Can white people trust the CIA when CIA leaders publicly admit to being ashamed of being a white person?

[crmoore]

[ShadezMcgee]

Not even so much a question of race as much as it is about accountability and job capability. I saw the recent advertisement they put out about that woman who claimed she was x and x and got pissed.

Proudly stating you have generalized anxiety disorder (GAD) How the fuck did you get in the CIA? Back when I got in the military they didn't let people in who took medication to manage it or just recently got off. That is a liability and definitely not something that would allow you in the armed forces, let alone one of the best and most acclaimed intelligence agencies on the planet.

The CIA of old is dead and has been replaced with a weaker and more politically correct stance. They didn't get a reputation for being politically correct, they got a rep for being able to neutralize enemies of the United States by use of paramilitary operations and intelligence analysis and were feared for it.

Then again, I wouldn't be surprised if they have been spying on U. S. citizens regardless of affiliation, race, etc as well. So they weren't just feared, but they weren't trusted by our own public either.

[jshm2]

Being "White" is not their crime, bub.

They've done some pretty horrific shit to many a country and person to be at least ashamed over.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_rights_violations_by_the_CIA
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_CIA_controversies
http://www.huppi.com/kangaroo/CIAtimeline.html

[Lliam]

Anyone who trusts anything about the CIA is a moron. The CIA's job is deception and its list of outrageous crimes against U. S. citizens and people of the world are too numerous to list.
JFK said he wanted to “splinter the CIA in a thousand pieces and scatter it to the winds” He was right. But it was too powerful then and now it is a shadow government of its own with zero accountability.

[hellionthesagereborn]

Its the CIA, why would you ever trust them to begin with? I mean they are just using the local trends to manipulate the public, which is their MO, so I don't believe that they actually feel that way, but I think its unreasonable to suggest we trust an organization that we have no control over, that uses propaganda and lies and spying to get what they want, that have been implicated in multiple violations of the law and of maniupating the American people.

[Anonymous]

Very few, if any, CIA members have said that they are ashamed of being a white person. This post sounds more like lying propaganda, than anything legitimate.

[crmoore]

Depending on your political perspective, one of these three links should suffice:

nypost.com/.../

www.foxnews.com/.../cia-brennan-embarrassed-white-man

www.independent.co.uk/.../...bc-cpac-b1810912.html

And to further support the general idea, rather than the specific case: here's her another instance of the questionable ideology that the CIA is adopting, where one of their employees regards herself as intersectional (the next three links regard the same person/incident, just pick whatever you trust mose, but if you're only going to read the headline like a lot of people do, just pick the first one as it describes it best):

https://www.rt.com/usa/522767-cia-ad-diversity/

www.msn.com/.../ar-BB1gij1X

www.washingtonexaminer.com/.../cia-recruitment-ad-profiling-cisgender-millennial-mocked

And this describes what intersectionality is:

en.m.wikipedia.org/.../Intersectionality

[Opinion Owner]

Giving Fox news as a link, when the suck up to Republicans, and actively lie for Republicans, doesn't give any credibility to what you say. In fact, Fox lies so much, it makes what you say less likely to be true.

[crmoore]

Well, to preface, the links regarded an interview John Brennan did on MSNBC (a left-wing news source). So whether you think Fox News lies or not, they're not lying this time, unless you mean to say MSNBC, too, is somehow lying. Here's the link: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cY6aWvJ0w18 .

Additionally, since I expected you'd distrust certain sources, I specifically provided several links, one of which being left-wing (and that wasn't even MSNBC). I find it odd that you seem to have been completely fixated on Fox News being one of the three links. You mention alleged lies, but if lies from Fox News was a concern for you, you had two other links to choose from (not to mention, you could google this, yourself). It seems you either 1. didn't read hardly any of my post and jumped the gun with your response, or 2. found my stance difficult to refute, so you selectively addressed what you think is most easily defeated. Either way, it was a very immature way of going about this and I expect more from you in the future.

So considering that my response consisted of more than just Fox News, and that the regarded situation happened on MSNBC, and that very MSNBC interview from MSNBC's official YouTube channel is now linked/provided, I don't foresee there being any obstruction to this conversation. So I figure that if you're truly a willing participant and a truth-seeker, this conversation will now become productive and you can assess the situation and we can come to a conclusion.

[Opinion Owner]

The source doesn't actually matter, as what you say, if that to a degree necessary to cause a problem, CIA members are ashamed of being white. That is something that is utterly unprovable. There is no way, that enough CIA personnel cold have been interviewed, and had this finding. Your whole premise is ludicrous.

