Fellow Americans: It’s YOUR job to design a nearly foolproof voting system. What does that look like? ?

[Stacey55666]

This question was inspired by a guy who questioned voting and all the corruption that goes with it.

This is my solution. All voting will be done on your smart device. You will have to register before you can vote. You will give your name, address, social security number, birthday, mother’s maiden name, city where you were born, your scanned fingerprint, and three secret questions/answers that only you would know the answers to. Your location of where you're voting from will be recorded.

I don’t believe that Biden won in 2020. People will say I have no proof of that. So I tell them to prove to me he won. They can’t. So let’s move past the ridiculous honor system and embrace technology. There has to be a better way. What’s your idea?

Updates

+1 y

Folks, I've come up with a plan...

I'm going to ask Elon to come up with a foolproof voting system that you can do from the comfort of your couch.

Why Elon?
1. Because I trust him more than I trust Google or Microsoft.
2. Because Joey the clown hates him and is suing him because Elon wants free speech.
3. Because Elon has more money than God.
4. But mostly because having a fair voting system would drive the libs crazy

[BoobMan]

I'd say go back to the previous system of in person on the day voting only except for active duty military personnel. Then I'd add that thing they do in some other countries where when you vote, they dip your finger in some blue ink so it's really clear if you try to do it again. And lastly, add the term "blockchain" to my voting system to give it the allure even MORE perfect security. Who could argue with that?

[Stacey55666]

Interesting ideas.

[BoobMan]

Thanks! What's your favorite solution so far?

[Stacey55666]

This is my solution. All voting will be done on your smart device. You will have to register before you can vote. You will give your name, address, social security number, birthday, mother’s maiden name, city where you were born, your scanned fingerprint, and three secret questions/answers that only you would know the answers to. Your location of where you're voting from will be recorded.

[BoobMan]

Cool.

[Stacey55666]

A girl on this site said that's how they do it in her country and it works well.

[BoobMan]

Interesting! What country is that?

[Stacey55666]

It was either Sweden or Switzerland. (I get them mixed up)

[BoobMan]

Both are countries which tend to work pretty well, so I guess either one could make sense.

[Stacey55666]

I just believe that we don't utilize technology as much as we should. Why not vote from your couch instead of taking off work and standing in line?

[monorprise]

@BoobMan A key qualify of an election system is transparency and simplify, meaning complicated security measures no matter how effective they are, are in fact a detractor.

This is simply because most of the population can't understand and verify their operations leaving their maintenance and modification subject to corruption of the few who do. Unfortunately one of the things that happened in many of our elections.

Keeping it decentralized is also a very important security tool, as it prevents any one set of leaders from making bad modifications which can then never be discovered or corrected.

So really we are stuck with something relativity straight forward of in person voting. This is easy to understand and verify for most people.

[BoobMan]

@monorprise Pretty sure what I proposed is pretty simple, so not sure what you're on about.

[monorprise]

@BoobMan
How many people understand what a "blockchain" is?

[Pohjolan]

Some other first world countries have totally reliable analog voting which can be hacked as much as a typewriter.

Also they get the results on the same day unlike the US digital system.

[Stacey55666]

Sounds like a good idea to me.

[Dargil]

*Voting on election day only except Military, overseas contractors and State Department Absentee.
*No voting machines permitted and any counting equipment cannot be connected to internet.
*Every voter must register to vote in person at the county or municipality board of elections no less than 45 days before every local and national election.
*Every voter must have a physical residential address assigned to his/her name by county property records. Properties are known to have occupancy limits and the number of voters assigned to that property can't be exceeded.
*Residences cannot be business addresses or residential complex clubhouses.
*Multiple residence owners must name their primary residence and vote only once.
*No voter can vote in multiple states. Said owners must include a SS# when they register and be cross checked against other states or municipalities.
*No mail in ballots or ballot harvesting
*No motor Voter.
Paper ballots only.
Every voter must have a government issued picture ID. Make them free to obtain.
All ballots counted and finalized by midnight on election day.

