Race Question: Why do some white people these days think "biracial/mixed" people are not "black"?

[YellowSidewalkChalk]

Of course I mean people mixed with black African heritage. (Note yes I understand that race is a social construct and that there is only one biological race, human race. This is about social identity and heritage, family, etc.)

I'm asking this here just to get some feedback because I know there are a lot of white people here...and I'm bored. I've heard quite a few white people try to tell me that I shouldn't call myself black because my father is white. Of course I'm not going to let someone tell me what to label myself when it comes to something like race but I just like to think about things like this. For the vast majority of our countrys history (I'm American) white people have not wanted black people of any kind calling themselves white. It's true that there were other terms like "mulatto, quadroon, etc." made for black people of mixed heritage but generally we were treated as a black citizens. One drop rule and all. If you're black, you're black. Blacks were and still are much more accepting of their biracial relatives than white people are, even though there are some black families who are just as unaccepting. So why all of a sudden am I hearing ridiculous questions like, "Why do you call yourself black and not white?" or statements like, "you're not black." What changed? It seems like the Obama thing really set things off. I heard some people saying "I don't know what black people are so pumped about, he's not black he's mixed." I just shake my head and explain to them how I feel. I'm just curious. in my opinion (and the opinions of most "mixed" people I have met in my life) if I'm part black that makes me black. I can't erase part of my heritage. I have an entire family that is black - how can I not be part of them? That makes no sense to me.

I think for me its even more so because my mom is black and children tend to identify with their same sex parent. I love love love my father don't get me wrong, but my mom is a woman and I see myself in her. Growing up that's how I processed things. If she was a black woman, then I was a black woman.

There are some black people who do it too. Some have told me that because I have a lot of white friends, I date white guys , "talk white, act white" etc. that this makes me white. Again where the hell are people with their logic? I can't change my heritage and who I come from. I'm just as white as I am black, but I am black nonetheless and so I can call myself black. Also, even though I'm just as white as black...there's something funny about me saying "Hi my name is ___, I'm a white girl,..." lol ya know? it seems so much more natural to call myself "black" or "African American." Idk. Who disagrees? Who agrees?

[jrose]

Well- I definitely hear where you're coming from- just because you have mixed heritage doesn't mean you aren't one or the other. You're BOTH, which I suppose makes people uncomfortable because groups like to have easily identifiable members and easily identifiable outsiders, but you straddle the line so some people become threatened by that because you can't be a "true" member of either group, your loyalties are divided. I'm not saying people consciously think this, but subconsciously we like to categorize everyone and it makes us uncomfortable when we can't...Now, if you ask me, that's a problem society really needs to get over- you're either black or white, asian or middle eastern- it's crap.

But your question got me thinking- you say white like we're all of the same heritage, when I identify myself as Irish, Scottish, Native, and Bavarian - all very distinct and different cultures just as your african culture is. I don't go around saying I'm all of those things because it's ridiculous to give everyone my family history up to my birth just to define myself. I say "Hi, my name is___" and let my personality speak for itself. I identify with all of those cultures in my past to varying degrees and I see no need to squeeze myself into one category or the other. I wish it were that way for you, you could just be YOU and not have to explain further or feel the need to be one or the other. Both parts make you who you are, yes you're black, but you're white too- you can't erase that either and it's equally important just as each part of my heritage is important to me. I hope one day society (and you) will be able to accept and understand that you don't have to deny one part of you to embrace the other.

[YellowSidewalkChalk]

I totally understand where you're coming from. I don't deny that I'm white though. I have never said "no I'm not white" or lied when someone asks my ethnicity. I say the facts, dad is white, mom is black. I check "other" in those stupid boxes and everything. its just that when I label myself casually though (which true is not necessary) I tend to call myself african american or black. I do agree I don't buy the all one or other. most people aren't "purely" anything anyway.

