Should there be a wall or send people back to work?

Should there be a wall or send people back to work?
From his side of “the pond” there seems to be no end to this issue in America. Who is going to blink first in this political impasse?
Updates:
There is an undoubted polarity on the issue of “the wall” in the majority of responses, something not dissimilar to the same opposing views we currently have in the UK as we pick our way through the national divide following the referendum on our leaving the European Union (Brexit).
Politics here has got quite “tribal” and whilst compromise or negotiation is key to moving on in reaching a resolution, there seems little evidence of this on both sides of “the pond”.

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Most Helpful Guys

  • Maybe I'm in the minority, but how does anyone see the wall as a good idea.

    I purely believe that they don't actually care about what it does, they just care if there president does anything in the term they've voted him into.

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    • Their president*

    • San Diego had a wall put up in 2004 and saw a drop of over 90% in border crossings. That is why CNN this week asked for and then declined an interview with a reporter from a company affiliate in SD.

    • @Liam_Hayden in Sandiago, obviously they're going to go to other states instead if they heard about a wall in a specific place. They're not going to stop if it's all over the border.

  • I'll add something I saw because it's accurate.

    Trump is asking for 5.7 billion out of an annual budget of 4.407 trillion. In other words, he's asking for $57 out of an annual budget of $44,070. Think about that.

    Imagine your partner sahing, "We are not going to work, the kids are not getting allowances, and the bills are not getting paid until you give up this silly idea of spending $57 to put a fence in our yard."

    This is what Pelosi and Schumer have halted the government for.

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    • An enlightening answer but can I ask, Will a wall really stop people? Can’t people move by air and sea? I don’t know the logistics so just asking.

    • I was having this discussion with an old acquaintance. I told her the walls seem to work very well for places like the Vitican and we help fund walls for Turkey, Israel, Saudi Arabia, and Jordan. Those walls seem to work well. Even Area 51 has a "wall" provided by mountains. All these places are heavily secure. Is it possible to get around them? Of course, depending on how determined they are. Is it probable? Not so much and that's the point, to make it so much more difficult people say "why bother?"

    • Thank you for explaining

Most Helpful Girls

  • all this over the funding for the wall. I thought I heard Trump say in his election speech when ask who would pay for it the said Mexico, am I wrong in this

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    • Yes the trade deal With Mexico pays for it

    • an add on, Nicola your right again, trouble from all sides of the pond, it doesn't matter here what most wanted and I do wonder how much our politicians have invested in the EU to try and stop what was voted on

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What Guys Said 38

  • You know what: trump won promising the people to build a wall and the democrats are literally telling the people that, NO, the democrats don't care about the vote.
    Blaming it all on trump, will only work with dem fans.

    you know what pisses me off. that dems funded NGOs in countries far away from their own, with substantial amounts of money from the budget. And slowly proves those NGOs have links to attempts at overthrowing local governments. Even here in Europe.
    So money existed for that kind of "objectives" but now that trump asks for something that people voted for, you say the money could be used differently and more efficiently.

    How differently? funding NGOs across the globe is more suitable?

    Also interesting, how FBI suddenly launches an investigation intro Trump links to Russia, though the one that accused Trump of using Putin's help to win elections, admitted he lied.

    It's clear the secret services are not please with Trump, but interfering with political decisions or trying to overturn the VOTE, is NOT the mark of a democracy.

    Let the generals come and rule America and stop voting. At least at that point it will all be there for people to see and not a lie about "democracy" and "vote"
    .
    But nooo, the secret services like the position they are in because it gives them the highest control and little to no chance of ever having to put up with people criticism or having to pay for their actions.

    The secret services love pulling the strings from the shadows and giving people the false sense that their "vote" influences the country's faith, when in fact the politicians are just tools in the hands of the secret services.
    When politicians don't want to obey, as with Trump, the second the president is invested, the main objective is to "impeach", though he was VOTED.

