Are most people so uninformed about politics they shouldn’t have a say in political decisions? Is democracy a shitty system?

[Intothevoid666]

In why other advanced field of study does the average person get a say over the field? When it comes to human physiology, or particle physics, or anesthesiology the average person willingly accepts that they know next to nothing and don’t speak on it but suddenly when it comes to politics everyone is an expert. Democracy is like giving a monkey a microphone. The system that is in place in Russia is far better than the system that is in place in the US and I hope the US changes to that. People who straight up failed social studies in high school argue to the death about political opinions it’s sad honestly. The world is a brutal vicious place and if u can’t fully accept that fact u cannot make intelligent political decisions this is just a fact too bad for human survival most people can’t actually be fully aware of how brutal and awful the world truly is. Discuss

[MCheetah]

Democracy works just fine; it's just that people are stupid and politicians keep people stupid. Fix corruption, outlaw and criminalize lobbying, and hold bad politicians accountable, and the problem fixes itself.

But if you want a better system, maybe the Starship Troopers form of government, Stratocracy, might be more up your alley, where you have to serve military duty and become a "citizen" in order to vote. "SERVICE GURANTEES CITIZENSHIP!"

[MCheetah]

But in reality, the US has no actual democracy anyway. It's been an oligarchy for literally decades now, and I think you already know this. Who TF wanted Hillary Clinton or Joe Biden to be president?

[bamesjond0069]

I agree except you can't make a political test when people do not agree on facts. Who will grade the answers, consider this question: "life begins at..." a conception b birth - who do you suppose will set the correct answer? This is a problem for all issues pretty much.

At its most basic level making all ballots a write in only so if you dont know their name you cannot vote for them... that could be a good idea.

But really the should increase the age to 40 to vote and people who own their own house or any real property. That should be sufficient.

[Intothevoid666]

Yeah if they made it harder to vote that would def make it a lot better

[ChrisMaster69]

Only people that live in democratic countries say this shit.

Why not get rid of the jury?

A huge number of cases are far to complex or those on the jury not provided with enough evidence.

oh yeah they do that shit in North Korea, Syria, Russia etc.

Try asking someone in Hong Kong their view on how well free speech works in China.

Now are people stupid and vote for shit that people say but if you look at it objectively, yeah they are.

a trip in to the politics section on here shows how fucked up some countries are and how polarised.

[Intothevoid666]

Plenty of people in Russia like the government they have tho

[Guy13]

Democracy is a shitty System because what that actually means is Majority rules and there are no Underpinning Values. Democracy, worked out, is Putin’s Russia. Democracy is code for Absolute Power, absolutely through the uneducated masses of cells that vote Leftists.

A Republic, with underlying principles that both the majority and minority have to follow is a great System as it demonstrates liberty, freedom, and Justice at man level adopted from the Bible

[Intothevoid666]

Putin does not have absolute power. This whole notion that Russia is a super authoritarian state by global standards is just not true

[Intothevoid666]

Russia is a republic

[goaded]

"Russia is a republic" Where journalists, doctors who tell the truth, and opposition politicians are killed or imprisoned on fake charges. I think North Korea holds "elections", too.

[Guy13]

You are an informed fool. I’ve been to Moscow. and St. Petersburg. Freedom found in republic in the Soviet Union cloaked is 💩 . Clearly, the true State of Russia is self-evident. —“It’s who counts the votes” has been the saying and lint of view since The days of Nicholas there.
You say this or your kids, who are not in military or “drafted” will be serving in Ukraine.
You bring a whole new definition to uninformed. You sound like a Russian disinformation tool.

[Intothevoid666]

Russia has never claimed to allow the people to elect the president the ruling party elects be president and the ruling party has changed several times in the last hundred years without an ounce of bloodshed.

[Intothevoid666]

And the people elect the ruling party

[goaded]

Putin's ruling party, because journalists, doctors who tell the truth, and opposition politicians are killed or imprisoned on fake charges.

[Intothevoid666]

@goaded because most people shouldn’t have a say in politics because they cannot accept the brutal nature of the game and if they are gonna fuck things up for everyone else they deserve it. Or else u end up like America 30 trillion in debt and on the brink of massive civil disorder.

