Why is it that someone can start talking religion to people that don't believe in that junk & we're expected to just put up with it & let them talk?

[Anonymous]

but, if we say we don't believe in that crap, we're the bad ones? Or, if we start talking about how it's made-up and pointless, they refuse to listen and want nothing to do with us, anymore!
Look, I'm sorry you fell for the brainwashing and the bullshit but, why does that make me the bad guy in this, just because I'm smart enough not to have fallen for it?

[CupcakeTheDestroyer]

Just as they try to politely steer you down their road, you can also politely tell them that’s not what you want. Being rude does absolutely make you look like an asshole. Also, 9 times out of 10, encouraging you to join their religion is a brainwashing technique not for you, but for them. In their mind they’re approaching with loving, kind intentions and want to help you and when you reject them it only further cements that the religious community they’re a part of is the only one that will accept them “as they are” rather than the cruel outside world. It’s just to reinforce their ideas that only their people are good people and that’s why they need to stay.

[Asker]

But, there's no rudeness involved, at least not on my part.
Yes, they need to open their minds to the fact that not everyone is like them.
The weird part is when they decide that, since you're a non-believer, you MUST be a satanist or against their religious ideas in other ways that they hate, like I'm the next Charlie Manson!! When I could hardly be further from that kind of person! I'm VERY nice, kind and helpful, if I can be and I got this way WITHOUT religion!! Is THAT SUCH a BAD thing? It's like, we're both working the same side of the street to get to the same end, we're just using different means to get there. And if I can be as nice as I am and get to the same point as them WITHOUT religion, why does ANYBODY need it?

[CupcakeTheDestroyer]

I'm starting to think you don't actually interact with that many religious people, just one shitty person who happens to be religious

[Asker]

Most of my family were/are religious, quite a few of my friends are. I just see no point in it! It's like WILLINGLY being a slave! What do you get out of it that you can't get without it?

[CupcakeTheDestroyer]

A sense of direction and purpose, they’re not doing anything wrong by maintaining their spiritual health. Trying to force it on you is obviously wrong, and you’re free to say that it’s not what you want, but some people prefer to care for their spiritual sides through religion. That isn’t inherently bad.

[Orion84]

I simply tell people that I respect their beliefs, and ask that they respect my (lack of) beliefs.

That usually works, but if they persist, then they are, by definition, disrespecting me, and I am then justified in laying into them about it.

[Asker]

True! That's another aspect of it, If you say you don't believe, they rabbit on and on about what the bible says and how wonderful it is to be like them and they keep trying to convert you!! But if I even TRIED doing that to them, they'd throw a biblical curse at me and walk away!
The worst of the lot are those that hear that you have another religion so, they start trying to convert you to theirs claiming yours isn't as great as theirs but, they want YOU to respect THEIRS, no matter what! Like, if they go to a country that has natives that don't know about our religion but, they have one of their own and then we do whatever we can to convert them to ours instead of respecting theirs and leaving them the hell alone!!
There's others, like my cousin, Gary, who would take ANY CHANCE HE COULD to squeeze religion into a conversation!! I love music but if I tried to make everything about music, people would shun me and tell me to shut the hell up, already!! But, because Gary's talking about religion, everybody HAS to sit there and listen!!

[Orion84]

Yeah, that's why I give them one chance. I don't want to hear their crap, but by very carefully asking them to respect my beliefs, I retain the right to treat them like shit for refusing to do so.

That puts it entirely on them, and justifies my reaction to their disrespect. Bonus points if they're some denomination of Christianity, because then I can call them out for disregarding their own golden rule by treating me how they wouldn't want to be treated.

That one really gets them upset. 😁

[strateguy632]

Because liberty means: people can say opinions that differ from you... one day we will get that back on gag.

[Asker]

I have no problem with opinions, just show me that there's facts to back them up.

[contentious]

You're the one making the claim that it's made up. Thus it falls on you to prove it.

[contentious]

You want to make claims, then you need to provide evidence to back up your claims.

[contentious]

If you don't have evidence to back up your claims, then you're just talking out your ass and making up bullshit spewing your brainwashing toward other people and expecting them to believe it. Why would anyone deal with your irrational cultist behavior. You have no valid reason for your beliefs.

