In 5 years will 50 percent of men will be incels?

[Anonymous]

Yes

No

Other

[Investigator]

Before I say anything, I decided to go and find the article this video references, which can be found hereand is titled "The share of Americans not having sex has reached a record high". Sounds alarmist, but let's see what it has to say.

My single biggest issue with all of the statistics provided--such as "The portion of Americans 18 to 29 reporting no sex in the past year more than doubled between 2008 and 2018, to 23 percent" and "30 reporting no sex has nearly tripled, to 28 percent"--is that there are no baselines given.

For example, "54 percent of unemployed Americans didn’t have a steady romantic partner, compared with 32 percent among the employed." 54% of who, where? What is the sample size? What are the extenuating circumstances? Are we talking small town American with a relatively-minuscule population or a bustling metropolis with a few thousands residents? The article doesn't say, and these two communities are most definitely not remotely the same and shouldn't be treated as such.

"Jean Twenge, professor of psychology at San Diego State University and author of iGen: Why Today’s Super-Connected Kids Are Growing Up Less Rebellious, More Tolerant, Less Happy — and Completely Unprepared for Adulthood, said in an interview that growing sexlessness among America’s 20-somethings is primarily attributable to partnering up later in life." I get the feeling a lot of 20-somethings are not prepared for adulthood (I'm certainly not, but it will happen regardless), but I think that's a symptom of the problems related to no sex, not a cause. Also, it sounds like part of the research in this article is the product of universities and not an independent study group that asks casts a wide net in terms of regions and districts, so my guess is that they are using university students (which are their mostly readily-accessible focus group) as the control, which introduces a mountain of biases into the study, if that is the case.

I think this one comment from "gandhi102" is a pretty good description of the overall trend in our society and why these findings are the way they are, "Happiness is down, anxiety is up, the benefits of a robust economy are being reaped by an ever smaller group of Americans, political rhetoric is divisive and destructive, social media amplifies and give constant voice to our worst angels, everything is vulnerable to political weaponization, two generations have been the victims of abstinence and STD messages that moralize and demonize sex rather than present a positive message about human sexuality, and young people are fearful of marriage having seen so many fail. This finding is not surprising. "

Do I think we're gonna see 50% of men become incels? I surmise you are talking about American men and also referencing the oft-quoted Tinder experiment, where 80% of the men were deemed undesirable, but that's just a guess. How many men even is that? The population of America in 2019 was ~329,617,200; 50% of that is 164,808,600, and 50% of that is 82,404,300, or the combined populations of California, Texas and Florida. That's a pretty big number. Do I think 82.4 million men are going to become incels before 2030? I mean, given our upcoming election and current political... everything, it's sort of bold to assume that things don't go to complete sh*t before then. My forecast is "no, 50% of men are not going to abstain from sex unwillingly; they'd do it voluntarily, long before 5 years had past, if either dating women and/or engaging in sex becomes too much a hassle."

[thehorriblesheikh]

I think the sexless lives that young adults are living might have something to do with the rise of anti-depressant prescriptions. Perhaps, sometime around 2008, anti-depressant use arose, and anti-depressants are known to reduce your libido quite significantly.

[thehorriblesheikh]

No, and people also throw this word around quite a lot, towards anyone they dislike for pretty much any reason.

There are female incels as well, by the way. But they are more strategic with their expression of hate towards men, usually you will see these women complaining how women are so sexualized these days. The truth is that these women are insecure, and they are afraid of the competition. So, they use the idea of sexualization to manipulate women into hating the very men that give them attention. Female incels want women to give up their own freedoms, making them believe that it is the only way to be "safe from men".

Male incels think in a similar way, but they are direct about it. They complain how women are so choosy and judgmental, and on and on.

The reality is that the world is becoming more and more competitive with each passing day. Incels are an unavoidable problem. The same way when automation hits properly, jobless people are going to become the problem. Anyone who doesn't have a degree in a field that requires creativity is eventually going to be replaced by machines. Creativity is the one thing that machines are quite poor at. Engineers, many types of doctors, teachers, plumbers, electricians, masons, etc, are all going to be in some serious trouble soon.

[UncleJessieRabbit]

Am I the only one kind of getting the idea that it is our exponentially advancing and disruptive technology that will eventually be the downfall of human society, never mind money?

[Anonymous]

No, people are just generally unrealistic... a waitress working at some greasy breakfast place shouldn't expect that she will meet her rich prince and live in a castle... a guy who works in maccies is unlikely to meet a size 0 model, and get married to her...
Just because a guy has a six pack doesmt mean every girl will throw themselves at you, and just because you are a model doesn't mean every guy is going to drop their average girlfriend to date you...
People on the internet are usally those who have had a bad relationship or haven't found someone to date... sometimes you are just unlucky and are struggling, however sometimes you need to be more realistic... if you are a middle aged person who wants to settle down, should you really be trying to date 18 year olds who have just started life... BE REALISTIC

[MannMitAntworten]

I agree. Though I will note that certain young guys and young women just have a natural inclination towards the older set. That is just their preference so this segment does exist. However, this is a minority and definitely not a majority so for those of us who prefer the older or younger, the option will always exist. The tricky part is not to be dated purely because you are the trophy youth but share a genuine adoration between one another. Which even those of comparable ages can’t even seem to manage these days anymore.

