Gender roles come from our biology, not from socialisation. There have been studies done with monkeys where they were given toys, and every time the result is the same - the males go for the cars and trucks, and the females go for the baby dolls.
The person who first coined the term "gender identity" was a sexual identity researcher named John Money. He invented the idea that gender is entirely learned, that's it's nurture rather than nature.
He did an experiment with a boy named David Reimer. When he was circumcised as a baby something went wrong and they damaged his penis beyond repair. When John discovered this he approached the parents and encouraged them to raise David as a girl, and they eventually agreed.
As he grew older however despite their efforts he acted like a stereotypical boy and played with boy toys. Eventually they told him the truth, and he decided that he wanted them to stop treating him like a girl. When he grew up he eventually killed himself.
Despite this failure, and arguably fucking with David's head so much that it eventually drove him to suicide because gender isn't something to play with, many people still believe in his theories and think that he was an amazing person. In fact when my girlfriend took a childcare course they tried to teach this story in a false way by telling the class that they successfully raised him as a girl and that he lived happily as a woman for the rest of his life, blatantly lying.
The people who push these ideas have a sick agenda to completely ignore the very real differences between the sexes and to do all they can to destroy them, no matter how much harm it causes to the mental health of the children.
For this reason I find it very frustrating when I see people talk about this, because it's so easy to find the information I just gave and see that it's a lie. But it's as though because people want there to be absolute gender equality and sameness between men and women they ignore all of that and carry on with these bullshit ideas. This is one of the reasons my children will be homeschooled, they're being taught by idiots.
EVERY time an experiment like this has been tried, the results always came out to a similar conclusion. Girls gravitated toward each other and formed friendships, and talked about each other or other people. They made up games that mostly focused on domestic situations, or being a nurse, or animal vets.
The boys all wanted to play with balls (baseball, football, basketball, etc..), acted somewhat violently toward dolls (tore their arms or head off), OR played with them as if they were in the military. They'd use different kitchen items as either make-believe guns, swords, or shields and used the big plastic kitchen appliances as forts.
At what point are people going to FINALLY figure out that males and females are simply wired different right from conception? SMH...
How did the experiment go? i think total gender reversal would be stupid but its good for boys to learn how to do house hold chores and chef could be a good career if not they could be a line cook while in college. For little girls to just say no needs a little bit more context. Not being a pushover is important. They should have had the little girls play with legos or to do wood shop. That way they can be able to fix stuff when they are older. Its good for people to be more well rounded , but i don't think they should try to force opposite gender roles
Yeah they need something that is testable. You can set up an experiment in which the control group is little boys and girls where they stick to traditional toys , boys with legos, woodshop , cars and sports and the girls play with dolls, crochet , and take a cooking class. The experimental group the girls with play with legos, do woodshop, play with cars and do sports. The boys should do girl stuff. Then for six months they should check in with follow ups every 2 weeks to test their skills at what they have learned, their level of interest , happiness levels, and ask them about their interpersonal relations with others
I think the little boys would be a lot less happy than the little girls
No but traditionally female gender roles are oppressive
No that’s going way too far
easy bake oven, ballet classes, stuffed animals, makeup
no they can put makeup on a doll or a maneqin
i used to play with both legos and dolls
@COCOCHANEL me too !
We need to cut teaching this is for girls and that is for boys. A guy once wouldn’t date me because I wouldn’t cook for him. I said, that’s what wives do so unless you make me your wife, I’m cooking for myself and you can do the same. Guess what, now my husband enjoys cooking for me and my ex is cooking for his single ass self.
Was there an article about this you read? I have a feeling there was a bit more context if there was.
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What we play with or are interested in is less important than how we treat each other and how well we understand each other.
If kids are encouraged to play with just anything, ignoring their gender is one good point though. But it rather serves to discover their (unguided, inclined) interests.
To work out gender roles and related, I think that pretend-play and games are more efficient, because there is more cognitive activity involved.
However - if playing with toy cars and trucks improves parking skills in girls: please DO IT :D
In any case, role related 'education' should always give a voluntary feeling; or it may backfire.
Well there is an agenda at play here. In case y'all have not noticed, every cultural institution has been overtaken from the inside out by cultural marxists, descendants of the frankfurt school. Look this shit up before calling me some dumb conspiracy theorist, and no that doesn't mean going on george soros funded snopes and saying 'durp hurp it was debunked durp hurp'
They are trying to eliminate gender roles by reversing them so everyone is just one basic type. This will make it easier to control people. First there was feminism, now there is this whole men need to be cucked pussies bullshit. Masculine men need feminine women and vice versa to be strong, we are weak right now in the west, which is why we are being displaced by third worlders who will vote for w/e the fuck they are propagandized into voting for. Why do we trust authority? We are so dumb
Stupid and pointless. The whole idea of society influencing gender roles is bullshit because why did society have them in the first place? Did people get together and decide which gender should be interested in which thing?
These things are biological, it's the way we are. Why would you even bother to change them anyway.
