Would it be a red flag to date a guy who doesn't like/believe in feminism?

[Anonymous]

He doesn't like it at all. I would say I'm a little bit a feminist. Not full blown but I don't want to get stuck with a misogynistic dude. I told him that I like Susan b Anthony stuff where she fought for the womens right to vote. He told me that he thinks that women shouldn't have won the right to vote at all and he's against that. That disturbed and upset me combined. I found this out after I told him I am interested in a relationship with him but I'm like extremely uncomfortable and I feel weird. Now I know he feels that way, I feel stuck. Like I told him I'm down for a relationship and now I found this out and I feel afraid of him like he may be a crazy person. It's weird I feel depressed for some reason and I have no idea why I am suddenly depressed lol.

Updates

3 mo

Also let me add that I am traditional. But I just don't want to get into a relationship with a guy who doesn't respect me.

Updates

3 mo

So I talked to him about it. He says he believes in being against women having the right to vote not because he hates women. He thinks that the people who fight for the country should more have an opinion when it comes to voting, since women don't have to fight in wars. He said that he's not against it where he would talk me out of voting he said I can do whatever I want he doesn't care. He said he's religious coming from a mentality of how it used to be. He doesn't believe in evolution either.

[dynamicyandere]

There’s equal rights and equal respect between both men and woman. That’s the kind of feminism that all people should stand behind.


But there’s also misandrists that label themselves as feminists, and instead of equality, they are promoting hate against men and preaching male inferiority and female superiority.


Most men don’t have a problem with respecting women equally.


But most men have a problem with hatred towards their gender.


As for your guy… Based on what you wrote about this him, it sounds like he’s even against gender equality.


And that’s a red flag.


He sounds like a blatant misogynist and I’d stop seeing him if I were you.

[Asker]

We talked more and he was saying that he believes men should be number one and women should be second class citizens. Just wanted to let everyone know I ended it with him.

[dynamicyandere]

Damn. Well, you dodged a bullet there. He sounded very problematic and brainwashed. Glad you got out of that situation. Kudos to you for looking out for yourself. 🥂

[IceCreamSandwich]

It is totally reasonable to change your mind and revoke your being open to a relationship with him in this situation. When you said that, you assumed he respected you as a person. Finding out he doesn't believe you should have rights is a very serious change. He may not respect that you see that as a deal breaker, but I believe most people would absolutely be on your side that "they think I should not be allowed to vote" is a perfectly reasonable deal breaker to have—even if they personally don't see it as a deal breaker.

[IceCreamSandwich]

I guess he didn't put 2 and 2 together that men are the ones who said that men and only men have to fight in wars and be drafted?

Has he been drafted?

Look do whatever you want but he effectively just said "I wouldn't personally stop you from voting, I just thing the government should stop all women including you from voting."

If it was really about who served their country then he would believe only veterans should be able to vote.

[Asker]

I did mention that to him, what you said about men are the ones who say women shouldn't fight in wars. He basically didn't care. He was saying all men in general should only be allowed to vote because they are the ones who'll be drafted, if a war does happen even if they're not serving in the military.

He also said something about how it would help the judicial system if only men voted and it would benefit politics.

[blueonblack22]

Quite the contrary you should take it as a red flag if he said he supported feminism.

Before you get all defensive let me explain. There are three kinds of men who would insane enough to “support” modern feminism. Also it’s possible to be pro female empowerment without calling yourself a “feminist” Reason being is feminism today NOT about equality but is instead about “equity”.

The “equity” concept uses baby algebra to determine the “wage gape” by not taking into account the fact men and women voluntarily pursue different career paths and some are more lucrative than others. The concept of “equity” is subjectively one sided and fixates on struggles one side has (sexual harassment) while completely ignoring the other sides issues (4x suicide rates, most homeless people are men, etc). Before I go any further down the rabbit hole let me explain I really want women to have a fair chance and succeed but I absolutely hate modern feminism’s approach to this.

Anyway as for “male feminists” there are three types:

1. Sociopathic men who pay outward lip service to feminism thinking it will get them cherished by women and laid. But deep down they actually see women as objects.

You see this hypocritical bullshit in Hollywood and politics. Do you know at one time Harvey Weinstein was considered pro “feminist”? He’s the one who produced kill bill. He spoke highly of women during interviews.

Also former NY governor Andrew Cuomo was supposedly “pro feminist” then it later came out he was an absolute abusive creep towards women.

2. Sneaky beta male types.

These guys are similar to number 1 but they usually lack the societal prominence. But they will have no problem whatsoever being one of your “friends” but they will pay you all sorts of lip service. But they have one agenda: to get in your pants. They might get it once in a blue moon by domineering women who like submissive men. But it rarely works out for them and deep down they hate themselves but are too weak to change.