[Opinion Owner]

@MannMitAntworten to be fair, this was a generalisation and there are rare cases. It is more the fact of being realistic, so like you said picking people with shared interests and people you enjoy spending time with... there seems to be too many that have high expectations when all anyone needs is someone to love and love them

[MannMitAntworten]

... and again, I agree. ;)

[Opinion Owner]

@MannMitAntworten of the rest of the world understood this, I think it would be a nicer place... even just a little bit

[MannMitAntworten]

Most definitely ;)

[SHREYASH007]

AGREED

[MzAsh]

By and large, males who are incels are unattractive in a variety of ways. They are lazy, selfish, entitled, bitter, unskilled, delusional, immature, irresponsible, with terrible attitudes and behavior. There are exceptions, of course. Most of them can change this though, by self improvement and therapy.

[chris_987]

Don’t you think it’s odd that there are group of men that women should avoid but there isn’t a female equivalent

[MzAsh]

What do you mean there isn’t a female equivalent? Men are constantly telling each other to avoid single moms, women over a certain age, a certain notch count, who don’t cook, etc. Some dating coaches swear by never dating a woman with any social media accounts or who attends girls nights. I have links if you want them.

[chris_987]

Yeah sure post them.

But single moms are like incel. They’ve at least been with one dude obviously. I’m just saying that an incel is shunned by women because he’s never had a relationship. Where as all the women you’ve mentioned are shunned because they’ve been with too many men.

And I’m not looking down at a women because she been with a lot of guys or has some other dudes child. I’m avoiding them because she has high expectations based of her previous relationships.

[MzAsh]

Women with reasonably high standards should be seen as a good thing. It means she values herself, her relationships, and will be less likely to cheat. If a woman was easy for you to get with, it will he easy for other men to get with behind your back if you’re with her too.

[chris_987]

High standards is subjective, cause a big bank and a big penis is what women refer to as high standards, and that’s says more about there personality than anything else

[MzAsh]

Yes there are a lot of women out there who are just novices in dating and long term relationships. Standards in regards to looks, money, and status are just a bonus. Real standards involving character, attitude, and behavior are what women should be qualifying for.

[chris_987]

What percentage of women act like that, probably more than half

[MzAsh]

That’s why I do the work that I do. To help women properly qualify a man.

[chris_987]

The work you do? Do you really think women should be qualifying men women they literally do nothing to get men.

[MzAsh]

What particularly do you think women should do to get men that they aren’t doing now?

[chris_987]

Show interest treat us like we’re equal and if we’re not equal then appreciate us and don’t act like your entitled to love from men, cause if you do men will just sleep with women instead of having relationships with you. And I’m you don’t want that

[MzAsh]

That sounds reasonable. I’m sure you’ll find someone who does that someday.

[chris_987]

I doubt it, girls don’t think it’s there job to talk to me. And I don’t think the same way so that life.

[MzAsh]

Do you ever approach them?

[chris_987]

Can you give me a reason why you feel I should approach women while women don’t have to approach me.

[MzAsh]

I didn’t say you should. I asked you if you ever do. Do you?

[chris_987]

Nope definitely not, but only because women don’t either

[MzAsh]

Then you’re the one playing games. You can’t expect to be successful with women with that attitude.

[chris_987]

Do you tell that to women? That don’t approach men? Or do you think that it’s the guys job, if so tell me why

[MzAsh]

I tell them it’s an option but most of them are too busy weeding through all the men who *have* approached them. I help them separate the boys from the men.

[chris_987]

Yeah that why you don’t get it, you where quick to say bad stuff about incels but a guy has to do is not approach girls and that makes him an incel. So you can act like girls are so important and teach them whatever you want but if guys don’t see the point of chasing after girls then your not gonna help anyone out

[MzAsh]

If you have this petty attitude like “well girls don’t approach so I’m not going to approach them” and nothing happens as a result of that attitude, that doesn’t make you an incel, sweetie. That makes you immature.

[chris_987]

But you never explain to me why not approaching girls makes me immature but when a girl say she shouldn’t have approach guys, you don’t think she immature. Can you answer that.

[MzAsh]

It’s not that you aren’t approaching girls, it’s because you’re acting out of spite. Most women don’t need to approach because they have their hands full with men who already have approached.

[chris_987]

It’s not out of spite, I just be told that men are supposed to approach women but I’ve never been told why. You said you teach women how to qualify men but what makes them worthy of being put in that position to qualify men? Are women the prize?

[MzAsh]

Most men prefer to approach and most women prefer to be approached. I also help women become better women as well.

