Why can't a U. S. citizen, who was originally a foreigner, run for president of the United States, even if he or she has obtained U. S. citizenship?

[Julie4]

[RavVid]

I guess a President or a PM who was born elsewhere is always going to have the doubt of other allegiances. I suppose that is why that US constitutional requirement was put in.

But what if a US Presidential candidate held citizenship in another country despite being born in the U S of A and what if he couldn't revoke that foreign citizenship? Is he/she still eligible by birth right is what I'd like to add to the question.

This is a relatively fresh constitutional question in my country (Australia). It saw the Deputy Prime Minister disqualified from parliament. Plus a number of others chucked out of parliament.

The deputy PM was born in Australia to a naturalized New Zealand father. NZ automatically gives citizenship to children of Kiwis no matter if they were born elsewhere. A lot of countries do this. If a grand parent was foreign born they still get citizenship in the old country in many cases.

Some of the parliamentarians caught up in this dual citizenship furor had in fact tried to revoke the foreign citizenship but found the other country didn't have a mechanism for this. The court sort gave them a free pass more or less for making the attempt.

In the case of the deputy PM, after being chucked out, he revoked his NZ citizenship and then stood for election in the by election of his former seat. He was out of parliament for about 6 weeks.

I am very curious how a similar circumstance would play out for the US presidency. I am aware of doubts expressed on Obama's birthplace and citizenship. But if a candidate had been born in the US, his father was born in the US but his grandfather was born overseas and become a naturalized US citizen. Then that foreign power decides that he is a citizen within his life time without reference to him. Which is what New Zealand did to Barnaby Joyce deputy PM.

[bolverk]

The Qualifications Clause set forth in Article II, Section 1, Clause 5 requires the President to be a natural-born citizen, at least thirty-five years of age, and a resident of the United States for at least fourteen years.

Like the age requirements for membership in the House of Representatives and the Senate, the age requirement for the presidency set forth at Article II, Section 1, Clause 5 ensures that persons holding the office of President will have the necessary maturity for the position as well as sufficient time in a public role for the electorate to be able to assess the merits of a presidential candidate. In his Commentaries on the Constitution of the United States, Justice Joseph Story stated: Considering the nature of the duties, the extent of the information, and the solid wisdom and experience required in the executive department, no one can reasonably doubt the propriety of some qualification of age.

The Framers appear to have adopted the requirement that citizens be natural born citizens to ensure that the President’s loyalties would lie strictly with the United States. By barring naturalized citizens from the presidency, the requirement of being a natural born citizen, as Justice Story explained, protects the United States from ambitious foreigners, who might otherwise be intriguing for the office; and interposes a barrier against those corrupt interferences of foreign governments in executive elections, which have inflicted the most serious evils upon the elected monarchies of Europe. Article II, however, provided an exception for foreign-born persons who had immigrated to the colonies prior to the adoption of the Constitution. Justice Story explained that this was done out of respect to those distinguished revolutionary patriots, who were born in a foreign land, and yet had entitled themselves to high honors in their adopted country.

[Anonymous]

Status as a natural-born citizen of the United States is one of the eligibility requirements established in the United States Constitution for holding the office of president or vice president. This requirement was intended to protect the nation from foreign influence.

[Julie4]

Under these conditions, what's the point of granting American citizenship to a foreigner who will always be suspected of being a traitor, ready to defend the interests of his country of origin?

[KostasKouvalis]

Yes, I agree with Julie.
I was born here, but my parents are immigrants and I'm still considered "that foreign kid". Maybe MY kids if they're born here and I have an American wife will finally be considered Americans.
Julie is right. No matter how long you've been a citizen, Americans will still treat you as a foreigner. It's so stupid because they literally make you swear off your citizenship.
At the same time though, I won't hide the fact that many Americans even ones who were born here do still have loyalties to their parents' country. There are people who were born here but root against the US when they're playing their parents' country.
So I kind of see BOTH sides of the argument. But I still think it's a risk they should be willing to take, especially considering most of our presidents are more loyal to other countries anyways. Just look at Biden. He cares more about Ukraine, then he cares about America. At the same time, someone who fled from a shitty country that they hate might be more loyal to America. Elon Musk is certainly more loyal towards America than Biden is. So I agree, it's kind of stupid.