[crmoore]

No, it's not. It's not just "one guy said this" it's the literal leader of the CIA said it, AND the OFFICIAL CIA YouTube channel expressed politically similar views.

[crmoore]

I rest my case.

[Opinion Owner]

Good point.

[Opinion Owner]

You have to understand what they say in context. They aren't actually saying they are ashamed of being white, they are saying they are ashamed of what many white people have done regarding race. People commonly say things to make a point, that they don't actually mean. For instance, I can say, I was so embarrassed I could die. No, in reality, I was not so embarrassed that I could die. Or, I could have fallen through the floor. No, I could not have fallen through the floor. It was said to make a point. Just as saying one is embarrassed to be white, is a way of making a point. The point being, that so many white people on the right, are so racist, that it's awful.

[crmoore]

Firstly, you don't know whether he genuinely meant what he said. But even if we assume you're correct, there's a difference between making an exaggeration like "I was so embarrassed I could die" and "I am ashamed of being white." No where in "I was so embarrassed I could die" do you imply that the actions of members of your own race in any way is reflective of you or other members of that race. One is toxic, harmful, and quite frankly racist, the other is a simple, comical, very clearly exaggerated remark. These two expressions are not comparable.

[Opinion Owner]

It is reasonable to think, that bad actions of a large number of people belonging to a groups to which you belong, may reflect upon you. So it's reasonable to distance yourself from them, or to make it clear that you do not agree with what they have done, or to even speak of some shame at being identified with them, regarding a particularly bad act.

[crmoore]

So you think that it is reasonable for innocent, black, law-abiding civilians to be ashamed of the comparatively very high crime rate of things like murder, rape, burglarly, theft, etc?

[Opinion Owner]

I think it's reasonable for a person to feel in various ways about how their peers act, and how it effects them. I don't feel a need to box anyone into how they should feel.

[crmoore]

Those are not their peers. They have no relevance to that person. Those people should not feel ashamed of the actions of others just because they have the same or similar skin tones. This collectivist way of thinking of yours is very harmful and dangerous.

[Opinion Owner]

A peer group can take many forms.

[crmoore]

You're technically right. I just refreshed myself on the definition of peer. Though I think peer is rarely used in this way, and I also think it is unreasonable to use peer in this way. As you're boxing in vast groups of highly varying people and attempting to regard them as a unit, rather than as the individuals they are.

But I'd also like to point out you addressed a single line from my prior response. If we're going to have a discussion, we're going to need to address the gist of each other's points at the very least (if not the entirety).

I politely ask you to address the notion that those criminals have no relevance to law-abiding citizens, and thus they should not be ashamed of something some random person they don't know does.

[Anonymous]

Whoever said that needs to quit pandering to the Race Grievance Industry and realize not all white people are alike. The same applies to any other race.

[RealMarek]

The bigger question is why anyone would trust a completely unaccountable organization regardless of opinions on race.

[EyesOfGod]

You should realize a vast majority of the CIA FBI and DOA are white washed. Maybe not by choice maybe so, but its a fact.

[JamieLoves]

The CIA is a Nazi organization that murders and runs drugs to support their black opps!

No one can trust them !

[anylolone]

No one can.
Their racism is just extra evidence that no one can.

[Anonymous]

no, he should only feel ashamed of things that he has done. I hope that he gets arrested and put in jail for being such a terrible white cunt

[Anonymous]

There are other, even better reasons to not trust the CIA

[pokerbot]

WTF is wrong with you?

[crmoore]

Could you provide something more substantial? I may be able to give you a better answer, if so.

[pokerbot]

Your question is nonsense.

[pokerbot]

If you're talking about John Brennan he's a private citizen who shills for CNN. He doesn't influence policy at the CIA.

[crmoore]

In the same way that Trump and Obama are a private citizens and don't influence policy in the United States? He's CURRENTLY a private citizen, he wasn't always. He DID influence policy in the CIA. And he wasn't just some intern in the CIA, he was the Director. "The director of the Central Intelligence Agency is a statutory office that functions as the head of the Central Intelligence Agency" (link: en.m.wikipedia.org/.../Director_of_the_Central_Intelligence_Agency ).