[chris_987]

You know what I think, I think you’re incapable of helping anyone with any real problems because you put men a box where there supposed live up to your standards and when someone ask why should men do the things you say, you call them immature because you really don’t think men should question what you think. So the fact that you think your qualified to tell women how to treat men is comical. But that just my opinion.

[MzAsh]

You can’t help someone who doesn’t want to help themselves. You can’t sit on GAG all day and expect women to fall in your lap. You’ve got to get off your ass and do something to make it happen. I know that’s not advice you want to hear but it’s advice you need to hear.

[chris_987]

I can’t expect women to fall into my lap but yet your completely ok with it the other way around? I’m just saying you aren’t really mental competent to have a deep conversation about why men need to pursue women. But then you do think I’m dumb and immature so guess that’s your excuse

[MzAsh]

Women naturally have more options. I’m not saying it’s fair. It’s just the way it is. I don’t think you’re dumb but you do need to stop blame shifting. This is the kinda thing that will destroy any relationship you try to have. You’re not ready.

[chris_987]

So I ask why things are the way the are and your only answers is shut up and play by the rules. Ok I see why you think your good at giving advice.

[MzAsh]

I didn’t say shut up and play by the rules nor did I call you dumb. Now you’re making things up.

[chris_987]

The fact is say it is the way things are, is a clear sign that your not deep thinker. You only see the surface of things so that way it odd that you feel qualified to give people advice

[MzAsh]

I’ve done the research. It’s part of biology that most men prefer to pursue and most women prefer to be pursued. I’m not saying you have to abide by that. Just don’t complain when you don’t do anything to improve your odds as success. And don’t call yourself an incel because you’re not one.

[chris_987]

Ok no problem

[Kaazsz]

I think the men you have described are a very small minority of vocal men. The overwhelming majority of men who fit into the category of incel do not fit the criteria you have just listed. It’s just that you don’t know about the larger Majority because they don’t say anything out loud.

Or do you believe that for a man to be an incel in the first place he must necessarily possess the qualities you listed? If so I’d say this is also wrong.

I think women have a knee jerk reaction to incels because it says something about women. For there to be an incel population there are two options:

Men as a whole are degrading in attractiveness for x y and z reasons or:

Society is becoming much more free and so therefore our animal sexual nature is being expressed as it was when we were monkeys. Implying that females only wish to mate with a small percentage of men and as time goes on a majority of men will become incels.

And when that happens, women will have plenty of excuse to throw at those incel men, saying they posses bad qualities, rather than acknowledging that it’s simply evolutionary biology, the female nature is to exclude most males from the reproductive pool.

I don’t know which one is the truth. Or maybe some combination. But I don’t think anyone is capable of an honest conversation.

[Kaazsz]

Also as far as your description of incel men, I know plenty of women who possess those same qualities. But that never affects a woman’s reproductive success. That never affects a woman’s chances to date and find love.

I have a female friend whose teeth are black and rotting. Her breath smells like she stores fresh turds in her cheeks. This is not a joke. She’s hideous and obese and she knows it. She has 4 kids from 3 different men and she doesn’t take care of ang of them and they live with her family. She’s a deadbeat mother who lives on welfare.

Yet I see this same girl go through boyfriends left and right. She’s always got a new one every few months. She’s the epitome of disgusting and unattractive human being.

I know other women of similar quality with varying levels of attractiveness. I know tons of women who are nothing but lazy worthless bums but they are showered with love and affection for their entire lives.

To say that men who are incels are somehow lesser men implies that women must be above those few men at the bottom. But they aren’t. I know tons of girls who are exactly as you described incel men.

They don’t suffer as a consequence though. And incel men don’t deserve to be isolated and hated on. They suffer for being rejected and isolated in a way that women do not. We don’t hate women who are discriminated in the world but we hate men who are descriminated against and we justify it further and further.

[MzAsh]

An incel is a man who can’t get laid. And 9 times out of 10, he can’t get laid because he’s highly undesirable to women. This usually doesn’t apply to women because men are vying for sex at a much faster and frequent pace than women are.

Chris here wants women to approach him. But he’s simply not desirable enough yet for women to approach him.

[MzAsh]

I believe if he actually did approach women, he could get one to overlook his poor reasoning skills although that would prove to be a problem longer term.

[Kaazsz]

That’s not true at all. I can use myself as an example. I can’t say I’m an incel but depending on how you define it I have been in my past. I’d say you’re an incel if you want sex but haven’t had sex for 1+ years.

I’m 34 now and I’ve had stretches of no sex for 4-6 years in different periods of my life.

I believed I was a worthless piece of shit. I believed women were disgusted by me.

The truth is that I have come to realize later in life is that I’m attractive. I have model tier looks. I’m tall. My voice is super deep. I have braid shoulders, I’m a large man.

Girls and women have been throwing themselves at me my whole life. I simply didn’t recognize it because of my abused childhood. I didn’t have friends until I was an adult. I was bullied by other men even into adulthood because I was a shy person.

