Do you denounce socialism?

[SolitarySolace]

Incredibly, 98 Democrats just voted AGAINST denouncing the horrors of BIG GOVERNMENT socialism.

The forced famines.
The forced jailing.
The killing fields.
Over 100 million lives lost.

It has ALWAYS made the lives of innocent people WORSE, and failed miserably EVERYWHERE it has been tried.

House Republicans made it clear: America will NEVER embrace Marxism.

Democrats refuse to say the same. - x.com/.../1991931292317888871?s=46

Yes

No

[Effably]

Whenever people pool resources to ensure things are provided, that's the basics of socialism.

In this case I am delighted to inform you that USA, and every government in the world, is socialist.

The most obvious example is basically that any country with a road is a socialist country because that is how we fund roads worldwide. You are living, and almost certainly would prefer to keep living, in a socialist society. The only difference is what extent and mix people want.

Politicians denouncing it is as sensible as employees declaring that income is evil. It might feel right, but it is not an answer or alternative. Just an empty statement.

[BCRanger10]

Yes. Socialism is Satanic.

[BCRanger10]

Thank you for MHO 🙌

[emeraldsaphire]

Socialists killed more people then fascists and Nazis did.

[Snakeyes7]

They are all socialists. They all had a death grip on how the economy worked, taxed their own citizens to death, had no concept of private property and slaughtered or quarantined anyone who spoke out.

[emeraldsaphire]

@Snakeyes7 The Nazis had some idea of private property, but it was highly controlled. I mostly agree though, Fascists, Socialist, whatever label you want to use, if you support initiating force on people, you are basically all the same thing

[loveslongnails]

Your posts are so funny. You still don't know that full blown Socialism has never existed on this planet. You still don't understand we already have a form of socialism in place in much of what we do. You just seem to throw out the word to demonize it and exalt Capitalism, no matter what, because you've bought the ruse.

And the ruse is... it's NEVER been done. LOL All your examples are of dictatorships that "posed" as Socialism but never, ever were. Yet, you keep repeating the same thing without even researching it. Why?

And while you're at it, realize that it's pure, unchecked Capitalism that has gotten the USA into the mess it's in right now. Understanding why is something else.

[goaded]

"Former CIA Officer Philip Agee explains why the US wages war on all socialist countries"

files.mastodon.online/.../dbec1ed455542f79.mp4
mastodon.online/.../115576108410406855

[loveslongnails]

@goaded Excellent videos, man! Agee is 100% spot on. Any country that can provide for their people in the areas of health care, education, general living conditions and keep them out of poverty, is a threat to the US because they won't need them.

[AyChingao]

First things first. Socialism is not Communism is not Marxism.
You should know that every nation in the world that I know anything about is a mixed economy including the USA. USA is Capitalism and Socialism combined. Socialism... ie social policies and programs are the single best solution for certain applications over capitalism.
Some of the more popular social programs here include your police, fire department, military branches, post office, mass transportation, your public roads and highways, every service provided to you by your city, county, state, or federal gov't.
Notably absent is healthcare which we should NOT be allowing some corporation with a "for profit" mission to run. They want to make money onn you when your kid needs a prcedure or med. to survive. Purely barbaric. Some of both is a good answer.

[SolitarySolace]

Well the house voted to denounce socialism and I am in agreement with that vote 🤷🏻‍♂️

[AyChingao]

The fact that a partisan House decided to declare something as evil doesn't make it so, just proves they don't like it. Scientists such as Galileo have been jailed or killed in past because some backwards official thought declating the earth round a heresy.
Guess if tyour house catches fire you'll need to show the people that put it out your reciept for "fire service" or just let it burn down. Hope your neighbor paid his because it might spread. Bad for neighborhoods. Being against certain social services is pure nonsense and contrarian as well as dangerous, as is our healthcare system on capitalism. It just is.

[emeraldsaphire]

You are right, but they can be used interchangeably. Communism is the goal of socialism. It's the idealistic utopia that socialists use to justify their barbarism. The Soviet Union was the United Soviet *Socialist* Republic. Marxism involves a lot of things like the labor theory of value and the idea of class warfare. That people with power oppress the people with out power, but one day the people with out power will rise and take over ironically becoming the people with power and oppressing the people with out power. It has many religious undertones. Which is funny because Marx called religion the opium of the masses.

