What’s so bad about socialism?

[Anonymous]

[RolandCuthbert]

Nothing. In actuality, there is no such thing as a nation that is 100% capitalist. I think the U. S. might be considered to be 80% capitalist. Europe is more so, probably most nations around 60-70%. The point is to create a government that has the right amount of mix for the society in question.

The debate in the forum isn't about socialism. It is about misogyny, racism, anti-immigration, etc.

Like take for instance the abortion debate, the point is not just to return abortion rights to the states, but to ban abortion throughout the entire United States.

The same folks who back the Alito ruling are the same ones who are trying to ban women from crossing state borders for an abortion. They are the same ones who want to punish private companies for paying for employees to cross state lines.

Because again, this is not about an individual state enacting its own laws. Fascism cannot co-exist with freedom. Just like the Taliban, Al Qaeada, etc. it must find ways to stamp out other governing philosophies.

[andreasderjuengere]

Bad: the way it had been put to practice previously.

A little bad: it's a 100-something years old theory that nowadays needs a renovation if it's intended to be used.

Quite bad: the ''stigma'' associated with the term; better call it differently when attempted next time :) (marketing...)

The basic idea is honourable, and makes sense. The whole thing just wasn't thought through entirely, and was offered to ''the market'' before all aspects of human nature were considered.

But to buy a ''Windows 10'' version is pretty much the same :D

[Embarrassing123]

No ideology is perfect and whether socialism is perceived as efficient or not depends on your political standpoint ofc. Some people prioritize welfare over low taxes while other people prioritize low taxes over welfare. Ofc if you are someone who doesn't care about free healthcare and free education and just want as low taxes as possible, your perception of socialism is highly negative. essentially, free education and healthcare is paid through taxes.

[Embarrassing123]

Also it is harder for the rich to stay rich in a socialistic society, but overall social mobility is easier in a socialistic society. With high taxes it is hard to have lots of money. In Denmark, half of our income goes to taxes. Furthermore it is easier for vulnerable businesses to survive in a society with planned economy compared to marked economy, due the internal competition on the marked. However the competition in question is the reason why companies has to prioritize quality in order to survive and the companies have property rights.

[KelleyNice]

@Embarrassing123 Almost 90% of Denmark are of Danish decent and are mostly educated that, unlike blacks and too many whites in the USA, don't abuse the welfare system. Therefore, do fine on half their income; not that they wouldn't do better with all their income.

[This_Is_My_Opinion8]

@KelleyNice they wouldn't. Because then they wouldn't have tons of perks. That monkey is used to improve infrastructure, give people affordable housing, give free healthcare and education. It's awesome all around.
Thanks to that they are all very highly educated people.

[alice55]

They're fucking hypocrite, in France the assembly wanted to pass a new laws to lower taxe and the socialist were the only one to vote against it like seriously what's their logics...

The middle, the right and the far right wing all vote for and the socialist, communist and far left were the only one to vote against a law that lower taxes come on.

[This_Is_My_Opinion8]

Because those taxes can be put to good use for the people.

[notwoke]

there's no incentive for individuals or corporations to take risk or work extremely hard so society produces less and everyone becomes poorer. Just go to any socialist country. I kill myself working long hours but as soon as this no longer benefited above and beyond doing the "minimum" that would be the end of that. I don't actually like living to work. by the way, we are getting there. I know lots of people who used to be go getters who have said "fuck it". In fact myself and many others I know are already figuring out how we retire early with a high net worth but low taxable income and qualify for health care subsidy.

[NamerOfStars]

Its side effects. Everyone who looks into the matter on even the most casual basis knows that competition leads to better products and services; government is no exception. This isn't a huge deal when it comes to, say, libraries, and the idea of privately-operated free-market ROADS is a libertarian nightmare, but when it comes to phone companies or healthcare, well, just look around you.

[FilmGuy93]

There's not necessarily anything bad about socialism, but you need economic activity to replace the value lost by government control of certain industries. The trick is getting the system to work in a sustainable fashion, and that requires the economic input of other countries. So basically you need colonialism to fund socialism

[SmokinAces2000]

The reason it has failed in the past has been because of too much socialism and also the government of the countries as well, the main reason it wouldn’t work is because people are selfish and it’s crazy because a lot of the people that are so strongly against socialism don’t even fully understand it and it would benefit them if it was implemented in a reasonable fashion.

[Adam1978]

The disrespect of other people earned resources and how easy they often use it up. If they actually valued the comon resources instead of taking them for granted. They might actually do common good decisions.

[normalice]

It's a direct threat to the rich people taking all our money and they control all of the media, so "socialism bad" is simply repeated over and over until people accept it.

[KelleyNice]

Aside from the fact that it greatly lowers the GDP, socialism is robbery from those that don't agree using violence and threats.

[EnglishEuropean]

That could be said of any government funded by taxation.

[KelleyNice]

@EnglishEuropean Of course, that is because it is. Other than courts, and prison which could be paid by fees for civil matters and criminal matters, there is nothing other than prison that private industry wouldn't do better and cheaper. And, prison for the criminals could be paid from their assets, if any, or by the work they do in prison or else, because the victims are willing to pay for their imprisonment.