[goaded]

The brutal choosing who's allowed to vote is fascism. But you know that, because you clearly support that.

[Intothevoid666]

@goaded anyone who uses the word fascism in any modern day political discussion has no clue wtf they’re talking about. That’s not fascism actually fascism is a very specific for of government that was popular in Europe in the first half of the 20th century. But thank u.

[goaded]

No, it's a good description of what Orbain, Putin and Trump are doing. They're making false accusations about people in order to gain power.

[Intothevoid666]

@goaded like the cia and Hillary Clinton did with the trump russia hoax?

[Intothevoid666]

@goaded trump said the US is in an abysmal state of disrepair which is true and he also said he alone can fix it. Which is also true. He’s not making any false promises. The options are either him or societal collapse. And that’s really not being dramatic. I wish that wasn’t true but it is

[goaded]

Classic fascist move: "Only I can fix it!".

He was president. Did he fix it? No. He made it worse, and is now trying to destroy the country entirely by lying about the election.

And you're helping him.

[Intothevoid666]

@goaded we were def on track. Look at where we’re at now? Our economy is in ruins. We had the lowest gas prices in a long time under trump and leaders around the world respected us. Now we have the highest gas prices in a very long time and we are a joke to the world.

[goaded]

Utter bullshit. The economy collapsed under Trump and his mis-handling of covid, which was also the reason for the low fuel prices; nobody was going anywhere. Unemployment is back down to 3.6% and new jobs have been added at about 400,000 jobs a month for a record length of time. And you really think Trump wasn't a joke around the world?

upload.wikimedia.org/.../..._Parliament_Square.jpg



Biden's got respect, and it's pissing the dictators off.

[Intothevoid666]

@goaded we can agree to disagree but this is what I’m talking about. Watch what happens in America we will become a republic and not a democracy it’s only a matter of time I would bet almost anything on it.

[Intothevoid666]

@goaded ur arguments are coming from emotion not reason. U don’t like trump so he has to be a bad leader.

[goaded]

Do you even know what Republic means? "A state where sovereignty rests with the people or their representatives, rather than with a monarch or emperor; a country with no monarchy. " Trump was a bad leader, he's a major reason the US has had over 3,000 deaths per million from covid, and he tried to keep control of the country despite the express wish of the people.

[Intothevoid666]

@goaded depends exactly how we define a republic. Either way we will end up like the Roman’s did. Like the Greeks did. Democracy is unsustainable. Our country is in ruins. We are 30 trillion dollars in debt, We have illegals just pouring across our southern border, we are facing a national security crisis, corruption is at an all time high, the average person is so detached from reality it’s frightening, our marriage rate is plummeting, China and Russia do not respect us and are invading their neighbors with little consequence, North Korea won’t even talk to us right now, we have no relationship with Saudi Arabia anymore but Putin is why oil prices spiked yeah, our species could legit end in like 4 different ways, we have a mentally disabled man running our country but at least it’s not trump right, our economy is in ruins, shit is about to get fucking real like Europe in 1939 type of real and everyone’s head is so far up their own asses they can’t even see the light of day anymore. Unless u want our country and quite literally possibly the world to end u better get used to being told how politics is gonna be cuz u and 99.99% of people don’t have a fucking clue in all honesty. The world is a brutal vicious place political decisions must reflect this reality. This isn’t a kindergarten class this is a gladiator arena ok. This world sucks and people need a reality check on that real bad rn. U will live a life of severe economic desperation at best and at worst the world will not be here in your lifetime. So get it together and stfu about feminism and gender pronouns and abortion and AR-15s and think about what actually matters for 1 second. We have bigger fish to fry besides this shit liberals won’t stfu about. Yeah I think u know what’s going on in this world politically rn? I think not or else you’d be in crisis mode too. This isn’t sweet this is a bitter harsh reality and unless everyone wakes up we are doomed.

[goaded]

No it's not. Democracy needs laws and for the constitution to be flexible. Your country is not "in ruins", in fact it's doing reasonably well, apart from income inequality and a political party determined to destroy it.

