Do you prefer the old or new testament?

[Roudyrebel8]

[RavVid]

I recently been thinking about this recently.

Specifically why was the old testament kept in the Christian bible? There is the bit about God creating the world, ten commandments and Adam and Eve but most of it is irrelevant to Church sermons. It could easily be summarized and abridged as a forward to the new testament.

So why is the old testament in the Christian bible?

The other thing I have been thinking about is the OT God is quite vengeful but becomes loving and forgiving in the NT. In Judaism is YAWEH still a jealous and vengeful god? Most Jewish people I know seem pretty chilled and relaxed.

To be open and honest I am an atheist BUT I did score 99% in divinity to scoop up the school's divinity prize. I have just recently got very interested in the historical side of the Old Testament and am delving around it.

[strateguy632]

your response is correct most is not relevant anymore just some predictions turned out right.
a rare unlikely prediction suggests a spiritual source because i know i can't predict.

[sean1234]

Schools only teach you want they want to teach you, whatever is in their agenda.

The new testament came about with Jesus because people were not following God's laws in the old testament. If God's laws from the old testament were no longer needed, the New Testament would be pointless. Oh and yes yes, Jesus is the sacrificial lamb, so those old laws become null and void, but not the rest of the laws. Want kids with down syndrome? Marry your sister like the old testament tells you not to do!

[RavVid]

Thanks for the comments

[strateguy632]

@sean1234 wow start reading book romans chapters 8 to 12. then you will see christian different from your two sentences you wrote here.

[sean1234]

Nope.

Romans 8:6-8

For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace. Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be. So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.

Can't forget this one...

John 14:15-23

If ye love me, keep my commandments. And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever; Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you. I will not leave you comfortless: I will come to you. Yet a little while, and the world seeth me no more; but ye see me: because I live, ye shall live also. At that day ye shall know that I am in my Father, and ye in me, and I in you. He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him. Judas saith unto him, not Iscariot, Lord, how is it that thou wilt manifest thyself unto us, and not unto the world? Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.

[RavVid]

@sean1234 Thank you for those. Romans 8:6-8 is very apt today

[sean1234]

I feel as if Christians today think the law of God is outdated from reading this...

Romans 8:2

For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.

Yeah, but that doesn't mean one can rob a bank and make it to heaven. "Yeah, buddy 🔫🦹‍♂️🔪, through grace we are saved"

Ephesians 2:8

For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God

THROUGH FAITH! People forget that part. 🤷🏻‍♂️

[RavVid]

@sean1234 I need to think more and thank you for showing me that.

[sean1234]

There's many masonic Christian preachers out there, preaching lies on purpose.

[strateguy632]

new testament much better quality, and sophisticated. old testament stories, i don't mean subjective i don't like, but measurably are short bumpy and objectively poor quality even the few i subjective like. only worth reading because religion said to read it.

[sean1234]

Quality?

[strateguy632]

@sean1234 yes.

[sean1234]

The only quality is in the reader, not in the bible, specifically KJV bible.

[FreyaRed]

I like the old testament where god likes to kill those who dare to disrespect him. A crazy old vengeful mofo with special powers of an eternal being who falls is uncontrolled rage easily, like Wotan (Odin)

[Joshydavid25]

Uncontrollable? He literally waited 400 years for a nation to repent.. And neighboring nations were crying most of the times for something to be done about the nations that God destroyed..

[Robertjo16]

New Testament

[Joshydavid25]

In terms of storytelling the Old testament was amazing.. The New Testament is good too, it's just more tame.. The World was becoming more civilized and less about big tribal battles like the Old Testament.. But the Old Testament was basically epic journey after epic journey..

[NamerOfStars]

New. Old Testament God was, frankly, a bitchass. Slaughtering hundreds of innocent children just to prove your superiority over your regional rivals is pretty damned awful, but then going on to insist that your followers praise your kindness and mercy is just... evil.

[Joshydavid25]

It wasn't superiority.. It was mercy.. The innocence of the Children means they'll go to heaven to be with him rather than turn out to be extremely degenerate like their parents were depicted..