This won't catch all fraud but will help a lot.

[Stacey55666]

Great ideas. I would add to that that the vote counters should be surrounded by tons of cameras broadcasting live in real time. All citizens would be able to watch the vote counting.

[Dargil]

Perhaps even body cams and mics.

[Stacey55666]

Absolutely! Last time I heard that in some polling places, Republicans weren't allowed in the building.

[007kingifrit]

the current system is close it just needs a few tweaks

in order to vote EVERYONE must accomplish the following

• finish highschool
• pay a net positive amount in taxes
• be born in america to two citizen parents, you may gain citizenship from a personal hand written letter form the president or congressman but this does not confer voting rights

to vote you must NOT have any of the following

• can't be a federal employee
• can't live in a capital city
• can't have a felon history
• can't have had a divorce

to vote you must also have ONE of the following:

• return from a war
• 3 children born from the same partner
• pay a very high amount in taxes

rules for politicians:

• term limit of 2 terms for ANY office, 2 terms as mayor means you can't run for president
• you are restricted from leaving the capital during your term, your personal space is limited to 1 bankbed and footlocker in the capital barracks
• you may not return to the capital city for any reason once your terms are up

[Stacey55666]

Those are all great ideas, but listen to Stalin:



Your ideas were very well thought out, and I agree with them. But we need to find a way to limit the corrupt factor.

[Dargil]

Perhaps one more thing. Every voter must own real property.

[KrakenAttackin]

You beat me to it.

[Stacey55666]

@Dargil

That concept is way outdated. If people lived in tents in the woods, I can see it.
But I live in an apartment, and that means I pay property taxes. I would love to be exempt from paying taxes, and if that happened, I'd forgo my right to vote.

[007kingifrit]

yea i don't really need to own property to have a complete life

[Dargil]

The idea is "having a "dog in the fight". Otherwise, the EPA can designate that puddle in your yard a wetland and regulate you to death.

[007kingifrit]

@Dargil i don't think owning land is the only way to have a dog in the fight, having kids also works, or having been to war

[Anonymous]

You do know everything that is on and transmitted electronically can be copied and hijacked with relativist ease.

even modern encryption tecnoligy is breakable both directly and via exploiting other weaknesses in software or hardware.

Internet (including phone) based voting is a terrible idea, it makes voter fraud easy.

The strongest element of your security is the user password and secrete which is effectively just 2nd easier to guess and thus weaker password.

A: Easiest way to hijack such a system is simply to go after the goverment computers, via an exploit either inadvertent or deliberate (remember goverment politicians running in theses same elections control the systems).

B: Beyond that ISP's generally can play man in the middle to compromise everyone's vote.(they only need a large share of the population)

C: Your registration system can also be hacked via countless fraudulent accounts. NO social Securty isn't a good system given there are only 999,999,999 possible numbers and most of them are per-allocated via region of birth, so your really looking at far less.
This to account for 330 million living Americans and everyone who has died since the 1930's.
Also remember this system like the computers are in control of politicians running in theses same elections. Even if mere lack of qualifications to get the job didn't guarantee incompetents, motivation to keep it and control other elections would.

Technically speaking the only way to secure an election is in person voting with verification of residency (registration) and identity by both factions.

[llorando]

No more electronic voting machines, all votes cast on ballots with carbon copy feature that are hand counted out in the open public for everyone to witnessed. 2016 primary made me despise electronic voting machines when Chicago board of elections officials were caught red handed during audits of voting machines, erasing Sander votes and adding Hillary votes so the hand counted audit would match the results of the voting machines. Don't need to be a genius to understand that's not how audits work.

[Stacey55666]

Great ideas.

What I like the best, is not hiding while counting ballots, but letting the whole world watch. I bet if you proposed your idea, the left would hate it. They would probably call you a racist or something.