Little did I know that girls were having silent crushes on me the whole time. But my shitty life made me believe I was scum and I was blind to the girls literally there owing themselves at me.

And I’ve known other guys like me. Maybe not as attractive as I am. One friend I had was a short guy. And he felt so bad about being short. Meanwhile cute girls were all over him and it was like he was blind or something. He also had a six pack and we lifted weights together every day, he was a jacked little Manlet and the girls loved him. He was a hard working intelligent guy with a bright future but he was a Virgin at 22 he never even kissed a girl.

[Kaazsz]

When you think about incels you think about those broken men on the internet who have suffered for many years and become jaded and lose their minds. They are the psychologically damaged minority. Many of them who were once upon a time perfectly good and decent guys who probably had female admirers in their life.

Remember that guy who wanted to kill a bunch of girls? I forget his name he was the most infamous incel.

The guy was good looking. I’m sure girls even liked him in his life. Yet he viewed women on a way that I did growing up. I believed I was unattractive and it fucked me up and obviously fucked him up worse.

The root cause, I don’t know. I have been trying to figure it out for a long time. I’ve come a long way myself. Girls love me now and I love women. They treat me great but half of it is just because I’m a big handsome teddy bear to them.

Personally I want to understand WTF is going on that so many decent men are feeling so bad and are having trouble finding dates, sex and love. It’s a big problem.

The explanation you gave in my opinion is wrong. That’s your perspective on a small minority of broken people who have gone through many stages falling through an ever increasingly wide tunnel of despair. When they come out the other end they join incel groups on the internet. And that wretched form of broken men is the only view of incels that you have. That is the end stage. That is the fully destroyed male on the extreme end of the spectrum.

Most incels are perfectly normal dateable guys. But something is missing and I don’t know what it is. I don’t know the causes. It’s something I think about a lot. I’m just trying to figure it out.

[MzAsh]

If you’re referring to Elliot Rodger, he was a decent looking kid but insanely spoiled by his rich family so he adopted an entitled attitude. He was socially awkward as well. I believe his flawed personality and unappealing attitude and behavior was why he wasn’t getting what he wanted. He was only 22. He still had a lot of inner work to do to become the high value man women actually want to be with.

[Kaazsz]

It seems to me that the majority of men are not the high quality men women truly wish to be with.

Can you define a high value man?

I’ll give you my own view on it so I can see the difference between our views on what makes a man high value.

In my mind a high value man is simply a good man, who loves and respects women. He values you for who you are. He treats women with respect,
Meaning he respects a woman’s boundaries and self autonomy. He is proud of women when they do good, whether it’s career or child rearing or anything else she does. A high value man sees the good things in women and strives to treat all women as human beings who deserve to live their own lives. A high value man sees the values a woman embraces and praises her for taking pride in her value systems.

I don’t think most men fit that criteria. I think most men view women as sex objects and we really don’t give a shit what you think about anything. Many men feel that women are automatically inferior to men. I think most men do not care if a woman has values, goals, dreams. Most men don’t care what a woman believes or what women want to do with their own lives.

If you ask me most men are not high value in that sense.

But also if you were to ask me about those men who I have known in my life who were the closest to incels? They did love and respect women. They were happy and proud to see the girls in their lives do well.

But they remained constantly alone and rejected while low value men who see women as nothing more than dogs get all the love. And that turns those men into jaded hateful monsters who turn to hate and violence against women.

Well that’s how it looks to me. I’ve known plenty of decent dudes who were chronically alone. Good guys who treated girls well and they were ignored, while guys that girls cry about and vocally hate continue to receive their love and affection.

[Kaazsz]

Once upon a time I worked with a ton of women. I learned a lot. I learned that they fall in love with abusive men and those men are the epitome of love. But they only choose to not date more men like that because they don’t want to be abused anymore, even though those are the men they have the greatest feelings for over and over and over again.

And again and again they say how they meet a great guy but they feel no love or lust for him.

So what is a woman’s true view in a high value man?

[MzAsh]

If you asked me what a high value man is, I’d say he’s a man who has his shit together: good job, his own roof, no debt, no addiction problems, no criminal record, good looks (healthy and fit, dressed well) good attitude, polite, respectful, agreeable, loyal, honest, good sense of humor, confident, responsible, virtuous, good conversationalist. He is highly skilled in how to manage healthy, long lasting relationships including with family, friends, coworkers, and women. I also agree with everything you said. No, the majority of men aren’t high value. Regardless, even if a man is all these things, he should know that nothing is promised. You cannot expect anything, even if all of these positive things apply to you. Relationships also depend on chemistry and connection. Even if you have all the high value qualities, it doesn’t necessarily mean that you will connect well with everyone you want.
You also have to understand that there are also low value women. Only low value women tolerate abusive men. You don’t really want those women even if you are attracted to them. They’ll only contribute to toxic relationships.

[Kaazsz]

I wish I could agree but those are standards you only discover after very very much experience. Most girls do not have those standards. Most women are on that level. Maybe you are, but most girls are fucking around with bums. And most women are bums. I mean hey I don’t know any female doctors. But I know a lot of nurses and women in the medical field. I know fast food workers and bank tellers.

