Is America (U. S. A.) irredeemable at this point or will it bounce back as strong on the world stage of strength, success and prosperity etc?

Question

nightdrot · Accepted Answer

It is the nature of fortunes and man that the pendulum swings both ways. Though in the end - as Lincoln said, "The only phrase that is true always and forever is, 'This too shall pass."

Nothing lasts. Human beings are frail creatures and imperfect. That is why those schools of philosophical thought that have sought Utopia or to perfect man have led to so much brutality and bloodshed. The greatest crimes in history having been those made in the name of perfection.

Having said all that as preface, of course the United States will bounce back. At least until it does not, but "we cannot know the day nor the hour."

What can be said in all conviction is that what the USA is experiencing now, both domestically and internationally, is not new - or at least not entirely new. This is a nation that experienced so much internal upheaval that over 600,000 of its citizens killed each other. More than the number of Americans who died in both world wars combined. It does not get much more violent and tumultuous than that.

The current interregnum of rising crime, social turmoil, campus radicalism and the like too has its antecedents in history. It being only necessary to look back to as recently as the 1960s and 70s for a period of equal social tumult.

Of course there are differences. The period of the 1960s and 70s played out against a technological backdrop of mass media - mass circulation publications, movies, radio and television. So all more or less experienced the world through the same intellectual and cultural prism.

The current technology, on the other hand, has a splintering effect. It is possible now for an individual - thanks to cable, the Internet, social media and the like - to look at their phone or watch television or listen to satellite radio and get the message that confirms their biases. Thus a culture in which the same words mean different things to different people and meaningful communication is more difficult and problematic.

Indeed, this has resulted in an interesting shift. In the 60s and 70s the message was to avoid conformity. "Do your own thing," and "don't believe what the man tells you." Now the cultural message is "wokeness." Don't use certain words. Don't say certain things. "You better do what the man tells you to do" - so long of course as it is the right man.

Yet the United States has even been through this before. As the economy transitioned from an agricultural/mercantile economy to a manufacturing/consumer economy, Americans worried about what would happen to the sturdy rural yeoman and the values of rural life. Indeed, this is part of what led to that aforementioned 600,000 dead in the Civil War.

So the nation has been here before - and will be again. Until it is not - it again being an irreducible reality that "we cannot know the day nor the hour." Thus it is the obligation of each citizen to be the best and most virtuous being they can be. Thus delaying, individually and collectively, that final hour for as long as is possible. It never being forgotten that it can be delayed, but not denied.

One last point: The question speaks of the USA being "irredeemable." This being the language of sin and faith and not the social sciences. Yet that is the funny thing, few nations in history have sought more self-consciously to become "a more perfect union."

So consciously and with such self-awareness, Americans - for all their many, many flaws - have an innate desire to try to be better. This is what keeps America from being "irredeemable." Note not immortal, but an example of the striving to be more than it is in any given moment.

LesterJester · Accepted Answer

There are too many fundamental issues at play for far too long that nobody in the US wants to or is willing to address.

These problems tend to get brushed aside and ignored for as long as possible, using multiple means of distraction, only for those ignored problems to pop back up worse than before... Then pushed aside because another major problem that was ignored for a long time pops back up to take its place.

The US is good at a few things. One is ignoring their own problems and acting like everything is fine to the rest of the world, while the house burns to the ground in the background. Problem with this is that as mentioned, those problems fester and boil over in time... But, the reason why they don't do anything about those problems is because

#1: them doing anything about the problem acknowledges that there is a problem and therefore, the US isn't perfect (that's OK, no country is perfect)

#2: most of the problems that need fixing are complicated by a centuries old ragged piece of paper written by some old fuddy duddies for an era long past and didn't foresee how times change. To update and modernise their Continuation to better serve the current day and age would mean acknowledging their forefathers were flawed humans like the rest of us and not gods.

Point being is if you do not adapt and evolve, you will become extinct. Adhering to some rules made up over 230 years ago without even considering some aspects are no longer relevant is to lead to collapse.

And the other reason why nobody will make change to their constitution is because the political sides see each other as the enemy and any changes made would immediately be assumed to have been made to give one side or the other an advantage.

One of the other things the US is good at is War and Distruction. The US was created through war. While other British Colonies found more peaceful ways to become their own nations and even break away from the Commonwealth, the US chose war. With the help of the French Empire, they got their "freedom" but for the most part, Americans act like they did it all on their own, simply because they're awesome like that.

Americans were "United" over a single cause, which was to fight the British. And yet, soon after gaining their so called freedom from the British, they were tossed right into a Civil War and started killing one another.

