Do you support law enforcement?

[Anonymous]

[LifeHitMeandRan]

Sure do. However, the police hiring process needs a few tweaks, specifically concerning DD214 interpretations. For those unaware, the DD214 is the discharge paper that lists your type of discharge and your eligibility to return to the military.

There are 3 sections of a DD214 that Police care about and only one that Corrections care about (I do not feel like digging mine out so if I call a certain category something wrong, forgive me, but the gist of this post is the point, not technicality):

1. Character of Discharge. These are Honorable, General (Also known as General Under Honorable), Other Than Honorable, Bad Conduct and Dishonorable. Most states have laws that only those with an Honorable Discharge can work in Corrections or Police. Some states allow law enforcement work with a General Discharge and a waiver, but most law enforcement agencies will NOT go through this and will simply decline to hire someone with anything but an Honorable. The last two discharges are extremely serious and require a Court Martial Conviction to get. They carry the same weight as felonies and often (but not always) come with felony convictions. This is as far as Corrections looks and is where I believe the Police need to draw the line. My discharge is Honorable.

2. Narrative of Discharge: This is the explanation for the character of discharge. Mine says "Serious Misconduct" (I'll explain the circumstances at the end). Corrections do not care about this category, but when I tried to become a police officer, this along with the next category gave me no end of grief.

3. Reentry (RE-Code): These range from RE-1 to RE-4. Some might have a letter next to them (i. e. RE 2-b). RE-1 means no issues, can reenlist as desired. RE-4 in the Navy means "do not even bother coming back". Mine is an RE-4, and rightfully so. Again, Corrections does not look into this, but the Police do.

Explanation for why I believe police do not need to go further than Character of Discharge when looking at a DD214:

I was 19 when I joined the Navy and 22 when I was put out. I went to Captain's Mast (Article 15) twice. Keep in mind an Article 15 IS NOT A CRIMINAL PROCEEDING.

The first one was for sending pizza to my ex-girlfriend's step dad as a prank. My first duty station was near where I went to high school. It was stupid, but the pizza was paid for. I lost rank, had 2 months of half-pay and 45 days extra duty. I deserved every bit of that punishment, but trust me when I say that falls into the category of dumb shit MOST servicemembers pull when they are young.

The second one was due to a misunderstanding and was the one that got me put out of the Navy. Basically, one superior gave me permission to leave on emergency leave to go see my dying grandfather (who was the one who raised me most of my childhood). He failed to do his paperwork so another superior tried to stop me. I said some stupid shit in the heat of the moment that was a CLEAR threat. I went to Mast again and this time was discharged from the Navy. Again, rightfully so.

My problem is how the police agencies decided to weigh these two incidents.

First, an Article 15 can be given for the SMALLEST of things. Really comes down to how much your chain of command likes or hates you. Article 15s are not used evenly across the military and there are servicemembers who committed violent crimes who never got one.

Second, again they are not criminal proceedings. Yes, I COULD HAVE been court-martialed for my threat, but the reality is I was not. Also, I was young and dumb. I was 22 when it happened and I was under serious duress and under conflicting orders.

Third, I served as a Corrections Officer, AFTER the military. The conditions a CO faces are MUCH HARDER than what a police officer faces. I can go into that another time. But, I was able to prove I could keep my temper even when dealing with the worst people in society.

Fourth, I have no criminal record.

Finally, under my state's laws, only the Character of Discharge matter when considering veterans, NOT the code or narrative. This is because the law recognizes that two servicemembers may have the same indiscretion yet be handled differently based on two different chains of commands. And many police officers and investigators are prior military and therefore should know this already. And when police weigh their investigation, they are supposed to consider ALL factors. And on a scale, most factors are in my favor.

When police recruiting is at an all-time low, you cannot expect to hire PERFECT candidates. Those don't exist in the best of circumstances. ALSO, there are police officers who HAVE CRIMINAL RECORDS (minor misdemeanors, but still a record) or who have done much worse than me that got hired.

I know this response was lengthy, but it makes it hard to support law enforcement when they will hire people with convictions over someone who did something dumb in the military but otherwise is an amazing citizen. And even the military considered what I did minor or else I would not have received an Honorable Discharge. And police agencies need to consider that the military disciplines for relatively minor things that WOULD NOT MATTER in police work or anywhere else.