    At this point, the democrats and the secret services are opposing the popular vote and worse than everything, they are using the suffering of budgetary people as propaganda against the VOTE.
    Sounds more like communism manipulation of masses to me! NOT democracy.

    Like the Brexit in Great Britan. The vote was crushing, the procedure was started and negotiations are being made.
    Anti-brexit liberal politicians say that it shouldn't happen and are blocking the parliament.
    Are you a fucking joke?
    Get on with what the people VOTED to happen and shut the fuck up or get lost.

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    • sorry for the swears. I just get pissed at politicians that want to overturn the "vote", no matter who their are. Why is there even a vote in this world if the ones in the shadows don't like it?

      Vote happens.
      If it fits the people in the shadows, it's ok. If not, they try to blatantly overlook the vote and do their own way anyway.
      What's the use?

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    • @hhues it's your election system, change it to whatever you want, but make it clear to everyone BEFORE actually voting. With the election system in place at the time of the vote, Trump won. End of story.

      Don't act as if the rules of the game are flawed just because the other is winning. Changing rules should be in-between games, not mid-game. Be fair about it and accept what comes out of that game.

      Polls in NY times... that's the evidence we needed. Trump will resign now.

    • I've never agreed with the whole electoral college thing, but I dont have a choice but to deal with it. You're talking as if I'm only disagreeing with it because I don't like who won.

  • Wow “the greatist negotiator ever” seems to really suck at, well, negotiating.
    Could it be he’s a liar?
    Oh wait we know he is, given all the lies we have him on tape saying.

    And now people are having to lose apartments and homes because rent dosen’t wait. Those people have children.
    Good job ‘murcia. Pathetic.

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    • It would be nice if they’d negotiate and not just talk about it

  • Here's the answer to your question from ANGUS KING, Independent Senator from Maine:

    The Senate passed a bipartisan resolution that would have avoided the current situation. President Trump forced a partial shutdown over his demands for an undefined wall along the southern border. The ongoing shutdown was easily avoidable; now, the fallout is hurting people in Maine and across the country, while further eroding the already too-little faith left in this institution. The President’s unwillingness to compromise or even seriously negotiate has resulted in unnecessary harm for hardworking families. Nine federal departments have not received a cent of funding since December 21st—meaning that 800,000 federal employees across the nation are either furloughed or working without compensation. That includes the brave men and women serving in the Coast Guard, who are not receiving paychecks during the shutdown. The Department of Agriculture has stopped issuing vital loans and grants for housing, critical research projects at the National Institute of Health (NIH) have been disrupted, and the Violence Against Women Act (VAWA) has lapsed. Trash is piling up in national parks across the country.. Most IRS operations have ceased—and if the shutdown continues, it will likely impact preparations for tax season. Each day this shutdown drags on, innocent Americans are hurt.
    As to the border, I want to state unequivocally that no one in the Congress, including me, is in favor of ‘open borders’. This is not a choice between the ‘wall’ and border security; it is about achieving true border security in a practical and cost-effective way.
    Democratic and Republican colleagues join me in my belief that our border must be protected by evidence-based and cost-effective methods. Physical barriers are useful in some cases, and for this reason we already have approximately 700 miles of them on the southern border. A physical wall from the Pacific Ocean to the Gulf of Mexico, however—costing $20 million per mile—is not a good use of tax payer money and is not even the best mechanism for curbing illegal immigration. This is because, today, a growing portion (now about 50%) of undocumented immigrants in the country entered legally, with a visa, but then overstayed their authorized time here—and wall would have no effect whatsoever on this problem. Further evidence suggests that a physical wall would not even be effective in stopping illegal crossings: a 2017 Government Accountability Office report determined that between 2010 and 2015 alone, the existing border walls were breached nearly 10,000 times. Modern-day problems require modern-day solutions, and the President’s border wall proposal does not adequately address our true border security or immigration enforcement needs.
    Currently, the most serious problem on the southern border is the influx of asylum seekers fleeing violence in Honduras, El Salvador, and Guatemala—three of the most dangerous countries in the world. These people are not trying to sneak in (or “invade”) the country; to the contrary, they come to existing legal border crossings and give themselves up to border patrol agents and ask for asylum under our laws. And, so again, a wall would have zero impact this problem.