I hate this new definition of socialism. Instead of socialism being the process of seizing the means of production. It' now just means government doing anything. Meaning that all governments are socialist.
We could do that with fascism too. Fascism is just working together and becoming unified. If you support team work and standardization you are a fascist. Do you realize how stupid that sounds?

Also there is nothing the government does that can't be done better by the private sector. We see this time and time again. Also we have a national healthcare system i the US. It's called Medicaid and Medicare. We've had it for decades. So when ever I here about people talking about government funded healthcare I just think we already tried that and it failed. The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results

[AyChingao]

@emeraldsaphire the thing is, the democratic socialist has no target set on even becoming a full socialism. Note also we are not talking about a social democracy, but democratic socialism. The examples everyone likes to use of disastrous socialist countries are also notably authoritarian.. dictatorships... certainly not based in democracy. The framework is much like the current nordic countries, which just so happens are rated the happiest countries in the world. In the 50's and 60's the American middle class was the envy of the world, created by FDR's new deal policies, LBJ added onto that with his great society even while botching Viet Nam. Fact is at the moment you might say we have socialism for the rich and corporations, where we the people bail them out if thety fail, thus we are taxed to sustain them while they saw and rip the programs and structure that once built a prosperous country. Where is the justice in Elon Musk recieving $8 million a day in federal subsidies while normal people are screwed to the wall with housing and education costs. By the by he is South African and got his money from daddy's emerald mine. We live in the great second age of the robber barons, another gilded age much like the 20's where the rich screw the poor literally to death with monopolies and lack of regulation. The USA is dying, and Republicans are wielding the knife.

[AyChingao]

Look at the current cost of healthcare and tell me private enterprise is doing a wonderful job. Some things are meant to be services in order to work for all the people. The oligarchs will sell you insurance, you'll pay for it monthly, have to choose a doctor from THEIR list. If your current doctor isn't on it... tough shit. They will look for every reason to deny you treatment even though you've paid faithfully for years (see UHC shareholders suing UHC for not denying enough claims. Let the oligarchs keep on. You'll be living inn Potterville from "It's a Wonderful Life"

[AyChingao]

additionally Trump just here recently wadded madicaid up and threw it into the trash, refuses to renew the ACA subsidies and was willing to keep food from 42 million people because he's a dictatorial thug,. In a country of 360 million people there are going to be needy ones, to think otherwise is patently ridiculous. You want 100% participation? impossible. Ya just gonna off the ones that can't or are between or whatever?

[emeraldsaphire]

@AyChingao the USSR was a democracy, they had elections. People like to say dictatorships are the opposite of democracy, but dictatorships are a product of democracy. The Nordic countries strongly reject the claim that they are democratic socialists. Lennon called him self a democratic socialist. If you were to talk to the Soviets they would have probably called them selves that. It's also important to note that many of those Nordic countries are rolling back many of their social programs and don't have things like a minimum wage.

And the New deal kept America in the great depression far longer then most other countries. Well other countries were starting to improve America was left behind. It wasn't until WWII that America saw any improvement, and even then the improvement wasn't that great. You'd be amazing how low unemployment gets when you send all your men to get shot. After the war if it wasn't for the fact that America was the only major industrial power that wasn't blown to smithereens we'd have gone into a depression far worse then the great depression.

[emeraldsaphire]

As for the great society and the war on poverty went. Prior to LBJ poverty in the US was shrinking. Every year America had less and less poor people, and more and more people were getting health insurance. It rates continued America would have had universal health insurance. That all changed with the great society. Since then poverty has stayed the same. LBJ created a permanent underclass. A new kind of slavery. That is what social spending gets you.

I agree with you that we shouldn't be subsidizing companies, but I have a feeling if republicans were to cut all green subsidies you'd be upset, similar to how you don't like the ACA cut. And the Medicaid budget is growing by 7.9% this year. So Medicaid isn't even being cut. It seems to me that your social spending isn't' working so instead of blaming holy government you are blaming trump for moving spending around in ways you don't like. Which by the way is how democracy works.

