There's guys who've got moobs, (and if you don't know what moobs are, look it up. Lol) so really, what's the difference? (I'm aware there's a difference, but...) I'm not saying girls should go shirtless, (I'm not saying guys should too,) but I am wondering, who made the rule? Men can go show off and it's all fine, but if a girl did it, it would be wrong and weird. I caught myself making an excuse for a guy who was "showing off" voluntarily. "Well, guys can do that stuff." I said to my friend who was weirded out by him. And my friend said, (who is a girl,) "Yeah, but it's still kind of weird. Women wouldn't go around doing that." It made me wonder... hmm? What exactly is the rule that guys can go shirtless and it's excepted and girls cannot? What do you think?
IN YOUR OPINION: What Is The Reason Why Guys Can Go SHIRTLESS and Girls Can't?
We are all programmed to find boobs appealing (primary food source). The problem is when that appeal is confounded with the fact that they are a secondary female sexual characteristic. Keeping them covered was probably a way of protecting young girls/women from unwanted attentions. Social attitudes have changed, but exposure laws have not caught up.
I am intrigued that 2 ladies down thumbed this. I would be grateful for an exposition of their viewpoint, as I would hope to not be offensive on this topic.
Ignore the immature ones that can't take honest input. The girls that downvote you are part of the radical feminist population. There's no logic in them.
Well of you ask me, going shirtless outside of a beach, swimming pool, country club etc. is something only attention whoring douchbags do. They also like to use shirtless profile pics, just in case anyone missed the fact that they're douches. There is nothing wrong with wearing a fucking shirt in public.
Because women's breasts are seen as sexual objects and mens aren't. That's what I think. Does it make it right or fair, no, but that's the way it is and we probably will never change it so why bother worrying about it :)
It's you opinion and I respect it but I don't think its an "OBJECT", It's sexualized, but it's not seen as a sexual object lol and actually I think (in my opinion) that you can sexualize guy abs as we sexualize breasts so each person should be able to do whatever they think it's correct without interrupting the other people's Way of thinking by force.
@markitospower243 dude the human body is an object, by strict definition of the word object. For reference, an Object (n): a material thing that can be seen and touched.
The human body can be seen, touched, and is made of materials. It is an object. It's not up to personal opinion, and is not up for debate. The body IS an object.
Exactly this. Every guy would probably stop and stare. Whether they are single or their so was right next to them. Men Make the rules and because they can't control themselves it would cause a lot of problems for themselves and they would try to justify sexual harassment as you asking for it. Until the day there are enough boobs exposed everywhere that people are desensitized to it. Plus a lot of modest women would get pissed because they can't bring themselves to do it even if they wanted to. Keep in mind some churches won't even allow women to wear pants and you effectively can't get a historectomy because it would effect your future husband
If women go out topless, men would stop and stare at first because boobs are considered private, sexual organs you can't see everywhere. But after a certain period of time I recon boobs would become unattractive and normal...
Well, seeing Mardi gras year after year for a couple decades there are no laws there. Also lots of women doing body painted clothes, so on and so forth. It isn't against the law, you just can't go into the same businesses that have no shirt no shoes policies.
Really the only thing stopping you is fear of what other people will think of you with your shirt off, same as a guy taking his shirt off.
It isn't widely socially acceptable, on the same token I can't think of any jobs that will let a guy work shirtless and keep his job either. Even in construction you at least need a wife-beater on no matter how hot it gets.
If you want to show your girls off, have at it, if you don't attach a reason to it, I guarantee a bunch of guys following you around like puppy dogs will, like those titties are an andy warhol or something.
I don't know why guys can go shirtless but I think women can't because boobs are sexualized. But it's not like nobody looks at guys at the beach either. It's just so normalized for men and boys that nobody thinks about it anymore. Actually, maybe it has to do more with vulnerability.
Men are typically stronger than women, more threatening, and all that. You know that phrase "she asked for it"? Maybe that's why women aren't allowed to go topless. As some form of trying to protect them from the men who have little self control and a lot of libido, and men who aren't rapists from the constant temptation. And if that's the case, then I guess it makes sense that only women have that rule. After all, they are the ones who are typically weaker as adults, and their chests are still more sexualized than men's, so it would help more for them to cover it up than it would for men to cover themselves up.
That's just a thought though. If it is the case then I think it makes sense. But I really dont know.
This practice is a relic of an ancient time where women weren't allowed to do much aside from cook and clean, and bear children. Now women are just as free as men to do what they want, go where they please, and chose what to do with their lives. But your mother raised you just as her mother raised her and was raised by her mother all the way back to the dawn of civilization that it's not ok to show off your breasts. Notice how most girls answering here say I don't know but it's not right, well that's because it's impossible for them to picture a world where men and women can both go topless in public without creating a frenzy.