[KostasKouvalis]

Why grant someone citizenship if you have doubts about them? Having citizenship should certainly a lot you the privilege of running the country.

[Julie4]

@KostasKouvalis

Yeah , c'est monn point , je ne comprends pas l'intérêt d'accorder la citoyenneté a un étranger si au fond vous pensez que cette personne sera toujours un étranger

[Julie4]

@KostasKouvalis

Yes it's monn point, I don't understand the point of granting citizenship to a foreigner if deep down you think that person will always be a foreigner

[KostasKouvalis]

So I'm guessing in France, "immigrants" can run

[Opinion Owner]

@KostasKouvalis You may become a citizen by immigrating to the United States, but you should not be allowed to run for president since, despite your citizenship, you are not an American. The only candidates for president should be natural-born citizens. Although it may not be fair to you, you must follow the rules. America did not ask you to immigrate; you wanted to immigrate, so respect the constitution. MAGA!

[Julie4]

@KostasKouvalis

Yes absolutely, a person who was a foreigner but who has obtained French citizenship can become president.

[Opinion Owner]

@julie4 Maybe in France they don't always view immigrants as foreigners “doubtful,” because I've heard that native white French people don't view North Africans or Africans as real French, and that includes the ones born in France, but France and the USA are not the same. If you come to America, respect the constitution or don't come.

[Julie4]

In France, if we grant citizenship to someone, it is because we consider that he is like us, and that consequently there is no logical reason to refuse him the right to stand for French election.

Of course, the problem today is that France has abandoned its system of assimilation, and that's causing problems.

But the important point here is not France.

My point is, what's the value of granting citizenship to a foreigner, if you think deep down he'll always be a foreigner? Take this logic to its logical conclusion and simply prohibit a foreigner from becoming an American.

[Opinion Owner]

@julie4 The logic is that one is a choice and the other isn't; America didn't ask the individual to immigrate, and they didn't force you to apply for citizenship; it was a choice made by the individual.

[Julie4]

Yes, and what's the point of granting him citizenship, if in the end this person will always be a foreigner? Simply prohibit a foreigner from acquiring American citizenship.

[Opinion Owner]

@julie4 The point is once you become a United States citizen, you can vote in local, state, and federal elections. Voting and the right to vote are the foundations of our democracy. You can elect the leaders you believe will best represent you and vote on issues that matter to you, your family, and your community.

[Julie4]

But there's an obvious contradiction here: an American citizen, not born an American, is denied the chance to become president for fear that this person is a traitor, that he's defending the interests of his country of origin. Deep down, you suspect that this person isn't really American.

But you're ready to give this person citizenship, it seems really strange, why on earth would you grant citizenship to a person whom you consider will never really be American anyway and may be a traitor, very strange.

[KostasKouvalis]

So you admit that you don't consider immigrants as "Americans"

French people don't see race. It you're quite French citizen you're FRENCH. French isn't just an ethnicity, it's a way of life.
They don't even ask for race or religion on their census.

[KostasKouvalis]

As a child of immigrant parents, Julie is right.

[Opinion Owner]

@KostasKouvalis No, it's your opinion, and guess what? I have my own opinion. I understand that your parents are immigrants; nevertheless, presuming you are not an immigrant, what is the problem?

[Opinion Owner]

@KostasKouvalis @julie4 Actually, neither of you are American, and I'm not going to engage any longer. Have a fabulous day/night.

[KostasKouvalis]

I just remembered that children of immigrants aren't allowed in the CIA for the same reason.

[KostasKouvalis]

The problem is that my parents have lived in the US for over 30 years and are still considered "immigrants".

[KostasKouvalis]

See, you did it again. You don't consider me an American, even though I was born here

[Jennz6]

@julie4 really please Julie

[DrPepper12]

But any office other than POTUS is chill? Even military positions? It's inconsistent at best

[Amy10223]

Because they are not born in the US. Thanks goodness for that requirement. Otherwise Musk would buy the presidency by now.