The only time the US is actually united is when they have a target to destroy. Look at WWI, WWII, Korean War, Vietnam (until it dragged on too long), Gulf War, then 9/11, Afghanistan/Iraq (Until they dragged on too long).

When there's an enemy to distract from their problems, they're United. But when a war that distracts goes on for too long, then they get divided again. When there isn't a war or enemy to focus on, what to Americans do? They target each other and make each other the enemy.

It all ends up rooted to one of their many long term issues: Narcissism.

BipBipLeddus · Accepted Answer

Seeing as my cousin in NY as well as someone I went to school with were two of many asian-americans killed by racists on account of the pandemic, I can't be bothered to want or expect good things from that place anymore.

It's a place where White Supremacy is no longer being swept under the rug; it's fucking celebrated. Race wars are running rampant. Everyone is too full of hate and preoccupied with pointing fingers to give 2 shits about fixing anything there. The USA won't be fixed until it's burned itself to the ground and everyone is forced to reevaluate what's important.

Empires rise and fall. This is the fall. Good riddance.

anon171999 · Accepted Answer

How can something that was built on the foundation of inhumane and cruel behavior be fixed? It can't. It's been corrupted by those in leadership being greedy and simply going after money since even before it was a country. (I am referencing those who came from Europe, not the native Americans)

NamerOfStars · Answer

As a nation? We'll recover. But as an empire? That's more complex. A study of history will show that empires have a definite life cycle, and that they wax and wane; they rise, grow in power, stagnate, innovate, grow decadent, fade, and die- sometimes shoving their way backward a few steps to buy more time, but they all fall in the end. And yes, the US very much has an empire, even though we don't conquer territory (anymore) and claim it as our own; we're just about "freedom and democracy" and the almighty dollar.

Whether we're in the final round of the decadence cycle or we'll pull ourselves out of it remains to be seen, but I rather suspect this is it- fortunately, this is looking like it's going to be more the "gently receding" type of collapse than the "horrific bloodbath" type; we'll end up more like the UK than the Romans or Mayans. Nor need it necessarily be a permanent thing: China's empire has collapsed MANY times, but it keeps coming back- local mythology aside, they're more like a phoenix than a dragon. It'll also be slow: the UK didn't have their empire collapse after WW2; it had been in decline for a quite a while, and was a slow, drawn-out process. It'll likely be the same for us.

As to why- after the end of the Cold War, every Presidential race went to the less internationally-minded candidate (until Biden). After the Wall came down, and even more after the USSR broke up, Americans weren't drenching themselves in champagne in celebration, they were looking around: at their decaying cities and their sky-high crime rate and their vast, super-expensive armada protecting us all from... what, exactly? Freighters full of Toyotas bought by Californian dentists? Osama and his thugs bought us more time, but the damage had been done- people were starting to seriously question what all the expenses and overseas entanglements were even FOR. The Pax Americana that our taxes go to is what makes shipping all our jobs overseas possible.

The one unpredictable angle is that no one's in position to take our place. Even if we lose our Superpower status, nobody's stepping up to take it. China's in no shape to do so, Russia hasn't been strong enough for forty years, the EU's barely holding itself together, India's a good three or decades of heavy development away from being a candidate (I wouldn't count them out somewhere down the line, but not yet), and Japan doesn't even HAVE a military, in any real sense of the word (they also have a similar population aging problem to China, and few of its resources to deal with it). Who does that leave? Greenland? Ethiopia? Maybe Paraguay, the little nation that couldn't, and is STILL really angry about it?

RealMarek · Answer

The dollar is the world’s reserve currency, but foreign powers are gradually reducing their exposure to the dollar despite the aggressive foreign policy of the US that serves to enforce the use of the dollar to denominate global trade. The US is no longer the world’s largest economy. The dollar will continue to gradually decline, and the decline may even accelerate. The standard of living for most people will collapse. The elite who exercise power in America are insatiably greedy and prey on the broader population through regulations and monetary policy, which is how the disparity in wealth became so unbalanced. I cannot imagine them providing much relief to the broad population when inflation becomes even more severe. America is not just an empire abroad, but also an empire at home. It has forced mass migration on its population and the original population is internally at odds with marked regional differences. When times get difficult, diverse groups with roots abroad and regions that are alienated from the central government tend to pursue their own agendas. The country is a powder keg waiting to go off.