[Intothevoid666]

@goaded 30 trillion dollars in debt is ok? Yeah get real. Economists say when debt is higher than total GDP you’re in trouble and we’ve been past that for awhile. We have government programs to dip into but this could get ugly fast. Russia has a constitution too. Global warming, risk of nuclear war, AI. I just listed a bunch of reasons we are not doing ok but again with being blind. U probably didn’t even read what I wrote. There’s no point in arguing with u but I’m telling u what’s gonna happen so u just wait and watch.

[goaded]

22 years ago, the debt was going down. Then Bush decided to stop that and give tax breaks to the wealthy. Then he started a war. Then he oversaw a recession. The correct approach to a recession is for the government to spend money, which he and Obama did. Then came Trump, who chose tax breaks (for the wealthy) over reducing the deficit.

It's telling that Democratic presidents had to pass "recovery" acts when they come to power. Why do you think that is?

upload.wikimedia.org/.../...ic_as_of_Sep._2020.png

[Intothevoid666]

@goaded bush had to invade Iraq so the petro dollar wouldn’t end which would have ended up costing us even more money in the long run. More capitalistic economic policies are objectively better for overall economic growth. Welfarism isn’t capitalistic. It sucks but that’s how it is.

[goaded]

He didn't, and it cost a million lives. That's something a fascist like would support. Whatever happened to free markets?

[Intothevoid666]

@goaded millions of lives of people who support the public execution of gays. It’s amazing to me how quick the left is to defend people in the Middle East when u should logically hate these people based on ur own values. They execute people for blasphemy, apostasy, sex outside of marriage, homosexuality the list goes on. And No one no where ever said an indefinitely free market is the best. Im for a free market if it’s good for our overall productivity I’m against it if it’s not.

[Intothevoid666]

@goaded also saddam Hussein was a brutal military dictator with a secret police who use torture and forced abductions as a regular method to control his population. Be threatened to go to war with Israel and Saudi Arabia, he actually did go to war with Iran and Kuwait. Let’s not act like he was a saint and his supporters weren’t saints either. This was one of the most immoral leaders in the world dude. So let’s keep this in perspective.

[goaded]

Well, now they'll never have a chance to see the error of their ways, because they're dead.

[goaded]

What is it with idiots like you who paint everything in black and white? Saying something like "it doesn't matter if we kill a million people because some of them had objectionable viewpoints." They might well think that that's an objectionable viewpoint and want to kill you for it.

[Intothevoid666]

@goaded don’t act like saddam wouldn’t invade us in a second if he could. I don’t hate these people but they don’t like us and we don’t like them and it’s been like that for hundreds if not thousands of years. If these people in Africa and the Middle East can overpower us we will be in deep shit. One day it WILL happen. We are a dying breed and they only get stronger each day. It’s not as simple as u think. It’s a national security issue and unless u want your children and possibly even yourself to be subject to financial and possibly even millitary exploitation by these people this is what needed to happen. And well they have seen the error of their ways now because homosexuality isn’t illegal there anymore. Also like u think people weren’t being tortured and slaughtered on the regular under saddam? Abu ghraib was already a functioning prison with mass torture under saddam. From an ethical standpoint I still think this was the right move tbh.

[goaded]

I'm not. Don't act like you care about human life. Or good government. You just want 'a boot stamping on a human face - for ever.'

[Intothevoid666]

@goaded oh come on now. That’s not fair. It’s not like I want these people in the Middle East to suffer but I’m not a huge fan of them tbh and when it comes to national and economic security they are our competitors and we have to act like it. Ur assumption is completely untrue and unfair. I get it tho politics is an emotional topic. I’ll have u know tho I was pretty far to the left for almost my whole life until pretty recently. I hates bush and the Iraq war but I think that was cynical of me. I still don’t know whether the Iraq war was the right move that’s a very hard question to answer but I def lean towards it was and I don’t this idea that bush is some evil super villain is fair at all.

[goaded]

He wasn't that super.

The solution to uninformed people voting is to inform them. The trouble at the moment is that there are multiple media outlets actively misinforming their viewers. Do you think Fox News will be showing the Jan 6th hearings live, or will they cherry pick right-wingers screaming that they're the victims?

