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- Absolutely, positively NOT!
I even oppose a "Trans Olympics" unless it's unofficial. Would that be like Special Olympics or something? How many people would compete and how much public interest would there be?
I would see nothing at all wrong with opening men's competitions to trans and even women. Because of sexual dimorphism men are typically bigger, stronger and faster. So if a woman (or trans) could qualify for men's sports I would be in favor. What would be wrong with allowing women to play men's baseball, for example, if they were good enough. It should be about whether or not they are good enough, not their gender.
But, for obvious reasons, it doesn't work the same way when it comes to men competing in women's sports. Because of sexual dimorphism, men would have an unfair advantage. And so would former men.0|00|0Is this still revelant? - No matter what the mind may say, the physiological structures and genetics give trans-women a usually a decided edge over genetic women in the areas of physical strength, endurance, and size. For that reason I would be on the side of excluding trans-women from participating in women's athletics.
On the other hand, the physiologic and physical changes hormone therapy and gender reassignment surgery cause changes away from the traditional male efficiency and physiognomy, so trans-women do not belong in men's athletics either.
The only logical and reasonable solution is to have athletics for trans-women limited to trans-woman participation.
The same could be applied for trans-men's participation in athletics.0|00|0Is this still revelant?
Most Helpful Girls
- Hormones makes us weaker and the Olympic committee agrees that there is no discernible advantage for us after 1 year of hrt. I imagine someone will strawman up a randy savage style example where someone identifies but has not got their levels in balance but once medicated properly-muscles atrophy and depending on age your bones reshape a little. Which fucking hurts by the way.
I've had numerous bfs and gfs. I've never won a wrestling match with any of them and i used to compete in sports at a decent level when younger. I get my arse destroyed everytime i try.
So if properly medicated and addressed to have no advantage than yes.1|20|2Is this still revelant?30% muscle atrophy is the usual amount to lose. Also i was born intersex so even if you don't think I'm a women i am biologically neither and my lungs and heart are very much feminine due to a fucked up prenatal development
- Where should we put Bruce "Caitlyn" Jenner then if he/she/it decides that he/she/it wants to compete in sporting events again?
1|31|0Is this still revelant?
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2481- absolutely fucking not. this is not a question of political correctness and sexual preference. this is a question of physical setup. and compared to women, men are testosterone machines optimized for strenth, speed and coordination. you could barely dope a woman to the point where she performs like an average man... even world class female sportlers are only as good as regional class men at best.
so being a man with gender disphoria competing in female sports is nothing less but cheating.0|00|0 - Men and women's sports are kept separate for a reason. Having these trans athletes entering women's events makes a complete mockery of women's sports and athletes, Why would any young girl get in to sports like athletics when they are never going to win anything. Even with hormone replacement therapy a mans body is just built to be stronger. I understand that a having specific events for trans people will be difficult as you would be hard pushed to find enough of them, but you could introduce a handicap system like they have in horse racing to even up the advantage.0|10|0
- You must not support womens right and equality and title 9 if you support a 100% man taking hormones and choosing to live as a woman and kick the shit out of natural in their sports.
People have lost common sense and justice if they think that is just to women.
Lunacy0|00|0 - It was not an easy answer. We are seeing this transformation occur more frequently than in any other time in history. But it comes down to genetics. At the genetic level still a man. Because transformation tends to occur after the age of 18 when they have already started and possibly passed puburty, muscle size and strength will be more than natural woman as result of testosterone increase. An unfair advantage0|00|0
- One can be considered transgender without taking progressive hormones that change their physical strength and appearance. If they identify themselves as transgender but do not take any hormones, then I think it is fair game when they are competing with other women0|00|0
So males who have made no effort to change their behaviour or body chemistry any thing like that can compete against women as long as they say they are women?
@Konabeana - you haven't gotten to human biology in school, have you? This would mean that "trans women" who are physically men would by and large be winners. Cheats in essence.
