Is love the USA or leave the USA as easy as it sounds?

[KelleyNice]

It is far more difficult to leave North Korea but the USA has made it almost impossible for any citizen to renounce their USA citizenship.

You’ll be charged $2,350 to give up your U. S. citizenship. This payment cannot be waived.

You will face rigorous and extremely complicated and difficult tax-filing requirements.

To renounce your U. S. citizenship, you need to have a second passport (citizenship of another country.) The State Department will deny anyone the right to renounce their U. S. citizenship if they do not have a second passport.

You must pay the onerous exit tax and fill out complicated and difficult to understand forms.

You must appear in person before a U. S. consular or diplomatic officer. And, it takes many months or even years to get an appointment.

[BeMuse]

What's so challenging about that? I could literally catch a ferry ride to the Bahamas tonight from Florida for less than a hundred dollars. They allow all American citizens into their country without any questions. Then if I find work there and can show I am financially stable, I just have to pay $150 a year or something like that to be a permanent resident there. If I do that for 10 years I can be a citizen of the Bahamas. They don't have income tax there, so $150 a year for being a permanent resident is nothing. It's easy enough to leave if one wants to. I don't know why anyone would want to though. If you've ever traveled, you know how bad it is out there, and how go you have it in the USA.

[BeMuse]

*good

[KelleyNice]

@BeMuse That sounds easy but, if you earn any money the USA will prosecute you if you don't pay income taxes, even after you have citizenship, on your earnings in the Bahamas and they are in no position to stand up against the USA.

[BeMuse]

Well at least you aren't paying income taxes in the Bahamas... It's not like you get double taxed on income... So deal with it for 10 years. I think there is a fast track to citizenship which deals with purchasing a home in the Bahamas. There are a lot of countries like that. When you buy a home or start a business they fast track you.

[KelleyNice]

@BeMuse I wouldn't want to pay any income tax; least of all to the USA on money I earn while living and working in another country. Force is the only right the USA has to rob my of my money and the fact almost every country in world will bow down to the USA and say, "Please let us serve you."

[BeMuse]

Tough luck. Look for a fast track option if you really want to leave. You can marry someone in another country, buy a home and/or start a business other places, and then instantly get your citizenship/passport in some other country and then renounce your American citizenship and off you go.

[KelleyNice]

Except you cannot renounce your USA citizenship until after pay the fees, pay onerous taxes and exit taxes, and waited months or years begging for appointment.

[BeMuse]

Again there are easy ways to get around that as well. For example, if I were to fast track my way into a country by say selling my home in Florida, moving to another country and purchasing a home there and starting a business or I got married to someone from said country I get my citizenship there quickly. Then I join their military or run for a political office in that country, and U. S. would revoke my citizenship automatically because I have declared my allegiance and sworn an oath to a foreign country/military. I'd never do that, but it's a loop hole in the system.

[KelleyNice]

@BeMuse We shouldn't need to look for loopholes. Because they are truly evil, the United States is the only country in the world which applies the same tax regime to all its citizens, regardless of where they live. www.taxesforexpats.com/.../...onal-Comparison.html

[BeMuse]

Not true. Eritrea, Libya, North Korea, Philippines, etc. all tax their citizens on their worldwide income. If they leave to another country to attempt to become a citizen there and are working on a visa, they still have to pay taxes back to their home country even though they live full time in say America for example. Countries like Australia, Austria, Brazil, China, Colombia, Japan and Mexico tax you on your international income if you stay in your home country for at least half a year, just like how states taxes work in the USA. This is why New Yorkers will spend 183 days or more in Florida to establish residency before moving back to New York. A lot of countries utilize the same residency policy between countries.

[KelleyNice]

@BeMuse Are you saying the website I posted is wrong? Because, if it is not, your claims are false.

[BeMuse]

Even the site you linked to mentioned Eritrea in addition to the United State. You just didn't read it.

[KelleyNice]

@BeMuse I'm astonished at the inability of people on GAG to read, including you. It is better to remain silent and be though a fool than to speak and remove all doubt. Obviously, you didn't read it, you just read at. However, I did read it, and rather than jumping to incorrect conclusion, I read it all including the following:

A year later, the Phillipines ended its citizenship-based tax regime.