[abc3643]

The United States Constitution says so. In Article 2 of The Constitution the description of the office of the President is given.

Article 2 Section 1 Clause 5 gives the qualifications for being President. This is that clause:

=====

No person except a natural born citizen, or a citizen of the United States, at the time of the adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the office of President; neither shall any person be eligible to that office who shall not have attained to the age of thirty five years, and been fourteen Years a resident within the United States.

=====

So, only a natural born citizen can be President. That is a person who was a citizen of the United States at the time of their birth.

[DrPepper12]

Yes but op asked WHY

[abc3643]

@DrPepper12 The answer is the Constitution.

You are thinking what @Julie4, a French woman, is really asking "Why does the US Constitution only permit natural born Americans as President?" But, that's not what she asked because the end clause indicates unawareness of the Constitutional requirement.

HOWEVER, I will answer that second question anyway:
To avoid conflicts of interest in the President when it comes to foreign relations with the US and the (immigrant) President's native country.

[Zack-Bann]

I find it kinda ironic that so many answered saying “it’s in the constitution” instead of thinking of a legitimate reason why


And then a few said it’s because if you’re not born on US soil (even if you moved there before your first birthday) you can’t understand “freedom”


It would seem freedom is just being able to quote a book that tells you what to do without ever stopping to question any of it.
Got it.

[Julie4]

What I don't understand is that you can't tell me that a foreigner who has obtained American nationality will never really be American, but still grant him citizenship, what's the logic in that?

Why grant citizenship to people who you think will never be Americans anyway and who are potentially traitors?

[QuietRunner]

It is only one office in the entire government of the United States 🇺🇸. If a foreign born naturalized citizen really wants to help out then That person will.
The President is more likely to be loyal and care about the United States if the person is native born.
I’ve heard a few Dreamers who have lived their entire lives in the United States talk of back home, as in another country. That is one reason why the President should be born and subject to the jurisdiction of the United States Constitution to be President.

[Zack-Bann]

To be fair the same is true in France and pretty much all over the world

[Julie4]

No. .

[Zack-Bann]

As a foreigner who recently started the French naturalization process I am pretty confident that I won’t be running for president in this lifetime 😇

[Julie4]

There's a difference between what you want to do and what you can do.

If you obtain French nationality, you can stand in the presidential elections. Afterwards, you can say that you won't be elected because of racism etc., but that's another subject, but as such, once you have French nationality, you can run.

I'll never run for president because I don't want to and I don't have the skills lol

[Zack-Bann]

No Im not talking about not winning the election.
I legally cannot run.
One of the requirements is being a third generation French citizen.
Meaning even my kids won’t be able to. Only my grandkids

Assuming i get the nationality
And have kids 😅

[Julie4]

I don't know where you read this information, but it's wrong.

[DrPepper12]

My observation EXACTLY!! Because it's written here is the WEAKEST reply ever or they just can't WAIT to defend the diety created suicide pact...

[TadCurious]

The Constitution of the United States requires that a person be at least 35 years old and be a natural born citizen of the United States. The Framers didn't want someone to serve as president who might have divided loyalties. Like so much else, they were wise in making this a qualification.

[KostasKouvalis]

"The Framers didn't want someone to serve as president who might have divided loyalties"

LOL. Like that law had any effect

[KostasKouvalis]

Elon Musk is more loyal to the US than Biden

[beefcakebradybatson]

@KostasKouvalis Elon Musk is loyal to further enriching Elon Musk !!!

[Red_Arrow]

@beefcakebradybatson This is the truth!

[beefcakebradybatson]

@Red_Arrow Why do you think Trump has him in his Cabal of Crooks?

[KostasKouvalis]

Aha! It wasn't the Framers. The Ammendment wasn't put into the Constitution until 1868.
The first US presidents HAD to be foreign born as the US was originally a British colony, and a baby couldn't be president.

[TadCurious]

I'm adding to my original opinion because some of you are ignorant of basic American history and civics.

The requirement that American presidents be natural born citizens is found in Article 2, Section 1, Clause 5 of the Constitution. It was not included in the 14th Amendment which didn't become part of the Constitution until the immediate period after the end of the Civil War.