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@AllThatSweetJazz The question is referring to women that identify as trans and compete against other women. Men who identify as trans can decide to take the hormones (Such as estrogen) which will allow them to develop the desired feminine features; however, if they do chose to take the hormones and DO develop feminine characteristics, it would not be fair to let them compete against the men that are naturally developing hormones such as testosterone. I’m not saying that trans people should compete, but I sort of am when the level of fairness is questioned. And no I am not saying that trans men should compete with women—doesn’t meet that level of fairness.
@PrimalInstinct I have taken biology, and I’ve learned quite a lot about hormones and the human developmental process. Trans women could never “physically” be men, and trans men could never “physically” be women. I think you are a bit confused, I am saying that trans women will by science win in all-women sports
@Konabeana - no, darling, you're the confused one. Your "I think it is fair game" in relation to trans not taking hormones means more or less you're fine with transwomen competing in the sport & winning. Cheating in essence. ... As for they won't be men or women, a transwoman with developed testosterone is automatically stronger & in women sports that makes him (/her) a cheat. No different than a biology woman taking performance-enhancing drugs which in Olympic events is illegal.
@PrimalInstinct I'm pretty sure she thinking of *females* who want to transition toward being a man but have made no change to their body whatsoever. That would be fair would it not?
@AllThatSweetJazz No because unless they start hormones early they're going to be weaker than men. Seriously. Transgenders should have their own events. It'd be fairer to them & everyone else.
@PrimalInstinct You don't think it's fair that females who have taken no hormones to compete against other females?
@AllThatSweetJazz I don't think trans, period, should compete against non-trans people due to fairness. Female vs female / male vs male isn't trans.
@Konabeana so you would fine competing against a former man in a physical match? bjj-world.com/.../
@PrimalInstinct But the premise of this this commenter was was that a person identifies as trans but aren't changing their bodies.
Also, transmen are still female, so you need to be clearer when you say female vs female isn't trans.@AllThatSweetJazz Genetically transmen are female but they take hormones to develop male traits so physically *no* they are not females. Just as how genetically transwomen are male but take hormones to develop female traits so physically *no* they are not males.
That's why trans should have their own events. They insist they are not the genetic sex they are born as but the opposite sex & they take steps to acquire the desired sex. So is it unfair to have them compete against their biological sex that they refuse to acknowledge themselves as.* So is it unfair to have them compete against their biological sex that they refuse to acknowledge themselves as. Just as how it is unfair to have them compete against the sex that they acknowledge themselves as because either they are stronger or they are weaker than the biological sexes.
@PrimalInstinct To clarify, genetics are the only thing that makes someone female or male, so that never changes. Saying they are “physically female” is not quite right, most people understand what you mean but to be absolutely specific about what we mean we would say they have feminine secondary sex characteristics or that they have a feminine phenotype.
Again, the premise for this commenter was a transman that has taken nothing. Are you saying they’re not trans unless they’ve done something to change their phenotype?
On the point about trans events, it’s never going to be relevant. Compared to a chance to compete in proper sporting events where they could be named the best in the world, no one cares to watch sport from this tiny sliver of the population that are considered too weird to compete with others. Either they’re going to compete in men’s sports or not at all, in my opinion.@AllThatSweetJazz *sigh* if someone doesn't take hormones then they're not legitimate transgenders. They're lesbians or tomboys or for a guy a drag queen that feels special about themselves. Nothing more, nothing less. The dub trans has changed to include these 'feel special' ones (and fluid genders, etc.) but the proper medical scientific meaning of transgender means someone who is undergoing hormonal replacement to assume the desired gender. I don't give a shit for anything else.
@PrimalInstinct The "proper medical scientific meaning" is people who identify as another gender, not someone taking hormones.
Someone taking hormones is called 'someone taking hormones.'@AllThatSweetJazz No. It isn't someone taking hormones. Take it from someone who works in the medical field. They're called legitimate transgenders.
@PrimalInstinct So they're called "legitimate transgenders" and that is anyone taking hormones?
@PrimalInstinct I think you are referring to gender dysmorphia where the person physically feels the opposite sex. Transgender means someone whose gender and identity does not correspond with their birth sex. I am not referring to “legitimate transgenders”, I am referring to transgender people. People that feel like they emotionally and physically identify with the opposite gender. You can never change a persons’ birth sex but they can identify as another gender.