3. Men who were brainwashed from a young age to hate “men”.

This often happens with boys who were raised by single mothers and either had a deadbeat/abusive/absent father or the mother exaggerated how much she’s hated the boys father. So the boy grows up with an unhealthy resentment of men and/or an unhealthy worships of “victimized” women.

He later often finds himself being “the savior” for broken women out there. But he painfully learn that he will be exploited when necessary but never truly respected by women. He rarely talks back to them. He will also initially support feminism and later come to hate it. He is ironically the most likely to have a rude awakening.

[blueonblack22]

Read your update. I don’t agree with your bf’s opinion that women shouldn’t have the right to vote.

However I semi understand where he is coming from. People who made the most sacrifice to protect this country (because they live it) should be able to call the shots. And no offense but men usually sacrifice more to provide for women and children. This is from years of evolution to be expected to be protectors and providers.

We generally make more sacrifices whether it be from simply working harder to make more money all the way up to fighting in wars to protect our country.

We also generally don’t expect (and actually highly dislike) someone else to take care of us. This includes having the government take care of us via entitlement programs. We know NOTHING is “free” and won’t sacrifice our independence and freedom for government handouts.

But more and more people especially women have a very naive concept of socialism and the fact it’s a precursor to communism. Communism killed over a 100 million people in the 20th century. But they always start out by promising “equality” and free things.

[blueonblack22]

And women generally vote Democrat and the democrat party is getting more and more radical. No politician in their right mind would ever identify as “socialist” even 20 years ago. But now you got the squad and AOC. It’s getting worse and worse and women vote these morons in because they are generally more emotionally impressionable.

[Anonymous]

I don't support feminism, it's a toxic ideology and basically women are brainwashed that they can do anything and be as powerful as men. I can put power and ego aside, but I am not going to deal with a bat shit crazy woman who is manipulative and destructive. I've heard many awful stories where women want to initiate divorce and ruin a man's life for what he worked hard for. I have a tough time supporting all women who think it's ok to call the police for fun and games or purposely hurt a guy for their own selfish reasons. I can admit when I'm wrong, I can admit when she's right and she's got the right answers. I have no problem praising a girl or woman on her success. But feminism in the west, it's an ideology. Just because you don't support an ideology doesn't make you hate the person, even with political ideologies I know it's a system of manipulation -- socially, politically, economically. Women can have good jobs and hold their own ground, that's fine. I think in today's world, women have lost touch with reality of what's right, and what's wrong, what's fair and what's just.

[Opinion Owner]

One thing to add to the poster -- it's okay to feel hesitant with a guy that you may want to pursue. If you are more of a girl where you don't mind if the guy takes charge and he's an ambitious and hard working, then it can work. But if you have strong beliefs that you want to solidify your own life, that you don't want a guy bossing you around with distorted male views, then that's something you'll have to talk about with him further. I think its natural where males support males and females support females. It's like the whole debate of what's worse -- being kicked in the balls for a guy versus a woman being pregnant. Obviously most men will say being kicked is worse, most women will say no being pregnant is more unbearable. As a guy who took political science in university and doing his masters in related to politics, I don't have an issue with women voting. I'm sure there are many women out there who are sick and tired of male politicians being involved in sociopolitical matters such as abortion rights where it has caused a major rift in the United States. When it comes to that, I try to follow the rights of religion of what God constitutes on abortion, not politicians. I don't want to get into a whole debate about that because it's a separate topic itself. No relationship is perfect, we will never see eye to eye with each other. Take me for example -- I am anti-capitalist, I don't chase worldly affairs, my sisters are different with their political thoughts. I've learned not to talk to them about those things.

[Billlewis]

When it's all said and done, after you've broken down the men in this world by ethnicity, education/income level, etc, there are really only two groups that matter -- men who understand that women run the show and men who have yet to realize, accept and embrace this concrete, irrefutable fact.

The notion that men and women are equal is a quaint but long outdated philosophy; aside from physical strength (generally, but not always), women should be regarded as utterly and completely superior to men in every aspect, and I, for one believe that their relationships should reflect that. This is my opinion only.

[Billlewis]

Thank you very much for the point, I appreciate your support, ma'am.

[Asker]

I know feminists want to be on top in a relationship but I don't want that. To be equal in a sense of trust and respect for each other. I'm fine with him being the leader.

[strateguy632]

bill, i have "yet to realize" i mean kamala did tip the senate voting but women dont "run" the show.

[DextroShade]

OP, this is one of one's I warned you about. These male feminist simps are creeps.

[Billlewis]

Yes, ma'am, and I understand where you're coming from. But to me, a relationship is a little like bargaining for a car -- you begin negotiations above or below where you anticipate that you'll eventually end up. In other words, I believe that if I encourage her to have complete, absolute authority, she can then decide exactly how much authority she wants. I believe a woman should always get exactly what she wants, or as close as possible to exactly what she wants.