    The President also repeatedly invokes the flow of drugs as another justification for a wall, but the facts do not support his case. His own Drug Enforcement Agency has stated that the vast majority of illegal drugs come through official ports of entry, hidden in vehicles. Again, a wall does nothing to address this admittedly serious problem.
    One of the problems with the current stalemate is that the President has never presented a plan of exactly what he is proposing in terms of location, design, and cost—only that he wants a “wall”. No responsible public body would commit billions of dollars without a detailed plan; simply saying that we need “a wall” is not enough.
    (continued...)

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    • One final note—I am deeply concerned that if Congress capitulates to the President’s demands in the current situation, holding the federal government hostage for some policy goal unattainable through the normal legislation process will become a repeated tactic for the remainder of the President’s term, and for succeeding presidents as well. It would be incredibly dangerous to set a precedent that the President can and will shut down the government over his or her policy priorities—especially when those priorities do not align with those of Congress and are not in the best interests of the American people.

      Congress and the President must fulfill their constitutional duty to pass a budget to fully fund the government—it is irresponsible and reckless to do otherwise. I am hopeful that my colleagues on both sides of the aisle will be able to work with the President to pass a spending bill that invests in our nation’s future, protects national security—including at the border—and builds on the past few years’ economic progress.

      ANGUS KING,
      Senator from Maine

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    • The House passed a bill to pay the workers and make their positions "mandatory" by a vote of 411-7 and the Senate did so unanimously. Trump has said he will sign the bill. The "poor federal workers" claim just collapsed.

    • @Liam_Hayden Thanks for the incomplete information, Liam. Reported like a true Republican and Trump supporter. The bill guarantees BACK PAY to furloughed workers --- AFTER the shutdown ENDS !!! Mr. King's assessment is still quite valid. Trump is nothing but a petulant asshole used to getting his way, and he's holding the country hostage to do it. Congress as a whole doesn't have the balls to cut him down... yet. Meanwhile, the damage being done to sites in our parks alone, is outrageous. These are things that can NEVER be replaced or repaired. Trump doesn't care. Report the WHOLE news next time.

  • They are all retarded as Fuck, and should be forced to switch countries with the Mexicans so they can see why they are so desperate to run away to the states, risking everything in the process including their life. Then have the mexicans build a wall once they are there to prevent Americans from running back to their old country. That would be the ideal situation

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  • Well the fact is Trump isn't, more then likely, going to go back on his statement as boarder security was one of his campaign promises. In fact the democrats, before Trump took office where all for more boarder security, its only now that he is saying it that they are against it. So its pretty well known that this is only a political maneuver on the left which makes their position weaker as one can easily go to youtube and hear their own words about wanting a boarder wall/physical barrier on the boarder. So the longer this goes on the weaker their position is going to be (as the majority of americans want more security (and not because they are racist despite what democrats are saying, legal immigration is always welcomed and always will be (I hope) its illegal aliens and the human/drug trafficking and the exploitation of our welfare system that is making this an issue)). So if Trump where to back down it would actually hurt his voter base, if democrats don't back down it will make them even more isolated then they already are (as they have steadily started losing the moderates and moderate lefts). So I don't see Trump backing down anytime soon (also he was trying to work with them and they refused (as they have done everything in their power to stonewall him at every turn) so they are the ones who will largely be blamed for this as well.

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  • I think Trump needs to quit trying to get everything he wants. Back to work of course. If they want, all of the 3 houses can take a pay cut to help the economy.

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    • I just don’t see it in his make up to back down

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    • It works on The Walking Dead so why not just do that? Snipers waiting for anyone who tries to cross.

