If God controls everything, why punish murderers or have any laws?

[SeekerOfTruth007]

Pretty simple: If God is Almighty, then he created and controls both good and evil, so nobody can be at fault for their own actions anyway. Why do we bother arresting criminals, since Almighty God obviously pre-ordained their criminal acts?

Life is a sick joke, and there is no rational way to resolve this paradox. We may as well just let criminals do whatever they want, since God pre-ordained their crimes to begin with. Tjhe people arresting criminals are "resisting the will of God" just as much as the criminals themselves.

Example:

1) God controls everything.

2) Therefore God controls the Oklahoma City Federal bombers.

3) Therefore God caused the Oklahoma City Federal Bombing by virtue of the fact God controls Everything.

4) Therefore arresting the bombers there was pointless, because God caused it to happen, but then again, God caused the arrest too.

5) So then everyone inherently obeys God, even when they are EVIL because God controls everything. They cannot resist the fact God controls everything.

6) Therefore I concluded if God controls everything, then Good and Evil are an illusion and probably have no inherent meaning or value, because God causes both Good and Evil. There is nothing special about you potentially being a "hero" some day, because God made you that way. There is nothing wrong about being a murderer, because God controls all murderers too.

[Chazmatazz269]

That’s not at all what the Bible suggests.
In fact, God quite deliberately created man with free will. He already had the angels who were designed to love him unconditionally. He wanted to be chosen, not the only choice.
Furthermore, God doesn’t create evil. Satan does. You could argue that God created The Morningstar who tried to usurp God, and therefore ultimately created evil. There’s not much room for debate in that sense. But God would be Lucifer’s father. Good parents don’t usually resort to murdering their offspring no matter how wicked that offspring is.
What else was he gonna do? Besides, it created the choice dynamic that he wanted out of free will. You can choose God and receive the rewards for your faith, or you can choose Satan and suffer the consequences of that choice.
God does create trials and tribulations to challenge your faith. Successfully negotiating these things and continuing to choose God strengthens your faith and ultimately yourself, preparing you for future trials and tribulations.
Our behavior is in no way preordained. Generations of observations and experiences have taught us that leaving antisocial behavior unchecked is detrimental to people and society as a whole. Therefore legislation and enforcement of the laws is absolutely necessary for a civilization to prosper.
The only real question is how far away from natural law can we get before our laws become detrimental? This is the underlying problem with large scale socialism and communism. They are attempting to create an “equality” that quite frankly doesn’t exist anywhere in nature.

[SeekerOfTruth007]

You're wrong of course. Isaiah literally states that GOD created both good and evil, light and darkness.

Satan has no creative power.

Besides, I don't need the Bible. The world which actually exists reveals the character of God, and the world which actually exists reveals the fact that God is AMORAL... BUT YOU BETTER CALL HIM "GOOD" JUST IN CASE I'M WRONG.

"Oh my God, you're an awesome God. Great is thy faithfulness, mighty is your name."

But God definitely created everything (Jn. 1: 1) so don't try to lie and claim God didn't create everything. God created the alleged "Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil" if that story is based on anything real, and God therefore created Evil.

You're a noob at this topic.

If God was "Good all the time," then why does he allow rape and murder when HE is able to stop those crimes before they even happen?

Because God is Amoral. He doesn't give two shits in a pot whether a prostitute is a prostitute, nor does he give two shits in a pot whether a serial murderer kills her and gets away with it for 40 years.

[Chazmatazz269]

100% wrong, as usual. “Light and dark” are not “good and evil”. Satan creates demons. Rape and murder are crimes by HUMANS who have been corrupted by Satan and his demons. If those people chose God, they wouldn’t be committing those crimes.
You really don’t know much about anything do you? You just like to go online and claim that your ignorance and opinions stack up to facts. They don’t. You’re wrong again. Seems like you’d be used to that by now.

[jshm2]

Your premise is false. God is not some puppet master. Hence the rest of your diatribe is moot.

