Are martial arts classes better simulated or competitive?

[Apinya97]

Would you rather attend a martial arts class where sparring is simulated with light-medium contact strikes, and with head and groin guards worn, where the fight is practiced very safely? Or would you rather a class where sparring is full contact strikes, with no head or groin guards, that simulates a more ‘real life’ experience, but at the risk of greater injury?

I love how my martial arts class practices full contact strikes, and without head and groin guards, meaning your training reflects a more ‘real life’ situation. Also allowing girls to take on guys provides for a greater variation and more practical training.

So which kind of class would you rather attend? How does your current class practice it’s sparring sessions? And which way is better do you think? Thank you.

[Johnsmith119]

I'd rather choose full contact strikes but with head guard and cup 😂, i know practicing without protections will be very helpful in real life but i do kickboxing every weekend and a few months ago, a guy was sparring without his cup and caught an accidental hard kick to the testicles by his opponent which actually ruptured one of his balls, had to be hospitalized. It was horrible, he was crying!

But since your class like to spar without any protections, have you ever witnessed any such horrible incidents yet?

[Apinya97]

The guys who choose that tend to do more Western martial arts that allow more protection, which is fair enough because everyone should have the choice of how they want to practice. Yes, I’ve seen and caused that kind of agony and damage to guys testicles before with my hardest possible kicks to win fights. I don’t care, it’s actually quite funny, but to my knowledge I’ve never known any permanent damage before, which is good for the guys I guess.

[Johnsmith119]

Yh like in the ufc, it's mandatory because most people in the Western martial arts see them as a combat sport. Krav maga is actually the defense class that actually teach us how to defend in real life unlike combat sports but if guys themselves have agreed and signed in to your class where groin kicks are allowed then I agree that u shouldn't bother about them and their balls..

It's risky for those guys in your class but for women, I think it's 100% alright to not wear a groin guard/cup because it won't affect your ability of having kids.

[Johnsmith119]

Funnily enough, this will exactly be my personal reaction if I joined your class: https://youtu.be/G3sjmrz8ELQ 😂

[Apinya97]

Yes, I think MMA descended from combat sambo and then implemented a load of rules, whereas combat sambo didn’t. I understand self-defence classes teaches just that, but learning a combat martial art also teaches how to handle yourself too. Yes, all competitors have to agree and sign up to the rules before sparring and competing. You’re right, with groin guards banned it’s more of a risk for the guys, but a quick and devastating full contact kick for a girl to win with. That video is funny 😂 the guys in my class focus more on winning than worrying about that one specific move.

[Johnsmith119]

I agree with that because in the earlier days of MMA/UFC, groin shots were actually legal but then there were more injuries and audience never wanted any sport to be so dangerous and dirty so they had to make rules for it.

And yes combat sport definitely helps in real life too but it still basically teaches you how you can defend yourself with blows to other body parts as well and not just by focusing on the most sensitive body parts.

And its basically so devastating that it can even make a guy throw up from the pain but then all i can say is good luck to them, I hope they don't ever have to loose any of their balls 😂
By the way, I have some questions:
1:) Do you believe you can bring a large and muscular guy to the ground with a hard kick to his jewels?
2:) I know it won't cause permanent damage but how effective is it against a strong woman? Can it still end the fight?

[Apinya97]

Yes, that’s probably why MMA is more popular and commercial and combat sambo is more for people who want to train under more old style rules. I’ve never seen or caused a guy to throw up from a kick to their groin, but obviously screaming and crying out in absolute agony is pretty standard! 😂 To my knowledge no guy has ever suffered permanent damage, maybe missed a few classes through bruising and swelling, but I don’t care about the pain and damage anyway. In answer to your questions 1. Yes, because I have and I’ve seen it happen many times. 2. A groin kick can put a woman down too, but it is less devastating and far less likely to end the fight than with a guy where a groin kick is an immediate knockout.