    • @meatloverspizza so true. Lol.

  • They can just approve the funding it’s not a big deal. It’s just a steel barrier so what lol

    I’m surprised they have convinced Americans to not have a steel fence to protect their borders from criminals not legal. Criminals 😂😂😂

    America is such jokes sometimes though. Ya’ll real stupid sometimes fighting against your own safety

    One day there will be a ww3 —> that wall could save the country at a point potentially

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    • @TripleAce you are a fool if you believe that stupid wall would stop anyone or anything from coming in.

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    • @spartan55 compare anything. Anything works as long as the logic stays the same

      Why test a medication in a lab before we test it on humans. Might as well just test it on humans

      Much like we test the fence and wall on a private house. Now we can model that to a larger area

      Simple

    • @spartan55 That was all you had? Fairly predictable because there's really no argument. The point is walls mitigate traffic. It's obvious that they don't 100% entirely guarantee stopping everything. The argument is that they do nothing. If that was the case, Nancy wouldn't have a wall to protect herself from all the people she's scared of in San Francisco. Walls help mitigate or and help detour. That's why countries and rich people use them. They can obviously combine other technology with cumulative effects as well. There's no argument though. Dems are amazingly pathetic now a days. They supported the wall back in 2004. Now walls do nothing though because it helps her politics. Have some integrity. It's easy to see other countries have used border walls to block people.

  • He and the lemmings around him.. when he said ‘Who’s going to pay for the wall’ and they shouted ‘Mexico’ you shut down the government because ‘Mexico’ isn’t paying for the wall and told you go to hell. You then say ‘you will take the mantle and not blame the Democrats’ on live television, but 10 days later you do...

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  • Build the wall the bottom line is the Demcrats can fix this we all know Trump is like a small child and will not give in and the Democrats are crybabies in their own right so just give him the funding

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    • Small children having tantrums and stamping feet is how it seems to me

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    • Don’t know, mine was +1 which I’ve given to all for their input

    • People either love or hate Trump and usually all of those people are clueless they either think he is the devil or he can do no wrong and really he is not horrible and he is not great

  • Id rather give the workers their jobs back at this point. From what i have read many immigrants come by plane and people have already cut through the "wall" using a hand held saw.

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  • There was a wall, it got torn down In 1991, it don't work and is pointless. Ever heard about a ladder? Or even ropes? If someone really wants to go somewhere then a wall will do nothing.

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  • Nearly a million people needlessly suffering, or a stupid wall? I pick the people

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    • I’m with you - people and their families have to come first

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    • @TsubasaCorrupted, agree.

      @MeatLoversPizza, the democrats are slightly to the right, but just not as much to the right as republicans, so I didn't expect them to have very good politics. I think Bernie Sanders care more about the poor than the average democrat. He's more of a social-democrat.

    • Did you vote him in? Now, vote him out!!!

  • I think there are faults on both sides. they need to find some kind of compromise or things are going to get really bad

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  • They should send people to work but both the Democrats
    and Republicans are feuding over a matter that just can be
    fixed. Well, from Senator Pat Toomey, in the State of Pennsylvania
    where i live in US. They been trying to build a wall since 2013
    but President Obama could not get it passed , now this is a
    Republican Senator so hard to believe what's true or what is
    make believe but this Government shutdown is doing more
    damage than helping people so yes people need to get back
    to work.

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  • Trump is a RHINO. Here is what REAL Republicans think:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GCO9BYCGNeY

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    • Clearly the concept of context alludes you

    • @cavmanier Nothing to do with it. Russia illegally occupying another country , wall separated Germany.. You socialist liberals must get your facts right

    • @Poormanscomedian it does not surprise me that democrats are exploiting lack of history knowledge from their followers and compare apples with oranges. It's insulting to their own supporters, but the propaganda and manipulation team behind these "social media shares" knows very few will realize it or fact-check the information.