- Transwomen are biologically male therefore they have a biological advantage over natural born females. Even if they take hormones they still have more physical strength than a natural born woman so they do have an unfair advantage. I respect trans people and other LGBT people and the struggles they face but this is one aspect I just can't get on board with.1|61|0
Same. Sorry. Women's sports is already so under-appreciated and underfunded. It's so sad to see cis-girls pushed out of sports like this. I'm all for trans women (and men) finding enjoyment in sports and wanting to be competitive, but I just don't think it's fair when they have such a clear biological advantage.
I don't think trans people are gross but they do need to realize they have a physical advantage over biological women by being born Male. I have nothing against trans people, I have a few trans friends and they're nice people. My friends also do agree with me that transwomen competing in women's sports isn't fair.
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No absolutely not
Though women have been forcing their way into what used to be male dominated sports so I guess turnabout is fair play
- really depends on when in there lives they opted to start / go trans and when they finished / stop with current form.
"most guys" have an easier time building muscle mass during or after puberty. due to high levels of testosterone and other hormones. so even if they opt to go trans later on they could still have an unfair advantage over natural born females.0|00|0 - Let them compete against each other based on their level of testosterone in separate leages.
Or if possible, let them compete in the same league, but give them penalties for their testosterone, like there are penalties for level of disablement in the paralympics.
Thats the only way, to remove the debate about "identity", which is subjective and not backed by any measurable values.0|00|0 - Only if the other female competitors agree to it and are aware of the trans individuals competing.
But they really should be put up against the men first and then given their own category. Like the special Olympics, only for trans people. We all know how special they are.0|00|0 - Heck if i transition to be a woman and join athletics i would be just running in the field knocking off broads left and right in a vollyball game😂😂you would have a lot of female athletes in ER after that match, from the opponents team and from my team. The match will be a draw due to injuries on both sides from my balls hitting them0|00|0
- Depends on their testosterone levels. I’m not a fan of arbitrarily limiting all those options, but I’d much rather give a range of testosterone values where one is allowed to participate with women.
So hypothetically, if those transwomen can take antiandrogens to such an extent that they fall within a reasonable range of testosterone for natural women (of course, taking in account outliers there as wel), I’d be perfectly fine with it.
If they fall outside that range, nah they can’t compete against women.0|00|1 - You never hear about female→male transgenders wanting to compete against men in sports. Know why? They can't compete. Surgery did not turn them into men; they are still women. Male →female transgenders are still males and should not be competing against real females. . . and no amount of PC brainwashing changes that result for any rational person.0|20|0
- No. They are not women and have no business in women's sports or anything else pertaining to women. They are dragging down both genders and women's sports. They should be compelled to do the right things and stick to what pertains to their own gender.0|00|0
- I don't know why this is even a question. Since the beginning of sports women and men did not compete together since people knew it would be unfair for women since men are bilogical stronger and taller. when you become transgender you dont lose height or streght. Even if you inject estrogen it won't affect your frame and it barly changes strength.0|00|0
- You can't change genders. They need to compete with men.
If I can change facts based on how I'd feel... I'd spray paint normal stones gold and try to sell it equivalent to what gold would sell for given the same size gold nugget. That's the same concept. Its still the same worthless rock like they are still men.0|00|0 - Should a guy be allowed to compete against girls? No, wouldn't be fair (yes, biologically she's still a male and nobody is going to allow trans only events, so go fuck yourself and kill yourself if you thought that was "transphobic" you pathetic little germ).0|00|0
Sick and tired of the sjw filth here checking every word, reporting to the pedophile-advocating piece of shit admins here, who then delete my comments because facts are offensive. So I make sure to give them a piece of mind in advance.