But baby steps. These days it's becoming more and more common I believe in a few years it'll be perfectly acceptable. Just think about it not twenty years ago it was shameful to be openly gay in most countries and now it's no longer an issue worth discussion, I'm sure this topic too will one day be meaningless as women will be able to comfortably walk around topless if they wish
Women are generally physically weaker than men. That's why they feel more intimidated when men ogle them or catcall them. They feel vulnerable. Regardless of society's laws in place in an attempt to deter men going further than ogling women, it still happens where men with a lower activity in the region of their brain which tells them to stop; the brakes in the brain (prefrontal cortex), still act on impulse and cause traumatic and potentially even fatal experiences for girls.
There is a factor in that we're more conditioned to find parts of the body that are covered more attractive. Back in the day, women would be considered dressing provocatively if they showed their ankles. Now, most of men are not really stimulated at all by womens ankles. My guess would be that if women transitioned to going topless as often as men do, then men would be desensitized to an extent. However, it's a bad idea because it would also draw more attention from guys that can't control their impulses as well.
It's not the way it should be, but it's the way it is and it's better to take precautions to prevent or lessen the likeliness of such scenarios taking place.
Personally, I would prefer it the opposite, that guys DIDN'T go shirtless, and women DID!! I have no issues, at all with a woman being topless at a beach, in public, and why is it a problem? I've seen women nursing, openly in restaurants, and I thought it was perfectly natural, and normal, and why can't, why don't they? I'm thinking a lot of it is social stigmas, and that a guy can do, whatever, but a topless woman, OMG!! That must be the end of the world!! What if children saw that? Uh, depending on their age, and if it was mommy, maybe they would be thinking 'lunch time'!! and nothing else! :) :) I don't know who made up this Bullsht, but I am thinking it is probably ugly, old guys, with bad comb-overs, and low self-esteem that never married because they were just dorks!!
The female nipple is... Seen as sexual. It isn't even boobs... But the nipple. When we got the different chromosome, our body became less female by the week... We came out as male and our nipples lost purpose. Society and some religions viewed the nipples as sacred. It's why you never see nipples on most dolls like Barbies or Bratz, and why pasties exist... You know what's there, but it is censored. The male nipple doesn't do anything for anyone, and a lot of men don't experience pleasure from them. The male breast isn't large and those that are large don't have the same function as female breast... Female breast is sexual because people allowed it to be. It didn't have to, but they chose for it to be. Like evolution.. people have an incredibly slow crawl to change. Moobs aren't appealing and they should be covered up...
All my life I have hated this double standard.. Let the women bare their nice , subtle, rosey, perky breasts. Especially if they are 36 dd. Anyway the reason is a Neolithic conservative way of thinking by society. My god, American TV wasn''t even allowed to show a womans belly button until the 60's? Bathing suits for women were body suits at the turn of the century. Hell I dont know the reason , but if I were running for president that would be my platform. BARE THE BREASTS 2020 !!! Seeing things in a whole new light. Be. Some fun campaign rallys.. Thanks
You just reminded me of a experience I had. Gone into this workshop to help them out. I like my boobs, and with it being hot I only had a tee shirt on. Well I hadn't noticed but my nipples were quite visible , there was one lad was so interested in my boobs, he was talking at them than me. But getting back to your question, I think there should be a level playing field. Being a guy I don't like going topless, but it should be ok for girls to go topless. Sadly it would cause a bit of a commotion...
In some places in the US, women can go shirtless. And with no bra. Despite dire warning of pedophiles and perverts being attracted to these areas, nothing of the sort has occurred. In fact, almost nothing has occurred, including few women going shirtless. If people would just stop worrying about women being allowed to go topless, very little would happen.
Is this the biggest sexist issue you can find? Cause men kill themselves 3-4 times more often than women in western countries, and everyone ("everyone" includes feminists and the media) has been trying to ignore male suicide since before I was born.
In the country where I live (canada) it is technically illegal, but court cases from the past two decades show that women will not be in trouble for it. It is officially legal in Toronto, but not the rest ofnthe country.
As for why these laws exist, probably because men were expected to be confident, manly, and proud, where as women were expected to be reserved, innocent, and lady-like.
Although I think woman complaining about not being able to go topless like men is stupid. I have researched why there's a big difference between male and female suicide. The studies claim the reason why there's more men that kill themselves is because they use guns or hang themselves which there's no coming back from. Women tend to take pills which either don't work or it gives time to realize they made a mistake and get medical help. So it's not that men necessarily attempt it more.
Still I believe men need more support than they are getting. I also believe men need to be more proactive in getting the medical help they need.
I've been in 2 long term relationships and both men would never go to the doctor unless they were pretty much dying or in to much pain. Otherwise they avoided them despite me getting on them to go.
