Correction: the workshop was titled "Violence Against Women Awareness & Culture Change Training for Men" - here is part of the description:"This workshop demonstrates how men can facilitate cultural change and influence the academic environment in a way that increases safety for women."To my knowledge, our culture has looked down upon and actively discouraged any and every form of violence against women. Increase safety for women... well I can understand that, but the title of the workshop did not represent that at all. I actually didn't read more about the event once I saw the title so I probably should have read more about it first. But the title wording was extremely poor.
Dude they’re still under puberty, when they go through and exit puberty majority lose interest in sophistication and naturally progress towards nurturing jobs. Just as most men after puberty lose focus on logic and tend to focus on being desirable to the opposite gender, just as women
Thanks for the MHO 👍🏼
You are welcome!
Actually if you look at research women are better at math and science after the age of 13 if given encouragement. They do better on both standardized testing, assignments, and competition. Historically women's roles in math and sciences have been minimized or forgotten all together. Look up the "Matilda Effect" it's a backed historical president where women's names were put at the end of scientific papers or left off all together. It also encompasses how historically even when an idea was a women's that her male counterparts would get the awards and credit for the idea.The fact is that throughout history women has continuely invented, theorized, and discovered just as many important and ground breaking ideas as men. Society tended to ignore this fact or belittle these women. Many women published around men's names just so they could be heard equally in their scientific field.
@mckatowitz wrong. thats feminist pseudoscience. funny how you say women are better at it when it was men who invented it lmao. Women are just learning some old mans equations and theories
mckatowiz tell that to the SATs
Also name some female inventions. There's nothing groundbreaking unless you wanna go off with a gamma bias
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You do realize not having those programs for guys is sexist? Girls have lots of girl ownly scholarships in stem than men do, yet it is men who are graduating all levels of education I fewer numbers. I'm not saying they should have these for women, but that they should also have the same level if care for the men/boys.
From my understanding, the stem program was for girls and boys, but they are pushing for more girls to attend because there are hardly any compared to the amount of boys. I am only speaking for the situation I was involved in. The school and the program available did not actively exclude anyone or any gender.
Yet girls are being hired at 3x more in stem. And yes I know you are talking about personal experience
But if there is a girls only stem then... I still wouldn’t consider it sexist because the same intentions are there. Girls who are interested don’t bother because of multiple reasons. Them opening up a space for girls to feel welcomed because they obviously weren’t feeling welcomed before.To say that it’s sexist is to say it was made because they are suggesting that the females are better than the boys. In my personal opinion, that really isn’t the case.Some female only spaces are sexist, but not this one. The context is important.
But that shouldn't mean you don't give men the same opportunities.
I agree but I don’t think men are losing out. Fewer women apply for those jobs and internships, therefore they’ll get hired more frequently.
Um, your logic seems to be backwards. And just because more men are still in it doesn't mean some men are missing out on getting into stem because they aren't being given the same opportunity as those women are.
I don’t see why you think that.The rate at which women are being hired due to fewer female applicants will be higher. That doesn’t mean these programs aren’t noticing how the overall women who are interested aren’t trying in the first place. That doesn’t mean the ratio of female to male stem workers isn’t worth concern.
For every 1 man hired 3 women are. Your logic seems backwards.
Part of that may have more to do with the fact that since the 1980s far more women then men have sought and finished college degrees. The number of women finishing Masters and PhDs has increased as well. If you look at the actual data though women are 30% less likely then men to be hired for the same job that they are equally qualified for.You can easily Google this to see the research.
But not in stem. Men are also more likely to ask for a raise travel further for work and work longer hours. As an employer why wouldn't you want those traits over someone else. I'm not saying they assume men do and women don't, but how they act in an interview shows that type of personality. Fyi those traits are likely why men often make more, after you account for the same job.And if women were graduating less than men feminists would be going crazy and fighting for more scholarships, yet when it is men no one cares.
I look at this similar to the issue with young girls not doing things such as joining the swimming team or a variety of similar groups because of body insecurity. If these girls are out there and truly want to do it, but are held back by that fear. Then cool. Address that fear for those girls who actually want that. That's is a good thing.But if it's just a sales pitch for any and everyone. Trying to sell men on how we NEED more women and selling women on that idea as well. But if the pitch is empowering people and more specifically women to pursue their dreams, whatever that looks like. I can get behind that.
Did you consider it is biologically inherent that girls are drawn less to the STEM fields?
@FakeName123 its possible but is the ability to do STEM biological?
No, but it makes a lot of things a waste of money at best, social engineering at worst. Especially when there are people and political groups that demand 50:50 representation plus lawmaking.To achieve that despite biological differenes you have to push Girls into these fields that eventualy realise its not what they want and/or sabotage boys. Both are curently happening and creating major issues
@FakeName123 I say leave girls the option but when you have to stack the deck to meet gender quotas then that's a problem. Like the majority of sewer workers and miners are male and the majority of teachers and nurses are female are we going to enforce gender quotas in those industries too?