[llorando]

Not everyone on the left, just Blue-MAGA's, I mean establishment Dem's. Us progressives know how electronic voting machines are used to rig primaries and don't like them. This idea isn't knew.
4 Simple Steps to Help Prevent Election Fraud ↗

[Stacey55666]

Why would a Blue MAGA not want to stop a corrupt system that elected Biden? I don't understand you.
And what is your definition of a progressive?

[llorando]

Because they support Biden and the only way he can win a primary is through a rigged primary, same as Killary Clinton. Can't speak for all progressives as it has different meaning to different people, but for me it's about progressive views on on things such as being anti-ware and pro-free speech, and other things such as Medicare 4 All and legalizing drugs. People who claim to be progressive while opposing speech/differing ideas are not true progressives. Some of theses so called "progressives", have gone to the extremes to dictate who can and can be labeled a progressive like they own the label progressive. This is nothing new and happens on all over on the political spectrum, one opposing view and your labeled as something else when your not.

[Stacey55666]

Sorry, I confused "Blue Maga" with a Blue Dog Dem that supports Trump. lol

[llorando]

That's OK, we all get confused.

[Stacey55666]

There is one Blue Dog left on the planet, and that's Joe Manchin. He gets death threats from the kind and liberal party.

[Subglacial]

If we want to elect somebody who represents the largest number of people, it stands to reason that they should be the largest person. We should elect a president based on their weight.

"But what if those in power divert food away from the general public and into the inner circle, fattening themselves while starving any competition?"

I say: anyone who can't pull themselves up by their bootstraps and bulk themselves up by their own belly doesn't have what it takes to succeed in this fatocracy and doesn't deserve that power. It's like "might makes right", except it's "weight makes great".

(I mean pull themselves up figuratively, by the way. I would not expect a half-ton person to be able to lift their own bodyweight.)

[A_Bell]

Only fools vote at this point. Neither party deserves support. As much as I dislike Trump, the Democrats actually scare me about our freedoms.

There is no worthwhile choice and your measly vote isn't going to turn the election. If it was that close, lawyers and judges would decide it long before 1,000 votes would.

Every system has giant flaws. The only way it is fixed is by demanding better. But frankly, voters are dumb. Half the voters are below average intelligence and the average person can barely pay their own bills. You can't fix that.

Even intelligent voters are a problem. Half of them are on the lower half of personality disorders and other social issues. Who wants narcissists deciding what's best?

The only answer is shrinking government and getting it out of our lives before we become the CCP.

[FunkyMonkee]

A piece of paper and a pen. At the end of the night, get 2 or 3 people to count ALL of the votes! Person one counts and comes up with a total. Person two counts them again and, if there's a discrepancy, they compare how they each got those tallies and re-count. You SHOULDN'T need a third counter.
25 years ago, I was working for a bank and, one of the jobs I had to do was tally bundles of checks. One group of people did one tally and then wrapped up the checks with the tally sheet that they made for them. Later, another group of people tallied them again with a new tally sheet THEY made for them. If the two totals for that one bundle didn't match up, the person doing the second tally had to compare both sheets to see where the screw up was.
Count the votes the same way and you SHOULDN'T have a problem!

[exitseven]

In person voting with paper ballots Voting only happens on election day. Don't bother to show up if you don't have an ID. Absentee ballots are for military and the elderly.

[Stacey55666]

And no ballot harvesting!

It's funny that liberals pretend they don't understand the difference between an absentee ballot, and a mail-in ballot.

Last voting season, my sister-in-law got about 5 ballots in her mailbox. I live in an apartment, so I got about 8. Mail-in ballots are just sent out. Absentee ballots are requested. Trump hated the bullshit mail-in ballots, because if I wanted to, I could have voted 8 times. Trump was totally find with absentee ballots, because they're a completely different animal.

Oh, and if you really want to score some ballots, just go through the dumpsters at apartment complexes.