DaveToo · Answer

This country has been through worse times than what we are dealing with now. Yes, we have to deal with 800,000 dead from this pandemic. That makes it the worst in our history. But throughout our history, we've had other pandemics and we have overcome them.

Our economy is driven by a number of factors, the pandemic has severely affected our workforce. But it's not the only factor. Average Joe and Jane America want better wages to help them deal with inflation. Our crumbling infrastructure is because past administrations have ignored the problem until one or another collapses and kills people.

Our current political environment, just as in the past, is driven by old white men. Love them or hate them, the new blood in Congress is pushing for change. The old man at the helm right now is being steered by an entirely different group than those in the past.

I don't see the country as needing recovery. We're on the path to recovery. In my opinion, those who have refused the vaccines have put themselves in harm's way, and as much as I would like to help them, they're going to die. Pandemics work that way. The stock market is going to do a massive correction, it's too bloated right now and those with the power to alter its course, will take their profits and make that correction.

We are one of China's best customers, so I don't see any more aggressiveness from them, beyond cyber theft. If Joe Biden gives an ultimatum to Putin that further aggression with Ukraine WILL, not could mean all out war with the United States. Putin will have to back down, as Kruschev did. A tough, no-nonsense stance is all Putin understands.

So let's stop wringing our hands, worrying if the country can survive. We will.

Texaskid1 · Answer

The US has been a haven for many but it seems like we are close to a civil war. The country is divided , the economy is shit , the covid thing is still out there and more people find themselves buried in debt that they cannot repay. The left fraction of the country grows more bold and they are pushing towards more and more racial towards segregation and they are constantly demonizing the right. Many people on the right feel as if the media, the general culture looks down on them and fell more and more isolated. Like it or not conservatives are half the country.

There was an interesting opinion that came out Washington Post and is said we may very well be in the insurance phase as of Jan 6th , 2021.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2021/12/17/how-civil-wars-start-barbara-walter-research/?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=referral&utm_campaign=wp_opinions

The conditions we are seeing now in the US have been observed in other countries right before they had their civil wars. This is not me saying this - this is the CIA.
Some people will laugh at all of this but it may very well be around the corner. I hope that it does not happen but on the other hand I am sure that if you told some one in 1850 that the US would have a civil war in some 10 years time they would have laughed at you. These things build up slowly - I think the Jan 6th attack was just the tip of the iceberg and a prelude of things to come. I hope that I am wrong though.

MadBoy · Answer

It is irredeemable because the corruption and stupidity now runs too deep. People would rather scream and protest instead of listening and understanding. They would rather blindly follow instead of forming their own opinion. They would rather resort to violence than find a more peaceful solution. Too many criminals, both in uniform and not, run freely. Those that don't pack prisons to near breaking point. We continue to feed the rich and damn the poor. Politics is nothing more than a verbal contest that goes nowhere because both sides continue to erase the other's agenda when they have enough power and push whatever the people paying them want instead. People act stupid and violent because it's more "fun" to do so, or because they know no alternatives and were never taught other alternatives. We don't really create much of anything except weaponry, and we buy and consume everything else. People even blindly ignore warnings and rules if it doesn't fit what they think is reality, and throw tantrums if their "reality" is questioned. We still have people thinking they are in the right when they break laws, and then many other people think they are the good guys.

America isn't great, and until we literally take away what America is, that is, a façade, it never will be.

Anonymous · Answer

Depends on the 2022 Congressional elections and the 2024 elections. In 2022 both chambers of Congress have crucial seats up for grabs. In 2024 the presidency AND both chambers will be in the same boat.

If the Democrats maintain their seats in the House and Senate in 2022, then nothing will change and things will be as they are now. Republicans have enough power in the Senate to maintain America as it is right now because they can block anything that can be blocked with Filibuster, which is most bills.

If the Democrats gain 10 more seats in the Senate and maintains the House, America is finished. Democrats are the party of giving criminals more rights, restricting the police and military and backing down to international pressure. Biden is their puppet.

If the Republicans win one or both chambers of Congress or keep their current seats in the Senate then America has a chance at improving our prospects for the future and blocking Democrat bullshit.

If Democrats gain commanding control of both chambers and Biden remains in office, America is finished. We will be a doormat to illegals and to international interests. We will lose our chance to protect ourselves from the government and our rights will be eroded.

In 2024 if another Democrat wins, the rest of the world will continue to not take us seriously.