- If someone actually has a disorder that they are intergender like kleinfelters disease or hermaphroditism I think it’s reasonable if they’re more close to a woman but if a grown man chops his dick off puts on a wig and make up some n and starts dominating women at a sport that’s just so unfair, wrong and shouldn’t be allowed. That mma fighter Fallon fox literally cracked a girls skull from just man handling her 🤦♂️0|00|0
- No, they should be excluded from society just like the eunuchs from ancient times. During christianity's rule eunuchs no longer existed, as a result, the christian priests took that position, vowing celibacy for life, now that christianity's power has waned, the lgbt movement takes the position of eunuchs in society.0|00|0
- "trans" people in general shouldn't even be allowed to walk the streets freely, let alone compete with the opposite gender somewhere. plus, we separated men and women in pretty much all types of sport, thats not a coincidence, there are reasons for it and it should stay that way0|00|0
- Unless a trans "woman" begins hormone treatment at 10 or younger they develop testosterone which gives them an automatic unfair advantage.
They want equality then they can start their own events.0|00|0 - A transwoman’s body on estrogen works in a different way than a biological woman’s or a man’s. Same with transmen. Trans people should get their own sporting events, if fairness is to be considered. It’s also a good idea overall - I’d happily watch trans sport events.1|00|0
Anonymous1 yNo, definitely not women’s events. I’m not even sure it’s fair to put them in men’s events since it’s not right to put a transman in women’s event either. Even if men on average are better at sports it still doesn’t seem fair to them to introduce competitors they otherwise wouldn’t have had, even if we expect them to on average end up in the low end.0|00|0- No. They can be seen as women but biologically they aren't. It's the truth. It gives them an unfair advantage and a biological woman doesn't stand a chance0|00|0
- They belong in therapy. But the Demonic Wants Campaign (HRC) is lobbying like rabid bats to outlaw therapy. To the point that when they saw a parody flag of LGBT (Lights, Guns, Beer, Trump), they started groups on Facebook calling for the group that made that parody flag to be assaulted with molotovs. No joke!0|01|0
- A is bad because of unfair competition
B is bad because that would be pretty much void of viewership and money
C is logical, given they have male strength0|00|0 - While yes I do believe that trans people can be whatever gender they like but when it comes to sport trans women have a massive advantage over women which isn't fair.0|00|0
- Anonymous1 yYes. I love seeing women get their ass handed to them because for years now we have been told by feminist groups that "women are just as good as men" and more recently that "a trans woman is just as much a real woman as a born female"
It's nice to see their bullshit blow up in their faces.0|00|0 - Men and women should ONLY play in contact/collision/strength oriented sports who have been born with the same sexual plumbing. Others, like Archery, no problem.0|00|0
- It's kinda a touchy subject... For thows who are trans gender I didn't or don't want to sound like I want to single them out cause they r people too. So I'm iffy on the decision0|00|0
- As long as the hormones were applied before puberty finishes trans women are next to identical to regular women in terms of athletics. This has been concluded scientifically.0|00|0
- Absolutely not. Look at my picture, do you think it would be fair to compete against females in a sport because I say I’m suddenly a woman inside? No lmak0|00|0
- Individuals with male genes belong in male competition.
Individuals with female genes belong in female competition.
Why is something SO obvious getting so complicated?0|00|0 - The research has been done. One year of HRT removes any form of competitive edge they had from being born with a penis. The event might require a doctor's note proving they've been on HRT for that length of time, but when that happens it's women competing against other women.
The people who are calling for this would have been the same type of people that were calling for black people to have their own leagues and events. It's fucking discrimination and all of you should be ashamed.0|03|4Show this study because there have been studies to prove otherwise.
https://youtu.be/Y1Fkld9PPO4So if bolt goes on one year HRT treatment, he'll lose all his advantage as a man and be able to complete with women?
@Hyper2 As a man, their are other factors with training and it still comes down to individual ability.
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Can Bolt compete with women if he goes on HRT treatment for a year or not?
Where is this research and how many athletes were studied?
Simple questions.Sorry but that's false. One year of HRT definitely does not "remove any form of competitive edge they had from being born with a penis". It's not the penis that gives them the edge, it's the testosterone. And the testosterone has permanent effects on a man's body, even if he does decide to identify as a woman and undergo treatment.
