one Russian girl I should have hit on when I had the chance back when I was younger would tell other people to screw off if they tried the bully me while she was hanging out with me.. but a submissive woman would have just looked to me for leadership the moment things went south.

[AvaOneLasTime]

God forbid men take the lead!

[Juxtapose]

There are plenty of men who love to lead. I have had submissive women before and it was fun but dominant women make my toes curl like nothing else.

[AvaOneLasTime]

Like i said, you are the desired specimen.

[Twalli]

You want men to stop asking before performing sexual acts? That's who men were.

[AvaOneLasTime]

Never said that. But i don't want men to call their lawyers to notify them, and their wives agreed for sex tonight. And every other night.

[Twalli]

Beats fake rape accusations

[bamesjond0069]

You can't both have traditional masculine men AND have modern empowered women. Mens behavior is a reaction to the way women around him behave. Modern women elicit men to either double down on a modern masculinity ie chasing women fucking them and dumping them without care OR withdrawl from dating to porn videogames pot/drinking.

I dont care what men simping online say, men are not interested in a woman with a bodycount and a career. They just aren't. Unfortunately thats essentially all thats available short of even less desirable combinations than that. So will women go back to waiting for marriage and keeping a home or will we just accept men being playboys and simps?

The idea of modern women existing with traditional men is ludacris because you're not trying to change anything except convince men to put in lots of effort for something they dont want. Clearly not going to happen.

[AvaOneLasTime]

Well, if you don't want to embrace who you biologically are, and if you don't want to work on yourself, improve yourself, and not have the society holding you back, who am I to intervene?

[bamesjond0069]

@avaonelastime i think many simp men would say "yes just let me play my video games in peace". However personally im the other type. I work hard and am well off, go to the gym and am athletic but i didn't do all that to commit to some slut who can't cook me a nice dinner. So damn straight ill fuck around and not owe any woman a damn thing. No hymen no diamond. Too many sluts to bang it seems stupid to tie myself down to one. I didn't create this scenario i find myself in, women have.

[AvaOneLasTime]

Good for you. And that is how it SHOULD be, no?

[bamesjond0069]

How i have chose to react to the current dating environment? I guess but women sure seem to complain about fuckboys not committing to them.

[disgustingweebtrash]

You can't have your cake and eat it.

[DonkeyDan]

I think there's a bunch of fat people who'd disagree 🤣

[Dchrls78104]

@DonkeyDan fat feminists 😂😂

[fred_durst]

even what you said is right , i would say it is mission impossible

[Djaay]

Women... You'all have abandoned your role as a real woman. And adopted the idea that men need to change. Change yourselfs back to what your suppossed to be and there won't be men issues anylonger. Funny how women fucked everything up then wants men to change and adapt to theyre fuck ups.

[driven159]

Most women want to feel safe with a man that can take care of anything

[BaldAvenger]

The best way to accomplish that is for women to return to being women