[AyChingao]

@emeraldsaphire I'm sorry but you're misinformed and propagandized in MANY ways. USSR... democracy? So Stalin was not an authoritarian? And what about Hitler. NO dictator wants to be called a dictator, and if you think Putin is legitimately elected each cycle then you're very gullible.
Who came after LBJ... Nixon... and what did he do? To be fair it wasn't nearly as ugly as what tRump is doing. Check and see where the GDP and wage growth start separating... W Bush. We must fix campaign finance so that people like Musk cannot spend as much money on candidates as they wish... legally. They are buying policy. Musk bought tRump the presidency this last term some people believe. I don't go for conspiracy much but he payed a boatload ro his campaign as a matter of record. Correct, scandinavians do not refer to themselves as socialists, they are democracies with MIXED ECONOMIES just like us, but they ARE heavy on programs of social uplift, unlike us. They are also among the happiest in the world, and noone is talking about seizing the means of production. Opening a state run grocery will provide much needed competition in the current environment. If grocers were not price gouging it wouldn't be necessary, however many of our consumer goods are getting far too close to monopolization including the right's increasing grip on media aided by tRump's threats and suits against people who "say things he doesn'y "like"".
Rightires complain bout big government... reign in ya damn police state then. ICE now bigger than the US Marine corps AND they got paid during the shutdown unlike air traffic controllers. Gotta keep assaulting brown people while wearing masks and no name tags... right. Buncha damn thugs and bullies. And people that support them must approve of it... disgusting

[AyChingao]

Also y'all need to stop trying to lie about not cutting medicaid. What kind of ghoulish asshole wants to revoke people's healthcare and insure that many many people will go hungry at the same stroke? Sociopath maybe?

www.texasstandard.org/.../

[Snakeyes7]

Of course I do, it has never worked and never will. Implementing a system like that cannot work without an authoritarian regime because you need something to threaten those who refuse to redistribute their wealth. There is nothing charitable about robbing people of the fruits of their labor and giving it to people who refuse to work, getting them addicted to it. VOLUNTARILY giving to charity or directly to those in need are charitable.

[Sal_Monella]

Socialism fails every time its tried. That includes the National Socialist German Workers Party.

[BadApple69]

Socialism as you have pointed out can’t work.

[beefcakebradybatson]

I vote for our democratic socialist party in provincial and federal elections.

[goaded]

No. Why do you feel the need to lie about it?

[SolitarySolace]

Lie about what? The house just voted today to denounce socialism. Denounce means to publicly declare to be wrong or evil.

[goaded]

"
The forced famines.
The forced jailing.
The killing fields.
Over 100 million lives lost."

[SolitarySolace]

I didn’t say that. The House speaker did. Pretty sure he knows what he is talking about. He is smarter than I am.

[BadApple69]

@goaded study some history

Mao
Pol pot
Jim il sung
Fidel Castro

I know what you are going to say… this isn’t socialism it’s communism. Please explain the difference.
They all started out just like this.
Mamdani in NYC (democratic socialist) wants government controlled food stores
Want to seize production
Public housing
Tax the rich and corporations.
$30 minimum wage

Now I know to the uneducated some of this sounds good. None of it is and it’s just the first step to communism.

[goaded]

@BadApple69 Not socialists, not democratic, authoritarians. The difference is democracy. Yes, Mandami wants a government option for food. Someone on here's been going on about how terrible it is that people don't eat right on food stamps, Mandami has a solution. What production is he supposed to be talking about "seizing"?

Minimum wage is a good thing, it stops working people from having to get support from the government.

[BadApple69]

Check out this video, "are there any videos about Zohran mamdani talking about seizing production"
https:/share. google03M8KVS6W5GxrJe12

[BadApple69]

@goaded I am also sure you have heard all I am going to say but we are not a democracy, We are a republic.
As for minimum wage going up, the effect it had in California was a lot of lost jobs.
Let’s take McDonalds as an example. If they had to pay every employee $30 an hour a Big Mac, fries and a soda would be $50. No one is going to pay that. So what McDonalds will do is fire 80% of the work for and automate all of the processes. They don’t do that now because labor is cheaper now hiring high schoolers, or the 20 somethings.

[goaded]

@BadApple69 Oh, not the wE ARe NoT a DemCRAcy nonsense yet again! If you can vote in free and fair elections to change your government, you're in a democracy. The word does not just mean a system where everybody votes on every decision. That would mean there isn't a democracy in the whole world.

"If they had to pay every employee $30 an hour a Big Mac, fries and a soda would be $50."
Only if they could only make one an hour and not dozens if not hundreds ("at most, it takes 180 seconds to cook a beef patty", and they don't cook them one at a time).

[BadApple69]

Are we a democracy like Canada?

[goaded]

@BadApple69 You are definitely a democracy like Germany. Just not as well thought out. The UK is a democracy, even though it's a monarchy and uses a parliamentary system, I think Canada similar, but I didn't look it up.

[Twalli]

Marxism=/=socialism. Socialism =/=communism.