[nightdrot]

Absolutely!!

No joke, when I was no more than 5 years old, I can remember my mother telling my younger brother and me, "If you kids get thrown in jail you can expect to stay there because I won't be bailing you out. Because if you are in jail it means that you deserve to be. When a police officer tells you to do something you say, 'Yes, sir" and you do it!"

To be sure, beyond wondering how I would end up as the first second grader incarcerated on Alcatraz, speaking at just a personal level, I have no sympathy for this notion that someone is a delicate little snowflake who deserves to have his feelings given a higher regard than the rule of law. It is utterly alien to everything I was raised with.

The police have a risky job, their lives are on the line at every stop, and they have no way of knowing who you are or what you are doing. They deserve deference and if they go outside the bounds, you have redress for that in a court of law.

The current popular attitude toward law enforcement is an outgrowth of a sniveling, self-absorbed and self-pitying culture that too easily takes for granted the difficult task of maintaining a stable social order. "The policeman was mean to me!" Good grief.

Do they get unfairly treated? Absolutely. It is the sign of a self-satisfied and sanctimonious age that too easily takes for granted its safety and those who assure us.

In 1977, after nearly two decades of a culture that had taken to calling the police, "pigs" and that thought the criminal was a victim of society rather than a victimizer, Gallup took a poll. It showed that 72% of all women - and 92% of African-American women - of all classes and incomes and all the rest, did not feel safe walking in their neighborhoods at night.

Americans, as was said of the French kings, "Forget nothing and learn nothing." Suffice to say, we are about to repeat history.

[Friendlybro79]

Relax my man. It's going to be ok. We definitely should respect law enforcement and they should respect us by not infringing in our rights in order to do their job and feel safe. They absolutely have a tough job and of course we should respect each other but they signed up for it. There are bad people and they will encounter horrible people and situations to which is why I think they should have the best training and high paying jobs. They just need better internal affairs and better internal accountability. So many great police officers are scared to speak out against their corrupt colleagues and it's a problem. Have family in law enforcement and they've said they protect each other at all costs. Had a great conversation with this family member and after hours he finally understood why it was wrong. By wrong I mean protecting their own when they do horrible things that actually makes them bad guys. That can't and should not happen and it does. That doesn't mean we don't need police it means they need to be held to a higher level of accountability because they're law enforcement... not the actual judge jury and executioner. I say this with peace and love and respect all the great police officers that do their jobs with dignity. We're lucky to have them but they are not perfect. They serve us. We don't bow to them.

[nightdrot]

@Friendlybro79 You write, "That can't and should not happen and it does." Can you cite some specific examples and how often does this kind of thing happen?

The question is dealing in an ethos of the culture at the moment. A society in which the public assumes its' own virtue and goodness and resents authority because it IS authority.

You are not wrong that there need to be - to borrow a phrase - checks and balances. However, the problem at the moment is not the police and other authorities are respected too much, but too little. (See also crime rates and such.)

What we have is a society that demands that those who enforce the law be accountable - fair enough - but imposes upon itself no accountability. "The effect of liberty to individuals is that they may do as they please. We ought see what it will please them to do before we risk congratulations."

[Date_a_Snob]

I read a story who a cop who arrested a burglar who was responsible for many break and enters. The cop when interviewed seemed proud to gotten a criminal off the streets. The news story however also mentioned the burglar was a single parent with two kids who were knowing going to go into foster care. I support the police but feel it's inappropriate they take pride in their job.

[goaded]

Maybe the father should have found a job instead of choosing to break the law. The police are not at fault here. How would you have felt, knowing he'd stolen things from many people, including you?

[DeeDeeDeVour]

Yes, I do.

[MisterWack]

I don’t support or support law enforcement, they don’t need my endorsement. They aren’t a candidate that tells you lies to get elected or a conman telling you what you want to hear in order to make a profit.

Law enforcement from Judges to Police Officers to Night Watchmen to Patrol Cars on the highway catching speedsters are important for the function of society. Without them, we’d be fucked to high Hell.