[Guy13]

You people are foolish. Just recently the Democratic Party is trying to eliminate the electoral college AND mandate show up and vote.-This is DEMOCRACY…majority rule. There is a reason that the Communists of Lenin era called themselves “Democratic Socialists”.-This is code for Communist JUST LIKE “our Democracy”. Majority numbers rule plus no self-defense (guns) =Bloc Movements only and Violators of Policy ELECTRICALLY and ELECTRONICALLY SHUT DOWN… From money, power, information…into Global Governance

[Intothevoid666]

@goaded so u propose that we don’t have freedoms of the press then? Like what they have in Russia

[Intothevoid666]

Russia today is not Russia under Lenin or Stalin not even close. And Russia under Stalin was absolutely 100% not majority rule it was a millitary dictatorship where people had almost no say in politics. It’s not coincidence that the Republican Party today is more closely allied with Russia than the democrats

[Intothevoid666]

The democrats wanted mail in ballots and the republicans didn’t im pretty sure. And I don't know why u have to yell lol. We’re just having a discussion here

[Intothevoid666]

republicans-oversight.house.gov/.../ Yep I was right

[goaded]

So, Republicans in congress post Fox News misinformation, and that makes it true?

"In an op-ed published by Fox News..."

Not even news, just an opinion piece.

Democrats wanted to use mail-in ballots so that people would not come into contact with each other during a pandemic (killing Americans). Trump wanted his people to vote in person so that he could declare victory before the mail-in ballots were counted (killing Americans).

[goaded]

"so u propose that we don’t have freedoms of the press then? Like what they have in Russia"

No, just quicker, effective remedies against lies. It doesn't matter if Dominion win their lawsuit in 2025, if Trump can pardon them because he's president because of their lies.

"It’s not coincidence that the Republican Party today is more closely allied with Russia than the democrats "
No, they both want to be able to shit on minorities.

[Intothevoid666]

@goaded ehhhh read what the other guy typed before I posted the source. I’ve seen stuff about Jan 6th on Fox News before. And honestly Idc I hope there is a coup because we literally cannot keep going like this unless we all want to starve or possibly even all die. He probably won’t get in trouble for it anyways because of immunity. But let’s see. The Supreme Court is likely going to side with him. This convo is getting old and everyone is just getting salty for no reason. U can think whatever u want but I think it’s clear that simply informing people doesn’t do shit cuz u actually have to be like an expert in the topic to really know what ur talking just like literally every other topic in the world. The average person is too stupid and uneducated to have a real say in politics I don't know why that’s controversial because it’s kinda just common sense but whatever

[goaded]

"I hope there is a coup" I know. And that's a bad thing. That makes you a traitor to your country.

Is this the opinion where I predicted Fox "News" wouldn't show the Jan 6th hearings?

"Fox News will be the only major news network not to air the entire Jan. 6 Committee hearings live, and instead will provide its own coverage “as warranted” through the filter of its regular prime-time programs and hosts, the network said Monday.

TheWrap confirmed earlier Monday that the hearings will be carried live in full by ABC, NBC, and CBS. Cable networks CNN and MSNBC were also planning to air the hearings in their entirety.

Fox will be the outlier by keeping its top-rated primetime lineup intact, with hosts cutting away to the political theatrics as they see fit. That means when things are getting underway in Washington on Thursday at 8 p. m. ET, one of the investigating committee’s biggest critics will be just kicking off his intro: Tucker Carlson. "
www.thewrap.com/.../

[Intothevoid666]

Why does the average person think they know enough to have a say in politics? Who tf r u to speak on such an important intellectual matter? Serious question

[Intothevoid666]

@goaded it’s incredibly narcissistic to think u should have a say in politics. The average person is pretty dumb tbh. Has had no schooling about politics and is an emotional wreck when it comes to the topic where tf do we get this idea that the average person should have a say here.

[goaded]

We get to democracy from having experienced centuries of kings and "might makes right". It's bollocks, and how can it be "narcissistic" to say EVERYONE should have a say in how they're governed?