  • I want my stuff! Yes force them back to work and boxing!
    southpark.cc.com/clips/r2a1a7/amazon-usda-choice

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  • An agreement must be met. So let them argue until they agree.

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    • The trouble is that there seems to be irresistible force meets immovable object - no one wins / everyone loses

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    • OK but he doesn’t seem to be wanting to seek compromise at the moment. Fingers crossed he does,

    • Why would he go into dealings saying "I'm willing to compromise"? That would weaken his position.

  • Just built the wall already. America doesn't owe other nations any favors. Every country on earth must fight to built themselves to be better and not depend on others for help.

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  • Pay the unpaid Government workers to build the wall.

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  • I’ve always been against building a border wall, even though I am in favor of selective immigration policies that would target attracting high skilled workers while keeping unskilled workers out. If he wants to spend on infrastructure, then he should work to expand things like the number of EV charging stations (e. g. expanded network of charge point locations in municipalities), high speed rail projects (e. g. Brightline in Florida), extend tax credits for solar infrastructure, increase high speed internet infrastructure (e. g. Google Fiber), etc. Those sorts of things would create large projects for civil/electrical/environmental engineers and create long term jobs for communication technicians, electricians, trainmen, conductors, service attendants, etc. while reducing demand on foreign energy sources, increasing transportation and communication conveniences, and encouraging real estate development around those pieces of infrastructure.

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    • What infrastructure did Obama do?

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    • @Rissyanne Learn to read. This thread is asking if a border wall should be built today during Trumps term or if people should go back to work. Government employees should go back to work, I’m just stating that if he wants to do infrastructure projects there are better options. If you build a wall in the middle of the desert as a statement that you want to keep illegal aliens out, that money is initially going to employ civil engineers and construction workers, but it’s not going to be a force multiplier in improving the economy. Once a wall in the middle of nowhere is built people are not going to relocate and build nice things around it because it’s neither beautiful or useful. It then just becomes a burdon to maintain. There are things that can make cities operate better and make areas more desirable for development of new real estate projects, relocation of high tech businesses, improve areas for tourism and scientific research, etc. Those initial investments in infrastructure encourage the private industry to invest 100 times what the government does into those areas and create tons of new jobs. None of that has anything to do with some guy that use to be president and will never be one again.

      @shephardjhon I’m not tied to any corporation, I just used Google Fiber as an example because they offer one gigabit (1000 mbps) up and down with no cap while many cable providers are offering 50 mbps down and like 10 mbps up with a monthly data cap. Having more areas with very good internet access helps to attract STEM companies and workers. As far as EV charging stations, I mentioned that because we are very deficient in our EV infrastructure when you compare it against places like Japan. If we improved that infrastructure it would make more sense for a larger portion of the population which would increase demand for EVs in the US. That could make cities cleaner and more livable, reduce demand for foreign oil, and even help manufacturing in the USA

    • (Tesla, Workhorse, etc.). Some projects create far more good jobs than the initial project investment. Those of the sort of infrastructure projects are what I think we should focus on.

  • Democrats just don't want to do anything that gives Trump a win even though they all agreed the wall to be built before even though America builds walls in other countries and illegal immigration drop drastically in those countries take Israel's border wall.

    The cost of the wall is 5 billion dollars illegal aliens cost America hundreds of billions of dollars a year.

    It really is just about Not Giving Trump a win so they have better odds in 2020. But it's going to greatly backfire on the Democrats

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    • Talk about MISinformation !! Good Lord. When he first started with "The Wall", that was his number. Then he went to $7-10 billion. Then it went to $15 billion. Now he says maybe $20 billion. Maybe. Not only doesn't he know what he's talking about cost wise, he doesn't acknowledge where the drugs are coming in from, which is NOT going to be stopped by a wall ! Read the letter above from Senator King.

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    • @Rissyanne 1. The BBC is not now, nor has it ever been a newspaper.

      2. What source would you believe?

    • @goaded nothing you would post.