[Johnsmith119]

Exactly and certainly combat sambo seems a much more dangerous combat sport.
Lol crying out loud must be very embarrassing 😅, it's weird how males have overall more strength then average females but one kick to the eggs can make them cry like little babies. That sounds good, they certainly have balls of steel to even return to the class after even minor injuries to the nuts. This makes me wonder, if your boyfriend tells you that he wants to join your class, what would you do or suggest him? Would you feel concerned for him?

Oh, it seems like girls don't have to worry much if groin shots are allowed, I like how female anatomy safely keep your packages inside but hate how our anatomy keep it dangling outside xD

[Apinya97]

If a boyfriend wanted to join my class that would be his choice, but I wouldn’t go any easier on him just because he’s my boyfriend. I might even go in harder to show him how I can beat him! 😂 I wouldn’t feel concern for him, no. Yeah, nature sucks for guys when it comes to kicking to the groin.

[Johnsmith119]

Lol I hope he never joins the class for his Ball's sake 😂 and if you do that, he'll just stop underestimating your strength but it'll just take a bit of accuracy to land a good shot down there.
Ikr! I have had a personal bad experience too..
A few years ago, I used to play baseball and one day, I took a 50+ mph ball directly to the nuts and I gotta say even though I wasn't crying, I was on the ground for like 15 minutes rolling and coughing hard.. one of my balls was swollen to the size of a tennis ball, it was difficult for me to walk, so this still is one of my nightmare

[s35bonanza]

In our gym guys and girls spar against each other all the time. While the written rules say cups are optional at the fighters discretion, and groin strikes are technically “not allowed” we gave a different tradition and practice. In mixed sparing the female can ask the male to remove his cup, this request is always honored, so in our matches males will never be wearing any kind of artificial groin protection. If a groin strike happens, to a male or a female - there is no penalty or point deduct, you are given a 2 minute recovery time and the fight resumes, if you can not continue, you lose. In this way females can use the groin strike to weaken or defeat male opponents without the gym being liable for any injuries. That said we have never had any injuries as serious as the one you witnessed, thankfully. Yes most of our guys have taken some very hard debilitating nut shots. I have seen more than a few strong young men reduced to a puddle of jelly, crying and bawling on the floor in a fetal position as a brave strong willed young lady revels in the exhilaration of such a dramatic victory!!! For the males in our gym pain is a great teacher, it makes us faster, quickens our involuntary reflexes, and instills a healthy respect for our opponents both male and female. It also makes for great entertaining fights to watch!!

[Apinya97]

@s35bonanza That’s funny how girls can request that guys remove their cup, like every girl is going to ask for that! 😂 Yes, the guys do react very dramatically to such a loss, but girls use that move because it’s such a guaranteed win, and it’s kind of funny to see how the guys react to it. Guys reaction speed does improve when groin protection is not used, yes. Watching such matches can be interesting too because groin strikes always get the biggest reaction from the competitors (very different reactions of course) and from those watching around the mat.

[CuriousMufuxka]

Light to medium. Martial arts are self defense, and in that discipline not kicking the ass of others.

[s35bonanza]

@Apinya97 yes it is kind of funny to have a girl asking if you are wearing a cup or not and requesting you remove it. Some girls say specifically, you can leave/ put a cup on if you want because they prefer the challenge of a little more aggressive protected male. One of our top female instructors will actually do this as a demonstration to the class, we can see the difference in approach, aggressiveness, and reaction time when she spars the same guy in round one and two with him in a cup and rounds 3 and 4 with him cup less. It’s a great psychological experiment as he approaches everything about the fight a little differently with a cup on vs. without!!! You should try it. Also for her own fun and our amusement she puts a fully protected guy an the ground just as fast and easily as one without the protection!!! The main difference comes from the male fighter. After seeing this demonstration everyone fully understands why guys fighting girls must do so with no protection whatsoever. If he can’t naturally protect his groin, she must have every right and opportunity to exploit his god given weakness. Using his testicles against him with a humbling and emasculating kick straight up into his balls is one of the most sublime ways a female can best a male. If she has the guts and the skills to do so she must be allowed the satisfaction. It’s happened to me and it’s no fun being on the other end of things, but fair is fair!!!

