Handguns kill wayyy more people than your so called "military variant" rifles. Semi automatic rifles only account for 13% of firearm murders. That's not even looking at the non-firearm weapons. Blunt objects actually kill more people in murders than semi automatic rifles.This question isn't even about done control; it's about David hog being a deceptive activist
@Adam_INTJ if you want to kill one or two people you use a handgun.If you want to kill a lot of people you use something like an AR 15
@Adam_INTJ and its not a socalled thing, that is literally what an AR 15 is, its a semiautomatic variant of a military rifle designed to be sold to civiliand
Can't you do the same with an m1 garrand or ruger 22 or any other non-ar15. Brevnik killed 69 with a Ruger Mini-14 Ranch Rifle semi-automatic carbine and a pair of glock handguns, injuring at least 110 people, 55 of them seriously.
@Waffles731 If you really want a high body count, you use IEDs or bioweapons.
@Landshrk0068 bioweapons maybe but IEDs rarely ever match mass shooters. Maybe a car bomb like the Oklahoma city bombing. I was suprised that the law Vegas shooting casualties were so few. There's also the possibility of some guy building a flamethrower to attack a public space or a weaponised drone.
So you care more about 17 students of a school shooting than 1000 adults killed by handguns? You really are blind.The deadliest school shooting to date (Virginia tech) was carried out with handguns. The more deaths per shooting is irrelevant. You would have to say some lives are more valuble than others for that to have any bearing in this conversation.Democrats only peddle the "ban assault rifles" gig because if they carried out their true agenda, they'd never be elected again.
@Adam_INTJ yes I care more about dead kids than dead adultsEspecially considering that handguns are too useful to ban.And don't give me that you could do the same with a garand bullshit you canf tell me that a full sized battle rifle that takes 8 round en bloc clips is going to be anywhere near as good for a mass shooting as say, an AR with a 30 round mag, And a ranch rifle?That was a bullshit naming choice by ruger, an actual ranch rifle should be something like a winchester 94Not a 5.56 intermediate round firing weapon that can take 30 round mags
What's wrong with Australian gun laws? You can own a gun if you have a license and a legitimate reason to need one.
@OfDeath you can't carry is what's wrong
So when some guy kills 17 students at parkland with an AR-15, it's somehow worse than if he did it with handguns?You are almost operating with gun control as a premise rather than a conclusion.
@Adam_INTJ no its the amiunt of people that consistently get killed in mass shootings, the numbers are higher for handguns for the sole reason that they are used for single, double, or triple murders more often and for the most part, people murder people for personal reasons
Personally guns aside you guys really need to start looking into whether ssri drugs and other anti depressants are causing or controbuting to mass shootings. Like are your doctors prescribing doses that are too high or the wrong drugs or prescribing medication that isn't needed.
That's true. Unless you're a licenced hunter or the police.If you're caught carrying a gun it's immediate prison time.So people just don't take that risk.
I'm not a big believer in antidepressants causing mass shootings, but I think their negative psychological effects should be researched - 11 to 13 percent of Americans are on them, and it's absolutely wild to say that all those people have biochemical chronic depression.Your mentioning it is stupid. It's a classic guilt by association fallacy. I'm not a baseball team. I'm not responsible for what everyone does under the label Republican.
Don't explain to me why handguns have more deaths. I knew exactly why. It's just idiotic that you hide behind false motivations like "I just want to prevent murder" while trying to ban weapons that are hardly relevant to murder by statistics. You are probably motivated by emotional stories, majority opinion, and propaganda from the left. That's not outside human nature; we all have confirmation biases. But you remain willfully ignorant of the facts that I've given you, and because of that, your position is weak.
@Adam_INTJ lol I love it when people attack "the left".
Well liberals wouldn't be accurate because that would include tolerant people. The left is only the fascist-type of people that shut down speech they disagree with and try to punish people for wrongthink
@Adam_INTJ that's generally what the right traditionally is.The left is for free speech and social justice.
Dude, the left has been shutting down speech al over the place. Did you forget that antifa exists? David hogg trying to remove Laura Ingraham from the air? The left is constantly trying to shut down speech.
@Adam_INTJ and like the right doesn't burn fantasy books cause they claim they are satanic, I myself play D&D which according to some members of the right makes me part of a satanic cult
I'm the right's defence when they burn books and CDs they don't like the authors and music artists are really happy because their sales go through the roof.
The entire American media is a propoganda system owned by corporate elites.
Yawn. . . you just posted fake videos of David Hogg. . . so now everyone knows how much research you put into your propaganda.
Yes just like Obama didn't have us citizens executed without due process.