Now my sons father, who was my first long term relationship, died at 40 years old. He had untreated hypertension and high cholesterol. Which all could have been treated if he wasn't so stubborn.
Men need to put their pride aside, realize they aren't 10ft tall and bulletproof, and get regular check up's.
Stop blaming society for thinking men have to be strong all the time. Men have a choice not to let the stupid one's make them behave a certain way. Just like women have a choice too.
I didn't say men attempt it more, but men statistically die to suicide more often than women. I agree that this can largely be contributed to men choosing more violent/permanent methods to commit suicide, but I would argue that that is largely due to societal norms and pressures. There is also potentially the argument to be made that women sometimes use suicide attempts as a way to get attention, which seemingly would make sense given how women choose less permanent ways to attempt suicide.
I agree, but I think a large part of why men choose not to get help is due to societal pressures telling men to suck it up and deal with it. Also, if you live in the USA then medical costs might be a factor.
I will blame society, until we change the way society views men, this will not change. These expectations on men push them to be this way, because if they are too feminine or weak then they fear it will make them unnattractive. Most men have been told since they were young that they are supposed to lead, to be confident and unafraid. It's the same as the way women were expected to be stay at home mothers, women had to change society to change that. Now many women are working to change societal norms so that women can be shirtless, yet societal expectations of men largely haven't changed since before feminism. The only real difference is that now men are expected to do half the housework too. The choice we have been told we have is to be this way, or to not get married because women will view us as low quality men if we don't behave the right way. Dating plays into this too, women constantly try to change their man, and it makes men percieve that they need to be a certain way in order to be worthy of a long term relationship.
I have had multiple women on this site tell me that if I want to attract women I should start being more successful. I don't mean to come off as rude, but I have seen the ways society treats men who fall out of line and pushes men to be this way. As a man, society tells you that you are only worth as much as you earn, or as much as you can lift. If you're physically fit and attractive then women will drool over you, but they still won't marry you if you work for minimum wage. If you are unnattractive but rich, women will marry you even if they can't stand looking at you.
The reason why men are asked to help with housework and the kids is because women work jobs too. In today'society you have to have a 2 income household in order to support the family.
there's no way to tell that women attempt suicide for attention. I think it's messed up to accuse anyone of that as if their pain isn't real.
What I don't get is what's the payoff for blaming women and society for a man's failures?
At what point do people stop pointing the finger and start looking in the mirror.
"What I don't get is what's the payoff for blaming women and society for a man's failures?", the payoff is that we get freedom from the expectations that bind us. Think about it this way, 60+ years ago, I could have said that to a woman who didn't want to be a mother and complained that she couldn't get married. "I just want to have a job and not be trapped in the house" "why blame men and society for your failures as a woman?". The implication is that all men must be a certain way or they are not valuable. I thought we lived in an age where we accepted that all humans have natural value just from being living things? Why are men objectified for their bodies and their money? We are humans too, we deserve better than this, we deserve to be able to break societal norms without being ostracized.
"At what point do people stop pointing the finger and start looking in the mirror.", why don't you start with that? Take a look in the mirror and see all the ways you fail as a traditional woman. Stop blaming others and start doing your job as a mother and wife! You must contribute to society by having lots of children! *sarcasm, I'm trying to point out how your arguments could be used against feminism*
I don't get why you're so offended by men trying to free themselves from societal oppression, feminism has killed traditionalism, yet men still need to fit the traditional norms.
According to you, men need to stop blaming women and society, so what should men do instead? Men should just accept that societies expectations of them are good and work themselves to death trying to fit the expectations? Why shouldn't men fight against biased expectations of us?
Women fought the expectation that they should do housework, now the expecation is half and half, yet when men complain about societal expectations you get offended and ask why we're blaming women and society for our own failures. You're a hypocrit. Either tell women to stop blaming men for their short comings whenever they complain that their man won't cook/clean, or else change your view of men who break societal norms. Women are changing societal expecations on the daily, but men try to do it and we get labeled as sexist failures.
Do you think it's wrong for women to blame men. I know I do. And I'm not offended by men changing things. But I don't see men changing things because instead they are to busy feeling sorry for themselves and pointing the finger. It's the men that aren't pointing the finger and doing something constructive to make things better that I respect.
So many complain how feminazis ruined things or are unfair toward men and then they turn around and act just like the very thing they complain about. Anyway I've tried explaining the best I could. Maybe someday you'll realize no one changes anything by sitting around feeling sorry for themselves and not being accountable for taking control of their lives. Goodluck with everything.
@kim45456 you don't believe in depression? Even though it is scientifically proven to change the hormone levels in the brain and thereby change the way the brain percieves things? Depression is heavily studied and understood by psychologists, I suggest you google it and read about depression from some scientific sources.