[NamerOfStars]

@Joshydavid25 No, it was superiority- each of the nine plagues was specifically targeting the weaknesses or divine portfolio of a specific Egyptian god. It was all about showing how He was so much better and stronger than they were. And if killing children was "mercy", it would be REWARDED in Judaism. It's not; it's reviled. As it should be, since it's reprehensible, even when God does it.

Omniscience and omnipotence should be mean being held to a HIGHER moral standard, not a lower one. Jesus coming down was God finally putting some skin in the game, and was a good start- shame it never went any further.

[sean1234]

Joshydavid25 is correct, but yes, God was indeed doing the plagues also because there God's they prayed to were false. Jesus is God...

John 1:1-5,14

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. The same was in the beginning with God. All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made. In him was life; and the life was the light of men. And the light shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not. And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.

https://breakeveryyoke.com/245/43/1/1/14/

Jesus is God and has always been here.

[sean1234]

Oh and it did go further... that is why there are still people like myself talking to people like you. People have the freedom to learn and obey God's word or to not have eyes to see or ears to hear it.

[Joshydavid25]

"It was all about showing how He was so much better and stronger than they were."

"When Moses approached Pharaoh, demanding that he let the people go, Pharaoh responded by saying, “Who is the Lord, that I should obey his voice to let Israel go? I know not the Lord, neither will I let Israel go” (Exodus 5:2). Thus began the challenge to show whose God was more powerful."

Of course God would show that he IS God.. The Israelites doubted him, and so did the Egyptians.. He showed the Israelites that he was worthy of praise and worship and the Egyptians that their gods were nothing.. So I guess in that sense he did show that he was superior.. But basically it was evidence that he is the God of everything..

Mercy doesn't mean that the killing of those children were good.. It means that it's something that has to be done.. Like I mentioned those kids got to go to heaven with God since they were still innocent and not accountable for any sins, instead of suffering from a result of War and knowing that their tribe or nation was taken out.. Not to mention those children would have grown up and taken revenge on Israel and continued the bloodline of their enemies..

Well, TBH, you're not omnipresence and Omnipotent.. I would think an Omnipotent being would know better than we do about what to do.. Jesus was not finally God putting some skin in the game, but coming down to finally reconnect us with the God the father and the Holy Spirit by becoming sin and sacrificing himself as flesh.. That was planned from the start.. The whole point of the Old testament was to show that it's in impossible for humans to live up to his standards alone.. And that we needed a savior..

[NamerOfStars]

@sean1234 Again, no- slaughtering innocent children, were it a clear path to God, would be a sacrament in Judaism. It's not- it's reviled as an atrocity.

Likewise, the Jews sure as Hell weren't praying to Jesus; they were praying to a deity who demanded endless sacrifice and provided nothing but protection from the harm He Himself dealt out. That's a mob boss mentality AT BEST, and yet He so duped people that even now, thousands of years later, you still defend Him with rhetoric, not reason.

[NamerOfStars]

@Joshydavid25 That's bullshit, and you know it. Exodus 9:12 (among other places): "But the LORD hardened Pharaoh’s heart, and he would not listen to them, just as the LORD had said to Moses.". Not "But [the] Pharaoh's heart was hard"; but "God hardened Pharaoh's heart". Yahweh grabbed the wrist of the pharaoh and slammed his hand into his head, saying "Stop plaguing yourself! Stop plaguing yourself!" until He turned to killing kids and got bored with it. Haki, Heket, Geb, Khepri, Hathor, Isis, Nut, Set, and Ra, in that order, had their domains overpowered, showing that Yahweh was stronger- a pissing match, like I said. And completely unnecessary, if His intervention in keeping the proto-Israelites in Egypt.

The children didn't HAVE to be killed; Yahweh could simply have pushed the Pharaoh to let the people go, or stood aside and let it happen naturally, or just teleported them away. He didn't; he shed an ocean of innocent blood, which is exactly the kind of thing that would JUSTIFY taking revenge on Israel.

And you're correct, I'm neither omniscient nor omnipotent. I'm human and fallible, limited in many ways, which is why it's appropriate to extend tolerance and understanding when I screw up. God doesn't have those limitations, so what's His excuse for the miseries He Himself inflicted? You claim that humans can't live up to His standards, but NEITHER CAN HE, evidently.

