So, now McCarthy has agreed to destroy the world's economy, do you think Republicans should still support him?

[goaded]

"Rep. Ralph Norman (R-NC) told reporters on Wednesday that McCarthy would have to commit to "shut down the government rather than raise the debt ceiling" to win his opponents' support."

"A reporter asked Norman if he meant default on the debt, as the debt ceiling and a government shutdown are not directly linked. "That's why you need to be planning now what agencies — what path you're gonna take now to trim government. Tell the programs you're going to get to this number. And you do that before chairs are picked," he said, referring to the process of choosing and installing House committee chairs."

[CrazyGirl2]

I honestly don’t understand why people are so obsessed with national politics? The Governor of your state, hell the mayor of your city has WAY more impact on your daily life than the federal government EVER could! This is not a big deal, I would rather see this, which is real democracy in action than watch them coronate á previously decided House Speaker. In 1856 it took over two months and 133 ballots to elect a Speaker , and yet here we are 167 years later, and almost nobody remembers it! So it REALLY is not a big deal.

Whenever someone whom I do not consider a close personal friend asks me a question about national politics, I say politely “I’ll answer your question if you can answer my two simple questions first… Who is the mayor of THIS city, and second When are the county commission meetings? If they cannot answer those two questions, I know they are not a serious person, and they’re merely regurgitating other peoples political talking points that they saw on Fox, MSNBC, or CNN!

This will all be over soon, life will move on and nobody will think or even care about this. As for a government shutdown… good! We could all do with less federal government in our lives!

[goaded]

1856, 167 years ago? What major event happened five years after that?

The federal government refusing to pay its debts will have a huge effect on the entire world. It used to be unthinkable that anyone would be so rash as to threaten it. Now it seems to be Republican party policy.

[DaveJord]

Obviously these ultra conservatives hold outs, are doing it in the hopes of gaining political influence and power. They Obviously feel that they are in the minority within in their own party, and scrapping for any chance to wield some type of influence. So it's a sign of weakness from the hold outs, as far as how desperate they are, and a sign of strength for McCarthy that he can stand against it. But McCarthy is taking damage from this.

[DaveJord]

And city planners and commissions... honestly really depends on where you live... but you don't have to know who they are, to have an opinion.

What ever is decided in Washington today, your city planners will struggle with next year.

[CrazyGirl2]

You cannot possibly think that a government shutdown would trigger another Civil war? We’ve had 5 government shutdowns since 1995, and as far as I remember / have researched, NOT ONE of those resulted in a civil war! I thought this was a serious discussion… My mistake I guess?

[CrazyGirl2]

@DaveJord David, you must be confused, I did not mention “City Planners” I stated that I ask “Who is the mayor” and “when are the county commission meetings”. In MY opinion, your Governor and your local government have more of an impact on your day to day life than anything done at the federal level. Again that is JUST my opinion, you are free to have your own. That’s the wonderful thing about opinions.

[DaveJord]

No I don't th8 o civil war is coming, and yes governors I agree with... mayor's not so much, and county commission I guess so... really depends on were the money is coming from. So more easily bought.

[DaveJord]

*Dont Think

[goaded]

I'm not talking about a government shutdown, although that's bad for America it doesn't affect the world economy that much.

No, I'm talking about not raising the debt ceiling to cover what Congress has already committed to spending. That has never happened in modern history because everyone understands how bad it would be. I think there's a good chance that it would hand over the position the US Dollar currently holds as a safe currency to the Euro.

This is about when it almost happened, in 2021:
"One analysis by Moody's Analytics chief economist Mark Zandi shows that breaching the debt limit could plunge the U. S. into another recession: The default could eliminate as many as 6 million jobs, pushing the unemployment rate as high as 9%, and wipe out up to $15 trillion in household wealth.

"A bedrock of the U. S. economy and global financial system is that the U. S. government pays what it owes in a timely way," Zandi wrote in a research note. If the U. S. defaults, "The U. S. and global economies, which still have a long way to go to recover from the recession caused by the pandemic, will descend back into recession.""
www.foxbusiness.com/.../what-happens-congress-debt-ceiling

[CrazyGirl2]

@DaveJord Ok, well if you own a house, let your grass grow too long, and see who gives yo a ticket… the federal government, or your city! In most cities, try to park an RV along the side of your house, and see who fines you, the federal government, or your city! Or hell just leave your trash cans out by the road all week, and see who gives yo a ticket, the fees or the city! In my city, you couldn't even park a boat in your driveway, or anywhere on your property. The residents got together, protested at every city commission meeting, and they eventually reversed the city code! Now residents can park their boats on their own property again! by the way, the reason for the rule… the mayors neighbor had a huge boat in their driveway, he didn’t like it so he got the city to ban all boats from residential property! THAT is what I mean when I say that the local government has mor control over your daily life than the feds.

