What is the meaning of these Bible quotes?

[Anonymous]

1 Timothy 2:13
11 A woman should learn in quietness and full submission.
12 I do not permit a woman to teach or to assume authority over a man; she must be quiet.
13 For Adam was formed first, then Eve.

[strateguy632]

The CLUE is the word "authority" in 12th.

My lady pastors who taught me bothered to specify "you = me are not under my authority " to obey this when TEACHING.

Romans 15 specified the original church had lady leaders, not only allowed but actually did. Not "derogatory and disrespectful towards women".

But you only twist this to attack Christians but don't complain about other religions excluded lady sheikh imam and rabbi.

[Asker]

Don't worry! I think that Islam and Judaism suffer from the same problem. I'm simply asking for clarification. To me, the misogyny is as clear as day.

[strateguy632]

Only new testament is innocent, as i quoted book romans 15. N as you quoted "authority" .

[Asker]

So, yes, we need to pick and choose which verses are relevant and through the rest of the book in the trash. People have been doing this forever... so many denominations... so many interpretations...

[jahaims]

It's imaginary

[jennifer_bloom]

Proverbs 31 say the godly woman teaches kindness on her tongue.

I believe the teaching Paul speaks of is procedural instruction and integrative sociologically derived cultural philosophy, not natural sentiments about human behaviour since the bible says you must discipline your children and teach same gender people about religious ideas.

[Asker]

Ok, but what is the meaning of the passages I asked about?

[jennifer_bloom]

I believe the teaching that Paul talk about is spontaneous critical rebuke done to promote a selfish personal agenda. Quietness deals with harmonious compliance and full submission means you fulfill the full throttle of necessary duties needed to maintain the family unit. To usurp authority over the man is to contravene how good, necessary or reasonable intention for vain and nonsensical reasons, without a recognizable moral structure or intellectual reason behind it. To be silent, is to maintain the pathos of peace and reasonable observance for unity’s sake and not for egotistic gain.

[Asker]

I find the passages I cited to be derogatory and disrespectful towards women. It's obviously women who are the target here. The justification for subjugating women seems to be because "Adam was formed first, then Eve." I can clearly see how this supports a misogynistic stance towards women in the church and society.

[jennifer_bloom]

I believe this Adam and Eve idea me and the man is the practical and stationary cause of professional society, while the woman I a the secondary and tertiary cause of mechanical society. The man builds the garden, the woman cooks using the plants the man planted. She I a the conditioned secondary sequence while he is the post conditional primary sequence in the chain of life.

[Asker]

Sorry, I don't accept this as a good reason to subjugate women. Using religious teachings to oppress and control any group of human beings is an absolute abomination to me.

[BarryLiverstone]

The author was speaking to a church and in that church there was a group of women who were disrupting services and not remaining quiet enough every week during the sermons to allow everyone to hear the words of God. So the purpose of the verses are to instruct those who were being disrespectful to not keep interrupting everyone.


Why are you curious about only these three verses?

[Asker]

I'm curious because they strike me as being very derogatory and disrespectful towards women... regardless of the setting.

[Asker]

Men can also be disruptive, but men were not identified here... only women. The justification seems to be that Eve came after Adam, so women are the ones who should be silent, not men.

[BarryLiverstone]

Thanks for asking. Like I said this was directed towards one church. They seem derogatory today as women in our culture have rightfully been elevated to having leadership roles and gaining respect. But other verses of the Bible show how Jesus really wanted women included and showed they are just as worthy as men in the eyes of God.

[Asker]

The problem I have is that many go around talking about living a life based on Biblical teachings, etc., but once you drill down into the actual teachings, folks tend to pick and choose what they are comfortable with or the interpretation of what they are comfortable with. Hence, we have multiple churches and denominations. No one will ever agree

[BarryLiverstone]

That’s a blessing. No one will ever agree. So we are charged to love each other and spread the good news. Jesus is our savior, praise God!

[strateguy632]

Barry interpretation conflicted v. 12 not "students ".

[BarryLiverstone]

At that time women couldn’t lead in the church. Thankfully times in society have changed. We had a female paster lead my church as I grew up

[Asker]

The differences have also been the cause of violent conflict.

[jshm2]

11 Women should be assisted to dedicate themselves so they can focus on learning

12 They should not be forced into command.

13 Adam (males) has more responsibility than Eve (females)

[Asker]

Even this interpretation is suspect. It's interesting how there are so many different interpretations of the Bible. Which one is correct? Who decides which one is correct? Who gives women this "assistance"? Why do they need "assistance"? Are they inherently incompetent? Why does Adam have "more responsibility"? Your transportation of verse 12 is completely the opposite of the one I quoted. There are multiple ones. It's clear to me that this was written and interpreted by men to justify control and domination of women in terms of expounding religious teachings... which is extrapolated into supporting misogyny in general.