[Intothevoid666]

@goaded does everyone have a say over what nasa does or only those who are smart and educated on the topic? I’m not advocating for autocracy. How do u possibly expect the average person to be able to make valid political decisions?

[goaded]

Yes, you are advocating for autocracy.

"Average" people vote for someone to represent them. It's best if those people didn't lie about what they'd do for the people they represent. Failing that, it would be good if media outlets pointed out when politicians had lied. Republicans, on the whole, want to do away with the social safety net, such as it is in the US. The voters aren't informed of that, at least not by media they trust, which has been telling them for decades not to trust the honest outlets.

[Intothevoid666]

@goaded Russia isn’t an autocracy. Putin does not have absolute power over Russia and to even suggest that is pretty ridiculous. If he does not keep his party happy he will be out in a heartbeat the party likes him that’s why he stays in power. The voters are not just uninformed they are uneducated on the topic and they are just not particularly bright and they are overly emotional about the topic the fact politicians have to continually lie just to do what they think makes sense should tell u something. Ur giving waaaay too much credit to the average person. Putin won’t be in power too much longer most likely anyways. Times r changing in Russia and he’s old af. A true autocracy is pretty rare maybe North Korea but like to even try to compare Russia to North Korea is absolutely insane. The American left is incredibly detached from what Russia is today and thinks of Soviet Russia under Stalin as how it is now when that’s so far from the truth it’s insane

[Intothevoid666]

@goaded our founding fathers didn’t even like democracy and now we have all these random immigrants coming from 2nd and 3rd world countries will little education and they have as much say as the wealthiest most educated natural born citizens in America? What is that?

[goaded]

Something tells me Putin (or possibly Stalin) is your Founding Father, but regardless...

Putin has the power (and the inclination) to order pretty much anybody who opposes him killed, which makes being in an opposition party extremely dangerous.

"the party likes him". Funny how that's in the singular, don't you think?

[Intothevoid666]

@goaded the cia in America doesn’t have the power to have pretty much anyone killed American leaders can’t do that too? There are people in America who can get basically anyone killed without consequence too so i don’t know if I see ur point and u didn’t answer my question

[goaded]

Niet, or at least they don't do it in a way that says "I did this". Polonium is not something people make in their kitchens.

[Intothevoid666]

@goaded so why do we expect the average person to be educated or intelligent enough to understand politics?

[goaded]

We don't, we expect them to understand their needs and vote accordingly.

[Intothevoid666]

@goaded what they think they need and what they actually need are two different things tho

[goaded]

Not really. Most people just want a chance at a decent living.

[Intothevoid666]

@goaded yes really. How can u possibly say otherwise? If people understand politics they know what they need if they don’t understand politics they don’t know what they need. It’s as straightforward as it gets tbh. U can’t possibly say otherwise this is A+B=C type logic that u can’t really refute.

[goaded]

You can repeat your rubbish as often as you like, it's clearly just an excuse so that the "right" people (people like you, natch) can choose who runs the country, and what the people need above all is for that not to happen.

[Avicenna]

Ther "experts" when it comes to anything related to politics are just playing politics and doing what they're told to do, which is mostly gaslighting us. That isn't democracy, which requires a free press and above all freedom of speech so that public policy can be debated and governmental abuses can be exposed. A dictatorship like Russia only results in elites getting what they want and a whole lot of human rights abuses.

[Intothevoid666]

We have too much freedom of the press tho? And sure actual free speech would help but most conservatives are too scared to even say their opinions anyways because of the social repercussions. I don’t think it’s fair to say Russia is a dictatorship. By global standards russia is only slightly authoritarian. Much of the world is far more authoritarian than russia. Democracy will always favor liberalism because liberalism appeals to emotions. Democracy will always cause uneducated people to have the most say and they will generally go for what makes them feel best in the absence of true information.