The Framers of the Constitution were overwhelmingly native born citizens of the United States. The major exception was Alexander Hamilton who was born in an overseas British colony in the Caribbean.

The issue of divided loyalties was particularly salient in the period of the founding. Many people living in the colonies were British born and supported the Crown during the Revolution. The Framers of course were well aware of that and thus included the native born citizenship clause in Article 2. As I stated in my original opinion, the Framers were very wise to include this requirement, because British born Tory sentiment was widespread during the revolutionary period. Today the requirement still serves an important purpose.

[KostasKouvalis]

That's what I read. But in the end it doesn't matter if it was an amendment or a clause, what really matters is the YEAR it was implamented.

How were they native born though if the "United States" was a British colony?

Okay, so now define "British born". Does that include the 13 original colonies? Because if YES, then that contradicts your previous statement.

[AviatorTom]

The US Constitution requires an individual to be a natural born US citizen in order to run for President. The Founding Fathers wanted to make sure the President was a US "local" person, and feared someone from Europe coming over and taking charge. They didn't want to go back to being a colony of a foreign country.

[KostasKouvalis]

The first 11 presidents were all born in Britain though, because the US didn't exist yet

[KostasKouvalis]

Oh I guess it was *first 7, but you get my point

[AviatorTom]

@KostasKouvalis Those men were living in the United States when the country first existed, which made them "natural born" by interpretation.

[KostasKouvalis]

Actually the Ammendment wasn't passed "til 1868.

How could they be born in a country that didn't exist. They were born in the UK

www.quora.com/How-many-US-presidents-were-born-in-the-UK

[AviatorTom]

@KostasKouvalis If you live in a country when that country first exists, your are considered to be a native of that country, which is what "natural born" really means.

[KostasKouvalis]

But the US didn't exist. It was a colony.
Let me try to ask it another way.
Milana Vayntrub. The ATT girl. She was born in PRESENT day Uzbekistan, but at the time it was the Soviet Union.
So is she a natural born Soviet, natural born Uzbek or natural born Russian? Does she have Russian citizenship?

[AviatorTom]

@KostasKouvalis Based on what you said, I would consider "Lily" to be a native Uzbeki.

[KostasKouvalis]

Okay, so under THAT rationale you also think George Washington is a native American.

[AviatorTom]

@KostasKouvalis Yes I do.

[KostasKouvalis]

Okay. I disagree with you that he is, but that's fine.

[KostasKouvalis]

I bet he had a British accent even. I mean, he even utilized his British citizenship to travel to Barbados. So before he became president, he was 100% British. It doesn't matter if he acquired US citizenship later. He was born in Britain and was a British citizen.

[DrPepper12]

Does that logic hold for any of the territories occupied by Israel? Asking for a friend...

[lightbulb27]

Imagine way back then a brit coming over and becomming American, then president. on day one, he bows to the king of england... and it's game over... start paying that 6% tax to the king!

if you are born here, you better chance not going to bow to the king.

funny thing is we pay way more than 6% ...

[exitseven]

The founders wanted to insure that our commander in chief would be 100% American. There is a difference between being FROM a place and being OF a place. The founders evidently thought this was true.
America was a young country and was made up of former British subjects.

[Anonymous]

It is about loyalty, a normal person is expected to be loyal to their family.

Loyalty is important as a part of character in top level executive positions where your choices can't be debated and examined.

You are less likely to betray the country where your family lives.

[DrPepper12]

*Results may vary. If you wanna fuck you're own daughter the above is null and void.

[Opinion Owner]

@DrPepper12 That is a sick reference that has nothing to do with the topic.
The point: Blood is thinker than wine.

You are more likely to support and love the country in which your family and daughter was raised than the country to which you just moved.

That is the propose of birth right citizenship and such requirements for holding certant offices.

Ideally you would also have religious test requirements as well. It is not idea to put someone into an office of limited real time accountability if they don't believe they will be accountable to a God, ideally your countries popular understanding of that God.

[Anonymous]

Cenk Uyger wants Trump to put him in charge of the US budget, so he can't stop funding to Israel.