We don't need a savior; we need a God who's actually WORTH worshiping- one who's not a hypocritical, murderous monster. Jesus was an attempt to show that He was- putting, as I said, some skin in the game.

[Joshydavid25]

Did you also read the scriptures where Pharaohs hardened his own heart multiple times before God did anything.. His heart was already evil.. Also did you read that Egypt had enslaved Israel for 400 years and killed every male baby.. Meaning the entirety of Egypt was compliant in the enslavement of Israel and the slaughter of thousands maybe millions of male babies.. So God waited 400 years for Egypt to come to its senses and repent, but they never did.. TBH, it would have been justified if God had destroyed Egypt entirely because of the sin they committed against Israel..

But also, God hardened Pharaohs hard actually meant that because of God showing his miracles made Pharaoh even angrier and even more resistant to letting Israel go.. It's the same way when you know somebody is already upset, and you might ask them something or do something that might make them even more upset.. By God performing his miracles he made Pharaoh even more pissed off and resistant to letting the Israelites go. Basically the scripture today would read "The Lord performed miracles and that pissed Pharaoh off even more"..

And he did push Pharaoh to let the people go.. As I mentioned Pharaoh was resistant of his own free will.. He didn't wanna let the Israelites go from the get.. And when he saw the miracles, it kept making him more resistant.. Dude obviously had a god complex and was letting his ego do the talking.. Also why would that justify anything against Israel when plenty of Israel's Innocent blood was shed.. A few days of plagues and one night where the first borns were killed is nothing compared to what Egypt put Israel though.. Context is key my guy..

[Joshydavid25]

What misery has he inflicted? If you the scripture, God rarely intervened in human affairs.. He specifically was for Israel because he made a promise to the only man at the time who recognized his Creator "Abraham".. Everytime he intervened was for the defense and protection of Israel.. God was basically nudging Israel towards the right path, show them the way, and use them as an example to us in the future.. God operates within the natural human world to live us live out our lives in whatever way we choose.. Rarely did he perform supernatural feats.. Most of the time Children were killed it was him directing Israel to make sure their enemy nation has no way to spring back into action..

He was a murderous monster? He literally sent waited for a nation to repent, repeatedly warned them that if they don't turn from their ways that he will destroy them, most of the time through Prophets or seers.. And you know what happened to those prophets? They were brutally killed many times.. He literally showed Mercy by waiting for a nation to repent for hundreds of years, giving them repeated warnings, and they still didn't listen.. So I don't know where you get this idea that he was a murderous, hypocritical tyrant. You wouldn't worship him anyways either way..

[NamerOfStars]

@Joshydavid25 Context isn't "key" when it's just an excuse to justify bad behavior. You can't look at the situation reasonably because you're too brainwashed to ask questions- due to the commands of the very deity you're stumping for. He's strong, therefore he's right.

That's why Jesus was necessary. A shame His message hasn't reached you yet.

[NamerOfStars]

@Joshydavid25 He kills thousands of innocents, mandates His followers mutilate their own babies, bathes the land in the blood of other people simply because of the gods they follow, and you ask what misery He's inflicted?

You don't understand how that makes someone a murderous monster? Do you have any ethical standards AT ALL besides "strong equals good"?

You're right: I WOULDN'T worship a god like that; I actually know right from wrong. And until Jesus came along, there was no evidence that God did, too.

[Joshydavid25]

I literally gave you reasons why he did what he did, and that went right over your head it seems.. Nothing in my message indicated anything about "strong equals good".. But you probably didn't even read it which is why you decided to strawman.. LOL..

It's you who doesn't understand Jesus' message.. He was necessary because we needed a savior and the Old testament showed that..

It's clear you didn't read anything I said.. And just decided to reply.. 😂.. And what mutilation? Circumcising is not mutilation.. Since the penis is still functional.. Just doesn't have the foreskin.. And Egypt is still around today so he didn't bathe in any blood.. Like I mentioned he used Egypt as a demonstration of his power.. But you also keep forgetting that they enslaved Israel for 400 years and killed all of the male babies without a care in the world.. Not to mention, if you read the Bible and see what the nations Israel destroyed were doing, they were doing all types of acts we would perceive as absolutely evil and grotesque.. Sacrificing children to their gods, cannibalism, beastiality etc.. When God destroyed nations it was to destroy wicked seeds, and not just to kill people.. Which Is why he unfortunately had to include the Children..

