Did you know that the Trump Justice Dept. sides with Catholic Church to fight law requiring priests to report abuse?

[msc545]

Virtually every profession that has contact with children has a mandatory report law, except the clergy. Trump agrees with this exception apparently. Wonder why?

https://www.friendlyatheist.com/p/trump-justice-dept-sides-with-catholic?utm_source=substack&utm_medium=email

Updates

1 y

I think the priest is always free to try and convince the person to turn himself in. However, if the priest should tell anyone else what he has heard from the person confessing that is a breach of confidentiality.

Updates

1 y

I just described it to you.

[Gwendoline]

You mean the sacrament of confession being confidential between you, the priest and God?

Look at it this way, a murderer, rapist, child abuser etc isn't going to confess crimes if they think they police will be waiting for them outside the church are they? Would you?

Priests have often convinced criminals to turn themselves in to the police.

Here's a summary of what the priest did and why:

1. Initial Situation:

A criminal approached a priest, often expressing remorse or guilt about a crime they had committed.

2. Priest's Role:

The priest listened to the individual's story, offering counsel and support. In some cases, the priest may have encouraged the individual to confess their sins and seek forgiveness.

3. Convincing the Criminal:

The priest, by offering faith-based support and possibly highlighting the need for justice, convinced the criminal that turning themselves in was the best course of action.

4. Turning Himself In:

The criminal, after being convinced, decided to go to the police station and confess.

[msc545]

That is a little different than what we were talking about here. Basically what we're talking about is is legally obligating the priest to report certain or all crimes with or without the cooperation or knowledge of the person who has done the confession? As you can tell this is a different situation

[Gwendoline]

What is the situation? Do you have a better link?

[msc545]

I described the situation completely to you and the link works just fine. I don't know what you mean by a better link.

[Gwendoline]

"The state of Washington has now passed a law requiring clergy members to report child abuse to law enforcement authorities even if they happen to learn about it through the act of confession."

Again my point stands. A child isn't going to confess to being abused on confession knowing that it's not confidential between them, the priest and God. So the priest can't counsel them and encourage them to seek help from parents, police, teachers social workers and so on. A priest at my church back home helped a 15 year old girl get help when she was getting abused by her uncle, convinced her to go to the police, even went down with her. She would never have gone if she knew the priest would break the seal of confession. Nor would any child molester.
Maybe your not Catholic and don't understand what it's like to confess your sins, it's not easy, even very minor stuff.

[msc545]

you are not wrong about this, yet the same thing is imposed on mental health practitioners.

[Gwendoline]

But it's a religious thing and not a mental health thing. It also means for the mental health professional that a victim won't say anything because they can't trust that it's confidential.
Sounds like government over reach to be honest.

[msc545]

renaming doesn't change what it is.

[Gwendoline]

You lack understanding because you aren't a practicing Catholic

[ProbablyClueless]

Oooh that is a STICKY situation. That is a rough law.

Basically, there is a long standing legal precedent where members of the clergy can't be compelled to testify against people who have confessed to crimes in confession. It's the same idea as doctor-patient confidentiality.

The Washington law seeks to compel that disclosure, even if it violates that confidentiality of confession.

[msc545]

So in mental health, practitioners like myself are mandated to report all incidents of suspected child abuse to CPS or Police or some authority within 24 hours of learning of it, despite the fact that everything else we hear or do is strictly confidential.

So why not clergy as well? What I do and hear is arguably more sensitive than what goes on in confession...

[ProbablyClueless]

I'd love to learn more about the specific language of the law.

[msc545]

The one for mental health, or the one for clergy?

[ProbablyClueless]

Clergy. I've looked over a lot of the mental health disclosure laws.

[msc545]

I am not sure where you would find that, but if you do, please tell me - I too would like to read it...

[exitseven]

this is compicsted and it is a slippery slope that will result in the end of the confessional which is a big part of the Catholic church

[exitseven]

Thanks for the MHO😎

[beefcakebradybatson]

Most Repliglikswine (and lots of clerics of ALL faiths) are pervs !!!11