True? False? Don't tell me it's in the Constitution! Is it welfare? DEI? Inappropriate? Irrational? Offensive? Wrong? Right? Affirmative action?

[DrPepper12]

The Constitution is a suicide pact.

[abc3643]

Well, you need to understand something that many people don't realize and I didn't until I was in my 40s or 50s...

It didn't occur to me at first because I didn't dwell on the history of it, but I my systems engineering sense led me to "reverse engineer" the mindset of the Founders when they built our federal republic.

In a sense, we live in TWO "United States" - one of people and one of states.

First, the United States of the People. The House of Representatives is the legislative branch for the people.

Second is the United States of the States. The Senate is the legislative branch for the states.

Looking at Article I in the US Constitution, this makes sense. If you look closely, you notice which powers are allocated to each of these two houses. If it involves money (which is what people pay or get), those bills start in the House. But, things like foreign affairs, those effect states equally. Same with appointments which is why the Senate does the confirming.

And notice one other thing... Article V discusses the Amendment Process. Notice that the Senate, having equal representation for each state, is the ONE unamendable part of the US Constitution... sure, an amendment can set each state having a dozen senators, but all states have to get a dozen members.

So, when it comes to electing the President, the Electoral College is sort of a mathematical compromise between the two houses. Each state gets the total number of House members plus Senators.

This is why I am not too bent out of shape about the Electoral College. However, I do believe that the number of House members is woefully too small. Yet, expanding the House is also problematic for logistical and operational reasons.

So, I'd support a Constitutional amendment for a new Electoral College formula: The number of Electoral College votes that a state has is equal to 2 times the number of representatives in the House plus the number of Senators.

So, for example, here's the current situation:

California currently has 52 representatives and thus 54 EC votes ("ECV"), but the 2020 population of California is 39.37 million.
That means there's 729704 persons per ECV.

Meanwhile, Wyoming has 1 representative and 3 ECV, but the 2020 population of 582,328.
That means there's 194109 persons per ECV.

This means that, from an ECV perspective, the Wyoming voter has about 3.75 times the power of a California voter.

Normally, that wouldn't fly in courts because that is an egregious violation of the 1-person, 1-vote concept. Indeed, the Electoral College situation is like the 1989 SCOTUS case "Board of Estimate of NYC v. Morris" in which high-population Brooklyn complained that low-population Staten Island's representation in NYC government was too much and the SCOTUS shot it down so the city had to reorganize its government.

From Wikipedia:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Board_of_Estimate_of_City_of_New_York_v._Morris
===

Opinion of the Court
The court unanimously declared the New York City Board of Estimate unconstitutional on the grounds that the city's most populous borough (Brooklyn) had no greater effective representation on the board than the city's least populous borough (Staten Island), in violation of the Fourteenth Amendment's Equal Protection Clause pursuant to the Court's 1964 "one man, one vote" decision (Reynolds v. Sims).[3] The Board was disestablished.

===

However, in this case with the Electoral College, the courts can do nothing because the Electoral College is defined in the US Constitution.

OK, so, right now, the Wyoming voter has 3.75 times the power of the California voter.

But what if the Electoral College was modified like I suggested: Count the House twice...

California THEN has 2*52 + 2 = 106 ECV which implies 371145 persons per ECV.
Wyoming THEN has 2*1 + 2 = 4 ECV which implies 145582 persons per ECV.

The Wyoming voter still has considerably more power in the EC, but, at 2.55 compared to the California voter, it is a bit more equitable than the 3.75.

Parenthetically, in this scenario, there'd be 974 ECVs so winning the election would mean getting 488 ECVs.

Anyway, the Electoral College exists because it was deliberately engineered to be the balanced compromise of electing the President who is the President for both the US of People and the US of States.

[Ladsin2]

The Constitution is the fundamental bargain of our country. If you want to get rid of it then we need a new constitution or to disband the country. Pretty simple. If you want to change the constitution there are very well explicated methods of doing so.
The US is not a democracy. We are a constitutional democratic republic. Our founders, wisely, saw pure democracy as tyranny of the masses, and oligarchies as tyranny by a minority. The separation of powers is the best attempt in all of human history at reducing tyranny by both parties. Thus our government is the worst, except for all the others.

[DrPepper12]

They fucked up. a lot.

[Ladsin2]

Which is why it's the worst... except all the others. If you want to add your ideas about lesbian dance parties and flying unicorns to the constitution you can. Just do it the right way if you want to maintain the country. If you're an anarchist that's a different bag of worms.

[Anonymous]

There's more people in Red China, perhaps they should be able to dictate how the us is run rather than the electoral college.

[Fireguy17]

I'm not sure how you connected those dots, but everyone is entitled to their opinion.

[Opinion Owner]

@Fireguy17 why should new York have more say in Montana than voters from Montana?

[DrPepper12]

That makes as much sense as a MAGA in a library! You need analogical help. Majority rules.

[Fireguy17]

is this because the house is based on population?
The senate is just 2 so it balances out.
It's been that way since the constitution was approved.

[loveslongnails]

No matter how you slice it, here's the simplest explanation of the founding of the electoral policy of the United Snakes of America, as I see it ---- in other words, this is my opinion:

* It was formed by mostly wealthy, white landowners who didn't want to pay taxes that went to the Crown with no apparent benefits for themselves. Only they could vote; the common person had "no say in governing" and was essentially a slave.

* Today, it's RUN by wealthy, mostly white landowners via corporations who no longer pay much in taxes, if any at all. The common person has the pretense of a "say in government", called voting, and IS still essentially a slave.