Once again you're strawmanning..

Apparently you don't know much about the God of the Bible though.. Apparently you also don't know history..

[NamerOfStars]

@Joshydavid25 Delusion's an ugly thing, and it doesn't become less ugly because the delusions are yours. Evil is evil, and being powerful doesn't change that.

If you ever DO find Jesus, tell Him I asked Him to save you from His father.

[sean1234]

Jesus IS God!

[sean1234]

1 John 2:22-23

Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son. Whosoever denieth the Son, the same hath not the Father: (but) he that acknowledgeth the Son hath the Father also.

https://breakeveryyoke.com/245/62/2/22/23/

Nameofstars, you are a antichrist.

[Joshydavid25]

I'm glad you realized it was, and hopefully take the steps to overcome it I believe in you.. And yes evil is evil and being powerful doesn't change that.. Good thing I never alluded to that being the case..

You would need to find Jesus as well.. It seems like you really need him..

[sean1234]

Your gobbledygook makes no sense at all, talking like a person who is a Pharisee, but instead of worshipping the Father and not the Son, it's the Son and not the Father which is the same thing.

I can imagine, you are in the past convince God to not kill the evil parents kids, but later grow up and not care and wage war against you. So in the end you and your family die and those kids all grown up burn in hell instead of making it to heaven. I don't really want to go there as for how things are today in that regard.

[WhiteSteve]

“Probablyyyyyyy…equal.”

https://www.youtube.com/embed/ERUngQUCsyE

[Zestyassmf1997]

Tough call. Generally I prefer the new one. I just find most of the parables in there to be more interesting.

[Anonymous]

It's not like Coke or Pepsi, they were 2 epochs of human history.

[PBandJ_Nerd]

We go by the New Testament because it explains a lot more about Jesus and stuff like that. Old Testament mainly just talks about God.

[sean1234]

They complete each other. You can't have one without the other, you can't have your head without the rest of the body.

[strateguy632]

not comparable. a body interacts circulatory system, but books are nothing like a body.

[sean1234]

Oh you don't know how wrong you are...

John 1:1-14

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. The same was in the beginning with God. All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made. In him was life; and the life was the light of men. And the light shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not. There was a man sent from God, whose name was John. The same came for a witness, to bear witness of the Light, that all men through him might believe. He was not that Light, but was sent to bear witness of that Light. That was the true Light, which lighteth every man that cometh into the world. He was in the world, and the world was made by him, and the world knew him not. He came unto his own, and his own received him not. But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name: Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God. And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.

https://breakeveryyoke.com/245/43/1/1/14/

Jesus is the word and when you are not reading what is in all of his Bible, it is the same as wanting the body without the head.

Ephesians 5:22-23

Wives, submit yourselves unto your own husbands, as unto the Lord. For the husband is the head of the wife, even as Christ is the head of the church: and he is the saviour of the body.

https://breakeveryyoke.com/245/49/5/22/23/

[sean1234]

Can't forget about the symbolism

[strateguy632]

your quotes did not list any books by name, so did not support your claim.

[sean1234]

I wasn't trying to compare books but said Jesus is God and is the word. Why would God forget half of history? God doesn't change, that being said...

[sean1234]

Hebrews 13:8

Jesus Christ is the same yesterday and today and forever.

Malachi 3:6

“For I the Lord do not change; therefore you, O children of Jacob, are not consumed.

James 1:17

Every good gift and every perfect gift is from above, coming down from the Father of lights with whom there is no variation or shadow due to change.

Numbers 23:19

God is not man, that he should lie, or a son of man, that he should change his mind. Has he said, and will he not do it? Or has he spoken, and will he not fulfill it?

Isaiah 40:8

The grass withers, the flower fades, but the word of our God will stand forever.

Psalm 102:25-27

Of old you laid the foundation of the earth, and the heavens are the work of your hands. They will perish, but you will remain; they will all wear out like a garment. You will change them like a robe, and they will pass away, but you are the same, and your years have no end.