[Anonymous]

They don't know about black people. It's funny how SOME white people always want to claim blacks with mixture if we're say, exceptionally attractive or successful...but they don't take into account damn near EVERY African American person is mixed somewhere down the line...and that many white Americans have African in their blood also due to the high amounts of blacks passing for white back in the day. My mother is mixed with white & dougla and my dad is mixed with Indian. People think I am mixed because I don't "look" like a typical black girl when there are black people straight outta Africa who are lighter than me. Overall we are mostly black by bloodline, heritage, and culture so that is what we are going to call ourselves. You can't make a One Drop Rule and then reverse it when it becomes convienient to you. My cousin is mixed but she lives in the UK where she is considered mixed race, she was raised mostly by her white mom around white people so I can understand why she wouldn't consider herself mixed. But my boyfriend is half black and white and he considers himself a black man.

And yeah I've had so many people say I act white/talk like a white girl and question why I don't seem to care about race when it comes to guys I date. And for that I say f*ck you! You just do you and Imma do me! how bout that

[Liv89]

Really, how can you be so sure that every African American is mixed? It's very different in US and the rest of Europe by the way. If you are black and white or black mixed whatever you're mixed in Europe but in the US you're black.

[peace-love-couture]

My mom is a white Hispanic and my father is black.

I label myself,not society.I don't need some mojo or black moron telling me what I am.

Not to mention I don't focus too much on race anyways.I get told I "act white and talk white" WTF is that supposed to mean?The fact that I haven't dyed my hair blond at 15 and gotten pregnant or that I don't have 5 baby daddy's running around and that I'm legal.

I call myself mixed.I don't care about the one drop rule,legally the doctors chose for me to go as Hispanic,but I'm dark skinned and many people are ignorant to the fact that Hispanic isn't a race and not all Hispanics are brown or short.

I think people who aren't mixed should sh*t the f*ck up and keep their opinions to themselves.Without one or the other I wouldn't exist

[YellowSidewalkChalk]

Lol you get a thumbs up. :) I agree but I do tend to focus on race. I get that from my mom. lol

[AlexSmith1010]

".. I think people who aren't mixed should sh*t the f*ck up and keep their opinions to themselves..."

That statement is very closed minded. Not all biracial and mixed people have the same opinion on what being in our shoes is like. Someone who isn't mixed can easily have the same point of view as you, along with someone who doesn't; whether they're biracial/mixed or not.

[sinful1620]

Being "white" doesn't have much to do with skin tone. It's more about how closely you identify with the Grecko-Britannic Puritanical values that largely compose American culture (I am going off the presumption you are American, knowing you really haven't done anything to indicate that).

So for Americans, "whiteness" is more about how closely you identify with the typical religious American values. Being "black", both through stereotyping by some as well as supposed rebellion by others, has turned more into identification with a second culture that ironically conforms to the stereotype.

So our culture says you aren't really "black" if you don't listen to rap, or live in the ghetto, or go to a church where you sing. It also says you aren't really "white" if you don't go to church in somber silence, or love mayonnaise on your sandwiches.

I have an interesting split identity that's similar to the situation you're in. About 4 years ago, I was diagnosed with a very serious disability. So on one half, I'm a white male; I'm the ultra-privileged. On the other half, I'm a cripple; I'm in the midst of a civil rights battle.

I like to bring this up because it shows how misleading presumptions about identity can be. People have not known about my disability and attacked me saying I had no right to speak about a sensitive topic because I don't know what it's like to face and overcome adversity.

Identity is not some all-inclusive thing where it's like "oh OK you're black here's your uniform and music collection". If someone wants to break down exactly what proportion of white and black you are, let them, but understand that your genetics and your identity are independent of each other.

[YellowSidewalkChalk]

Yeah I TOTALLY disagree with that, You do know that secular society, atheism, rebellion against religion are all concepts that are associated with European/white culture? There are plenty of cultures that clash with one other that are associated with white people. punk rock subculture, hippie culture, sex cults, etc. I don't think there one specific "white culture" unless you're ignorant...I think you are only touching on a very surface view of suburban american culture maybe.