Another thing that was pointed out was that voting shouldn't be done on a Tuesday. A large percentage of people get weekends off, so that would make more sense.

And the smartphone idea was not mine. I got it from a girl on this site that told me that that's how they vote in her country.

I do have to say something good about mail-in voting, it's really nice to be able to vote from your couch, rather than stand in line.

So I think voting should become easier, and without as much fraud as we have now. I don't trust the people who count the votes.


I think technology is the answer.

[exitseven]

I work in IT and I know that none of these systems are secure.

[Stacey55666]

And going to ballot drop boxes and filling up your trunk with them, is ripe for scandal, and it's happening every time. I know there's no perfect answer, but we both know that Biden wasn't elected, he was installed.

[exitseven]

In states that require voter ID and in person paper ballots on only one day there is hardly any cheating. It is when there is early voting and then late voting and they democrats keep counting and counting until they get the result they want.

[exitseven]

In the town I live in there was a group of parents that wanted to build a new high school. This thing got on the ballot every year and every year it would be voted down. Then somebody got the idea to have the election on a Saturday in the summer. People who usually voted were either out of town or just too busy to vote. The parents who were pushing this made sure they got their families and friends to vote and the damn thing narrowly passed. Everybody's taxes went up that year but you have to give them credit. They did not give up and they figured out a way to do it that was legal.

[Stacey55666]

I understand that, but in my state it's only mail-in ballots. But you are right, but your ideas would only work if the federal government was in charge of voting in federal elections. As it stands, I am clueless how there can be so many variations on voting at the state level. I still don't understand how a caucus works.

[Robbey]

A uniform national standard for all elections. And also multi-member constituencies for legislatures including Congress and the STV (Single Transferable Vote) for all elections.

[Stacey55666]

It would be nice if all the states could get on the same page when it comes to federal elections.

[Sparkie460]

If you put all that information on your phone and then the system gets hacked, now the hackers have everything they need to destroy your life and livelihood.

[Stacey55666]

1. It would be stored on the federal government cloud, and not your phone.
2. I didn't ask for criticism of my idea, I asked for your idea.
3. I'm waiting to hear your idea.

[Sparkie460]

The federal government has also been hacked several times.

When you go to vote you provide a pin number given to you by the government

[Stacey55666]

How will you be voting?

[Sparkie460]

By going to the polling place

[Stacey55666]

(I'm in no way questioning your idea, I'm just trying to bounce ideas off of each other)

The problem with having to go to voting places, is that the voting turnout is dismal at best. I can't remember the state, but they outlawed people giving food and water to the people standing in the long lines to vote. The reason they outlawed it, was because the people dishing out the water and food, were trying to get you to vote for their candidate.

[Sparkie460]

They can try to get you to vote for their candidates but in the end, it's your choice. I get people coming to my house pushing their candidates. I just tell them that I'll vote for who I want, they are wasting their time

[Stacey55666]

Don't you feel like the way we vote is very archaic? I was watching congress voting on something on C-Span. It was painful to watch. It could have been done in 30 seconds, versus an hour.

[exitseven]

@stacey55666. Yes, and the government always has the most secure network

[Sparkie460]

@exitseven I have to disagree with you there. The internal revenue service has had their system hacked and so has our county government offices.
It took 3 days to get the IRS systems fixed. It took a week to get the county system back up.
This was in the last 2 years

[exitseven]

Sarcasm. my boy, sarcasm.

[Stacey55666]

@exitseven

It's probably more secure than having ballots in the back of a Buick. Or in Joey's case, in the garage next to his corvette.

[Stacey55666]

@sparkie460,

Nothing is perfect, and that's why I assembled you guys to help me come up with a better system than the fraudulent system we have now.

I have a question I want to ask, but this goofy site has capped me off for the day. (similarworlds lets you ask 1,000 questions per day. lol)

How are you set for un-asked questions?