[OneViewpoint]

Hey the low population rural slave states in 1776 resorted to blackmail to grab more power for themselves because they knew a level playing field would not favor them when 75% of their population weren't even given the right to vote, Africans and women. If there was gonna be a nation, we needed the morally bankrupt states too. So the other states capitulated to their blackmail and gave them the electoral college. We've been paying for that spineless decision ever since.

[beefcakebradybatson]

They hate DEI only when it benefits POC, not goobers like them. This slavery compromise (look it up, folk;I'm going to my room to listen to the Pistons-76ers NBA clash at 7:30) is why the Red States, most of whom are far less populous than many Blue States, have disproportionate power to enact their anti-democratic agenda.

[Jersey2]

The Constitution was written by geniuses. And today morons take pot shots at it. It works as everyone’s interests are represented. Alaska has different interests than Florida, Texas, Maine or California. Greenland probably doesn’t understand how much influence they would have as a state if they joined the Union.

[Jersey2]

Oh, and we need voter ID in California and other Blue states as they cheat to high heaven. They will have fewer Electoral Votes and they won’t tilt the popular vote with their obvious cheating… and this is why they fight Voter ID laws. CHEATERS

[NaultD]

The decade census determines house of representatives distribution and EC votes. Last one was 2020 under don.

[Jersey2]

@NaultD answers like that are why no one trusts or listens to liberals. There is a real reason and then there is your BS. F off.

[DrPepper12]

Everyone interests are represented... UNEQUALLY!!!

[Jersey2]

@DrPepper12 The nation would fragment otherwise, don’t be silly. You can’t have massive numbers of farm boys fight wars to keep city soy boys safe if they don’t feel the less populated areas have their ideas represented. We are a Republic, not a pure Democracy. This fact is lost on many people and I would have thought you would know better. We also know that there is rife cheating in California and other states so it is unequal in terms of numbers anyway.

[Friendlybro79]

@Jersey2 this whole soy boy thing is so childish. I live very close to nyc and I hate soy so there pal!

Also, your farm boys need to stop making soy and collapse their entire economy if you think it's weird that people consume soy. It's one of the biggest crops farms make.

If you like conspiracies like most right wingers do, not saying you do, but if you do, then it seems like red states not only take our tax dollars to fund their states because they can't do it themselves, but they're also poisoning the city boys and turning them to soy boys!

I'm just screwing around. I just want to laugh. I'm sick of all this back and forth who's the worst shit lol

[Jersey2]

:D

[Friendlybro79]

Come to the city. You’d like it more than you think.

[Jersey2]

@Friendlybro79 I have worked in a major city downtown for decades, I get it. I saw the people living in tents, sleep tents feet from an major highway, doing laundry in a park fountain and hanging cloths on the shrubs to dry, herring the same guy give me a long winded story multiple times of why he needs money, the never moving beggars who I knew by name, the crazy guy who shouts at the world and then crosses the street to talk to you, the guy who incessantly slobbers and can’t even supposedly think but for a couple of bucks can give you directions, the hundredth guy who just needs $10 for gas to get home, the nice valet who steals you cash in your car, the city bus driver who doesn’t car that you are driving in the lane that he wants, the filthy cabs, the corrupt city government leaders such as mayor, city council and others that you know personally, so yeah, I know the city, the good, the bad, and the ugly. I am still proud of that city but see it for what it is. And perhaps surprising to you I have given money to black city council member who was amazing, an Asian city council member who was also gay, also amazing but not quite as good. I didn’t give to the mayor but she was amazing as well but naive I think and it cost someone their life because of it. Yeah, I know the city.

[Friendlybro79]

Not surprised by anything you said and I think it's great all the things you added and these are unfortunate things that big cities contend with. Some more than others. There is good bad and ugly in blue and red states. I was just commenting on your soy nonsense and trying to do so in a manner that's a little funny but also so you could think about how silly that comment is. Regarding my last come to the city. I didn't mean to insinuate, although the way I wrote it did, that you've never been to a city. Have a great day my man.

[Jersey2]

@Friendlybro79 someone I know says soy boy a lot. I said it once here, it seems a bit funny and fit. It seems to have a hit a nerve. Not intended. Have a great day.

[Friendlybro79]

You too.

[exitseven]

The government was set up like this so one big state would not get all the power. Big states get more representatives. Havinme 2 senators makes it more equal. It is not DEI.

[DrPepper12]

LMFAO!!! Must be socialism then if everyone's equal no matter what. Marxism?

Louisiana getting 13x what it puts in is merit based?

[Twalli]

It was a compromise. The senate allows equal representation for all states. The House gives states representation based on its population; that's actually how the 3/5th compromise came about.

[DrPepper12]

Doesn't mean it's wise, safe or practicable.

[Miristheiss]

Too many things being said here.

Is what true or false.

[seeyounexttuesday]

man the desperation is palpable from you wusses.

[Anonymous]

This is nonsense. The Constitution, the number of senators, and the electoral college apply equally to red and blue states.

[Massageman]

One side of Congress is by population. The other side is 2 per state.

[Pterodon]

DEI and affirmative action are. both discriminatory

[Friendlybro79]

Interesting lol

[chrissykerdock]

a man who wears a dress is pervert

[Friendlybro79]

Do you consider a kilt a dress?

[chrissykerdock]

@Friendlybro79 i'm not from there

[Anonymous]

Who knows at this point.

[jimmy2]

True it not