@FakeName123 there is a biological aspect to it, with men more left hemisphere dominated and girls being more right hemisphere dominated. With the left hemisphere responsible for that reforming tasks that have to do with logic. E. g. science and maths.
Thats true. Women by nature are more interested in working with people, given that most that type of career field is dominated by women, like nursing, teachers, caretakers, etc. Men by nature are more interested in things, like machines, engineering and building. Which is also far more scaleable in the income bracket. Courtesy of Dr. Jordan Peterson
Balancing out? So you want. To force women to become scientists and force men to become beauticians?
@grega239 Lol! XD What are you talking about? How does giving people a choice of doing something equate to forcing them into a job they don't want? A lot of young people have no idea what field they want to go into but are content to do many different things. If people get a chance to try something different & it works for them, they might pursue something they hadn't thought of before. That's it. Nursing is also VERY different to makeup etc. Since they're the ones that do most of the hands on medical treatment, they're the ones strapping people being violent to beds or carting equipment or physically moving invalids. Not to mention, kids in distress often respond really well to guys but I know that from working with them in child care.Forcing anyone into any industry is only going to end badly, manipulating, even worse. But stubborn businesses who make a proud point of not hiring wo/men (if they can help it), end up limiting their opportunities for investment, growth & capturing the market. It doesn't really matter if there's an equal amount of both in the workplace but the opportunities for people to join, progress & make an impact. When it comes to important things like STEM that can push society forward, well if there's *anyone* that can make that better/faster/more secure it'd be ridiculous to not give them a path to it.
Women already have the choice to go into stem. Some choose not to and some don't qualify. There is no balancing it out.
I went to an airshow a month ago and for every woman there was about 10 men. Women didn't need someone to tell them that there's these things called planes flying in the sky. They grow up like men do but they dont have the interest. No program can change that or should try to change that
@DeshawnMGTOW I'm guessing there's a key aspect about how this issue has been handled in the US that makes it about much more than just having more women in the workplace. The hard work a lot of guys have to do to get into certain fields usually goes overlooked but they deserve to have their ambitions supported just as much. This isn't about people being smart enough or not but having a chance to understand & appreciate things they wouldn't normally & if that leads to a career, it does.
Ooh you're a STEM girl? Which area of STEM are you studying?
@SpiderManFan2002 biology and chemistry
Oh cool- I'm studying Computer Science right now! :) <3*STEM girl high five* ;P
@SpiderManFan2002 :) :)
Not many people are ever interested in logic in their whole life, let alone at that age. It's just a set of rules that are hopefully internalized by children post puberty, then they apply those rules to other concepts from various fields (math, physics, or... politics) to derive conclusions from premises. People are usually interested in the conclusions, some forget about the premises, and most don't think too much about the paths between them. The interest in building these paths, aka the interest in logic, is often developed later on, informal logic (most people just stop here and declare their internet argument logical) -> propositional logic -> predicate logic -> serious adult work on logic. Unless you mean the rapper.
I'm glad that there are girls on this site with interest in S T E M though
Shame to hear that about your friends. At least you’re still on the STEM career path. 👌🏾🧫🧪🧬
@FakeName123 no I think that we push robots and science experiments more towards boys so that is what causes this
I’m a boy and I’ve never heard people pushing men a certain profession and women another.I believe majority of women do what women do best, care and nurture therefore inherently choose those fields. You may get some that after puberty aren’t extremely feminine and don’t care about wanting male attention and end up in a STEM field or trade school
@Apple1996There is zero evidence for this claim. On the other hand there are studies showing that men and women gravitate more towards gendertypical interests. In fact there even is a study showing that the more freedom people have the more they gravitate towards it. Or in laymans terms: Women in oppressive environments such as Saudi-Arabia are more likely to be interested in Stemp-Topic than their more free counterparts
Maybe but then shouldn't there be an equal push to get boys into stuff girls typically do like into nursing and teaching using gender quotas?
Did you consider it is biologically inherent that girls are drawn less to the STEM fields? Like you say Girls need encouragement. That might be because they actually dont want to
@The_White_Queen - I think it's a good idea to teach boys nursing (medical assistance) and home economics (cooking, cleaning up a kitchen). And I don't think those are feminine.
Lol teaching guys that would ruin a stem-potential person. Girls are generally better at home related stuff. Country would only develop better if traditional roles are chosen. Jordan Peterson
Do we give them a choice?
@The_White_Queen definitely. Ever seen anywhere written in a uni advertisement women can't apply for stem fields?
people shouldn't need to be encouraged or supported to go after they dreams
yeah but, speaking from my own experience, it’s much harder to feel like that dream is possible if you never see people like yourself in media representation of that dream.
oh yeah thats fair
Agreed , if they can't do the task needed to join. How will they do the (job) there hired in to do?