All of these girls go for men that are braindead. I know a ton of girls I have a lot of female friends. And because of it I get these fucking dudes trying to buddy buddy with me. Talking about football and beer and call of duty and football and beer and call of duty and... lol.

And I’m super honest. I tell them I don’t give a shit about those things. I tell them I don’t give a fuck about making friends I tell them the truth and these dudes just harass me and won’t stop trying to talk to me and be my friend.

But I also see most girls fawning over these guys that are worthless bums. And I see the girls having babies with these dudes and then they dump these dudes and raise the baby by themself cuz all the guy does is fuckin play call of duty all day.

[MzAsh]

Of course there are always exceptions. Dumb girls going after less than average guys. Relationships like those won’t last unless the chick is also at his level. Then through just suck together lol

[Kaazsz]

So obviously the majority of my female friends are single mothers.

I don’t think girls have very high standards for men at all. I think you only develop standards after you fuck up and mess around with these bums.

I still don’t know why incels are the ones who end up lonely and alone. I think it’s because they just aren’t masculine enough. Some men take in the message that masculinity is bad, and that ruins their dating success with women.

Maybe it’s for the better. They don’t end up a video game playing player with kids with multiple women sending them all child support checks lol.

The standards you listed are great and I agree those are some good things. I guess there must be some men who are on that level? Or maybe not? I really don’t know. I mean I see great guys who struggle with women who in my mind would be good on most of those points, but not as good at showing that masculine confidence because they believe masculinity is bad lol.

[Chthou95]

The way you think is why more guys will become incels

[MzAsh]

Women could definitely stand to have higher standards in regards to a man’s personality, attitude, and behavior. That’s why most of their relationships only last a couple years at best. Because they get with guys who for various reason, just don’t have what it takes for long term.
Also, masculinity can be great, but it can also be very poisonous, depending on how it’s used.

[Chthou95]

What makes it long term? Physical attributes right?

[Kaazsz]

As nice as it is to have a list of standards, us men know that those standards are not what bring us success in dating sex and love. If it did I think we would strive to achieve those goals.

But we know through experience that women go for men who are the complete opposite of said list. And you’re saying those are immature women. That’s literally the overwhelming majority of women.

If women actually demanded the standards you described, you would see men become those things. But we as men all see very clearly that those things do not bring you a girlfriend.

If that’s what women want I’m not seeing it. And as far as that list goes, it’s funny because many guys I’ve known fit the criteria very well actually, almost to a T. This really brings me back to the debate I keep seeing on here. The things women say vs the actual things women do.

I think a lot of guys wish that it was the truth. That being those things you described would bring them a girlfriend or a wife. But it doesn’t. In reality women are choosing men on a completely different set of criteria. Maybe that is women’s fantasy when you ask them. But that’s not the reality expressed. I don’t think so anyways.

[Kaazsz]

I love feminist forums for this reason. I read a variety of feminist forums and follow feminist subreddits. And the women tell their stories over and over and over again.

They fall in love with assholes and bums. Pieces of shit left right and center. After years and years of heartbreaks they finally decide to shape up their standards and go for a “real man.”

So that’s what we see. We see girls going for scumbags and so we give up. Or we try to become the scumbag so we can get some love from women too.

By the time you shape up your standards all the decent men have been married up by some girl who didn’t just fall in love with playboys for the first 10 years of her dating life.

[Kaazsz]

I think the truth at the end of the day is women are just like men.

Men have to realize that looks aren’t everything at some point. A guy dates a bunch of beautiful women and they are just awful. He gets a bit older and realizes that looks don’t do shit and he has to have standards for the women he dates.

The same goes for women. Women are attracted to masculine aggressive dominant men and they have their hearts broken over and over and over and eventually they decide to let go of me masculine dominant, and to settle for a man who is less than perfect in attraction (masculinity and dominance) and to seek out a good man who treats her well who has the other qualities you mentioned.

Having standards comes with experience and maturity. Women are not attracted baseline to good qualities and maturity. Women are attracted to dominance aggression and masculinity.

I feel the problem with men is we have internalized the societal pressure of not being masculine. We have learned to hate ourselves and we hate women when we realize that what they want is what society told us not to be.

[Kaazsz]

I think what incels really need is to escape their brainwashing and hatred for masculinity.

I also think as a whole men need to respect women more. Maybe that’s just me. But in my view a loooot of men view women as inferior. And I think that’s sad. I honestly love women. But maybe that’s just because they are so nice to me I don’t know.

I think a lot of incels are the guys who respected women once upon a time. And we’re lost as to why girls didn’t like them at all. They become jaded and hateful. But the reason that women don’t like them is they lack connection with their masculine nature.

And society keeps lying and you women keep lying to us. You keep saying it’s these criteria and these standards! That’s a lie because in my mind and you agreed, most men are not meeting them. Most men it seems to me really disrespect women and look down on you and think of you as lesser and I think that’s awful. Women are great I love girls even the scummy ones who are worthless bums. I still love them.