  • Again, what were his actual reasons for the national emergency? I only know of the so called "shut down" which is to come up whenever no new debts can be negotiated.

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  • Ha thank god I'm not an American, "hears no deal in brexit" time to immigrate to Canada those business don't like certainity.

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  • Build the wall, it's a monument of sovereignty and zero tolerance for freeloaders.

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  • boo freakin hoo you have people working for what they don't believe in.

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  • Wall and we should layoff most of the workers to pay for it

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    • Ok so surrender your paycheck. Since you want to volunteer other people’s paycheck

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    • Welll to keep producing them we need trade. Every device has a component in it that is not made in the United States. You would be surprised where it’s actually from but that’s besides the point... and all these foreign luxury cars would go... things like that. Literally majority of trump supporters are undercover racist who just disguise themselves. Just be honest, people like you don’t want them in our country not because of violence, or drug trafficking or whatever the hell else you guys made up... it’s simply because they are Mexican. Because they are a minority. You don’t care about actually American lives ( because you don’t care if they get paid or not) you just don’t want Them in the country... How about we worry about our domestic issues as a country within. Then worry about others.

    • Your completely missing my point. This is why I can never have a debate with y’all die hard trump supporters. Who cares if it was 26 trillion ( which you stated first) or 5 billion. Did you read anything else I said

  • First off, people aren't working because Congress can't agree on shit. Whether or not there should be a wall has no bearing on the government shutdown. Second, the ones who don't have work will receive back pay when the government resumes, so it's not as if these people aren't going to get paid. They're actually going to get paid for doing nothing, but that's neither here nor there. The government should get back to work and decide on a wall or not. It's not a matter of "wall or work" it's "work or continue to be obstinate".

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    • Do they get their houses back if they're foreclosed on for non-payment?

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    • I seem to recall someone being foreclosed on for a debt of a few cents...

    • I speak to that one way or another.

  • Wall and we should layoff most of the workers to pay for it

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  • We only need 5.7 billion dollars so every American throws in $20 and its covered and or put a large calliber bullet through trumps head

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    • 20 x 320,000,000 = 2bn.

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    • Yep mars survayer 98

    • Did NASA stop using imperial measurements, yet? Furlongs per fortnight was cute, but metric makes a lot more sense.

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    8

What Girls Said 5

  • Honestly, it's not going to be built. We're already in so much debt, it's in the trillions. We can't afford a wall just to appease this guys tantrum and it's hurting the lower class and working class sections.

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    • Unfortunately it’s the workers who are paying the price

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    • @cavmanier just over 5 billion is peanuts they have far more to spend if so lol
      It’s clear it’s just political now. The race for 2020

      If they can stop trump from getting a wall. You bet it’s to use it against him in 2020
      That’s all it’s for. They don’t actually believe the wall is a bad idea. They’ve propose it themselves lol that’s the funny part

      People are so stupid 😂

    • @TripleAce It's amazing how fast they become fiscal hawks! The party of entitlements cares about saving money lol. Hilarious.

      I agree. They are doing it so they can say, "AND WE DIDN'T GIVE THAT RACIST ORANGE MAN HIS WALL. WE'EEEE." *Drinks soy*

      True. The same two democrats against it voted for funding our border wall in 2004 I believe it was... They are so full of shit. Complete liars and performers for whatever trend is currently in vogue to get votes. At least Trump says what he's thinking. He doesn't give a fuck.

  • Back to work, the wall is idiotic and a waste of money.

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    • Your rich democrats live behind walls and gated communities. Do you think that’s stupid?

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    • @Rissyanne I already gave you one. My bots and the others made by immigrant researchers WILL take your job.

    • @shephardjhon dude go back and play your video games

  • I don't understand why if the wall was so important and immediately necessary the Republicans didn't pass the legislation a few months ago when they had a supermajority in Congress.

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  • There should be a wall and send people back to work.

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  • Send them to work building the wall.

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