[YellowSidewalkChalk]

For the record, nothing about me screams "conventional suburban culture" and I still get the same responses from some black people and white people. I'm bisexual (very into lgbt rights), vegan (pretty into animal activism), hardcore atheist (hate religion), and listen to all kinds of music. So no one, NO ONE, is looking at me, meeting me, and seeing any of the things you listed. Many simply go by the way I look and say I don't "look black." So I think genetics is a huge part of it.

[YellowSidewalkChalk]

**that should be "look black enough. I look black in a very biracial way. you can tell I have african heritage but you clearly see there's a lot of other stuff there... I also have big curly afro like hair. yeah. don't think they dig that too much in the suburbs. lol

[sinful1620]

Fun fact: every new generation in America rebels against their parents and thinks they're being unique. You sound like a very typical high school girl, maybe a freshman or sophomore in college.

The fact that you announce these typical things as though they somehow makes you ultra-unique makes you common. That's probably why your friends are confused that you aren't identifying with the common.

[YellowSidewalkChalk]

Lol how do you know my parents didn't raise me to be this way? I wasn't announcing them to be special. you made an argument that I didn't agree with. you implied that I embodied the characteristics you listed and that that's why people say this to me. I rebutted. for the record I don't do anything specifically to rebel against my parents (since you assume they didn't raise me this way) everything I believe in is an issue of morality and I'm very passionate about my beliefs, always have been.

[YellowSidewalkChalk]

Correction my dear. I said "some people" not "my friends." My friends are generally more intelligent and know me well enough to know that everything I believe in is from a genuine place. Actually most people who meet me even just acquaintances get that vibe in the way I empress my passion for my beliefs. Several of them agree with me. I'm a junior in college by the way, not that it matters. I can see you might have a chip on your shoulder about one (or all lol) of my beliefs but there's no need. :)

[sinful1620]

No, I didn't imply that you were at the "white" end of the spectrum. I implied you were closer to the stereotype of white than the stereotype of black. As you're a junior in college, vegan, activist, and overall fit the stereotype of "angry white college girl", I'm going to keep assuming that you are closer to the white stereotype.

[YellowSidewalkChalk]

I'm sorry I'm actually passionate about things. Didn't know I had to be an all around angry person just to be an activist. lol That's totally fine if you do, but do you understand where I'm coming from when I say you have an unbalanced view of what black should be? First your interpretations of both white and black were equally narrow. Now that I pointed out all the other things associated with "white" you have accepted that yes, if I believe in those things I'm more of a white stereotype.

[YellowSidewalkChalk]

So if a a person who embodies what you think are "white" qualities and cultures, what's left for black people? According to you white can be anything from conservative suburbanite to extremely liberal activist. What's left for black people? Are the stereotypically narrow confinements of rap/hip hop, ebonics, loud singing in churches, etc. all you really think being "black" is? This is my problem with people who share your view. It doesn't leave much room for creativity or diversity for black ppl

[YellowSidewalkChalk]

If I have you wrong then correct me, please, but this is what I'm getting from you. :/

[sinful1620]

You're confusing my beliefs with my perception of our culture's beliefs. Yes, our culture has an extremely narrow view of race. That doesn't mean I actually agree with what I said I thought our culture's view was.

[palek]

Whenever I give any amount of thought to the issue of skin color or race, my head inevitably spins out of control and I determine never to spend another moment thinking about it. You see, I can sincerely offer that skin color or racial orientation matter not at all to me, but then I'm forced to explain why it is I ONLY date black women, and it's at this point where everything unravels. So, suffice it to say you have every right to proudly claim your black heritage so long as you have the skin tone to support your claim. At least that's as simply as I can break it down in my own mind. If anyone should take exception to your doing so, ask them if they're blind.

[YellowSidewalkChalk]

What skin tone is that? I didn't know there was one skin tone required to claim it...Good for you though. I think about race and culture 24/7. Not really but a lot. It matters a lot to me, and I study things in those areas so I like it. :D

[palek]

I suppose the skin tone to which I allude, has been classified as everything between "dark-skinned" and "high yellow". Perhaps the only sure litmus test would be to ask me. Since I profess to be exclusively attracted to black women, I should surely know one when I see one (lol).