[Billlewis]

@strateguy632 I don't mean in terms of politics whatsoever -- we all know that liberals -- the majority of whom are comprised of bitter, middle aged white women -- are hell bent on wrecking the country. I mean in relationships, etc.

[Robbey]

The feminism issue would likely only be a problem if you were a feminist.

However, a man who doesn’t think you have the right to vote is very, very likely a man who will treat (and any hypothetical daughters you two may have) you like trash if not worse. Also, he’ll likely be okay with “physically disciplining” his spouse, so you might want to ask his thoughts.

I tend towards conservatism/traditionalism myself but what you do is your choice, but I’d suggest being absolutely sure that if you choose to stay with him, you’re not letting yourself down

[Asker]

Would you date a guy like him?

[Robbey]

I’d sooner become a nun.

[Asker]

I get that lol

[pepper1993]

The main problem is that "feminism" is seen as some sort of radical social movement that wants to erase gender norms and destroy men. Which isn't the case, but that's what a lot of people think when they hear it. Most guys I know say they support things like, women earning equal wages as men, being in control of their own bodies, and stronger support for women who've been victimized; however, if you asked them if they support feminism, they'd say "hell no". Even though all those topics I mentioned fall under the banner of feminism. I almost wish we had a different term for the promotion of women's rights, but alas that seems impossible.

[Sabretooth]

I see those as merely talking points. I've seen at least 3 examples of feminism argue AGAINST equality.

[Anonymous]

It depends. I'd ask him what his definition of feminism is.

I don't like feminism either. But not because I don't believe in equality. I DO! Very much so! But today's feminism is not that!

God made Adam first. But he knew he was incomplete without eve so to speak. It's no coincidence that women are strong in every way men are weak. And men are strong in every way women are weak. We weren't made to battle eachother but compliment eachother. Any guy worth anything GETS THAT! Unfortunately sometimes it takes some guys longer than others to learn it.

[Asker]

I do agree with that completely. I am religious and I agree with the idea that men and women exist to compliment and help each other out. It's more about love than domination. That's why I don't want to say I'm like fully a feminist. Just a feminist in a sense where I don't want to date a toxic guy, I don't know if I would be considered feminist or just a rational human being lol. Maybe I should talk it out with him

[Opinion Owner]

That's up to you. Let's hope the no women vote is just macho bluster. Because if not I think you have you answer. A man with true power does not fear a woman with equal power.

[stepyo99]

Your date sounds very smart to me. The 19th amendment was definitely a mistake and should be repealed. The only reason you think it's weird and uncomfortable is because you've been brainwashed to think it's HATEFUL to think otherwise. But you haven't mentioned that he has treated you poorly or disrespectfully at all.

Have you considered having a conversation about why he believes the things he does? And I mean a conversation, not a debate. Take the opportunity to listen and try to understand a different viewpoint.

[LiamJHayden]

I would ask him how he defines feminism. If he's against Susan B. Anthony Equality Under the Law Feminism, yeah, dump him yesterday. If he's against Clementine Ford Type Feminism then that is understandable. if you do not know who she is, here are a couple of dandies from her.

[sage2021]

Just let him move to Europe and forget about this guy. It will only get worse as the two of you clash.
Women were allowed to vote since 1920. He needs to get over it.

[LiamJHayden]

@sage2021 Yup. That is why I mention that. The guy's a nut. I should have stated that I often answer questions with an eye to others in similar situations. That is why I put in the latter stuff and talked about having him (not the particular one in the question but any other guy who says something similar) clarify what he means, because a lot of guys think of crazy radicals like Clementine Ford when they hear the word.

[Miristheiss]

It is a red flag if you are a feminist who believes the "pay gap" or in the "patriarchy" and that women are oppressed and that it is 100% FINE that there aren't tons of women in construction, brick laying, welding, oil rig work, HVAC, plumbing, electrician work... etc. but throws a fit that more women aren't in STEM or CEO's or political leaders. You throw off your natural femininity and think women should act like men, career should always trump family and marriage and women are shamed for wanting to be moms and not prioritizing work above all else, preaching women should forgo settling down at 21-22 and getting married but instead having tons of loose, casual sex throughout their 20's and then around 30 find left chump to settle down with your leftovers.

He should run. He should FLEE if you are some modern feminist.

[Asker]

I did say I am traditional...

[RingOfFire]

Don't trap yourself in the prison of two ideas. This is one of those things that isn't necessarily one or the other. Just because someone doesn't like feminism doesn't mean they are a misogynist.

Feminism in its current carnation is some kind of lunatic belief that men and women are the same. Just because you think that belief is lunacy doesn't mean you don't respect women. It is possible to respect the DIFFERENCES between the two genders without thinking they are "the same."