Yeah let some random guy not from your country in charge of everything in your country and then he lets terroist and psycho dictators take over.

[malarkey]

Foreigners don't understand American freedom. Here's a perfect example...

https://www.youtube.com/embed/3oRdP3SYjgM

[malarkey]

He wanted to move to America when he was 10 years old. He dreamt about it and was obsessed with America throughout his childhood. He moved to the USA when he was 21. He's is now 77 years old and he still does not grasp the idea of American freedom.

[Red_Arrow]

Better question... why allow someone with multiple felony convictions to run for president?

[DrPepper12]

Pshaw!!! There you go again asking relevant meaningful questions! You scamp!

[DeeDeeDeVour]

A candidate must be a natural born citizen of the United States.

[FunkyMonkee]

Apparently, you can. Ever hear of Barry Soetoro? His alias is Barak Obama.

[Hispanic-Cool-Guy]

Because its against constitutional law. That simple.

[Julie4]

Explain the philosophical reasons for this constitutional rule

[Hispanic-Cool-Guy]

Because a foreigner will have divided loyalty.

[WowGIrl4ever]

Well put

[KrakenAttackin]

Being written in the Constitution, it doesn't matter what the motivation is, the Constitution is the highest law in the land.

[GlowUpGirly5]

Very well said!

[DrPepper12]

Agreed. That Teodoro Rafael Cruz is shady as fuck...

[DrPepper12]

It's a anachronistic holdover from The American revolution where they didn't want Brits elected.

[Julie4]

Ok this explanation makes sense

[OddBeMe]

I mean I'm not against that constitutional change. We shouldn't be afraid of adding more amendments. That's what their for.

Hell they used one to outlaw liquor and another to bring it back

[Petermorgan343434]

Its just the rules under the current constitution, meant to ensure loyalty and consideration only to the USA, Is it right, or wrong? The jury's still out on that.

[Fireguy17]

because it is in the constitution and that says you cannot run.

[Dargil]

It's in the Constitution. Don't like it? Amend it.

[Jennz6]

I think 🤔 it’s against the constitution? Not totally 💯 sure

[KostasKouvalis]

She already knows that. She's asking WHY it's against the Constitution

[Jennz6]

@KostasKouvalis ask the founding fathers

[MarjorieJ]

No shit!

[MarjorieJ]

@jennz6 That didn't come out right. I meant that I agree with you. No one has the answer to this.

[Jennz6]

@MarjorieJ thank you darling

[KostasKouvalis]

Aha! It wasn't the Founding Fathers. The Ammendment wasn't put into the Constitution until 1868.
The first US presidents HAD to be foreign born as the US was originally a British colony, and a baby couldn't be president.

[MarjorieJ]

@KostasKouvalis

So you don't know the answer?

[KostasKouvalis]

@MarjorieJ I do, after some other people already explained. I see no sense in posting it again if multiple people already explained it

[zagor]

Because it's written in the US Constitution.

[KrakenAttackin]

Because it is specified in the Constitution.

[DrPepper12]

Yes but WHY?

[KrakenAttackin]

@DrPepper12 It doesn't matter, it just "is". Unless there is a Constitutional Convention to potentially change it, it simply is.

[jjj101010]

Just one of the rules, u need to be a naturalised citizen, just like u need to be 35 or older. Just one of the rules.

[Daniela1982]

They can't? Wasn't Obama one?

[KrakenAttackin]

Yeah, but that was different...😨😨😨

[Kelley1]

Obama proved that they can provide that lie.

[slatyb]

Because the Constitution forbids it.

[Massageman]

Constitutional Requirement.

[WowGIrl4ever]

100% American by birth

[GlowUpGirly5]

Obama was president yet he was a foreigner

[RedInnocent69]

Because, the Constitution

[noohair]

Because it is not allowed in the constitution...

[WhiteBoyChill]

Because they were originally a foreigner.

[Anonymous]

Because it's the law.

[Anonymous]

I wonder the same, too bad.

[Anonymous]

Because he will not love the country 100%

[Anonymous]

Like Obama.