"Transgender women’s performances generally decline as their testosterone does. But not every male advantage dissipates when testosterone drops. Some advantages, such as their bigger bone structure, greater lung capacity, and larger heart size remain, says Alison Heather, a physiologist at the University of Otago in New Zealand. Testosterone also promotes muscle memory—an ability to regain muscle mass after a period of detraining—by increasing the number of nuclei in muscles, and these added nuclei don’t go away. So transgender women have a heightened ability to build strength even after they transition, Heather says."
It's not discrimination, is literal science. There's a reason why there are separate categories for men and women. I, as a 25 year old woman, also can't compete against 10 year old girls, because I obviously have a massive physical advantage since I'm a grown ass woman. Even though I'd also be competing against girls.athletic results indicate this 'research' is an academic falsehood and an intellectual travesty.
- Notice how 1 year ago everyone, including female followers, cucks and white knights, didn't have the heart (or balls) to speak against this shit? Now everyone is overtly speaking against it and denouncing it? SJWISM IS OVER... THANK GOD.0|00|0
- Anonymous1 yAbsolutely. If we're gonna accept them as women, we need to fully accept them. Trans men can compete in men's sports, shop why wouldn't trans women be allowed to compete in women's? I mean, unless you guys are afraid you'll catch yourselves staring at a trans girl's ass...1|00|0
- Yes: because it would contribute to embarrass the present idea of what gender equality intends to achieve.0|00|0
- We can start by not labelling them as trans women but mentally ill men.0|00|0
- No they're too sick to even be playing sports to begin with their not mentally healthy enough to even be outside an institution.0|00|0
- Who would dominate in trans events: trans men (ftm) or trans women (mtf)?0|00|0
- No, I don’t think so. I don’t think it’s fair to natal girls or women to compete against trans women.0|00|0
- Fuck no. Just cuz you cut a guy's dick off doesn't mean he's a girl. What is the matter with people these days?0|00|0
- I really don’t understand Americans. They say Women are strong! Men are not stronger than women, Women are capable of doing anything bla bla.. and then they say no trans women cannot compete against women0|40|0
You cannot say it's never true neither...
When it comes to physical strength then yes, but if you say women aren't capable of being imdependent or building a society then it's plan sexist
- Trans anyone should not be allowed to compete in any sport as being trans necessitates hormonal augmentation which would be consider cheating if a non-trans person did it.0|00|0
- They are (no matter of their feelings) still physically a man, wich is physically the stronger gender by nature (in normal cases). No hate, but its like letting a normal cat fight vs a tiger while the tiger feels like being a cat, wich is obviously not fair.
That is just MY opinion.0|20|0 - No they shouldn’t. They’re still men, and always will be.0|50|0
- Anonymous1 yNo only biological born woman can compete in women league.
As that person has advantage over others.
I don't care balls are chopped of or not, phisiologically it is men and all muscles and bones are of men body originally.
Not even local underage amateurs should be allowed...0|10|0 - there's also different sports to think of with this. An activity like archery, skiing even, and things of that nature aren't exactly the same as running, boxing, or whatever is in the Olympics nowadays.0|00|0
- In any case, using hormone replacements would be the same as athletic enhancing performance drugs, so it shouldn't be allowed in the first place.0|00|0
- That's like paiting a human face on a tiger, and putting it in a boxing ring with a man0|00|0
- Anonymous1 yTrans women are not genetically women. Just bc you call yourself a female doesn’t make you one just like if a 40 yr old man has sex with a minor they can’t identify as a minor themselves even if mentally they really think they are0|00|0
- Only if the actual females are card-carrying Feminists who believe the Cultural Marxist lie of nurture rather than nature.
If they are Feminists, then have at it and let the blood flow. 🤣0|21|0 - Trans women are women TERFS are bigots who should just get better at sport.0|00|0
- They should be cause that is discrimination. Not only that they are women even though they are not biologically0|00|0
- Absolutely. Let all those strong empowered female athletes lean in and prove they are just as good as men.0|00|0
- No. The biomechanical advantage of a man's body make it completely unfair. They should either have a separate trans event or have to compete as a man.0|10|0
- Anonymous1 yEveryone should be allowed to compete against women. And allow drugs and prosthetics and big mechs in sports too.0|00|0
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