Do you think instead of saying diverse, we should just be honest and say excluding white men?

[Anonymous]

Updates

1 y

There is a company in my town that predominately hires Nepali and Somalian people. They do a lot of community events and are constantly going on about how diverse their company is. It isn't. They're leaving a lot of people out.

[Ez-Bri-Z_v2]

Yikes.

That's not what diverse means. The problem is and has always been that white men have it much easier in the work place than minorities. The point isn't to exclude white men, it's to give others a chance in those spaces too. That makes a diverse work place. If you feel that them getting those opportunities is a problem then that's a YOU problem.

[Asker]

That's not what diverse means but it is precisely how it's being used. You don't fix discrimination with discrimination. Anyone that believes that's the answer is a big old hateful racist.

[Ez-Bri-Z_v2]

Ah yes, the big "no u" defense.

Again, it's giving others an opportunity where one wouldn't have existed before.

[Asker]

Again, you don't fix racism with racism.

[Ez-Bri-Z_v2]

Then what do you suggest in order to fix what is an obvious problem both ways?

[Asker]

Hiring on merit.

[Ez-Bri-Z_v2]

That's what led to white men exclusively getting roles because there were no checks in place to ensure diversity.

Try again.

[Asker]

Diversity is not a must. Discriminating against this person instead of that person does not solve anything, but people are ok with it because the "right" people are being favored. Just admit you're ok with it for that reason.

[Ez-Bri-Z_v2]

I admit that both ways are flawed because, in your way, it's an honor system, and frankly, most people are not honorable. They will hire people who look and sound like them.

In dei hires, more people get a chance but at the cost of whites. It is flawed even though it gives more opportunities.

Diversity IS a must. We shouldn't be able to discriminate just because we have a bias against someone's race, sexuality, gender, etc., which is what happens in merit hiring only.

[Asker]

But, diversity hiring is also bias against someone's race, etc.

[Ez-Bri-Z_v2]

Clearly already said that, but it also allows more people to have a chance that wouldn't have gotten one in the past. There is no perfect method.

[Asker]

No, it allows different people to have a chance, while taking a chance away from others. It's no different and no better. It's merely the "right" people being treated unfairly.

[Ez-Bri-Z_v2]

Are you just ignoring what I'm typing or what?

In theory, if most people weren't absolute assholes and inherently racist/sexist in their hiring practices, then a merit base would work. They are though and that's why merit doesn't work.

[Asker]

No, I absolutely see what you're saying. One form of discriminatory hiring is better than another because it discriminates against the right people. I'm saying one form is no better than the other, except that hiring on merit might actually give the job to the person most qualified.

[Ez-Bri-Z_v2]

Except that isn't what I said at all. I said both were flawed, but merit specifically really doesn't work because it's been tried in the past, and minorities/women were discriminated against.

If you want to stan white men only, then own up to it, but don't pretend it's because it's the "fairer" system.

[Asker]

You did say both were flawed, but went on to say diversity hiring is better because more people get a chance. More people don't get a chance. Different people get a chance. Diversity hiring doesn't create jobs. I don't care if every qualified person is a black woman, as long as they're qualified. Diversity hiring, for the sake of diversity hiring is another side of the same coin. If I was hiring people, I would want the best people regardless of what they look like, because I want to succeed.

[Ez-Bri-Z_v2]

White men vs every other race/women/sexuality. This is MORE people getting opportunities unless you are making the absurd claim that white men are equal in size to all those others combined.

Again, not the best hiring system and has its flaws for sure, but more people do get opportunities that way.

[Asker]

So diversity hiring creates jobs?

[lightbulb27]

yes.

easy solution is for white guys to dress in heavy burkas, identify as muslim women with acronyms WTF on their headdress.

that should fix it...

Why is there no MSGA Make Somalia Great Again movement, like back before Thomas Jefferson sent out the navy to deal with them when their ancestors were pirating European women.

[TadCurious]

You make a good point. 👍

[TadCurious]

I read your update. Americans shouldn't be made to feel like strangers in their own country.

[Asker]

Agree

[TadCurious]

Thank you for MHG opinion.

[exitseven]

not exactly. Gay white men are still good enough to get in the club.

[Asker]

Good point.

[DrPepper12]

"Privilege isn't the presence of perks and benefits. It's the absence of obstacles and barriers. That's a lot harder to notice. If you have a hard time recognizing your privileges, focus on what you DON'T have to go through."

Now ask again...

[Anonymous]

racist liberals would never admit that

if a POC disagrees with them, they get labeled a race traitor by these racist liberals

[Nerdvana]

Saying diverse means all men are included regardless of race. By saying excluding white men, is racist.

[Asker]

But the diversity that is being pushed today is just that, everyone but white men. But I'm the racist for pointing it out?

[Cormac995]

Thank you! nice to see someone see's it. I'm not going to pretend there isn't racial and sexual discrimination in the work force there is but things like DEI departments have become a legal way to gate keep jobs from people based on basically anything. I've heard of people in the gaming and film industry getting rejected even though they're qualified because they have a mixed-race family and they "Aren't black enough." They use it to exclude people based on personal preferences or politics and with enough paperwork in the DEI department they can make firing you because they don't like you look like justice and a fair decision.

You don't fight racism with racism that just creates a push and pull of hate that keeps bouncing between extremes until everyone hates each other. This also hurts products and the work force as well because if you hire based on artificial preferences rather than the quality of their work weakens the whole and if you hire enough inept people, you kill the business meritocracy's get better results.

[RavVid]

That is what it does mean, so YES.

[Anonymous]

My gosh, you are so awful.

[Asker]

How so?

[Pterodon]

Definitely

[Anonymous]

Yes.

[Anonymous]

Probably.

[MasterKS]

why not?