@xkildy Exactly. It makes no sense. It's just some more silly feminist stuff which is going to cause more good than bad, yet again.
As always bending to the will of others
@xkildy Haha yup
In proper hard science fields like math and physics, it's the opposite, women are often treated like precious treasure if possible, e. g the woman who created the first image of the black hole, or the woman who discovered spin memory effect, impressed Stephen Hawking (and me) with her solo paper on asymptotic symmetries and electromagnetic memory, she's also hailed as the next Einstein... also all the girls in our department are favored by the professors.
Omfg u think bio med isn't 'proper hard' math and physics 😂😂😂 u know nothing.
No need to be so sexist.The campaign is about encouraging those girls that already express interest in the sciences, to continue on the path instead of being steered away.
@Prof_Don i'm a social scientist. not a sexist. there are certain things that men are better at and certain things women are better at. i know feminists love to ignore that but it's a fact.
i personally think it's dumb to force everyone to be the same instead of letting people do what they are naturally good at.
OMG you believe there are zero girls and women in the world capable of excelling in STEM subjects & their applications?
@Prof_Don you haven't read what I first said have you? I said that "some" women can achieve in those fields and those that can should. Factually though the majority of women's natural disposition equips them with skills for other field as represented in what women choose to major in. This campaign is idiotic as it makes people choose for shit they're not good at. Take me as the example. Social science is usually a female domain. I as a man should be in the stem field but well I suck at math and I'm compassionate and interested in the humanities so I go for that. Men on average though are more fit for stem fields and saying that isn't sexist. It's a fact.
@Prof_Don I don't say stuff about people based on my ignorant opinion. There's stuff about society we know. We can't ignore that and the fact that women are underrepresented in certain fields has nothing to do with sexism or suppression. It has to do with "most women don't want to be in those fields cause they are just not good at it. That doesn't mean all women are not good at it. We just observe that it happens to be the case for most women.
You are presuming that all the girls and young women who want to pursue STEM careers... will do so without this type of promotion.That’s where you’re wrong. Many gals that DO have the interest and natural acumen for math science & engineering... get steered away from that due to societal & family cultural pressure.A campaign like this is to at least attempting to curb “steering away” of gifted and talented women from these fields.
@Prof_Don i am not "presuming". again. i'm a social scientist. those women who are predispositioned to excel in those jobs are naturally driven to them. there's no need to have big campeigns. all that does is attracting people that are insecure and don't know what they should do, leading to failure as that field was the wrong choice for them. this entire "gender equality movement" is complete bullshit and fucks people up instead of helping.
What do you mean?
#updog45 Goverment programs assisted me all through my stem program. Sounds great but eventually the guys went through the dirt and we actually able to learn more. So in some ways i was shielded from the harshness of engineering. I hate when there is programs for girls. Engineering is what it is... its damn hard and tough. Girls should learn to go through it just like men without someone holding their hands. It ruined my career.
Ahh I see, I agree 100%
If someone needs persuasion to follow a particular path of education (male or female), they're probably gonna end up disappointed
Males heavily dominate the % of people in STEM fields. The majority group doesn’t need “encouragement”
Yh fair enough but I don't really get why girls don't go towards stem difference in parenting maybe? I don't know really
@Prof_Don soz if it sounded accusatory or something
The parenting is exactly what the issue is. Family cultural ideas of "science and engineering is for boys". So outdated and needs to stop.
I suppose I never really got taught that so yh I guess
sexist statement. u are implying people all have the same thoughts if they are the same gender therefore only a new gender can create new thoughts.
Moronic. I’m saying that different types people bring in new experiences and fresh perspectives. No one is implying that narrow minded view that you seem to hold.
I don’t see how forcing diversity will do any good. Democrats want equal representation everywhere which isn’t possible. Forget STEM and Government what about oil drilling pipe line, or construction of any variety?
There is no forcing. There is encouragement. Do you know why many organizations fail? A few reasons are because they fail to adapt to the ever changing society and choose not to diversify, cutting themselves off from new outlooks that they might not get otherwise. This isn’t only about race and sex.STEM fields work in those areas and needs more people in those areas. The issue is that there is a lack of encouragement and an unspoken ridicule against certain groups in particular fields.
Humans have free will and choice. Pursue a career that interests YOU and not the collective. Very few women attend STEM due to interest not because a patriarchal society deterring their ambitions
"different types people bring in new experiences and fresh perspectives" . This question is about gender. So someone's gender determines whether they will have fresh perspectives or not. LOOOOL
But is this a problem because they are girls and there's something wrong with their ability to comprehend or is the problem that the k-12 grades way of testing is inherently flawed and not teaching young women the skills to Excell in these types of classes and fields?