Like I said, you are not wound too tightly.So you just went from posting fake videos and spreading propaganda about David Hogg to blaming Obama.memegenerator.net/.../you-sir-are-crazy-.jpg
this site doesn't let you like replies but... ^like
Your the guy that will condemn Russia potentially assainating a citizen on foreign soil while applauding Obama and his assaination via drone bombing campaign.I'm not spreading propoganda I am merely asking a question. Surely your not "wound so tight " that your beliefs can be questioned without you declaring jihad on those that disagree. In my mind David Hogg and his motives are suspect. That is all.
Nope, I condemned both. But you claimed that Britain could not take action against Russia, because somehow it was hypocritical. Putin is the epitome of hypocrisy. He is the leader of thugs and mafia goons. His goal is to destroy the dominance the West has in the world economy so that when he makes his dictatorial moves, invades sovereign nations, assassinates his political opponents, or spies working against his country, there can be no price to pay.Britain has every right to take whatever action they deem necessary to respond to Russia. Just as Russia would have every right to take action against Britain if it attempted to assassinate someone on Russian soil.But you continue to try to make this argument about your gripes with the U. S.That's why you always sound so crazy.
Britain has as much proof that the US poisoned that guy as they do that the Russians did. The US has been trying to gain access to Russian oil resources and take over Russian spheres of influence. Its not the "west's" dominance in the world economy that's under threat it's the United States.If Britain has right to take action against Russia then that means by your logic the citizens of every country the US military is blowing the shit out of has a right to attack the US on US soil.
Britain has not charged the U. S. with anything or are we all supposed live in your dream world with you. And if Russia ever suspected that Britain or the U. S. killed someone on Russian soil there would be hell to pay.Putin even threatened the West for even appealing to his political opponents. That's just how little he would stand for any meddling in his nation's politics. You still talk in circles. Russia does not want to be messed with. And with good reason. But Britain does not play either.As for retaliation against the U. S. we lost three thousand people on 9/11. 6,000 more were injured, families broken, destroyed, people who will live with that horrible incident for the rest of their lives.So I hope you are happy. You can throw yourself a party this September.
Again there's no evidence. Russia could suspect the US of catlrrying out assaination on Russian soil but then they don't have evidence.So for the 6000 killed on 9/11 by a former US agent you justify killing millions of innocent people who had nothing to do with it just because they are muslim?
Well, Britain says they have evidence and I would believe them long before I believe anything Putin says or claims. Besides, we are allies, we have a duty to them. They stood by the U. S. when we lied about the causes for the Iraq war.
Britain has a history of falsifying evidence and assainating British citizens on British soil. Yes the Americans directly lied and violated international law and committed war crimes. It's not clear how much the British government knew about the completely false claim that Sadam Hussein had WMD's. It's also not clear if the British security services or the American CIA assainated weapons expert David Kelly.
Yeah, Putin has no history of falsifying evidence. Try again.And no one else has any direct evidence that America lied. Why would Britain be so special? We had been spying on and keeping secrets from our allies for decades.And understand "Comrade", I could not have these conversations in public, in public forums, in Russia.I would simply disappear from the face of this earth.But you should move there immediately.
One thing about Putin he isn't bombing the shit out of 10 different countries resulting in millions of deaths, assainating hundreds ever month and committing war crimes.
He just invades his neighbours and keeps them.
@goaded maybe true but the body count isn't in the millions. What is the US kill count in Iraq alone so far?
Far too high, and Blair helped, too, don't forget.On the other hand, how much land (and accompanying citizens) does the US now claim as their own that they didn't before?
@goaded Blair got played. He thought the US government wouldn't invade without UN legal approval.
Millions of deaths? Evidence please. You just post nothing drivel, conspiracies, and propaganda. You and your Putler can go on your honeymoon in Crimea where uppity Tatars disappear when they voice their displeasure at their persecution.
In Iraq? Again evidence. And I mean from the administration that you hate so much. . . Obama.We already knew what Bush did. But you seem to have an agenda. Because you do not critique the whole of American foreign policy. In fact, you only have one administration that seems to draw your ire.So please, let's get on with comparing Putin to Obama.Show me the millions killed in Iraq by American soldiers during the Obama administration's tenure.
The US military use private military contractors, Foreign militaries, drones and US green berets to recruit and train terrorists to effect regime changes that way they pursue their interests with less US boots on the ground.
Show evidence. Pardon me if I don't believe a guy who spreads propaganda and lies about a kid who survived a mass shooting by the skin of his teeth.You aren't even American and you didn't even bother to read his story.