[YellowSidewalkChalk]

Lol uh sure... I have cousins who are half black who literally can pass as white though. I've seen people like that all over. I was just reading up on the old black actress fredi washington last week( she was in a version of one of my fav movies about race -The Imitation of Life) and she could pass as white. happened a lot and still does. she's still black even if you can't see it. just saying but yeah. thanks! :)

[palek]

I hear ya. We have a woman at the church I attend who can pass without any question. In fact, I knew her when I had attended this same church 14 years ago. It had a predominantly white congregation at that time (now its 99.9% black), and I always thought she was a white woman. It's really very strange how this happens. I can see where its a little confusing to claim you're a black woman when you appear to be a white woman in all outer respects. Again it comes down to color. Black people tell you

[palek]

And white people don't know the difference.

[palek]

Last post should have read "...you're white, and white people don't know the difference".

[YellowSidewalkChalk]

Damn those typos..lol Yeah I think genetics are so extraordinary. The combinations create different things. Even within "races" its all so beautiful. One of those cousins I mentioned thinks of herself as white but its bothers her family because she's not! Anyway not many people are purely anything. Too much has happened over thousands of years. My mom has two black parents, and they have black parents and so on. However, due to slavery I guess, she has a look people think is "mixed."

[YellowSidewalkChalk]

Just a question...you seem older...lol was dating black woman harder when you were younger, for you personally? was your family always accepting? random question I know but that's me ha ha

[palek]

Actually, I grew up in a lilly white area, and had no real interaction with black people 'til later in life. About 14 years ago I was producing a "Legends in Concert" show on a gambling ship, and my coproducer was the Tina Turner impersonator. We became very close, and started dating. Since then I've only dated black women. I've been engaged to two black women, but for whatever reason marriage has never come to fruition. Of course, people (both black and white) inevitably hit me with the "once

[palek]

You go black, you'll never go back" comment, and I suppose I fit the bill. Incidently, I worked with a booking agent some years back named Lita Bolton. She was white and in her 70's, but her first husband was Deke Watson, leader of The Ink Spots, and boy would you have liked talking to her; parties with Louis Armstrong, the Mills Bros, Al Hibler, etc. Lita wrote the Ink Spots biography, and had their statue from the Rock n' Roll Hall of Fame on her shelf

[hollygolightly]

I'm mixed too my dad's black and my mom's white and I really just same I'm both. I get a lot from both sides saying I'm to light to be black and too black to be white but there just haters of my tan. Its true I don't fit into any race and I've been trying to work on this concept for a few years and slowly more understanding comes and more acceptance not a full on but little by little. the idea is to define yourself and be happy with that, ill let you know when I accomplish that(:

[YellowSidewalkChalk]

Lol haters of the tan. Good luck babe. Really just be happy with who you are. You don't HAVE to define yourself, but many of us want to. If it keeps you from accepting yourself then to hell with it! I've never really cared if I fit in completely to one or the other its mostly just how I see myself. love yourself <3

[mattdzz]

I don't think there's much to your assertion that you take on a black identity because of your same sex parent. Studies have been conducted, which show that a political stance is often derived from a father. What I would suppose is that you take on a black identity because it's convenient for you to do so. You can fit in better with blacks, as light as you may be, than you would with whites because any "african tinge" signals african/ black. Also, your dating marketability will be easier to broadcast as black than it would be white, your hair, other markets of racial characteristics that would fall outside the ideal, or at least general white standard. There are also plenty of governmental/ academic/ social benefits you can get by claiming to be "black" (whatever your makeup) than white.

[TheMasculinist]

Because they are racist. They look at the president and see a black guy. He's half white. Its stupid. If I fill a glass half with water, half with milk, would they call it milk or watered down milk? lol! They should respect BOTH cultures, but when a persons half and half they don't want to admit that one half is like them...why...because they are racists.