So I think on one hand men need to respect women and love women. On the other hand men need to reconnect with their masculinity and stop listening to feminists and suppressing their male nature to appease society because appeasing society makes you unattractive to women. And it makes you hate yourself and it makes you crazy.

That’s what I think.

[Kaazsz]

But I think you are also right in some ways. A lot of guys don’t try. They don’t look their best, they just don’t try.

Part of that is they just don’t know how to try. I’ve seen so many guys post up pics on forums or reddit, asking “why don’t girls like me?” The guy is handsome except he wears clothes that look like his mom bought them and ugly glasses and he looks like a bum. But under the bum exterior is a good looking man who is a good ad kind respectful man.

A lot of men are lost and don’t know what to do. As much as it’s fun to look at incels and talk shit about them. There’s definitely a factor where a lot of men simply don’t know what to do.

And the replies are usually really good to that guy’s post. “Bro you’re clearly handsome but it’s hidden beneath these awful clothes and blah blah blah.” And the guy replies saying he never realized how bad it was. How bummy and silly he looked.

We keep telling men it’s all about personality and that the right one for you will come alone and just be yourself. And they just don’t know wtf they are doing.

So there’s definitely people who just need a little bit of polish and they go from a turd to a diamond and develop confidence because of it.

I think in a way a lot of men are suppressed. That guy who looks like his mom dressed him, he sees girls gong for assholes and so he rejects that shit. He doesn’t want to spend all day on his looks and he doesn’t want to become this player he sees them as scumbags. So in that sense he rejects all the things he needs to be attractive thinking that just being a good dude is all he needs. So in that sense a lot of guys need some work. But to imply that a man is an incel because he’s just this bad shitty broken person is wrong. Most incels are not that. That broken shitty person is the destiny of a man who doesn’t understand what it takes to become attractive to women. Sometimes you’re just that lost that you didn’t know you should like... have some style in your clothes lol.

[MzAsh]

You’re saying women go for the opposite of what I described. I’m saying it’s only the low value and/or foolish women that do that. Smart and/or high value women don’t bother with low value men. Come up from the boiler room once in a while to see how happily married people are running things on top.

[Kaazsz]

divorce rates are extremely high and among married people dissatisfaction rates are even higher than divorce rates. I learned in psychology class.
It’s like 50+% divorce rate, and like 80% rate of those who stay married are in unhappy marriages. I don’t think marriage really says much it’s honestly in a very bad spot for the overwhelming majority of people.

I guess there must be some small lucky
Minority that has great marriages.

[MzAsh]

I’m well aware of the statistics (and how divorce rates are actually on the decline). That doesn’t have to do with my last statement as I referred to happily married couples.

[Chthou95]

Extremely rare now in days

[thehorriblesheikh]

I am going to simplify this debate for everyone, and that includes men who are considered incels.

In my experience, I get chased by women because I try and dress in a cool way, which in a sense makes me similar to the popular guy, I guess. So, it's like an aesthetic thing. I see it as a cultural requirement, which isn't necessarily a requirement.

When it comes to sex, women are interested in how sexy your body looks, that's all. You just need to get a wide chest, wide shoulders and decent arms.

When it comes to relationships, women care about how empathetic you are. Half the times, women will want you to have a sexy body as well.

I think a lot of the girls do have a sense of style, a lot of the girls also have naturally sexy bodies, and a lot of the girls are quite empathetic as well. That's all they want in a man as well. This doesn't apply to every woman though, of course.

Some women want a man to be intelligent, and I want a woman who is intelligent as well. So, that's an extra requirement on my part, and some women's part.

As for horrible women being able to get laid, I blame the men more for this because most men I come across say they just want a hole to fuck 🤷🏻‍♂️

[Froyologirl]

I mean to be fair you can say the same for women.

[Levin]

@chris_987 "I can’t expect women to fall into my lap but yet your completely ok with it the other way around? I’m just saying you aren’t really mental competent to have a deep conversation about why men need to pursue women. But then you do think I’m dumb and immature so guess that’s your excuse "

I think there's a biological aspect to this. It's just the nature of the game. Willingness to approach indicates self belief, confidence, relaxation. All things that are indicative of good genes and someone she might like to 'mate' with. Don't get me wrong, I don't get too caught up in a Darwinian conception of our own existence, but it's a facet that makes things interesting and challenging. You could see it another way, if you're content with your lot, have made a life for yourself, then it should be quite easy to approach people because you have that confidence. Things happen naturally when you're relaxed and creatively making a life for yourself. Women have to weed out the wheat from the chaff. It's not necessarily beneficial to have a lot of suitors because there's a lot of men they simply won't want to date. Approaching indicates interest. But as I say, it should never be too difficult since hopefully there are natural opportunities in life that can be taken. But if you're doing cold approaches on anight out or something, then obviously that's more challenging. But still needn't be hugely difficult provided one doesn't force things and takes opportunities when they arise. If your mindset is, I must approach this woman, then you're just going to be miserable. It is disappointing that this 'love' could not be more pure and unconditional, but it's for your own self development. You want to be independent, too. Never to rise and fall by a woman. As they say, don't hate your own challenges and shortcomings, because they are what have the power to transform you.