The idea of laws is to "prevent again, or worse". So things need to happen in order for the people to see and then be able to mitigate. Or make laws and processes to prevent it happening again.

There is not something supernatural at work, but very human. Humans are being taught to value themselves and each other by making proper functional laws from the base of divine laws.

[SeekerOfTruth007]

If God is supposedly both good and Almiighty, then the onus is upon him to intervene and stop murders. You expect fallible humans to prosecute criminals, but they get it wrong and acuse the wrong person at times. If God is both Almighty and Good, he could do that himself. Since God does not do those things himself, it implies he doesn't give a shit.

[strateguy632]

you left out a word "God is Almighty, he created both good and evil. He CAN 'control them' but didn't. so when someone shoplifts god let them choose but did not push the hand. so:

the statement 'God controls everything' is false. God COULD control everything but lets us choose. therefore people at fault for their own CHOICES and actions. god only made the abillty for evil but never did evil.

2. we COULD wait for god to judge but god COMMANDED to make courts to 'punish murderers and have any laws' that is why.

[Maybe_Maybe_not]

I could say that it's...

"Best not to speculate, it's all part of the Great Plan, it's not for us to understand... It's ineffable. It is beyond understanding and incapable of being put into words"

https://www.youtube.com/embed/oBOKi5XmR30

[exitseven]

God gives us all free will. Punishment b through the courts is designed to get bad people off the streets and maybe rehabilitate people or at least discourage them from reoffending.

A good public hanging used to serve as a deterrent to future murders.

[slatyb]

Because even religious people don't really believe God solves problems. Everything makes a lot more sense when you leave God out of it. Forget "The Lord moves in mysterious ways". That's just a complicated version of "Shit happens."

[SeekerOfTruth007]

No, it's worse than that. I can absolutely prove that there is a God. I didn't claim it was the Biblical God, even though it's not far from that, but there is a Creator nonetheless.

Problem:
The Creator has no moral oversite, being the first Being of any kind to ever exist and also being Almighty, so he can do anything he damn well wants to do, including kill 800 people in Nepal and wash another 3000 of them out to sea and probably kill them too.

What moral oversite is there with God? None. He can do whatever the fuck he wants to do, and you and I can't do anything about it.

You should probably still be "Good" all the time anyway, just in case I'm somehow wrong.

[slatyb]

Proof? There's no proof, only meaningless words. Proof will come if and only if the supposed God reveals itself. This hasn't happened since the beginning of humans drawing on cave walls. We see extinct animals in cave paintings tens of thousands of years old, but no gods.

[SeekerOfTruth007]

The God is not a mortal being. We live in a material universe CREATED by this God. One should not expect that God to be a substance within the universe. That would actually be a self-contradiction, which is precisely why Christianity is dead wrong. God is not a man. He's also not a rock nor a tree nor an elephant nor a bird, etc. I don't believe it's correct to call God a "spirit" either. That's a Jesus of Nazareth thing, but Jesus was verifiably a false prophet. No, God is on his own Ontological plane of existence, by himself, and everything else is something else entirely.

You are not going to find God "hiding under a rock" to draw in a painting, so don't be ridiculous.

[slatyb]

"We live... CREATED by this God" -- I see no evidence for that?

[SeekerOfTruth007]

Then I don't know what to tell you. It is mathematically proven that DNA is not a mistake nor is it inevitable. It's an actual CODE.

The laws of the Universe are logically derived and they are maximized. If there was no God, the laws of the universe shouldn't exist in the first place.

[slatyb]

"I don't know what to tell you" -- exactly. You can believe whatever but there's no evidence for any gods. "If there was no god..." is just another unsupported assertion. In any case, none of those arguments provide evidence for the utility of any religious practice.

[msc545]

You rest some fairly good questions to which I have no answers. I think you should just ask God. He should know the answers to these questions and I'm confident he will. Whether or not he will speak to you and tell you the answers is a different issue.

[kültigin_tr]

Only he knows :D