As for Eritrea, it imposes a special 2% tax on all Eritreans abroad - dual-nationals included - in order to fund the dictatorial one-party government which has ruled since independence in 1993. This is a special tax on citizens abroad, as opposed to the U. S., which imposes the same tax regime on citizens regardless of where they reside.

Eritrea does not allow renunciation of citizenship, so anyone who ever was a citizen carries this tax burden his whole life.

The enforcement mechanism for the citizenship-abroad tax is simple: if you are an Eritrean citizen abroad and don't pay the special tax, then your relatives in Eritrea will be severely harassed, beaten and imprisoned. Additionally, the Eritreans abroad who don't pay the special tax are not allowed to cross the Eritrean border or are arrested when they attempt to leave Eritrea.

Interestingly, a Canadian court in Toronto ruled in 2007 that the imposition of the 2% tax on its citizens abroad was illegal and that a dual Canadian-Eritrean citizen should be paid back the money he had given.

Which leaves the United States as the only country in the world which applies the same tax regime to all its citizens, regardless of where they live.

[BeMuse]

Meanwhile if you are North Korean and lets say you live in some developing Africa working on an oil rig, 100% of your income will be paid to the North Korean government, which then pays the you as a citizen in North Korean currency, minus the value of insurance taxes and socio-cultural fees. But yeah it’s ONLY the USA that taxes their citizens that are living and working in other countries. Kid you’re not half as smart as you think you are.

[BeMuse]

I gave you some different tax structures to consider, and you just acted like an asshole because you were wrong. If you're not interested in learning, stay dumb. I don't care.

[DWornock]

It will become even more difficult because the USA wants to keep their tax slaves.

[Adaeva]

At this time, the USA can't build an Iron Curtain to keep people from leaving so they have created a legal Iron Curtain. Either way, very few people can escape the reach of the USA.

[libsaretards]

Everything you described is just the legal process on the side of the U. S. Technically you can ignore all of that if you move to a country that allows dual citizenship AND does not have an extradition treaty with the U. S. There are plenty of countries like that, but most are not in Europe. Move to one of those, set up a local bank there and do not report your earnings to the U. S. Once you have this citizenship and bank account, use this account whenever you travel abroad.

That being said, the U. S. is not such a bad place.

[KelleyNice]

The USA may not be a bad place but it is not the great freedom country it used to be.

[FilmGuy93]

Of course it's not as easy as it sounds. But here's the real kicker; where else would you go? All of these people who complain about the US's social safety net have absolutely no idea what they are signing up for when they go elsewhere. All these pro-abortion rights people like to idolize european countries without realizing that many of Europe's abortion rights are far stringent than what we have here in the US.

[tartaarsaus]

It’s not necessary to renounce citizenship to move away from the USA.


That being said, the idea that people can easily move away is simply not true. Starting with the legal barriers that come with immigration, such as typically needing to have a well-paying job (exceptions exist, such as Canada and easy citizenship in places like Italy/Germany/Israel id you qualify), you also effectively give up the social life you built up.

[tartaarsaus]

*if you qualify

[Whatever2929292]

I love America and love living here but hard times right now.

[RealMarek]

As dedollarization continues, eventually the US will not be in a position to dictate terms to people living abroad, or at least outside of the West.

[exitseven]

So I guess that is why the moonbats that threatened to move to Canada if Trump was elected ended up staying in the US.

[Kabluie]

it's just easier to nationalize to another country, I've been given that offer several times in my job lifetime.

[tartaarsaus]

This is only true for a few countries

[MikeInHawaii]

If you leave the country, take your assets with you, and never return, is any of this enforceable?

[DWornock]

Yes, because almost every country will assist the USA in enforcing their laws.

[peedy]

For some it should be get out or we will throw you out

[KelleyNice]

Countries, such as the USA, that are desperately holding on to their tax slaves would never allow that.

[baserunner611]

I am never going to leave the United 🇺🇸 States I was born American I died American

[Pterodon]

I’ve made this very clear on here especially to blacks that think they’re so mistreated. Officially renounce your citizenship and I’ll buy you a one way ticket to Liberia. I’ll even pay your fee

[KelleyNice]

Talk is cheap. You would never do that.

[Bratsondanielle]

Well hurray for dual citizenship

[globetrotter22]

Make it easier for the idiots to leave.

[fireforeffect]

Yes it is.