Have you heard about the Treaty of Tilsit in 1807, between France and Russia?

[Julie4]

[Bluemax]

Yes, at the conclusion of Napoleon's campaign in Prussia.

As I understand it, France and Russia stood poised on a potential new era. The Tsar expressed personal like, even admiration for Napoleon and vice versa. Russia didn't suffer from defeat the way Prussia did. The two countries adopted a live and let live posture.

If Napoleon wasn't so fixated on stickin' it to England with the Continental System, which ultimately failed and drove a lot of countries away, I often wonder if history would have gone *much* differently. Including no nightmare invasion of Russia. One wonders if France said to England, "We get it. You *do* rule the waves, but we kick butt on the continent. Let's see what we can do to stand down with each other," if France's destiny would be vastly different, with a victorious Napoleon.

The treaty of Tilsit could have ushered in more Franco-Russian cooperation that would probably make the two nations unstoppable.

[Julie4]

Interesting answer 🙂 but in reality the treaty of Tilsit will be only a humiliation for Russia, Russia will undergo one of its biggest defeat of its history in Friedland or Napoleon in one day will crush the Russian army, following that the Tsar will be obliged to negotiate, from where the treaty of Tilsit.

During this treaty, Napoleon will impose his conditions to Russia, notably abandonment all his ambitions in Europe and on the Black Sea and moreover accept the "refoundation" of a Polish state which did not say its name, with moreover the obligation to put in place the continental blockade. But the Russian economy was too dependent on England.

At the end of the Tilsit meeting, Tsar Alexander sent a letter to his sister, telling her that he was only thinking of revenge.

Napoleon by imposing a succession of humiliations to Russia, condemned himself all the potential of this alliance

[RyanEC]

No I was not aware.
I need to brush up on my history.

[Julie4]

No, your historical knowledge is very very good, I would like to know as much as you do 🙂

[RyanEC]

Oh you really think so, thanks.

[Julie4]

Of course I mean it 😊

[RyanEC]

I appreciate it.

[OddBeMe]

Damn, why can’t I go a day without hearing about this…

[Andres77]

I was unfamiliar with this.

[Cubus]

Of course I heard

[Julie4]

I am sure that this treaty was presented to you as a "sharing of the world" between France and Russia

[Cubus]

Not really. It was presented as creating of Warsaw Duchy

[Julie4]

I should have known this answer from a Polish guy lol.

[Cubus]

Don't remeber yet? :)

[Julie4]

Yes, I remembered that you were Polish lol.

But it is true that the creation of the Duchy of Warsaw is one of the most important acts of the Treaty of Tilsit

[Cubus]

Sadlu Napoleon thought that conquering Russia is actually possible

[Julie4]

I know that everyone thinks that Napoleon was crazy to have wanted to invade Russia, and in view of the result we can say that the Russian campaign was a disaster.

But Russia did not respect the commitments signed at Tilsit and Russia reconstituted a more and more powerful army with the intention to invade "Poland" and to threaten us directly

[Cubus]

That makes him sound even more crazy.

From a pragmatist view - fighting in Warsaw Duchy would be perfect for him. Much better than in Russia

[Julie4]

Not really, because if he had fought again outside Russia, nothing would have prevented Russia from doing it again and again, etc.

Napoleon wanted to finish with Russia once and for all.

[Cubus]

That is silly. You can't conquer Russia. Two biggest armies in the history tried without success

[Julie4]

Napoleon should have annexed the Russian territory or at least a part of it, after Friedland. Besides, Tsar Alexander was convinced during the Treaty of Tilsit that Napoleon would annex a part of his territory, but Napoleon will not do it, and the Tsar will be the first one surprised.