I believe there are flaws in this system and I always speak out though not at the cost of the officers. I will always speak out on the bad cops and speak out in favor of the good cops, period full stop.

If you are a cop serving this land, God Bless You and you don’t need me to remind you though I want to say it any way: Protect And Serve 🫡🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸

[MisterWack]

*By cop, I meant the addition of Judges to Prosecutors to Lawyers to Patrol Highway Officers to Police Officers to Security to Night Watchmen you name it. God Bless You! Protect And Serve.
🫡🇺🇸

[Anonymous]

Of course I do!
Kamala and the leftists trying to defund the police are pathetic.

Sure there could be bad people anywhere but the fact is most cops not bad. We need them.

it’s good the left are out of the White House for now. they support wars and chaos, how many rioters went to jail for burning down buildings? They destroyed not only our streets, but many people died too because of their “protests” which were really only riots and burning 🔥 and destroying and stealing more than anything else and nobody was imprisoned for it, NOBODY. instead they were encouraged to continue their chaos. And then “defund the police” ? 🤯

bunch of retarded crowds among leftist. Yuck.

[goaded]

"What does "defund the police" mean?

Before diving into the debate, let’s clarify what "defund the police" entails. Defunding the police doesn’t necessarily mean completely eliminating law enforcement agencies or abolishing police departments altogether. Instead, it implies redirecting a significant portion of the police budget to non-law enforcement services, such as:

• Social and mental health services
• Community programs and initiatives
• Education and job training
• Infrastructure development
• Alternative crisis response and emergency services"
www.civil-war.net/should-we-defund-the-police/

Obviously, you'd still need the same level of police funding while those policies take effect.

[slatyb]

As a concept, yes. But there has been a lot of abuse of citizens by law enforcement. I don't support that.

[goaded]

Fair enough. What's your opinion on bodycams? I think they're great at protecting citizens from abuse and police from false accusations of abuse.

[slatyb]

@goaded Great if they are ALWAYS ON, and the video is immediately made public on demand of the involved citizen.

[jaskinry2022]

hellyes i do. they are the reason why i am alive today if you really want me to be honest. if it wasn't for who saved my life i would had been dead. i grew up and around lawenforencments. talk about veteran family , and talk about first responder family. i support them 100 percent.

[ForevrLonely29]

As an EMT or Paramedic, our privilege to practice and perform our duties lawfully depends on whether we possess a valid, state-issued professional license. Any misconduct is grounds for a revocation of that license, and therefore, the inability to practice. I do believe the same should be implemented for law enforcement officers. It shouldn't be easy for them to jump from one agency to another in the event misconduct takes place.

[ChicoFromThe305]

Yes and no, I believe they do play a important part of society but I'm not out here like "yay cops" or believe they are good people, I believe there's specific good people that are cops but I'm not brainwashed to believe the majority of them are cause at the end they are human too.

[Unit1]

Don't rape, steal, scam, destructively destroy, harm or kill (except for self defense purposes)? Sure

We will shamelessly invade your digital privacy, spy on you with mass surveillance and have access to all data of and about you AND if you previously married or divorced someone of the female gender, you're forced to give them alimoney? Fuck. Off.

[exitseven]

Yes, they have a difficult job and in a lot of cities they get no support from politicians that want to defund them. If they do their job they can get fired. No wonder it's hard to recruit good candidates

[Anonymous]

It depends on what law and how it's enforced. For example I support laws against reckless driving, but driving recklessly to enforce this law and actually causing more danger (engaging in a high speed chase) is not something that I support.

[Staximus]

When they are in the right and their actions are just. One of my best friends used to be a cop in Wyoming after he moved out of state. He was the first responder to over 100 suicides and murders (mostly suicides), and is fucked up in the head from it. Most people don't realize the shit cops have to go through, it's a totally fucked up job.

[beefcakebradybatson]

Yes, except if they're brutal as in the George Floyd, Tyre Nichols (two years ago tomorrow), Breonna Taylor, Michael Brown, Oscar Grant, Tamir Rice (a TWELVELE-YEAR-OLD lad playing with a toy gun !!!) situations where folk were criminally slain or in too many more numerous cases, beaten.