[CrazyGirl2]

Please excuse the typos, I'm extremely tired!

[DaveJord]

@goaded Honestly, debt ceiling I mean, I'm an old school fiscal conservative/social liberal. So depends on what you are raising it to do... interfere balanced budget to fight inflation, not increased government spending, while interest keep going up.

@CrazyGirl2. Yeah, I here your piont.

[goaded]

@DaveJord It's a crazy thing. There's a vote on what the government is going to spend, then another vote on whether the country is going to pay for it. The idea that you can do one and not the other is nuts.

Apparently, it now only takes one House member to call for a new Speaker. That sounds like a very useful tool to disrupt government, much like the filibuster. It's also, like the filibuster and holding the debt ceiling hostage, a tool only useful to extremists on one side. Democrats want government to function, a small but significant number of Republicans do not.

Unless I'm mistaken, they can now call to elect a new Speaker every day, if they want to. Nothing will get done, and they'll blame Biden for getting nothing done ("he should have convinced us not to do it", or some such nonsense).

[DaveJord]

Yup. It's pretty sad

[CrazyGirl2]

@goaded I’m like you, fiscally conservative but socially? I’m very liberal! But from what I understand the conservatives who were holding up the election of the speaker believe that he’s not fiscally conservative enough. And there are things that their constituents want (like investigating Biden’s demand that Ukraine fire the prosecutor investigating the company that Hunter Biden worked for, and the origins of Covid etc.) Now they may or may not be important to most people, but to Lauren Bobert (? Sp) and her constituents it is important! I can respect a representative actually representing his/her constituents. As for the reason for the “change” that allows one person to be able to call for a vote on removing the speaker, and electing a new one… That’s how it always was! Nancy Pelosi changed it from requiring one member to requiring six, they just want it out back to the way it always was. And for almost 250yrs it only took one house member to call for a vote to remove the speaker, but we NEVER had anything like “a new speaker of the house every day” that’s just pure hyperbole. Do I agree with what they wanted? NO! Im sick of constantly investigating the president, whatever party he belongs to. But on an intellectual and ethical level, I can certainly respect that they are actually doing what THEIR constituents voted for! So while it took a week, it wasn’t THAT bad. In the 1800’s they took like two or three MONTHS to elect a speaker. That’s democracy at work. I’d much rather that then yet another speaker predetermined and essentially coronated. It wasn’t the BEST thing to do, but all in all, I don’t think it was as bad as the pundits have made it out to be. Good discussion, thanks guys!

[goaded]

AIUI, the prosecutor Biden got fired (with the approval of the world bank and many, many countries) was fired because he wasn't investigating corruption. Including Burisma.

I take your point about the one member rule being traditional, but in all those 250 years there wasn't anyone who was willing to burn the country down. So many norms have been been broken in the last 30 years, all by or triggered by the Republican party, and they're accelerating.

I think you're supposed to be sick of people constantly investigating the president, whatever party he belongs to, because that allows the ones who actually commit crimes to get away with them. Yes, I'm aware of the documents Biden shouldn't have had, but because there's no indication he intentionally hid them from the government, and there were far fewer, it's a bit like a car thief saying it's OK because people shoplift.

Sorry for the delay in responding, spent a few days in Paris.

[CrazyGirl2]

@goaded Seriously, the Republicans want to burn the country down because a few members listened to their constituents? Do I agree with their demands, NO! But I dont live in those districts.
As for the documents Biden stole, you may want to reevaluate your position there was “no indication he intentionally hid them from the government” given another trove of classified documents was found in his house!”. Obviously what Trump did was wrong and illegal, but I’m shocked the media and people such as yourself who were rightly outraged at what trump did, are now “it’s no big dealing” Biden doing even worse! At LEAST a President has absolute authority to declassify! The VICE President, has NO such authority, and the documents are from his time as vice president! This will be my last political question I answer, I AM a liberal, but ridiculous tribal arguments, have me sounding like I’m defending Trump (whom I hate), when I’m just being consistent in my opinions. It was REALLY bad, and a crime when Trump did it, and it’s REALLY bad, and a crime now that Biden has done the same thing! Only the reactions have changed! Those who said “Trump did nothing wrong”, are now calling for the arrest of Biden, and those who said “This is espionage, Trump belongs in prison”, are predictably now saying “this was nothing”! Frankly I’m sick of people I agree with politically, SO invested in what letter is after the perpetrators name, before they say how bad they believe it was. Then change their level of outrage accordingly if that letter matches the one on their voter registration! Mine WAS (D), it’s now an (I).
Congratulations on your Paris Trip, I’m sure it was beautiful. I’ve been there myself and I absolutely loved it every time… I just hope you didn’t fall for any of the scammers and conmen, sorry con-people, near The Louvre, or especially in the park surrounding the Eiffel Tower! Glad you are home safe.