This post is lengthy, but it all comes down to this: Democrats win, America loses. Republicans win, America wins.

normalice · Answer

One of two things has to happen for that. Either the republicans have to become a serious party again or democrats have to hold both chambers in 2022. Unfortunately these come as a package. The only chance there is of republicans abandoning trumpism is if it costs them seats in 2022 instead of gaining any for them. I'd imagine if that happens people like McConnell will become a lot more vocal about their extreme elements. A republican can not get away with complaining about bad faith behavior. But a republican absolutely can complain about losing power.

But if Republicans win on trumpism then it will become the permanent state of the US and we will no longer have any credibility worldwide.

ChrisMaster69 · Answer

It’s pretty much digging it’s own grave.

you have a polarised society that blames everything on politics, or makes everything political.

Everything is a political point scoring and blaming the other side, all the time the ship is sinking.

pretty much two sides digging to the bottom as fast as they can.

what makes it even more farcical is both parties are pretty much centre or right of centre, there is no left wing party lol.

it’s like UKIP and National Front in the UK demonising the Conservative party for being communists lol.

Between Politics, religion and anti vaccine / believing conspiracy theories, the countries fucked.

Everything is blamed on politics.

the Russians and Chinese must piss themselves laughing.

Also they likely have numerous accounts on social media pushing this polarising.

Let’s face it, having a superpower split down the middle and failing, means they win and keep winning.

dankstranger · Answer

Goku lost some battles and had to recollect his strength and come back.

This is one of those stages were America is not the super power it once was. We've fell off the horse. We've lost some battles. It's just gonna take recollecting strength getting back to our core values and getting back on that horse.

America has been in even more dismal scenarios in the past and was able to survive. As long as Americans care about maintaining America it will survive.

America is surely going to look different. We are surely going to change. But I think the only way America fails is if the people give up on its ideas.

Anonymous · Answer

It would take a radical change in course for the US to bounce back. It is currently a house divided and the constant, vitriolic discourse within both its government and populace has both weakened the nation and tarnished its global reputation. If I were a betting man, I'd say America's days as a world leader are behind it. Not because of anything from without, but because of its enemies within. For all the fear of Russia, China, Iraq, and more, it was none of them that destroyed America. It was America itself.

andreasderjuengere · Answer

How do we specify 'your' parameters?
strength = violence? (related to military 'power')
success = dominance? (related to corrupting other cultures?)
prosperity = greed? (related to consuming useless goods?)

To be #1 in everything is not equal to being the best in everything :)

To live a 'good' and fulfilling life as an individual is possible next to everywhere; the ''greatness'' of the country that surrounds me will not change my own quality.

Irredeemable... the original idea behind the U. S. of A. was lost some 100 years ago already; it's now something else.

JCrockett · Answer

Liberals want to destroy America. Conservatives want to do the same thing, only slower. We're doomed unless we can escape this framework. But doing so will be difficult because the ruling class are all scum who have no interest in America's best interests.

It'll take something radical to save this country, (and the entire western world).

If the next Napoleon has already been born, we have a chance.

Lw85381 · Answer

Of course it will. The US, like just about every other country in the world has had bad times, bad leadership, upset citizens etc. At the time is always seems to look like the end of the world as we know it. It almost never is. It seems our South American friends seem to go through these periods on a regular basis, but somehow bounce back. The US will also. Trump will slowly fade out as have multiple prior awful presidents, Overly Woke people will slowly go back to sleep, CRT and SJW's will get older and straighten up or die off. This period will be remembered as the the Time of Hatred, or some such moniker like that.

Personally, I'd like to go back to the Hippi Sixties, grab some bell bottom jeans, my faux suede fringed jacket and lovely long hair in a pony tail. Smoke a little boo, have sex, eat a peanut butter and butter sandwich, fire up the black lights with Tuesday Afternoon on the record player, have sex and smoke a little more boo. Life was good.

Anonymous · Answer

If the US would put it’s people first then they would have power. It would be a country to look up to. At least figure the hell out of healthcare for all. Neither side has anything to brag about there. Everyone needs healthcare. No denials. No permission. No paperwork. No f-cking waiting weeks to get to a doctor. Think about why we don’t have it. No president red or blue has given it to the people. Fully fix this and you start to fix a broken country.

Robber_Baron · Answer

Insha'Allah!

This country is deeply divided, the two of our politics are extremely stupid and sometimes borderline insane, we don't have affordable healthcare, let alone universal healthcare, billionaires get richer and everyone else is getting poorer, crime is rising, people behave like spoiled children until their 50s...

And at the same time our retarded government is picking a fight with China, Russia and Iran at the same time!