I asked the question. Is your own political ideology so weak it can't be questioned, can you not even do your own research rather than believe what CNN says.https://youtu.be/4m5xMev8xD4
Dude, I actually do research. And CNN never reported that David Hogg lied and was never at the Parkland massacre. So they have much more credibility than you. Oh. . . look an unbiased source. Russian State NewsLOLx10!!!I would rather get my news from Al Jazeera. I tune into their news shows every once in a while. I also watch a few Arab news shows on Link. The BBC, Euronews, and alternative news sources.But I am a lemming like you. I have the education, the intellect, and the wisdom to take in information from various sources and reach my own conclusions. I will not follow any one's ass like you. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zgAJI_IEVho
Even socialist labour leader jeremy corbyn is raising doubts about the lack of evidence linking Russia to the assaination.
So in a free society people can have doubts. Try having a doubt contrary to government positions in Russia.Let's see how long you last. Move there dude. You need to experience losing your freedom so you can see just how precious it is.
Your wealth and freedoms are paid for by the suffering of people in the third world.
You are just posting drivel. My freedoms were not paid for by anyone but the brave souls who came before me. Everything you post is incoherent.Get out of the house man. Go to the movies or something. Being anit-social will only lead you to an unpleasant end.
Those rebooks your wearing were funded by the blood of third world children.
Says the guy who just posted a lie about David Hogg.And you care nothing about children in developing countries. If you did, you would not even use the term "third world".en.zamanalwsl.net/.../885b0e97ee8644a12ad2a857.jpg
Look at all the kids killed by American drones in your pic.
Those kids are not dead. They are in the hospital after an chemical weapons attack from Assad.It is evident. You care little about their lives. You only care about who has the right to kill them.And that is sickening.peacenews.org/.../...eral-damage-gaza-children.jpgYou don't care what extremist groups have done to innocents. You can only blame Obama.
For all we know the US launched the Sarin gas rockets given the US having a history of chemical weapons. The UN found no evidence that Syria or Russia did it.https://instagram.com/p/BVlMlsvjbj6
Again, you can only accuse the United States, when the latest attacks all are confirmed to come from Syria. Even your guy Trump agrees.
Trump is your guy and it's just as likely that the CIA is responsible.
And all these mass shooters are each just one person well regulated militias, using their 2nd Amendment rights.
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Maybe if Fox hired decent people instead of people who insult children on national TV, they wouldn't have these problems. He was at the school; stop believing any site that still claims he wasn't. Even redstate admits he was there.www.redstate.com/.../"an article I wrote Monday evening that originally questioned whether David Hogg was on the Marjory Stoneman Douglas High School campus during the shooting. [...] That was a grievous mistake. It was absolutely wrong. And I am sorry."
@goaded He"s a snobby kid who thinks he's and her then adults.And it was perfectly okay for Liberals to mock 12 year old Barron Trump?It's not just FOX. Frank Stallone also said someone should sucker punch me.If anyone needs to find more descent people, it's the Liberals. They get away with shit like this all the time
Shouldn't David Hogg be protesting outside his Dad's office at the FBI for allowing the parkland shooter to buy a gun?
"He"s a snobby kid who thinks he's and her then adults."What?"And it was perfectly okay for Liberals to mock 12 year old Barron Trump?"No. When did that happen?
Never mind. According to this, it was two tweets. One from an SNL writer, the other from "a middle aged man who runs a YouTube channel dedicated to playing video games".www.louderwithcrowder.com/.../That's just the same as being insulted in front of 1.69 million viewers, right?
@goaded I don't care. If you bitch to the public, you should accept criticism from the public.
Especially if he lied about being there. He's an attention whore trying to guilt trip us, and make is feel bad they he didn't get into. college. Neither dud hundreds of other kids who applied. There were less popular schools he could've applied, but apparently he's too good for them.Fuck this kid
Did you miss the part about where even RED STATE says HE WAS THERE?He. Was. Not. Lying.
@goaded seems suspicious to me.
@goaded Hogg says some of the most disgusting things I've heard come out of people's mouths about his opponents, but as soon as his opponents say something even mildly critical of him he whines endlessly about how he is "just a teenager" and sends a lynch mob after them.David Hogg is the perfect face for the gun control movement and the left in general, he's entitled, dumb, a snowflake and insane.
@gotc147 But he did spend time hiding in a closet in school while someone with an AR-15 style rifle was shooting other students.What were these disgusting things he said?
@goaded so did Kyle Kashuv, but you probably don't even know who he is.Let's see... Child murderers, cowards, pathetic fuckers... All kinds of nasty things, David Hogg is a bully. We haven't heard anything from him in a week or so now so maybe the puppet masters figured out he is more of a hindrance than a help to them.