[NatalieKeller95]

@chris_987 what if the reason he didn't have a relationship was because he didn't find anyone yet, not because it was any fault of his own

[NatalieKeller95]

@Kaazsz we were never monkeys you fucking heretic evolution is false

[NatalieKeller95]

@Kaazsz incels are part of the autism spectrum

[Kaazsz]

@NatalieKeller95 You look like a hot 55 year old woman... lol

[Account]

I hope at least they are vocal about it in order to know who to avoid.

[navyrobin]

Hahahaha

[Turrorrr]

It has to do with two things in my opinion:
- first is that society pressure towards sex has skyrocketed. every male considers he should have sex with a beautiful women in order to feel satisfied towards society's standards. you can see movies and instagram are full of this subliminal messages that all normal males have sex with beautiful women which in past was only present directly in male colleagues' fake stories. however, today you can see cute girls from your high school getting extremely popular on instagram and this can make normal male colleagues frustrated. now they have to compete with potentially thousands of other males for this one cute colleague. This one cute colleague than might get overwhelmed over such interest into her and might become totally uninterested towards men, liking attention from then more than an actual relationship.
same can also drive other not so cute girls crazy because it causes lack of self cautiosness and asociality which is a turn off for a lot of guys and also weakens their chance of actually meeting some guys.
- second is that we are not satisfied with small anymore. we want as best as we can find. this shopping behaviour has translated into sexuallity way over the edge. we started considered each other as brands, and too much objectify each other. especially each other's looks and body, because this is the simplest. we don't shop in the nearby expensive store anymore, we have amazon and ebay where you can get triple the stuff for the same price. and the same feeling translates to people. we don't look at people we know anymore. we are sire there is a prince/princess waiting for us and is easy on the reach. just open your tinder or instagram and you can find one in a few minutes. and this delusion is killing both, men and women. with men having standards a bit lower, because of bigger libido and society pressure.

[bradc00]

Incel = Involuntary celibate a. k. a. “guy who can’t get laid and it’s not his fault, but it’s instead due to things outside of his control”(genetics, childhood, etc).


I think 95% of guys who call themselves Incels can’t get laid, but not due to involuntary reasons. Nearly all of them choose not to voluntarily put in the work to become attractive women.


It’s true that some guys just got lucky in life and we’re born into the top 10-20% of attractive guys. But most guys weren’t. And you gotta of what you can with the hands you were dealt.


As a guy, no matter what hand you were dealt in life, you can always improve yourself. You can significantly improve your health by working out and eating properly which will reflect in your appearance. You can significantly improve your financial situation by being smarter with your money and working hard. You can improve your social skills by interacting with people and experimenting with rejection and embarrassment to become more charismatic. And through the process of doing these things you ultimately build a character that you and other men respect, and the women are attracted to.


You’d have to be in like the bottom 3% of men who are ugly as shit and mentally/physically disabled to not be able to possibly get laid. Stop making excuses by calling yourself an “Incel”.


No, I don’t think 50% of men will be incels in 5 years.

[NatalieKeller95]

wait so all autistic guys can't get laid, no matter the severity of their condition?

[NatalieKeller95]

is high functioning autism in the bottom 3%?

[djmzes]

Simple

Both genders have shit.
Men have shit, women have shit. Both are responsible for it.

Some men shit more than women and some women shit more than men.

You just have to choose on what category you belong and how much you shit, and how much you can avoid shitting to make it worse.

[Liam_Hayden]

No. There are very few true InCels. 99.5% of so-called InCels are just unrealistic in their expectations. If you are a fry cook at McD's then you should probably realistically look at the cashier at McD's not the Insta-THOT who is pulling down $500K or more per year and who gets attention from a million guys. If you are sloppy and overweight, the pretty girl you see running each morning is probably not going to be interested, either.

[Sonorous]

People claim they're incels when (by definition) they really aren't. But there may be 50 percent of males claiming they are if all this misinformation keeps getting spread.

Side note: I recommend watching "Thinking ape" (Stardusk) videos instead of Sandman's. They're more accurate and reasonable in my opinion.
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCo1qRcO1OehgkOD_fHsu_uQ

[Sonorous]

Here's a video from 5 years ago that's still relevant today regarding both channels objectives
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wGMTCJWN0VE

[sweettoothg]

Since when did people start using this term? And a lot of y’all came on this app out of no I had to search up what it meant loll. By looking at some of these “incel” posts on here, a lot of you seem miserable in my opinion. Lack of confidence. They want women to rate men that “looks” a little like them and if some women don’t find them attractive, those incels start disrespecting women in every possible way. Some have really shitty personality, they’re to quick to blame others but themselves.

