Are there natural laws?

[OddBeMe]

If so, who enforces them?

Yes

No

Not sure

[NathanDavis]

no... nature does not explain itself and needs no decree

nature just is... law is unnatural, just like we are with our fixation and fascination for reason and sense of things, mostly with the natural... and when we just don't get it then we deem that unnatural from our ignorant and limited point of view

[OddBeMe]

I agree. Our human minds like defining things to no end. But being imperfect there’s no way to know if we’re right.

But I would say, logically…nature has laws. We just will never know them.

[ChefPapiChulo]

Word salad LMAO

[genericname85]

There's mechanisms in nature that always work the same. Nobody enforces them. There's no sentience or will involved. It's not like the legal systems laws at all, where the laws are the rational decision of people. So it's not really the right word. We just find these mechanisms and call them laws, cause they don't seem to change. Not cause someone decided them.

[OddBeMe]

But on court say, we have enforced cancelling slavery, right?

[genericname85]

As i just said. We only call them laws of nature cause they can't be broken by us. It has nothing to do with the legal system. I'm taking about gravitation, speed of light and such. Slavery if obviously a legal system law and has nothing to do with nature.

[OddBeMe]

Sure. But I guess every person being equal could be a natural law, like gravity.

[genericname85]

You know what the word "normative" means? What you just said is a normative statement. It includes a value judgement of how things should be. Natural laws aren't normative. They are descriptive. Like sure i think on a normative level, humans should fly. But on a descriptive level, humans don't have the physiology, to fly, so me making that normative value judgement doesn't matter in laws of nature which are descriptive.

In fact equality is not a thing in nature at all. All life seems to strive for variety. Diversification of genes. Equality goes contrary to pretty much everything in nature. in nature, animals that are successful at surviving survive. And those that aren't die. It doesn't matter what you think should be. That's what nature is.

[OddBeMe]

I’d disagree on equality in nature. In fact evolution seems to have absolute equality when adapting species.

But back to “normative”…isn’t that subjective to a culture?

[genericname85]

Normative is subject to opinion of individuals or groups of people. Such are the laws in the legal system, not in nature.
Can you elaborate on what you mean when you say evolution has equality when it comes to adaption of species?

[dustybiker]

In the sense that if you touch something that is hot you’ll get burned? If you don’t cover up in freezing temperatures you’ll freeze? Yes. There is a natural order of balance that is kept. The ability to learn and react allows us to survive it.

[Juxtapose]

YES!

The only true law of the universe is power, and the only crime is weakness.

That's why being good is hard, because you're actively working against how the universe works to reshape it to your desires. You need a lot of power to maintain a utopian society and much less to bring about a dystopia.

[OddBeMe]

So might makes right?

[Juxtapose]

That is the most honest law of the universe, yes. Nobody can save you or instill goodness without power.

[andreasderjuengere]

We call them laws, but they are rather ''natural facts''; they 'enforce' themselves.

If they were indeed laws, some attorneys already would have attempted to twist, distort and exploit them.

[OddBeMe]

True, like anti gay marriage.

[Agagagagaga]

Catamite.

[AndrésC64]

It depends on what you mean by laws. There are descriptive laws of nature. There are no proscriptive laws of nature.

[OddBeMe]

I would say there are “proscriptive” laws in nature, but humans who are imperfect could never hope to discover them. Like we know gravity exists. Just not why are how.. in a lot of ways.

[Sevenpointfive]

the law of reflection. only you enforce it and control it

[msc545]

Physical laws in this frame of reference anyway. Gravity, light speed, etc.

[OddBeMe]

Sure, for this galaxy. Could be completely different next door.

[msc545]

Yes indeed.

[Andres77]

all laws are natural. nature enforces it's own laws.

[grega239]

I guess. If you mean how nature works, yes.

Who enforces them? No one because no one can break them

[ChefPapiChulo]

Lmao oh you are a loony