[MementoMori777]

I know exactly why you are depressed, because what he said completely changed your point of view on the guy, you now see him in a different light and it changes things, I wouldn't say a guy not supporting feminism is a red flag but the way he said that he doesn't even agree with women voting, that's a bit extreme and shows more than just not supporting feminism or whatever, true definition of a sticky situation I guess

[Aiko_E_Lara]

Being a sexist would be a red flag just like being a feminist would be a red flag. I am someone who don't believe in feminism because I believe in equality. How about if I say would it be a red flag to date a girl who doesn't like/believe in masculinism?

[Asker]

I'd understand, and in fact I support masculinism.

[Aiko_E_Lara]

In short, that would basically just make you an equalist/egalitarian which is neither both. You can't mix fire and ice because they turn into something that's in between

[Asker]

I don't think two genders should be higher than the other. Though, I'm not saying men and women have to be 100% equal with everything because that's impossible. But I know feminism made it heavily unequal for men, I don't think women should be above men.

[Aiko_E_Lara]

If that's the case, you're neither a feminists nor a masculinist. You can't say "Im a feminist yesterday because my mom got assaulted then I'll be a feminist tomorrow because my dad got falsely accused" otherwise you'd just be contradicting yourself like you can't make up your mind.

[Asker]

But at the same time I don't men should be above women either! lol I don't know what kind of weirdo I am.

[Asker]

I don't think men*

[Asker]

True, it's hard to keep up to date with all the labels out there

[Aiko_E_Lara]

Then you're an equalist/egalitarian. You're not a weirdo. You're just misinformed. You would've been a weirdo if you're just delusional about it.

[Asker]

Aw that's nice of you :) thank you. I'll start telling people that I'm a equalist. Thanks for teaching me something.

[Aiko_E_Lara]

*Hugs*

[Simslover92]

It's not a red flag to me that he doesn't believe in feminism especially today's feminist but him not believing women should not have the right to vote would give me pause I'm not going to lie. I'm traditional too and wouldn't have a problem with a guy who has more conservative views but women not having the right to vote is a bit much. Makes me think of the Handmaid's Tale. Yikes.

[therealricksanchez]

Being anti-feminist doesn't mean being mysoginistic or abusive. You can be perfectly anti-feminist and a good person, because feminism is mostly a particular political view. Figure out what he's values are, how he behaves and if he's actually mysoginistic or a decent person. However, saying women should not vote is quite extreme, if it's a joke, no problem, if he's being serious, not a good sign

[NamerOfStars]

Well, the logical thing to do would be to ask what he means; disapproving of Feminism could be anywhere from demanding equal accountability to demanding burqas. Did you ask why he thinks women shouldn't have the right to vote?

[Asker]

I think he thinks women are stupid and that's why but I plan to talk about it with him soon.

[NamerOfStars]

Yeah, there aren't a whole lot of legitimate reasons to deny the franchise to an entire gender, but you should at least hear him out.

[Kiss_Me]

If you are just now finding out about stuff like this you are nowhere **NEAR** ready for a relationship with this guy.

Are you regurgitating feminist propaganda, and upset he is agreeing with you? Remember, women are attracted to powerful men. A guy that openly speaks his mind is displaying power. Is his opinion a deal breaker? If so, break it off immediately and move on with your life.

[Anonymous]

Well first of all, you shouldn't trust any man today who doesn't dislike modern feminism. Today's feminism is a disaster and anyone, male or female, who supports it is either an asshole or very naïve.

Having said that, this guy does sound like an asshole. You being traditional makes you a high value woman, and you deserve a high value man who will treat you well. Don't settle for an asshole.

[Asker]

Ok I won't

[anon1903]

If he's against something like women's rights to vote, who knows what else he's against.

Abort mission.

[strateguy632]

to an, i agree with u

[DJB72]

If by feminism you mean civil rights like voting, yes.

If you mean a guy who values a woman who can tell the difference between working a minimum wage job to barely get by being as close as most get to slavery, and the role of being a parent and supporting your husband as his domestic partner allowing him to support you by earning the finances the family needs. Then no.

[Kinkyhubby]

You should leave him. He sounds like a tool. The part when he said women should never have won the right to vote, tells me enough. I wouldn't want my daughter dating a tool like that. That hasn't nothing to do with feminist. You should leave him.

[Asker]

He said something about how he wants to move to Europe because men are number one over there over women and he likes that, he thinks it's awesome. But we aren't in a relationship, he just asked me out and then dropped this bomb.

[Kinkyhubby]

I hope you said no to that date after hearing that.

[Asker]

I haven't because it's really hard for me to be assertive. I was thinking about ghosting him instead of telling him no.

[Asker]

I ended things with him today. Just wanted to let you know.