[molonski2]

Sometimes depending on the Country / State and their actions.

[molonski2]

I nearly got in big trouble when I left the car in USA , but in Australia that's best way to do it " hands up and on your knees "

Had done nothing by the way.
Random check.

[adventurous-1]

yes mostly except when one of them oversteps their authority or abuses their power. Most officers are decent folks doing their job the best they can. And lets be real, it's a difficult nasty job at times.

[FreyaRed]

I just ask myself how half of them passes the fitness test with this level of obesity. I guess, FBI needs to order stronger chairs and 5XL clothes for them. XD

[MotherEarth2020]

Sure, as long they are not pulling me over or invading my privacy with illegal searches of phones, homes and cars

[ThatGuyAaron]

Not when they abuse their power and face no real consequences for doing so.

[Dargil]

I do absolutely. To answer some whatabout, More unarmed Black Men are killed by cops then struck my lightening in the USA. Prove me wrong.

[lightbulb27]

a huge hell yes. I can't beleive the crap our police put up with. My patience wouldn't hold up. I'm thankful for them, they are essential.

[jshm2]

No. You are eight times more likely to be killed by a US cop, than a terrorist.

The number is higher if you're Black.

[MemeSupreme]

yeah but i don't like all police departments and cops tho

[BobbieBoy666]

Only by keeping them on their toes with my speeding. 😇

[Drumlin2001]

Absolutely. I'm sure there are bad eggs but in general they do an invaluable job. Society without them would collapse

[TadCurious]

Yes, I support and appreciate all of our first responders.

[Agape93]

Long as they don't cause problems, yeah. But in general, fuck no. Earn it.

[LiamJHayden]

I support good cops who know and abide by the law. I despise the ones who play petty tyrant and violate people's rights.

[bolverk]

Only if they are actually living up to the Oath they swore when they joined 'Law Enforcement'!

[DrPepper12]

About as much as they support the Constitution, neutrality, honesty, wisdom, de-escalation, justice, respect, restraint & civility.

[FunkyMonkee]

Absolutely!! Why WOULDN'T I? Only fucking RETARDS would choose NOT to!!

[Anonymous]

Absolutely. With thugs like Jordan Neely, George Floyd, Michael Brown, daunte wright out there

[genericname85]

yes. cause without enforcement, laws mean nothing.

[blackeagle007]

I don’t support the system. It’s untrustworthy. They train officers to shoot first then ask questions

[kaucky1]

Hell no they do a lot of bad things mess lives up is not authority over all my drugs morphing into me justification and vengeance

[Anonymous]

only criminals and lawbreakers hate law enforcement

[Kingofkings1992]

Not necessarily true

[Opinion Owner]

@Kingofkings1992 who else would hate law enforcement?

[Dongie]

I support law and order. Not every law officer is honest.

[Blueeyes81]

Yes but I don't blindly trust them like a lot do.

[Knightwatch27]

Always and forever. Any sane individual does.

[Hispanic-Cool-Guy]

Yes, assuming you they do their job right.

I however, don't support ish cops.

[plumplum-1994]

Depends on the town tbh. Small town cops seem to be more down to earth and understanding compared to big city cops who have a lot going on.

[TheFutureIsFemdom]

Most LEO's are good people just trying to do their job, but there are many among their ranks that are not such great people.

[Kingofkings1992]

Mostly, but they definitely have their share of assholes. Just like any other profession.

[rosemilk]

yes, i always will

[virtualwasp]

I support results.

[ItsJill]

Absolutely, being a LEO myself.

[Jennz6]

@ItsJill you’re a cop 👮?

[Jennz6]

@ItsJill where do you serve as a LEO?

[fantasticass]

Yes, I support law enforcement.

[AviatorTom]

Yes, nuff said.

[Jennz6]

“Real” Law Enforcement Officers 👮‍♀️

[Cassandra2003]

The Good ones yes.

[dustybiker2]

Depends

[QuietRunner]

Yes what choice do I have

[robocop666]

Well they don't do their job

[Miristheiss]

Yes.

[HungTexan]

Definitely.

[KrakenAttackin]

Mostly yes.

[Pterodon]

Definitely