Well, since it can be shown that gendered preference are not socialized, this experiment will do nothing. Also, shouting no, will not increase the likely hood of them being less compliant as to get them to do it in the first place the teachers would've had to reward the girl's compliance.
Sheesh, it's like teachers can't think properly.
I think that if a kid wants to do something let them do it, unless it's kill someone or something like that of course, and how does making girls shout no have to do with anything wtf?
All that will do is feminize little boys. If this is real, these teachers need to locked for child abuse, as well as lose they're job for overstepping the authority of a parent and trying to raise their child.
It’s stupid social engineering. Gender roles are based on millions of years of evolution, not easily undone by some asshole teacher.
Millions? Not really.
Yes, and there is proof in certain species that dont have the same social rules we do. Social rules are a reactant to social stimuli. We have only acted such a way because it insured survival. One day, humans will transcend their primal instinct and roles as some are trying to do now. Lets stop thinking like apes
For the time period we were in yes, but just because something has worked does not mean that it will always work. You have to adapt. Right now society expects two financial earners to pay off bills unless one earner makes insane bucks. There is no need for the mom to stay and watch the kids anymore. Kids have school, social lives baby sitters etc.. Times are changing quick, we have to adapt.
@theflash675 Yes, moms are working outside the home, and women continually report less satisfaction with life overall. Our children are medicated with powerful stimulants, and millions pop antidepressants daily. Depression and anxiety rates are very high. We have a generation of men who are lost and angry and grew up with no father influence in the home. The state has replaced a parent. We have the highest incarceration rate in the free world. Doesn’t seem your new way is working out so well for us as a species.
Lets not nitpick here. Working isn't good for anybody. There is a reason why men make up the work related deaths and a big reason why a lot of middle aged men kill themselves. We head in this direction because we have to adapt. Just telling people to stick to your role does not put food on the table. You want to stop crime and kids from taking such horrible drugs? Then education drug reform and ending the war on drugs is the way to go. That has NOTHING to do with gender roles. about 75% of crime here is because of drug related issues.
And i will also look at black families whose fathers had gotten arrested due to the war on drugs because before that the majority of them were present. Almost half of the prison population is in jail for a drug related crime. Drugs are projected to have an direct connection to 75% of crime, and is the leading cause of broken families, not reversed gender roles.. i am not saying a father isn't important, i am saying the problem you see today is due to various other factors , not gender roles. Just because things aren't working now with a ton of other factors at play you can't just claim the cause of it all. Dualistic thinking will never give you the answer here.
@theflash675 I don't disagree with the war on drugs needing to be eliminated, but that's really getting us off topic.
The bottom line issue is that for this scenario to work to "get rid of gender roles", you have to force people to do things they'd rather not do. Girls prefer to play with dolls, boys prefer to play with trucks. Women prefer nurturing support jobs where they can have flexibility in work schedules to help with child rearing, men prefer jobs in STEM fields. When left to our own devices this is what people CHOOSE. For any type of engineering you have to eliminate peoples freedom to choose their lives. How evil is that!
"I dont disagree with the war on drugd needing to be eliminated"
Then dont expect any of your crime to lower either. Its not off topic when you brought up kids using drugs at an all time high. You can't fight the demand of something. a lot of countries already realized this. I dont know what all girls want nor do i know how all boys work. Over simplifying the situation is where people go wrong when a lot of people fall in that grey area. There are a lot of boys\girls who are pressured into liking certain things because of roles. Ill tell you what, let people be themselves. If a boy really likes to do boyish things then so be it, if he doesn't however, she shouldn't be discouraged to do so. This is why we have a male teacher problem in this society, or a male teen who needs some money in his pocket but he has trouble finding kids to baby sit because of preconceptions that people have of male caretakers. Believe it or not, a lot of those guys do exist. Its never black and white.
gender are equivalent except sex organ, this preference due to parenting not education
Just let the kids do whatever they fucking want, what is wrong with this generation
I think they should just play with whatever toys they want to
i don't see how that would improve anything
This is fucked up bullshit
That's just stupid.
There's a difference between starting at a young age and keeping consistent through the years. Starting at a young age is definitely a good idea they may not remember all of it or even any of it, but having it enforced through the school grades will help to ensure that it's being taught.
Frost, you dont give kids enough credit. At the age of 5-8 kids have emulated things they have learned for as long as i can remember. Can they understand it? No, but it does stick with them until they do. Treating kids like dummies so they can grow up dumb is where we went wrong.
Sounds funny
Someone else thinks we should try this yea they need something that is testable. You can set up an experiment in which the control group is little boys and girls where they stick to traditional toys , boys with legos, woodshop , cars and sports and the girls play with dolls, crochet , and take a cooking class. The experimental group the girls with play with legos, do woodshop, play with cars and do sports. The boys should do girl stuff. Like dance, cooking, stuffed animals, and makeup. Then for six months they should check in with follow ups every 2 weeks to test their skills at what they have learned, their level of interest , happiness levels, and ask them about their interpersonal relations with others. What do you think about such a idea being tested would you support it?
That's stupid.
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