[contentious]

In contrast there are historic reports from a number of non-Christians scholars/historic figures on Jesus and early Christians from people like Flavius Josephus, Tacitus, Pliny the younger, etc. and there are archaeological findings of locations that are mentioned in the Bible and coinage with Christian symbols that can be carbon dated to the period. So academically, the historicity of Jesus and early Christianity are deemed to be true events covering real people. So when you look at the calendar and realize it's 2025, ask yourself 2025 years since what? Christians have evidence for a number of their beliefs even if every last detail can't be proven. Christians know Jesus was a real person, who influenced other real people, whom recorded eye witness accounts which align very well with one another even though they are written by people on multiple continents from different socioeconomic backgrounds, and people that witnessed those events were so sure in their claims that they were willing to, and did go to the death to defend those ideas. Are you willing to give your life to protect some made up bullshit? Not many people would die in horrible ways just to protect some bullshit...

[Asker]

Prove to me that it's real!
Hitler killed 6,000,000 Jews! Did god smite him for that? NO! He either killed himself or moved to Argentina where he died decades later!
My mother, a good catholic girl, ended up with cancer and a stroke!! Did god help her in ANY way? NO!! I DID!! I cured her cancer but she died a couple years later, anyway because of a saddle sore!! Did god help me for being so good to my mother? FUCK NO!! He allowed my ex-sister, who lives and breathes the bible, to fuck over both me AND mom!!
My aunt said her rosaries every night for about an hour and had mases for everyone she knew every month!! Did god help her? FUCK NO!! She died a few years ago, flat broke and left ME to pay back the fucking mortgage she took out 3 weeks before she died so she could give MORE money to the scammers that already took her for $11,000,000!!! Where was god to tell her to STOP throwing her money away? And YOUR answer is gonna be, "He gave us free will!" THEN, WHAT'S THE FUCKING POINT OF HAVING A GOD?

[Asker]

Yeah? BACK AT YOU!! YOU wanna make claims, PROVE THEM!!! SHOW ME YOUR GOD!!! SHOW ME SOMETHING YOUR GOD HAS DONE TO HELP SOMEONE!!!

[contentious]

I don't need to prove anything, you made the claim. You have to prove your position.

[contentious]

Where are your historic documents, archaeological evidence, eye witness testimony, scientific carbon dating of the fabrication? See the thing is you just talk out your ass. You don't have any evidence for your claims.

[contentious]

Hitchens's razor... What can be asserted without evidence can also be dismissed without evidence. You're entire ant-God position of fabrication is complete nonsense. You don't have a lick of evidence to prove your position.

[Asker]

Again, back at you! Where is YOUR evidence? I've looked and found NONE!!! YOUR GOD DOESN'T EXIST!! NOINE OF THEM DO!!
YOU'RE the one talking out of YOUR ass!! Making up fairy stories and claiming they're real!! I live in the real world!! You live in a fantasy world!!
YOU'RE the one that's brainwashed!! If no one ever bothered to teach you about religion, you wouldn't know anything about it!! I was taught religion when I was little, I saw that it was all made-up bullshit and chose to live in the real world, where my viewpoints are proven EVERY DAY!! Where is YOUR proof?
YOU'RE the one that's in the cult, idiot!! I'M FREE!! I don't belong to ANY cult!! YOU'RE the one that WANTS to be enslaved by the cult!!! Just like the brainwashed: accuse those that aren't of the things you are!!
I have LOADS of reasons for my beliefs!! They're called, FACTS!!! Where are yours? If god can do anything, WHY hasn't he cured ALL diseases? Why did he CREATE diseases!! If there's only one religion, why hasn't god done away with all the others?

[contentious]

It's well accepted in acadamia that Jesus existed. It's not disputed history. You're trying to disprove history without any evidence to back your claim. Where as I can easily appeal to the historic records and prove you don't have ground to stand on. For example Flavius Josephus (A. D. 37–c. 100) was a Roman-Jewish scholar, historian, and military leader born in Jerusalem four years after the crucifixion of Jesus of Nazareth in the same city. He was surrounded by the people that were witnesses to Christ, he walked and talk with them. Being a Jewish scholar, who knew what it meant to be the Messiah he still had this to say about Jesus in his work Antiquities of the Jews:

Antiquities 18:63

About this time lived Jesus, a wise man, if indeed one ought to call him a man. For he was the achiever of extraordinary deeds and was a teacher of those who accept the truth gladly. He won over many Jews and many of the Greeks. He was the Messiah. When he was indicted by the principal men among us and Pilate condemned him to be crucified, those who had come to love him originally did not cease to do so; for he appeared to them on the third day restored to life, as the prophets of the Deity had foretold these and countless other marvelous things about him, and the tribe of the Christians, so named after him, has not disappeared to this day.