[Johnnyroyyall]

We don't live in a democracy we live in a constitutional republic..
That is a fact
If we lived in a democracy a true democracy New York and California would elect everything and make all decisions.. that is why our forefathers were wise and created the electoral college system.. so that the big cities win rule and the rural areas would have a say in matters

[Intothevoid666]

Democrats say we live in a democracy. Republicans say we live in a republic the truth is somewhere in between

[Johnnyroyyall]

Oh it's exactly what I said it was we are a constitutional republic

[Johnnyroyyall]

You're assuming and taking the word Republic and tagging it with Republicans.. obviously you never paid attention in high school in history American history geez Google's a thing man

[Waldoe]

yeah... I wouldn't let you vote... your obviously an Idiot... oh, who gets to decide? White men? women? democrats? republicans? Everyone that is Not a criminal and that is over 18, can Vote... Dreamers and Doom-Sayers can Vote, we all get to have a say, it reduces the chance of the 45% declaring WAR on the 55%

[Intothevoid666]

The ruling party gets to vote

[Intothevoid666]

Most people have no clue wtf they are talking about to such a degree then having equal say as me is scary

[Intothevoid666]

America is in such a state of unbelievable disrepair and people don’t even realize it. Our society is going to collapse if we keep giving everyone a say. Whether u agree with what I say or not It’s that or societal collapse just watch how exactly what I say happens

[Waldoe]

People have been crying "the sky is falling, the sky is falling, the sky is falling," guess what? it never does. our Great Nation has the ability to "Self correct" and it has many times, through our History... slavery... GONE, civil war... Ended... too many to list...

[Intothevoid666]

Just cuz ur too dumb to realize the sky is falling doesn’t mean it’s not. U don’t even ask for why it’s falling u just assume it’s not. Lol but don’t take my word for it literally watch as trump and this “far right” take complete control of American politics in the years to come. It’s literally the only thing that will actually stop our society from collapsing.

[jshm2]

Was there a point to your little soliloquy?

Opinions are opinions, but gatekeepers like you get shot in the US, and jailed in Russia.

Maybe that's how we can fix democracy: burning gatekeepers like you at the stake, instead of witches.

[Intothevoid666]

Actually people who oppose democracy do very well in Russia lol.

[NamerOfStars]

"Democracy is the worst form of government, except for all the others that have been tried.

[Intothevoid666]

A republic is better

[Anonymous]

Is it? Russia is completely corrupt and weak. Look at its militaries performance in Ukraine

[Intothevoid666]

Russia is not nearly as poorly managed as the US not even close

[Opinion Owner]

Go there some time.

[Intothevoid666]

I’d bet like anything I know more about modern day Russia than you do. I actually would go there tbh. I wouldn’t even mind living there if it wasn’t for the cold.

[Intothevoid666]

The American left is like 40 years behind on foreign affairs it’s hilarious tbh. In the 60s none of u believed Russia was that bad but now that Russia is actually an extremely different place and isn’t actually that bad u all magically seem to think ur onto something cuz u don’t have a clue what Russia is like today. LOL

[Opinion Owner]

I've been there.

[Intothevoid666]

And what was so bad about it?

[Opinion Owner]

Good country if your wealthy

[Intothevoid666]

Kinda like America?

[Opinion Owner]

America isn't there yet. Put it this way you don't get obese in Russia

[Intothevoid666]

Well unless we have an economic miracle we will be there. Capitalism is more productive than less capitalism the American right wing is more capitalistic than the American left wing. We are 30 trillion dollars in debt and we need money asap. So u less we have an economic miracle to the run of like 50 trillion dollars we will be forced to become more capitalistic and have similar wealth inequality to Russia. If that’s seriously all u can say about what’s bad about Russia I’m not convinced in the slightest

[Opinion Owner]

Corruption is bad bit its that much worse in a poor country like Russia

[Intothevoid666]

I mean that’s fair but by global standards Russia isn’t really that bad of a place to live. Like the amount of freedom u have in Russia isn’t really that bad.

[fireforeffect]

Democracy is a left wing Idea and very bad. the Founding Fathers of the United States knew that every Democracy failed, which is why they gave us a Constitutional Republic.

[Intothevoid666]

Yep but we’ve slowly shifted more and more to a democracy as time has gone on

[fireforeffect]

We must stop the perversion!

[MountAverage]

So you want a authoritarian system, gotcha.

[Intothevoid666]

More authoritarian than what we have yes. Russia really isn’t that authoritarian tbh

[MountAverage]

Fuck off, fascist pig.