This country deserves to get fucked...

slatyb · Answer

I expect it will rebound unless the totalitarians are able to seize control. If Trump or someone of his ilk had absolute power they could destroy the economy in a few years, just as Chavez destroyed Venezuela and Erdogan destroyed Turkey, If Xonping retains power in China for much longer the Chinese economy will continue to suffer.

captain_voidwalker · Answer

I think america is about to balkanize. The political left and right are irreconcilable at this point. The left wants communism and the right wants freedom. So you will probably wind up with 2 leftist states on the east and west coast. And a right leaning state along the gulf coast and up the mid west

007kingifrit · Answer

they said america was irredeemable after the vietnam fall of saigon... within 20 years the soviet union fell and america became the single power on earth

america has no longterm weaknesses... besides democrats but that's a managable problem that only erupts every once and a while

BarryLiverstone · Answer

USA is the best country in the world. One undeniable stat is more people want to immigrate to the US than any other country. It’s a world power in terms of military and its natural resources are exported around the world. Doesn’t need to bounce back as it’s #1.

FlutteringFeelings · Answer

Was America ever at a stage of strength, success, and prosperity? or Did a tough time reveal America’s weakness that they’ve been masking this entire time?

RolandCuthbert · Answer

We are a divided nation. Why do we keep trying to stick together? We should have a referendum like the British did.

Anonymous · Answer

My friend the day we legalized abortion in this country was the day this country no longer deserved to continue as top dog. Once that evil rot infiltrated our society it was the beginning of the end for us.

Baredog69 · Answer

Man is going to take decades for us to recover from what this president has done in less than a year. I don't know how we can withstand another three years of this idiot.

Jersey2 · Answer

Voters just need to vote in good people who care about the country and the economy and social situation will work out.

exitseven · Answer

I imagine that once Republicans take back the house and senate a lot of the damage will stop at least. When Trump was president it really did seem like America's best days were ahead. Maybe it will happen again.

I_want_a_moustache · Answer

Maybe we can have a closed country policy like the Sakoku. It could give us time to focus on problems solely inside of the US. Probably never going to happen but it's a great book idea.

Anonymous · Answer

Nope the USA love cheap foreign abor an d cheating it's American workers.

Selling out to China, India, and Mexico

Moving American jobs out there.

American couldn't even make facemask last year March had to wait for China.

Car companies and Nabisco moving's to Mexico

Honestguyopen · Answer

The whole world is ruined and doomed by man. But once God steps in to cleanse it we will be alright forever after that.

Anonymous · Answer

the American Empire has fallen Civil War is guaranteed unless we divide up the country

sean1234 · Answer

The Bible doesn't talk about things getting better and better. Things will get worse and worse till the 2nd coming of Jesus.

joeblow123 · Answer

We did have a strong leader in Donald Trump. We also had global respect under Donald Trump. As far as saving America is concerned. If Biden wins a second term we are toast.

jimmy2 · Answer

Well Democrats off the charts lying to everyone. Democratic democracy my ass. It Democrats on steroids trying to destroy the foundation of what makes America great. Its Socialism peroid. Wake up America before its too late

Dargil · Answer

No, but I believe it is going to take blood and guns. I sort of have a plan for what to do but I don't want to discuss it with the FBI.

888theGreat · Answer

It will collapse , and they will start a new system

QuietRunner · Answer

I just watched President Reagan's 1980 Republican National convention address We can come back from anything

Kingofkings1992 · Answer

If Joe Biden stays president, soon there won’t be a United States.

Tomtom9494 · Answer

People miss Donald so badly, I was telling y’all what the truth was back when it was pop culture to demonize the Man

DiegoO · Answer

In my opinion the US is in decline and China will also be, in a near future.

Anonymous · Answer

America will finally face the end. They are not strong as it used to be and infrastructure are crumbling. In fact it’s only fakes. People will finally released from the lies and fantasy that they created.

OddBeMe · Answer

Not sure we’re dying but we’re not a leader as we were. For good or ill.

Anonymous · Answer

America is fkd. The damage Trump done can't be overturned

Hellraiser1984 · Answer

We're on the highway to hell!

Reijen · Answer

Always depends on the people.

BillyBalls · Answer

The USA. Has been decaying since 1960.

Twalli · Answer

We can, but we're not trying to

Staximus · Answer

It was worse off right after the civil war

emperor90 · Answer

Yes it is

Is America (U. S. A.) irredeemable at this point or will it bounce back as strong on the world stage of strength, success and prosperity etc?

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Is America (U. S. A.) irredeemable at this point or will it bounce back as strong on the world stage of strength, success and prosperity etc?

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