[RolandCuthbert]

But "Mixed" people are not "Black" unless they claim to be "Black". You can't say all people with mixed African heritage claim to be members or participants in "Black" culture.

Some just do not wish to be labeled that way. Let's all respect their wishes.

[princesskayle]

I didn't really read the whole thing but biracial people aren't black. If they're mixed with black they're just that mixed. Some claim black because that's all they know or they look more black. Some embrace both. It really depends on the individual but I personally see mixed people as mixed.

[Anonymous]

Stupid question. Technically you aren 't black. The one drop rule was created during slavery times, hundresds of years ago. In other countries, "mulatto's" are in a different racial category and are not viewed as black, they are called brown or colored. I am mixed too but don't view myself as black at all. Why don't you celebrate both sides? I just don't know why you would want to identify as only black but be my guest if you want to.

[SplendorInTheGrass]

Well really there's no "technicality" in race seeing as it doesn't exist in nature...i see what you are trying to say though. I just can't fathom the thought that I'm not the same as my parents. I don't agree with you for the simple fact that most people aren't pure anything so if your definition is "not completely one 'race'" for mixed then wouldn't that make like everyone mixed just to different degrees? that's my problem with it. I think its simply identity. I am much closer to my black family.

[SplendorInTheGrass]

So yeah I agree with her. like I'm not even half I'm just part but whatever lol that's my take on it. I'm not even gonna answer this question though. its a loaded one lol

[YellowSidewalkChalk]

I agree. that's what I'm trying to say. I do embrace both sides though I don't know why people keep saying that. if someone asks if I'm half white I say yes I don't lie about it or anything. and I definitely don't think this is a stupid question because racial identity is something created and always evolving but okay your opinion. :)

[jacquesvol]

There's no 'white' or 'black' race

www.trademarkia.com/.../...human-race-85194051.jpg

[jacquesvol]

www.americananthro.org/.../Content.aspx

[Breegee1989]

I'm black, white, Mexican, and Chinese and I hate when anyone sees me they just assume I'm just black. I am proud to be mixed. I love all the races that make me up! No matter what people will always have something to say about your race.

[SplendorInTheGrass]

im mixed and I get you. don't sweat it, you know who you are and that's all that matters. correct them then move on!

[Cybergirl65]

I'm British White, well actually kinda pink. Although I do have a slight tan at the moment. Does it matter what colour you are? Your heritage is your background not your colour? People should just see you? Who cares if your black White pink purple or spotty? Embrace your families history and culture great! I'm sorry but what difference does your colour make?

[anon543]

If yer purple or spotty I'm calling the alien hotlines and making some serious $$$...

on a real note tho, agreed. who gives a damn about race nowadays? seems like its more people discriminating about themselves then it is actual discrimination "i'm jewish, feel bad for me" umm no.

[YellowSidewalkChalk]

Thats what "color" means here. race, heritage, history, culture. black people come in all shades. very few people are actually pitch black. lol if we were actually going by color of skin we wouldn't be called "black" we would be called "tan" "bronze" "brown" "dark brown", etc. very few "white" people are "white." in fact the only people that are, are albinos. so I'm not following you but okay...lol

[goldgirl98]

Omg you should definitely watch this documentary called "little white lie" on Netflix if you have it. Please. Omg its only an hour, and it basically talks about everything you just described. Find it watch it love it!!!

[Anonymous]

Unless you can pass for white (with in a societal construct) then You're black. Don't let those people confuse you. If so one day you'll have a rude awakening. Unless you can pass for white - "this shouldn't even be a question". So for "you" the rude awakening may have already occurred. You just can't face it.

[DianaWest]

because you are not black. you are biracial. there's a difference.

[Yassminbrooks]

Because they are black and white they are there own race. Have you heard of biracial.

[Anonymous]

its the same thing to why black people say ethiopians ain't black.
when they are black.

[EddyMetal]

I agree. People are pretty stupid.

[beebetree25]

Just identify with who you want to identify as.

[Anonymous]

Because they are biracial/mixed and not black duh

[Anonymous]

That's really long...