@gotc147 I didn't, but I suppose meeting POTUS isn't as important a thing as it used to be. How many other SDHS students share his opinions? Why was he the only one to meet the president?I'd need to see links, not just random words. Wouldn't you call someone who knew there could be ground glass in baby formula "child murderers"? Why not people that let teenagers buy guns?
@goaded like the FBI?
@goaded don't have an exact number but apparently quite a few of those students share Kyle Kashuv's opinions based on what teachers at the school have been saying.I'm not going to bother tracking down links because the only media reporting these things is more conservative media, which despite having video evidence you will call biased and non-credible. Also you're in Germany, so your opinions on US gun policy, or any policy for that matter, are worth less than the pixels they appear on.There are hundreds of thousands, probably millions of teenagers in the US who own guns and never shoot anybody. I don't know why you Europeans are so violent, you're always telling me about how petty arguments will end in someone getting shot and such, are all Europeans that ill-tempered? Maybe I should reconsider my trip to Rome later this year...
@gotc147 It's OK, I looked it up myself. A like from a CNN commentator to a tweet by a grieving parent, in your eyes, is the same as an on-air insult from an anchor with an audience of 1.69 million?It's a desperate and, frankly, pathetic attempt to reproduce the genuine anger caused by Fox's reaction to the attack that caused advertiser boycotts.Also, there are also far more than a billion Muslims who will never kill anybody, or want to. Does that mean we shouldn't do anything to make it harder for the thousands that do?Enjoy Rome, the murder rate is about 1/5th of the US as a whole, and only beaten by Guam in 2007 and Noth Dakota in 2000, in the period 2000-2012. Maybe it's because they don't have guns to hand?
@goaded Laura Ingram made a legitimate and tame criticism of David Hogg, about something Hogg himself has made public. You enter the public spotlight you're going to get criticized, can't stand the heat get out of the kitchen.And apparently you didn't look very hard, Hogg has a very vulgar mouth on him, try searching YouTube for his interviews rather than relying on CNN, which has proven numerous times it has no interest in challenging Hogg when he says something that isn't true.If YouTube fails you, Daily Wire has some articles on Hogg.Now you're comparing cities to states... I can do that too, watch: compare Appomattox Virginia, where almost everybody, including the senior citizens and teenagers, own guns, to France and get back to me about which is the safer place. I'll wait.
Interesting, half my comment didn't post...If YouTube fails you, Daily Wire has some articles on Hogg.So where were you when that host from "The View" made disgusting comments about Mike Pence's Christain faith? Please show me your posts in outrage over that.Now you're comparing cities to states, I can do that too, watch: compare Appomattox Virginia, where everybody from the high schoolers to the senior citizens own guns, to France and get back to me with which is the safer place.
@gotc147 I wasn't comparing a city to a country; I was comparing Italy to the US. That's fair, right? You said so earlier. Actually, I was also comparing Italy to all the states individually, like Lott did.0.78 murders/100,000, Italy, vs. 4.88, US. States ranged between 0.6 and 46.4 from 2000-2012.France's rate is 1.58.en.wikipedia.org/.../List_of_countries_by_intentional_homicide_rate
@gotc147 I don't know about the host from "The View", but didn't President Trump say Pence wanted to hang all the gays, or something like that?
@goaded you said "Rome" not "Italy."You also need to re-check your information again, the murder rate in the US as a whole has been on the decline since 1993, it was dropping between 2000 and 2012, not staying static.While you're looking at historical murder rates, why don't you go a bit further back in history and check the numbers for the US? Take a look at the 60s, 70s and 80s, take a look at right before WWII, the turn of the century, the Wild West era... Tell me what you find.
@goaded not that I've heard, and I'm pretty sure the media would have been all over that had something even vaugly resembling that come out of Trump's mouth.I'm sure Pence has had some choice words for gays in his lifetime, as most deeply religious people do, but I'm unaware of him saying something that harsh.
@gotc147 Are you serious?en.wikipedia.org/.../List_of_countries_by_intentional_homicide_rate_by_decadeSince 1907 the US has rarely been below 5. England's rarely been over 1 and Germany rarely over 1.5 (in the 1990s). Hell, except for 5 years in the 1970's when the IRA was seriously active, Northern Ireland was safer than the USA.
@goaded yes, that is exactly the information I wanted you to find.So, based on that, what do you now know about the US?
@gotc147 Uh, even when significant numbers of people are trying to kill us on the basis of religion, the USA is generally a more dangerous place to live? Probably because the biggest difference between our countries is that you have guns everywhere. (I suspect more guns are stolen in the US every year than there are guns in the UK, which is 1/5 the population of the US.)