[Apinya97]

@s35bonanza Yes, I agree with you 👍 not many guys would share your view, but obviously those who practice martial arts this way do.

[Anonymous]

How does that work? Doesn't everyone in your class go home with a broken nose and all the guys with ruptured nuts?

[Apinya97]

Well competitors are trained to keep their guard (hands/arms) up to protect their head, so head injuries are often limited. It is true that in girl vs guy matches groin guards are forbidden, so girls often win these matches with full contact run up kicks straight up into the guy’s balls, which is obviously an instant win for the girl, and a devastatingly painful loss for the guy. Before being allowed to spar and compete though, all competitors must agree and sign up to the rules.

[Apinya97]

Does my explanation make sense to you? 🙂

[Catguy92]

Damn that's awful, why do they allow that, isn't it humiliating for guys?

[LisaS]

I do prefer hard sparring (I do Tae Kwon Do), but will always wear a head guard.

[Apinya97]

Yes, me too. In my class competitors are trained to keep their guard high to protect their head, so head injuries are often limited. In girl vs guy matches groin guards are forbidden, so girls often win these matches with full contact run up kicks straight up into the guy’s balls, which is obviously an instant win for the girl, and a devastatingly painful loss for the guy. All competitors must agree and sign up to the rules before being allowed to spar and compete though.

[Kitty26cat]

I am a girl but i think guys without a cup should just stay within the level of light to medium contact strikes. If you safely want to practice moves that can cause bad injuries with hard strikes, the only way I can think of it is with your protections on so guys who practice (or want to practice) full hard contact strikes like in your class should certainly wear a cup otherwise their bag of poor nuts might just turn into a bag of mush 😂 , has such thing ever happened in your class?

And of course head guard should be allowed too as Brain damage is very dangerous, so hard sparring = wearing protections.

[s35bonanza]

When we are sparing in class and practicing certain moves with each other over and over again, our gym policy is that the contact be 25%-30% of full contact. You want your opponent to feel it and it may cause some acute momentary discomfort, but after a few controlled breaths you can resume. This way guys can remain in the class rotation and be learning and practicing without having to sit out long periods of time. Girls like this because they still get to practice the contact and get to learn how to control the amount of force used. Guys like this because they can get experience working through the lighter to moderate contacts and fighting through the pain to remain in the match. I can tell you firsthand this experience comes in handy in fights where maybe you were hit with a glancing blow that doesn’t hit exactly right, but catches your balls enough to cause a great amount of pain. With experience you become more conditioned and better at fighting through instead of going right down!! In competition and competitive class sparing the instructors insist if you Ste going to use a groin strike that it be full force as hard as you possible can to go for the knockout win. You need to win the fight as quickly as possible and it doesn’t pay to hold anything back, this is most like a real life situation. The tradition in our gym is the female decides if she wants her male opponent cup less or if she will allow him to wear a cup. It’s a completely different fight for her depending on which she chooses. Most often girls insist we spar them without a cup. Honestly this is the most fair and even way for males to fight females in competition, we use our skill and reflexes to defend without relying on artificial protection of plastic cups pads or rules. Testicles are sensitive and that extreme sensitivity gets associated with fragility, but they are much more durable than you think. Extreme of permanent catastrophic injury is very rare, as would be causing sterility.

[Apinya97]

@Kitty26cat With the head guards a lot of work goes into keeping your guard (hands/arms) raised at all times, so head injuries are rare and never too serious. Without groin guards full contact strikes are still allowed to the groin, but everyone has to agree and sign up to the rules before they are allow to spar and compete. I’ve kicked and seen many guys take full contact kicks to their groin in sparring matches, but to my knowledge no serious damage worse than the obvious immense agony and bruising that makes them miss a few classes.