[Andres77]

The goal of socialism is communism.

-Vladimir Lenin

[Storm8756]

Because everywhere it’s been tried has resulted in mass poverty and death, people will point to countries who identify as capitalist and call them socialist over entitlement programs because they don’t actually have a clue what socialism is.

[Plinko]

That history didn't answer this question for you, is deeply troubling.

[jshm2]

Depends what brand and interpretation of socialism you're on about.

It's not a monolith, and Americans have no fucking clue about it.

[Storm8756]

Immigrants build boats out of trash and set sail through shark infested waters to Florida in order to escape socialism…

[OddBeMe]

The academic definition…nothing. Its simply anything government does- redistributes wealth. In a historical sense, bad, because of communism.

But Marx and Engels had good points. But like all literary works, people take it to extremes.

[Hispanic-Cool-Guy]

It's not bad if applied correctly and to small degrees.

It creates a fair balance in the workforce and not having some CEO make over 300× its employees who are helping bringing in the cash flow.

[NYCQuestions1976]

Socialism destroys individual success, creativity, and self-reliance in favor of big fat stupid bloated grim reaper government.

[TwoToTooTutu2]

Collectivist societies only work in insects. We're humans not ants. We each have a brain not one hive mind

[Rangers]

The fact that there is not one single example of it working yet thousands of examples of it quickly causing society to collapse into anarchy

[ArtemisSilver]

It's been conflated to mean full blown communism by some people. It's honestly not bad when executed in rational moderation.

[Storm8756]

Like where? Don’t lost capitalist countries…

[ArtemisSilver]

Canada, Norway, Iceland to name a few. Socialist economics can be applied sparingly and works just fine. I don't know why some people can't understand the concept of balance.

[Storm8756]

None of those are socialist… you’re conflating welfare/entitlement programs under a capitalist economy as socialist countries.

[ArtemisSilver]

That's what moderate socialism is dumbass, social programs like public healthcare and employment insurance.

Labor unions are a socialist endeavour.

It's not a black and white concept. For fuck sakes where did you go to school?

[Storm8756]

I went to school in an actual socialist country, we escaped on a boat my father made out of trash before we set sail to Florida.. So you don’t have a clue what socialism is and resort to insults.

[ArtemisSilver]

Cuba was literally a revolutionary communist country. Again you show that you know nothing about economics or geopolitics.

Your sob story doesn't excuse your ignorance, the world is much larger than your narrow personal experience. Read a few books before you talk about things you don't understand.

[Storm8756]

Buy a few guns and train or accept you’re talking out your ass about economic policies you don’t have enough souls to sacrifice in order to force on us.

[ArtemisSilver]

Oh believe me I've trained, only because I know there are people who like yourself are too stupid to be reasoned with.

Moderate socialists who want to provide free education and healthcare and restrain the worst exeses of capitalism aren't going to force anything on you. It's simple minded violent oafs like you who are dangerous.

Seriously man you need therapy and to educate yourself properly it's embarrassing.

[Storm8756]

So you’re not a socialist… you just call yourself one. Socialism requires force.

[ArtemisSilver]

Only under the Marxist interpretation. Seriously educate yourself better.

[EnglishEuropean]

Pure socialism doesn't encourage entrepeneurship, which leads to a lack of progress and economic stagnation.

[Soteris]

Arguably not true and honestly, looking at USA and late stage capitalism the alternative might be even worse that your claims.

[EnglishEuropean]

@Soteris I'm actually a socialist but pure socialism doesn't work, any more than pure capitaism. Capitalism ultimately fails because of too much wealth in too few hands, and elimination of competition through monopolies. But that wasn't the question.

[Soteris]

Still I disagree. Sure, there are flawed systems within socialism but its a very broad category with a lot of leeway that can circumvent all those problems. For example, the government if careful can be very good at stimulating innovation and competition. NASA is a good example where government investment has produced several leaps in innovation and technology for the whole market. The government is also much better at long term planning, for example identifying problems like lead poisoning and climate change to then force the markets to innovate new solutions in good time to prevent it like unleaded gas and green energy.

[EnglishEuropean]

@Soteris True, but the government is still working within the markets. It still needs private money to make things happen.

[Soteris]

That is why its important to point out the variety that exists within the larger category of "socialism" since many of those systems still use free markets and private money to more or lesser degree. Socialism is by no means as specific a term as capitalism is.

[EnglishEuropean]

@Soteris Well they're not mutually exclusive. Most successful societies are a mixture of both. America has food stamps. If that's not socialism, what is?

[Soteris]

I would say that food stamps is very much a capitalist service since it funnels public money into private products rather than have the government organize and procure the products themselves.

[QuietRunner]

At some point you run out of other people's money

[Cubus]

In socialism all people are equally poor except for party members who live like kings.

[KrakenAttackin]

It breeds sloth, which is fundamentally repulsive to the American DNA.

[Kingofkings1992]

It takes away the incentive for people to work hard.

[WhitneySnow]

Nothing. Sounds cool in theory at least.

[Anonymous]

They control what you do in order to get stuff.

[BeMuse]

Everything.