[sean1234]

2 Timothy 2:13
If we are faithless, he remains faithful— for he cannot deny himself.
Isaiah 40:28
Have you not known? Have you not heard? The Lord is the everlasting God, the Creator of the ends of the earth. He does not faint or grow weary; his understanding is unsearchable.
Psalm 119:89
Forever, O Lord, your word is firmly fixed in the heavens.
Psalm 33:11
The counsel of the Lord stands forever, the plans of his heart to all generations.

[OfDeath]

The New Testament is less barbaric but neither one is up to current ethical standards.

[strateguy632]

current ethical standards are about unimportant harmless stuff, and without Christianity atheism is very barbaric... just uses fake names like abortion snd circumcision but you think modern are "ethical" sarcasm.

[sean1234]

Lol, oh yes they are. People today are very barbaric. Strateguy just some some, although people did do circumcisions in the bible.

[sean1234]

Just said* some

[OfDeath]

@strateguy632 atheism is not barbaric. That’s like saying not believing in Santa Claus is barbaric. Atheism is simply the disbelief in gods and has nothing to do with barbarism.

[sean1234]

Atheists are one of 2 from what I've seen. They either have no morals at all because good and evil is how you perceive it OR the ones who have a likeness of, but deny the Father and Son.

Anyhow, what is barbaric are the things people do today, abortion, neutering, spaying, declawing, to name a few.

[sean1234]

Hmmm, taxation is barbaric come to think about it. What happens when you don't pay your land tax, lol.

[sean1234]

Conan is wearing a tux🤵‍♂️ this time.😂

[OfDeath]

@sean1234 Can you think of an atheist who had no morals at all?

I agree things like spaying are barbaric in a sense. Abortions are an issue of contention. But none of those things have anything to do with atheism anyway. And what else doesn’t have anything to do with atheism is burning people alive as a result of superstitious allegations, stoning people to death as per the will of a fictional character, human sacrifices to appease fictional characters, chopping off perfectly good limbs and destroying the quality of life of otherwise healthy and well mannered people for the “crime” of breaking rules attributed to the will of a fictional character to name a few.

[hopegirly]

I love the New Testament

But i am aware that i need to read the whole old testament too

[matchrestore]

New Testament- in particular Galatians 5:12.

[Anonymous]

There are aspects of both Old and New that I love. I love the Psalms and Proverbs, and the book of Ruth. But as a Christian, and a Gentile, I find more comfort in the New Testament.

[AngryCarl]

Since I used to be a Christian but was never a Jew, I'd have to say the New Testament.

[OtterMan68]

As a Christian, I follow the words and teachings of Christ, so the obvious answer is The New Testament.

[jshm2]

They both taste the same with ketchup.

[Al_Musafir]

The final testament: the noble Qur'an.

[strateguy632]

first that is not helpful for the question.
second assuming quran is true it praised book of jesus as light and good so book "injil" not corrupt as some shiek claim.
i wonder which of those two the quran praised more? moses book or new testament?

[Al_Musafir]

@strateguy632 it was laid down but the people did corrupt it. How many of versions of injil exist, again?

[strateguy632]

why do you reject quran that said jesus book is "good and light"? if not follow quran, more reason to be christian.

[strateguy632]

about versions like niv kjv they are TRANSLATIONS as English language changed but content same.

[Al_Musafir]

@strateguy632 where did I say I reject it? Prophet Is'ah (AS), was indeed a caller to Islam and a messenger of ALLAH.

[QuietRunner]

Old testament. More logical, the rules were simpler, stories were better

[imran_]

Last testament (Quran)

[OddBeMe]

Which one has the most facts?

[strateguy632]

old testament has more genealogy lists if you measure that way. new testament only 2.

[OddBeMe]

@strateguy632 so only two facts in the NT? Which are those? Cities that existed?

[strateguy632]

i mean family list. but pauls VERY BENEFICIAL and useful lessons are good true lessons, but not facts.

[OddBeMe]

@strateguy632 I won’t argue. Even though I bet those lessons could be traced back to Confucius.

[wHolLyGoTgodgods]

Old Testament

[WhitneySnow]

New Testament

[riverrat3]

The new