[Sparkie460]

@exitseven I thought that is what you were doing but I wasn't sure

[Sparkie460]

@stacey55666 I asked 1 question today, why

[Stacey55666]

@sparkie460

I was thinking you could ask one on my list, but I don't want to corrupt you.

[Sparkie460]

Message me the question you want to ask. I'll take a look at it

[Stacey55666]

I think I'll wait and just ask it in the morning.

[Stacey55666]

Alright, Sparkie, (If you don't want to ask it, I'll ask it in the morning)

Question:

"Why are Republicans so cynical about Kamala being the new Artificial Intelligence czar? Did she not kick ass as the border czar?"

(no description needed)





https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WN5w9IHOsTc

[gorydetails]

Paper ballots, in-person voting on day of only, ID required to vote.

[Stacey55666]

The smartphone idea was not mine. A lady on here told me her country had been doing that for a long time, and it was working out pretty good.

I like your idea, because it's way better than the current system where it somehow takes months to count the votes.
But paper ballots remind me of the pony express. It was the best in it's time, but we shouldn't still be doing it.

FYI My next question is... if we can all vote on the same day for the president, then why in the fuck do the primary votes start in the East and move West? The people on the Right coast get 20+ candidates to choose from. By the time the primary voting gets to the Left coast, we get dumb and dumber. There's no way that Joey could have won the primary if the whole country could have a vote on the same day.

[genericname85]

it's impossible to make anything foolproof. cause the world will always bring forth a better fool, no matter how fool proof you make things.

[Stacey55666]

And your idea is?

[genericname85]

make political exams mandatory, to make sure people are educated enough to even vote.

[Stacey55666]

How will that stop the cheating and corruption?

[genericname85]

it doesn't but at least it keeps morons from voting for moronic candidates.

[Stacey55666]

Maybe, but I think that most voters are just brainwashed to vote for a certain candidate. And the media plays a huge role in the brainwashing process.

[genericname85]

of course. cause the media just shows us what the most paying source wants them to show us. just like politicians vote for policies that the most paying lobby wants them to vote for. to think we live in a "democracy" is delusional. we live in an indirect plutocratic oligarchy that happens to have representants that are voted with a democratic method. but that changes nothing about politics but the faces we see on the news.

[genericname85]

so even if we had the perfect method of not having any voter fraud. that would still change nothing about the actual policies.

[Stacey55666]

A fool proof method to not have voter fraud would just be my phase ONE.

Phase TWO, would be referendum votes! I love that idea!

Raise your hand if you want 400 million of our Covid relief money to go to Pakistan for gender studies? What? No one? Not even one?
Fuck the politicians. I get that we're a representative republic, but that needs to get scaled back.

I talked to a lady on here and she said that in her country they get to vote on a lot more things than us Americans get to vote on.

Think about it this way, 85, Biden's approval rate is shit, but he still gets to be the president. If his approval rate is shit, then who is he representing?

[genericname85]

voter turnout is usually slightly above 50%. which means that slightly below 50% of the population is even without any changes to the political system not represented at all. which makes me wonder, why this system is even still alive. cause it barely has legitimation. who cares for approval rates. approval comes from a lack of choices not from agreement with the policies presented by the candidate.

"the people" are not represented. so it doesn't matter whether you vote or not.

as my politics professor used to say: the ammount of work the average person would have to do to even find out what their optimal political voting choice would be, far outweighs the maximum possible benefit they could ever get from voting.

and as my psychology professor said: the main sociopsychologic effect votes have is to generate compliancy by suggesting the feeling of being part of a "fair system that you were allowed to have a say in", which factually is not the case in indirect representation based democracy.

[genericname85]

because you're voting on representing candidates. not on policies. the candidates are by no mechanism obliged to comply with voter interest.

[genericname85]

i personally never vote, cause that's the only way to "decide" against the indirect (representative) democracy bullshit.

[genericname85]

The model you presented is a model I would agree with more. Cause you're voting for policies directly instead of hoping a candidate to act in your interest, which they never do. But the system you suggested is very far of what is currently possible in the system we have.