[goaded]

Oh, the con at the Eiffel Tower was transparent (collecting for deaf children). We stayed with cousins and had a great time. Although we may be a bit heavier than when we went.

No, I don't believe those members were listening to their constituents, they didn't put up serious alternatives to McCarthy, they were just after power for themselves.

The documents Biden retained were not missed by the National Archives. They were not asked for, they were returned immediately when found, and the others were seriously searched for and returned as well. Here's Carl Rove (seriously right-wing):



It's the difference between walking out of a shop with something accidentally (probably) and burglary.

[CrazyGirl2]

Actually they were! The national archives has been in communication with the Obama team about missing documents since 2016. But you are entitled to your opinion, im out of this discussion. I won’t be answering politics related questions on GaG anymore. I had hopped it would me more mature, more civilized than twitter, but obviously not. Take care, I’ll see you around the dating, girls/guys behavior, sexuality and romance forums, but im just so over this political BS.

[goaded]

OK, I'll wait and see if they'd wanted documents back.

[Anonymous]

Seems more like grandstanding and said for dramatic effect. From what I see is that all us politicians talk big about what they will do before being elected but do very little.

[Soteris]

Used to be that way, until the next generation growing up hearing all the grandstanding became politicians and did not realize that was supposed to be a lie.

[Opinion Owner]

@Soteris both sides do it here in America. They make grand contraversial speeches and make promises on their soap boxes without any intent on doing anything about anything.

[Soteris]

Again, that used to be how things worked. Its not even that rare in many leadership fields, be it military or government etc.. Problem is always that over the generations the new people who enter the field buy into the nonsense more and more and while the crazy things said for support/votes/whatever remains they will actually do it this time.

A good example is the whole anti-abortion thing. The whole point of "Revoking Roe" was to fire up their supporters and have them vote for them. It was not actually meant to succeed and remove their carrot on the stick. Well, in comes the new generation and suddenly they accidentally managed to remove it and now they are fucked since they never planned or wanted the consequences of their actions.

As such, I would be very careful what you consider grandstanding or not. Sure, I doubt McCarthy would do anything in particular (aside from the normal nonsense), but he has now given away a bunch of power to the younger crazier than usual GOP faction such as Luaren Beubert or however you spell her name. Those are definitely the types to not just talk the talk but also walk the walk and for example default on the US national debt.

[Opinion Owner]

@Soteris doubtful. I just believe the democrats allowed the abortion to go through for votes. Like you could still get an abortion but you would have to travel.

[goaded]

Republicans are already proposing legislation to limit abortions on a federal level.

[Opinion Owner]

Won't go through. They often push for stuff here they know will never go through for their voters base, there's elections in February

[Ill_made_Knight]

These freedom caucus folks like Boebert and Gaetz are simply poo flinging monkeys that want to be on TV, and quite possibly WANT to burn it all down.
McCarthy has made FAR too many concessions for a job that he showed everyone that he wanted far too badly.
The next two years are going to be a shit show... this current business has only been the teaser.

[OddBeMe]

This is why Repubs are more extreme. A Dem would simply ask across the aisle for moderate support. McArthy has to promise to damage the country’s credit rating, cause a recession in the stock market, probably make jobless claims rise…all to be elected Speaker for his vanity.


Prick.

[OddBeMe]

Maybe the Dems next Speaker should run on nationalizing the banks until the 2008 recession is paid back. Then maybe we’ll let them privatize again.

[ibodi]

Is he related to McCarthyism? that sound like American spirit

[exitseven]

The government was shut down in the early 1990s and except for federal employees that didn't get paid on time I don't think anyone else noticed.

[msc545]

Sure support him. The more destructive he is, the fewer the people are who vote for the Repugnants.

[CaptainSmartass]

I thought McCarthy was the "we hate commies" dude.

Simples...

[goaded]

It seems he's willing to hate the full faith and credit of the United States, for the speakership.

[goaded]

Oh, right the "red scare" guy from the mid-1900's. Sorry, I missed the reference. This one seems to be heading to be even more dangerous.

[jamesgoldman]

He's just doing what's required as part of plan 2030 has to reset across the board from the top down

[AngryCarl]

If you still think governments control the economy you haven't been paying attention.

[Juxtapose]

The guy is a world economic forum stooge.