[chris_987]

I know it’s sad when men start acting like women

[ct1243]

Exactly it’s a lot of incel behavior on here. The word was actually used on YouTube by a group of males such as MGTOW and SYSBM

[chris_987]

Lol you just called women less than men and men greater than women with out even realizing it

[sweettoothg]

Really? I can’t believe I’m just hearing that word now. I just searched up those groups And wow in speechless @ct1243

[sweettoothg]

@chris_987 what? How?

[ct1243]

Yep I didn’t know a word existed until YouTube @sweetttothg now that women are doing them these guys are pissed and desperate

[chris_987]

You said they lack confidence and are always wondering how they look. Which is what girls do on this site. So you simultaneously put down women by saying men acting like women are the worst.

[sweettoothg]

@chris_987 yeah but most of the time they don’t disrespect these men. Either way they’re all seeking approval

[nikooo0ooo]

here in russia we fight to the death for the last piece of bison leg

[ct1243]

Good thing I’m on the other side of the fence 🌈

[Asker]

Yeah i'm scared to have a son.

[ct1243]

Why?

[Asker]

I don't my son to end up an Incel. I'd rather a daughter at least i know she'll be able to pass on my genetics.

[ct1243]

Yes a lot of guys now a days are incels I’m happier with women

[Celtero]

Meh, I don't really believe in "incels." You go on those forums and it's mostly young men in their late teens/early twenties freaking out because they're too awkward to have lost their virginity yet.

And "inceldom" is certainly a wild falsity when sex is a commodity that can be bought and sold.

[Unit1]

I think right now it's 50% and it's probably running rampant anyway.
Desperate times call for desperate measures.

[winterfox10]

Probably not... I think women are starting to get the distinct vibe that reasonable, not pathetic men are also taking issue with their behavior and feminism in general. I'm not sure that they actually know what the issue is yet. But, there seems to be a lot of women who are looking at their real life results, comparing that with what they have been taught should happen, and seeing a pretty major disconnect (and to their credit, wondering why that is).

[RingOfFire]

I had enough sex in my life for my next 3 reincarnations. As much as I still want it, other things in a relationship have taken on an equal importance to me. So I have not had sex with anyone in some time, and don't plan to until I love a woman. I'm a born again virgin. 😎

[The_unknown_memer]

Well I guess straight women have to start practicing being lesbian. Actually there is no such thing as straight women so it will be easy for them

the government will have to cage all those men or create sex bots

Or we are gonna have to eradicate 50 percent of those men.

[Yaaten]

What on Earth are you babbling on about?

[Korbzilla]

Fuck no! Most men still have at least something that, in a way, resembles a spine.

Bunch of spineless punks. If no woman wouldn't want to have something to do with me, I'd ask myself what I'm doing wrong and work it out.

And to all incels who read this. Do it like our earliest ancestors, grow a fucking spine and evolve into something that at least looks like an adult man, you insecure schmucks.

[nerdybutlazy]

What's with the sudden increase of incel activity on here

[chris_987]

What the female equivalent of an incel

[nerdybutlazy]

@chris_987 A female incel? Like there are whole groups of them online.

[chris_987]

I’ve never heard a guy call a girl who he disagree with an incel. So it not a thing, cause girl call Guys incel all them time as a diss. Which proves that girls only respect men who has slept with other women. No guy makes fun of a girl buy saying she must be virgin that why she’s upset.

[nerdybutlazy]

@chris_987 I've never heard a woman say that sir,

[chris_987]

Why would a women call a guy and incel?

[Sweetheart666]

@chris_987 a nun?

[UncleJessieRabbit]

Well, everyone throwing around the term in a derisive way for any men who say they are having problems in the relationships and dating area isn't helping it improve either.

[igravenbunny]

Yes. Estrogen levels are on the increase.
This results in complete fucking garbage lesbian men lmao. Weak, shy, pathetic.

[DavidFox]

Why are estrogen levels on the rise?

[igravenbunny]

@DavidFox shit water & food.

[DavidFox]

That’s too bad. Last I checked women want real guys, not effeminate weaklings

[Bananaman177]

That's fucked up, poison a whole generation of babies and then reject them as adults because they're sick.

Pretty sure you'd go to Hell for being that vicious and cruel.

[Anonymous]

I don't know if it'll be 50% that seems a bit high lol. But as long as society remains to be obsessed with equality the worse it's going to get. Women just don't need guys like they used to. First they fight the men for their livilihood. Then they judge him for what he doesn't have. So women look for a guy who makes even more ( take a look at dating sites it's not unusual for a woman to expect a guy with a 6 figure income anymore

[Don-_-Don]

If that becomes true then we're doing something wrong as the human race.

[MountAverage]

Who seriously believes such insane nonsense other than these insane incels themselves?

[Anonymous]

No incels are mentally ill people with severe self-esteem issues, BDD and other mental problems that have an unrealistic view of society.
Fortunately the majority of people isn't like that yet..