This is coming from a Roman-Jew not a Christian.

[Asker]

In the meantime, there were a number of other forms of calendars, most oof which had nothing to do with the birth of Christ. Just because we chose to abide by the one we do, doesn't mean it was all real!
We've been told that he will return in 2000 years. We're 25 years past 2000 and he still ain't shown up, yet! Hmmm, I wonder why? Could it all have just been BULLSHIT!! Back then, people were VERY simpleminded and believed ANYTHING they were told!! Kinda like you!
Here, LEARN SOMETHING about what you're trying to talk about!! https://youtu.be/UqHSXTxhH24?si=TvlVigw6xctgrRXY
I don't HAVE to give up my life and YOU'RE the one talking about made-up bullshit!!

[contentious]

Then I could continue to corroborate historic Jesus/Christianity by looking to Publius Tacitus, who was a Roman senator and historian. They hated the Christians and had no reason to support the Christian narrative. In The Annals of Tacitus Book 15 the following is said about the Christus and Christians:

Tacitus – The Annals – Book 15:

Such indeed were the precautions of human wisdom. The next thing was to seek means of propitiating the gods, and recourse was had to the Sibylline books, by the direction of which prayers were offered to Vulcanus, Ceres, and Proserpina. Juno, too, was entreated by the matrons, first, in the Capitol, then on the nearest part of the coast, whence water was procured to sprinkle the fane and image of the goddess. And there were sacred banquets and nightly vigils celebrated by married women. But all human efforts, all the lavish gifts of the emperor, and the propitiations of the gods, did not banish the sinister belief that the conflagration was the result of an order.

[contentious]

Consequently, to get rid of the report, Nero fastened the guilt and inflicted the most exquisite tortures on a class hated for their abominations, called Christians by the populace. Christus, from whom the name had its origin, suffered the extreme penalty during the reign of Tiberius at the hands of one of our procurators, Pontius Pilatus, and a most mischievous superstition, thus checked for the moment, again broke out not only in Judaea, the first source of the evil, but even in Rome, where all things hideous and shameful from every part of the world find their centre and become popular. Accordingly, an arrest was first made of all who pleaded guilty; then, upon their information, an immense multitude was convicted, not so much of the crime of firing the city, as of hatred against mankind.

Mockery of every sort was added to their deaths. Covered with the skins of beasts, they were torn by dogs and perished, or were nailed to crosses, or were doomed to the flames and burnt, to serve as a nightly illumination, when daylight had expired. Nero offered his gardens for the spectacle, and was exhibiting a show in the circus, while he mingled with the people in the dress of a charioteer or stood aloft on a car. Hence, even for criminals who deserved extreme and exemplary punishment, there arose a feeling of compassion; for it was not, as it seemed, for the public good, but to glut one man’s cruelty, that they were being destroyed.

[contentious]

We could then continue to corroborate historic Jesus/Christians with accounts from Pliny the Younger who was the governor of the Roman province of Bithynia, located in Asia Minor. In 112 AD, he wrote to the Emperor Trajan, asking how he should deal with those in his region who have been accused of being Christians. In the letter, Pliny describes the practices of these “criminals”:
“They were in the habit of meeting on a certain fixed day before it was light, when they sang in alternate verses a hymn to Christ, as to a god, and bound themselves by a solemn oath, not to any wicked deeds, but never to commit any fraud, theft or adultery, never to falsify their word, nor deny a trust when they should be called upon to deliver it up; after which it was their custom to separate, and then reassemble to partake of food–but food of an ordinary and innocent kind.”

[contentious]

History is littered with speak of Jesus and Christians and that's from people that aren't Christians. Obvious there are far more detailed accounts from people who knew Christ personally and from Christians who followed his teachings.

[contentious]

Yawn... You try to lecture people on things you don't understand and then claim they don't understand.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wjm9nBQC5eU

[contentious]

meanwhile I'll be waiting for you to prove your initial claim, rather than running away to other points were you make a fool of yourself as you try to escape responsibility for your first claim.

[jshm2]

Because they are better than parasites like you?

You're just insecure, kiddo.

[Asker]

What makes me a parasite and insecure? I'm doing a lot of the same things they are, I'm just not allowing myself to be brainwashed by religion to do so! So, they must be insecure parasites, too except that they fell for the lies and I didn't.