To correct myself I started off with "never" then gave a more thought out rationale. The percentages are my actual thoughts. The never statement is just how pointless it feel to even try to do Dutch or let a woman pay.
I think its just the women you've been out with. But I've heard from someone that if a man doesn't pay for the first date then that means he won't take care of you well during marriage.
It's that kind of assumption that is the very reason men have to pay.
No, most men I've went out with actually want to pay, not cuz they are forced to. Many of them make faces or get irritated when I refuse
All the guys who I've been out with have paid for dates. The only guy who didn't end up turning out to be an asshole.
I think you need to do some more open minded research. Men spend hundreds of dollars on dates and courtship gifts and the like. Women often spend less then 10% of that in reciprocity. We do it because its expected of us.
Don’t forget how much women spend on makeup, clothes , shoes to attract a mans attention. If you want a decent looking guy, you can’t look like shit
Not all guys hate paying for dates. Just because you hate it, it doesn’t mean all guys hate it. I’ve went out with many many guys. Typically if he’s a nice guy, he will pay. I would always pay for myself back then. Until I heard someone say that a man who doesn’t pay won’t take care of you well during marriage. Now I’ve changed
Biologically men take care of women. It’s the reason why men are so protective of women. Men let me get off the train or elevator first. Make strangers always come to my assistance when I am in potential danger. there have been men who died protecting women. So if a man has a huge problem with paying for a woman , it’s a pretty good indicator that he’s not gonna take care of her well during marriage.
It all goes back to the cavemen and cavewoman era
What you are describing is cultural expectations. Just because we follow the expectations of our respective cultures doesn't mean we all like them. Also think about what you just said honestly. If a man doesn't pay for dinner he won't take care of you? I thought the whole point of relationships is to care for each other?
Another difference between your makeup theory and male spending is women get to retain everything after the fact. You may buy makeup but makeup and clothing is multipurpose and you get to use it for other functions. What a man spends on a woman is gone and is not returning especially if nothing comes of a date. Men basically throw a couple hundred on the gamble that a woman may like them enough for a second date.
And actually during caveman cavewoman era. A man would just knock you on the head and drag you to his cave... well historically that would be the basic premise for most era's really
"I thought the whole point of relationships is to care for each other? "Not all husband care for their wives well. Marriage is really not a promise that a husband will be a good husband. "What a man spends on a woman is gone and is not returning especially if nothing comes of a date"A man spends on a woman to impress and woo her. A woman spends on looking nice so she can get a man to accept and chase her. Both genders have something to gain out of it. If you ever studied biological human nature, men like to hunt, women like to nest. Men tend to seek way more than women which is why you always see men flocking to bars to hit on girls. Its also the reason why male seats at speed dating events fill up so faster than womens, so they charge much higher prices for men seats. At bar events, ladies can always go in for free while men have to pay. Because hosts know that there will be way more men than women attending such events. Men have the natural urge to seek and hunt which is why they chase. Men and womens brains are shaped by evolution. If you don't know what that is, maybe you should do some research. From my experience, a nice guy would be very willing to pay. If you're not a nice guy, you wouldn't want to pay. It all depends on who you are. You can't insist that all men hate paying and think you're correct.
evolution is why women prefer taller men while men prefer short women. This is based on men wanting to protect while she wants to feel protected. It goes back to the cavemen era. Same reason why men find big breasts and wide hips attractive because it shows a sign of good fertility. Women like muscular guys because it shows he can protect her well and he's high in testosterone which is an indicator of fertile sperm.
I am going to bow out of this particular discussion because I am becoming offended by your accusations that i am somehow a bad man for desiring the respect of being treated equally with a potential partner. In addition you a blinded by preconceptions of what men are.
dude im not trying to offend you. I'm just giving you some insight into science and evolution. nothing about this was personal
I see no scientific basis or grounds for the idea that a man not paying for dinner correlates to him being an unfit caretaker. Anthropology tells us culture dictates many of our person to person interactions or what would be our social norms. Who pays for a date is effectively a social norm. You can't allocate biological science to courtships because the rules of courtship is a cultural phenomenon not a biological one (well aside from sex). If only biological sciences dictated courtships this world would not be pretty.
I think you’re just being emotional. Just because you don’t like it, it doesn’t mean it’s not true
Interesting...I attempt to bow out respectfully and you claim you were just having a healthy debate based on science. So when I come back to the table with scientific fact you claim I'm being emotional... very interesting
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you are only one person
A truly good woman will refuse.
The thing is, most women always feel that they're good and anything that goes against what they want is bad.Hence why nearly every women says "men are trash".Could be as severe as a partner beating her to make her call men trash, or a guy wanting to split the bill that makes her call him trash.
@Armourdillo Most women do not say men are trash. Its trashy men who call women trash. Trashy women call men trash. If you are hateful towards women, it has more to do with you than women. same thing vice versa
You're claim is "men are trash" is not a common saying that is socially okay.While men saying "women are trash" is celebrated in society, correct?
@Armourdillo I don't think men are trash. I don't think women are trash either. The reality is, trashy men typically only attract trashy women. So if all the women you've dated were trashy, giving you a trashy experience, it can't mean you're a top quality guy.
No I'm asking about you denying that women saying "men are trash" is not common and those who do are ridiculed and shamed by society and that men who say "women are trash" are emboldened.
@Armourdillo And frequently trashy men always blame trashy women for having a shitty relationship experience. But reality is, he is also to blame for the shitty relationship.
You're not listening to me, I'm done.