[Kitty26cat]

Ohh okay the head injury part sounds safe and fine but regarding the groin shots, if it's allowed, I gotta ask how many males are there in your class? Are the majority of you females? The guys in your class are taking a big risk.. but thank god no guys in your class received a serious damage yet. I hope it goes on, the same way in the future

[s35bonanza]

We have about 10 - 15 guys and 8 - 10 girls that show up pretty regularly, every one gets to know each other and we are comfortable with each others sparring styles. I know it seems shocking to some that we would practice and compete with full contact groin strikes allowed and protection forbidden, but it’s no where near as bad as it may seem to an outsider. Guys new to the gym quickly come to appreciate and understand why we do this and are on board. I can speak from first hand experience, it’s very psychological but knowing your testicles are a valid target and you have no rules or artificial protection sharpens your subconscious reflexes in a way I cannot explain. Think how you blink and turn away instinctively when something like a piece of debris, wood chip, etc. comes at your face. You close your eyes, and feel it on your eyelid before even processing and thinking about what you are seeing. When you are wearing a cup or you know it’s against the rules your subconscious mind doesn’t want to believe it will actually happen, reaction time is way slower and most likely you will take the hard hit. It actually takes getting kicked in the balls really hard a few times to get much better at not getting kicked in the balls!! A strange paradox. None the less serious injuries never happen. Testicles are designed to be extremely sensitive, yet are remarkably resilient and durable. They heal quickly with no noticeable lasting damage. See the internet and YouTube for all kinds of crazy nut shots. Any guy who has played and sport, had sisters growing up, or really pissed someone off has been hit repeatedly there, guys do it to each other for fun, it is very funny!!! If it was so catastrophically damaging the human race would be extinct!!! Nope, it’s just pure agony in the moment, like the worst lower abdominal cramps you have ever felt and then it slowly passes to a dull lasting ache in your gut.

[s35bonanza]

You do get a nice rush of adrenaline and endorphins through your system after it happens, your heart rate and blood pressure max out and breathing becomes very labored for a while. Then your body begins healing. A bag of frozen peas is your best friend after class sometimes!!! The worst that happens is some acute swelling and deeper bruising in your testicles that lasts a week or two, then heals up just fine. I regularly spar with a girl and we have become good friends, she was testing for a higher belt and her adrenaline was really flowing. Suffice it to say I should have zigged when I zagged and wound up getting all of a fast leg whipping front kick square up under both nuts. The pain was immediate, explosive, it took my breath away and put me on the mat before I knew what hit me. My eyes were watering and snot was running out of my mouth and nose. I was down for what felt like an hour, she said it was 15 or 20 minutes. She won her belt, I was done for the day! She helped me up and got me an ice pack. I felt quite nauseous and thought I might throw up, but just kept swallowing.

[Apinya97]

@s35bonanza I think her reply and questions were directed at me 🤔 but thanks anyway. Maybe DM her as to not confuse this thread! 😂

[Kitty26cat]

@s35bonanza sorry i was replying to @Apinya97

[Kitty26cat]

@Apinya97 did u forget to reply? 😂

[Apinya97]

@Kitty26cat My class is quite evenly split between girls and guys. Yes, the guys agree and sign up to that risk, but I think some people want to train and practice for real life situations and the intensity that this brings. The rules are kind of necessary too if girl vs guy fight are going to be allowed, because the guys have so many physical advantages already. I don’t really care about the pain and damage, I’m more concerned about winning.

[Karate_Guy]

@Kitty26cat which martial art (s) do you do?

[Alltheflowers84]

Better competitive! What is better than beating someone in person? :-P

[s35bonanza]

What type of sparring do you do and what are the rules? Have you been in many mixed matches?

[quetimporta]

very interesting

[JohnBellagio96]

@quetimporta , I agree, can you add me so we can message?

[Shakenbake11]

A controlled but competitive environment