And not only this, we can look to other examples like, like this video from the official CIA YouTube channel, where they express and support identity politics, and more specifically, mention their intersectionality (link: https://youtu.be/X55JPbAMc9g ). I assume you're familiar with Intersectionality, but if not, here's how it's defined on Wikipedia: "Intersectionality is an analytical framework for understanding how aspects of a person's social and political identities combine to create different modes of discrimination and privilege." This video was only posted 1 month ago, by the way.

And if this isn't good enough for you, we can look to other government agencies like the military.

Top US general urging for more racial diversity in the US military: www.military.com/.../...al-diversity-military.html

Diversity training in the military started up again (after being banned): www.military.com/.../...training-trump-banned.html

And these are only two examples, if you want, I can find plenty more. Our institutions are infected. So what exactly is "nonsense" about my statement?

[pokerbot]

What is it about diversity that scares you so much? Intersectionality was the norm under Obama and will be again under Biden. I'd be more concerned if the CIA was a front for the KKK, which is what you seem to be advocating.

[crmoore]

That's a very typical response. You're (unsuccessfully) trying to dilute my stance into something you think is more easily reputable. Diversity doesn't "scare" me, I've never said or indicated such. And if you want me, and any potential onlookers, to take you seriously, I suggest you avoid these childish tactics from this point forward.

Race-based HIRING does concern me, however. It's immoral as-is, but it even leads to things like race-based medical accessibility (link: www.newsweek.com/vermont-under-fire-distributing-covid-vaccine-based-race-1580769 ), or race-based college admission (link: nypost.com/.../ ), or race-based loan forgiveness (link: nypost.com/.../ ), etc.

And I'm sorry, what was that about me allegedly being an advocate for the CIA being a front for the KKK? 🤣🤣 Are you serious? You wanna quote me on that? 😂 Do you see the irony in you asking "what the fuck" is wrong with ME?

[pokerbot]

What was unreasonable about my comment? Any rational person reading your white supremacist shit would draw the same conclusion.

[crmoore]

That you think I'm a white supremacist and that I'm in any way an advocate for the KKK. Aside from the assumption that "right-wingers are racist because of reasons," you have no reason to assume others.

Something is very seriously wrong, here, for you to confidently say this. I implore you to actually verbalize your rationale behind that conclusion of yours. I don't foresee it being anything more than assumptions, namely "you must not like diversity," of which I already refuted (so if you retain the stance you had, you should refute the refutation and explain how despite that I'm still supposedly a racist white supremacists).

I can't help but notice you also avoided almost the entirety of the post, ignoring everything except the last part. Maybe you realize that it's your side of politics that is employing systemic/institutionalized racism, and you can't bear the thought of addressing, let alone admitting, it?

[crmoore]

Was that a little too real for you? Should I rest my case?

[joeldalton]

We can not. Or the FBI

[888theGreat]

CIA = Shadow Government

[Leavesbound]

Who did this?

[crmoore]

John Brennan

[Leavesbound]

well I just read an article about it after you posted his name. I had not previously heard this of him. I'm not sure though that disqualifies him for the job though he is no longer in charge of the CIA and I could find nothing that Burns has said that is similar to this so I think we are in good hands for the moment.

[crmoore]

Even with Brennan out, we can look to other examples like this video from the official CIA YouTube channel, where they express and support identity politics, and more specifically, mention their intersectionality (link: https://youtu.be/X55JPbAMc9g ). I"m not sure if you're familiar with Intersectionality, but if not, here's how it's defined on Wikipedia: "Intersectionality is an analytical framework for understanding how aspects of a person's social and political identities combine to create different modes of discrimination and privilege." And this video was only posted 1 month ago.

[Leavesbound]

And so your point is? Analyzing people's thought processes is part of what the CIA was created to do. It is important that they are able to figure out what is in the heads of our enemies and why.

[crmoore]

The point should be clear. They're infected with ridiculous ideologies and they're indicating towards having a bias towards certain demographics. If they instead had an ex-CIA director come out and say "I'm ashamed of being black" would you still think there's no bias? Or if their YouTube channel came out and expressed anti-feminism views, would you, still, deny bias? And if someone brought it up would you say "what's your point?" or would you say "yeah, I see where you're coming from. There's certainly a concern for bias, there."

And I don't understand what you mean by getting inside the heads of people. The only way I can interpret that is you saying you think the CIA is hiring their enemies to get inside of their head, but that seems silly so I'm not inclined to believe that's what you were saying.

[JamesRandiDebates]

The CIA should be abolished

[Anonymous]

That's just their cover story, they're in on it!

[pigoat]

Woooowwww