[Stacey55666]

I told another guy on here that I want more referendum votes. I don't trust representatives to represent us.

For instance:

Who thinks congress deserves a raise? No one? OK, no raise.
Who believes in term limits? Everyone? OK, term limits.
Who thinks we should have an open Southern border? No one? OK, the border will be closed.

I talked to a lady on this site that said in her country they get to vote and a lot more than just electing representatives. I like that idea. Biden would be fucked under that system.

[genericname85]

Well that's not possible in indirect representative democracy. It's not a question of voter fraud protection. But even in the system you suggested, people are still too deluded to even know what's best for them.

[Stacey55666]

I'm out of questions for the day, but I keep a list of future questions, and this will be on the list.

In my state the liquor was controlled by the state. People had to travel to one of the few liquor stores.
It was put to a referendum vote, and the state got their asses kicked. 80% of the voters wanted government out of the booze market. So with those numbers, it was both sides of the isle that was agreeing.
So if only 20% wanted booze controlled by the state... were the citizens really being represented?

[genericname85]

what's the percentage of the population who took part in the referendum vote you were speaking of? because wether you wre represented or not is not determined by whether you got your will granted or not but whether your will was even taken into account during the decision.

[DollAlone]

Like highschool voting for prom queen and king. Majority rules

[Kelly6]

First thing= USA does not have democracy !!!

When you get democracy, then your voting system will fix itself

[Stacey55666]

I have no idea what you're talking about.

[Kelly6]

it means
USA does not have democracy

[Stacey55666]

Just say what you're talking about and tell us why you have democracy in your country. And please tell us how no one cheats in your country.

[Kelly6]

i mean you don't pick your leader by vote of public

[Stacey55666]

Since you don't want to spell it out, I can only assume you're talking about cheating and or corruption.

And that's why I asked people to help me come up with a foolproof system to prevent this.

But if I'm understanding you correctly, you're saying that if we didn't have cheating, then we wouldn't have cheating. I'm sure there's no cheating in your country.

[Kelly6]

there is cheating in every country,

[Kelly6]

that cheating system is unstoppable.
you can try if you want to.
but that cheating engine is what drive the country.

[Kelly6]

cheating system drives the country,,,, i mean that same cheating is done in our economy system and more.
if you came in truth then economy will crash.

[Kelly6]

you might understand after 10 more years.
i tried and hoped we could fix this system, but its useless

[Stacey55666]

That's why I asked for advice to come up with a fool proof system. Maybe there would still be cheating, but it would be so blatantly obvious, that even the news would be ashamed to try and convince us that it wasn't happening.
What we're doing now isn't working.

[Kelly6]

okay

[andreasderjuengere]

How can a voting system be foolproof, when fools are allowed to vote?
Democracy is an illusion.

[007kingifrit]

see my post for a more limited form of democracy which is against universal suffrage

[KrakenAttackin]

Your ass shows up, in person, with ID, and casts a ballot. Let's start with that.

[Stacey55666]

Who counts the ballots?

[KrakenAttackin]

@stacey55666. An excellent point. As Stalin said "it's not who casts the ballots that matters, it's who counts them".

I don't know how we handle that except to have dual counts with representative from both sides.

[Stacey55666]

Counting the ballots is by far the most important part of this.

[KrakenAttackin]

Agreed.

[Stacey55666]

Years ago I visited a bread factory. I realized that us humans are in dreamland if we think we can compete with automation and AI.
Tomorrow I'm going to post a question that will piss many off, but the top minds agree with it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zdbUXThQCLA

[whirled_up_girl]

@KrakenAttackin @Stacey55666 Sometimes I wish everyone had to work as a poll worker during elections or at least had the possibility of being selected.. Similar to jury duty, that way there would be people across the political spectrum counting votes.

[femalepretzelmaker]

The voting system is rigged and no replacement will change that