@gotc147 "Two sources also recalled Trump needling Pence about his views on abortion and homosexuality. During a meeting with a legal scholar, Trump belittled Pence’s determination to overturn Roe v. Wade. The legal scholar had said that, if the Supreme Court did so, many states would likely legalize abortion on their own. “You see?” Trump asked Pence. “You’ve wasted all this time and energy on it, and it’s not going to end abortion anyway.” When the conversation turned to gay rights, Trump motioned toward Pence and joked, “Don’t ask that guy—he wants to hang them all!”"www.newyorker.com/.../the-danger-of-president-pence
@goaded so Trump allegedly made an off-color remark about Pence, Pence didn't acctually say he wanted to hang all the gays, nothingburger.The US has always had a somewhat high murder rate, this is not a new phenomenon and it doesn't have anything to do with our gun laws since, as you can see, it's been like that for well over a century.Oh, and the UK didn't start to impose strict gun control until about 100 years ago.There is zero connection to gun control and murder rates.
Yeah but if he is lying he will sink the movement
Please explain how conservatives and gun manufacturers benefit from a mass shooting.
@gotc147 in @Soteris defence after the Las Vegas shooter's killing spree the sale of bump stocks went up.
And they're going to be banned in a few months at the federal level, how does a short-term surge help a business if their products are illegal to sell just a few months later?
@gotc147 are gun companies going to be reimbursing customers for their numb stocks? Selling all their bump stocks that they have in stock before they are made illegal sounds like gun companies will benefit greatly.
Then you clearly don't know how business works... Businesses need to keep selling stock to stay in business and keep making money. If they sell all their stock then suddenly can never sell their product again, they go out of business and stop making money.Does it still sound like a benefit?
@gotc147 no. They had a load of bump stocks that were about to become worthless and they needed to sell them. They had already stopped making bump stocks.
No, they didn't, they're still being produced right now as they're not illegal yet.
@gotc147 and you don't think these companies know how to make money?
They make money by selling bump stocks, which if bump stocks are made illegal, the6 won't make any money anymore.Is this really that difficult a concept to understand?
@gotc147 by which time they will have made maximum profit in the minimum amount of time for the maximum amount of profit possible. Not a difficult concept.
All of which means nothing because one year from now they will have a profit of zero because they will be out of business.That's the part you don't seem to get.
@gotc147 yeah they will be producing something else or shut down either the owners will have made their money.
No, they won't have.What they make off current stock isn't enough to last them their entire lives, how much money do you think they make off each sale?
@gotc147 pretty sure buisness owners know how to make money. When they've sold all the bump stocks they can they will move on to manufacturing something else. It will be the same when they ban 30 round magazines, they will make huge profits while they can and then move on to another product and it will be the same before 5.56 ammo is banned. Sure factory workers mat lose out but the owners will win one way or the other. Even if the company tanks and files for bankruptcy the owners get a nice fat cheque.
When 30 round magazines are banned people will just 3D print them, you do realize a magazine is just a box with spring inside it right?Some businesses might, others won't, and the businesses that make bump stocks are not large corporations, they're small single-location shops that usually don't even have a storefront and act as pass-throughs, they don't get golden parachutes.
@gotc147 small buisnesses are owned by large buisnesses or owe money to the banks. Either way they are owned by big buisness.Guns can be manufactured in a machine shop. It's very possible and cheap to build a sten or sterling submachine gun illegally and has been done before.
Most bump stock manufacturers don't make guns and there are only three big gun companies, none of whom own any bump stock manufacturers.As for banks, going out of business doesn't mean you don't suddenly not owe the bank money. In fact the bank could lose money if the business owner declares bankruptcy.
But do you think he's legit?
I'm not for sure. He also brings other personal issues like not getting accepted to certain colleges and stuff like that up. It's tragic that it happened
He was at the school. Just check liberal website "redstate":www.redstate.com/.../"an article I wrote Monday evening that originally questioned whether David Hogg was on the Marjory Stoneman Douglas High School campus during the shooting. [...] That was a grievous mistake. It was absolutely wrong. And I am sorry."
@goaded but how do you explain David Hogg's conflicting stories?
You have heard of redstate, right? It's not really a bastion of liberalism.He was there at the time, hiding in a closet, where he recorded some video. Afterwards, he went home, then came back hours later, around 6pm, to interview other students.twitter.com/.../978729939192164352"Let’s be VERY clear: my original interpretation of the CBS video was WRONG. It was a mistake. Hogg was definitely at school during the shooting, went home several hours later and biked back around 6 pm. Anyone saying otherwise is WRONG."
It's the American way! :)