Further, regardless of what you "believe" you have to face the fact that in countries like uk, Canada, usa, japan, and france the male suicide rate is 3-4 times that of women, we have a crisis here, and regardless of why you want to dismiss it, we are allowing humans to die every day that we don't solve this problem. While it would be nice to tell everyone who is suicidal to just not commit suicide, that doesn't work, it won't fix the issue, that just ignores the issue and passes 100% of the blame onto these people who are struggling so much that they're killing themselves.
Some people have lives far worse than yours, so you shouldn't be so judgmental. Nobody wants to die, everyone fears death, but some people have such terrible lives that they fear life more than they fear death, that is why suicide happens.
He is making a straw man argument. Just some group has worser, does not mean your problems should be ignored. He can go to saudia arabia or other countries where women life does not matter
@Kim45456 I did not strawman you. Do you even know what a strawman fallacy is? A strawman is when you lie about your opponents position in order to attack it. If I said, "well then you don't believe in mental illness because depression is a mental illness", that would be a strawman, because I lied about what you said in order to make it fit my narrative.
Finally, I only meant "some people have it worse", to mean that you shouldn't say it doesn't exist just because you haven't experienced it. You haven't experienced everything. Also, I think if you went to saudi arabia, you would find many of the women there suffer from depresion.
Also, maybe you should reread the part where I said that scientists have a lot of evidence supporting depression, because I made more arguments than what you addressed.
This is something that was recently changed in old Egypt and old sumer civilizations used to go around their business braless and showing either one or both breasts and women and their unique power to create and being life was worship and respected (there is a lot of things going on too, with worshiping in the temples and the magic sex practiced by the Egyptians which like most of their culture was a copy of their culture and myths) Greece is another clear example where you found women had great power in the social and political scene and structure of the country especially in the Spartans, also highly marked with the Akkadian civilisation.
I think it's because they've always been covered. I think that as humans, one of the things we want the most is something we get to see the least.
I think that if girls did go around topless, guys would go freaking ape at the start, lucky us, however after some time, you would get used to the sight. Seeing a girl walk passed topless would eventually yield the same reaction as a guy walking passed topless. If she's hot, she'll get a couple more looks, just like if a hot guys walks past, he'll get a couple more looks. That's it.
Girls can't go topless because of girls as a whole not going topless.
Social constructs and leftover stigma from previous eras where a woman even showing an ankle was scandalous (read: men were trying to control every aspect of a woman's body). I support #freethenipple campaigns as well as campaigning in my home state to allow open breastfeeding in public.
I'm pretty sure the clothing was restrictive for both men and women in that era. "Both men and women must wear gloves at all times when venturing into public." I don't think it's fair to say this was just men trying to control women. Also, it was a British era ruled by a Queen.
It's a stupid law if you ask me. It's because of indecent exposure laws. Women's breasts are considered sexual organs by society for some reason. It's an antiquated law. However part of the reason is also the behaviour of men.
It's stupid though. I shit you not, I saw a man with actual boobs at the beach the other day. Like they weren't moon's, this was the result of some kind of weird hormone imbalance or something. He had shapely breasts bouncing along as he walked. My friend and I could barely contain our immaturity about it. The poor guy.
I have always wondered about that. For some reason, our governments have decided that women's breasts are "sex organs." They are not. They are there to feed babies (primarily). Men and women should be treated equally. If a woman wants to be in the pool topless, what does it hurt? SOme say that it arouses men too much to see topless women. But some men are aroused by seeing women in high heels or boots.
The government has NOT decided that breasts are "sex organs", but many consider them to be "private parts" (there's a significant difference between the two terms).
I think it has to do with the fact that moobs are generally not considered attractive while boobs are. I do think it's a bit of a double standard although I do think boobs can be considered a sexual organ since almost all hetro males love them and many girls enjoy nipple stimulation in sex while very few guys enjoy it although some do.
The reason is how people react to it. If you are find with guys doing it and feel that it is is different when women do it the that's a reason. Men and women are apples and oranges, they don't need (not does it make sense for) everything to be the same.
Well, I think that the original reason was because when girls see a shirtless guy they would feel just weird (if he doesn't look attractive). They would just want to get out of there and there wouldn't be many negative consequences. But if guys would see a shirtless girl they would become horny. Some of them would not do anything except of thinking about sex and getting away quickly or staring at this girl. But some guys would definitely catcall this girl or do something which is called "sexual battery" or "sexual harassment". So I think that this rule was mostly created for preventing such illegal activities and for improving girls' safety.
Come on, try using the search option for your questions for answers first as this question has been asked 1,000 times. As an explorer you should probably know how many times you have seen it. Can't people think of some new instead of recycling the old?
Breasts are sexualized. (Not saying they should be but here we are.) It's legal for women to go topless in a lot of places, but personally I could never do it because I wouldn't want to deal with the inevitable staring and comments.
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